Terrorists that need to be kicked out of the US to make it safer

rambot

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Target bomb plot: Florida man arrested for plan to bomb Target stores - CNN.com
=This guy is a CRAZY capitalist. Perhaps somewhere like Somalia?

Benjamin McDowell: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know
=This guy? I dunno. How about we toss him into........ ISRAEL! Or...what about Palestine?
 

Saucy

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1) Occupy Democrats has a very, very low rating for their 'truthful' reporting and is essentially the alt-left. They like to twist things up.

2) Does Trump have to mention every single potential terrorist? I mean, how many times did Obama not mention things?

3) No one has doubted that white people can be terrorists or cause domestic terror. Trump isn't just focused on "let's get all the Mexicans and Muslims out!" No, he's a HUGE supporter of our law enforcement and plans to support them to stop these sorts of things from happening.

4) I am SICK and TIRED of garbage like this. The left is being completely divisive. Should it matter the color of the skin or nationality of a terrorist? Just because Islamic terror dominates the headlines, does that mean no one cares about domestic terrorism? Can we stop playing the race card and trying to bait each other?
 
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Vylo

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I am SICK and TIRED of garbage like this. The left is being completely divisive. Should it matter the color of the skin or nationality of a terrorist?

No it shouldn't. It isn't the left trying to divide people by doing travel bans.
 
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lasthero

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Does Trump have to mention every single potential terrorist? I mean, how many times did Obama not mention things?

I'd be more willing to give Trump a pass if one of his biggest criticisms of the media was that they don't talk about terrorist attacks (even though they do)
 
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rambot

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1) Occupy Democrats has a very, very low rating for their 'truthful' reporting and is essentially the alt-left. They like to twist things up.
Pro-tip:
That is why I included ACTUAL news articles underneath. I know how easy it is to a quick ad hominem, feel confident the issue is death with, and move on.
2) Does Trump have to mention every single potential terrorist? I mean, how many times did Obama not mention things?
Nope, he doesn't. And I'm sure when a 2nd generation Syrian American threatens to go on a shooting rampage on a university, Trump will also maintain a similar level of silence right?
Riiiiiight?
I mean, sure he and his administration have attempted to present to 3 NONEXISTENT terror events to the public in in an attempt to justify this or that. But that's different...I guess.

3) No one has doubted that white people can be terrorists or cause domestic terror. Trump isn't just focused on "let's get all the Mexicans and Muslims out!" No, he's a HUGE supporter of our law enforcement and plans to support them to stop these sorts of things from happening.
Support law enforcement= great! Stop ALL terrorism= Great! But to consistently ignore "white people terrorists" is a disservice to the minorities in this country. They are under JUST as much threat; if not MORE since the people that want to kill them are ALREADY IN AMERICA!

4) I am SICK and TIRED of garbage like this. The left is being completely divisive. Should it matter the color of the skin or nationality of a terrorist?
The bitter irony is that we both think this! Tell that to your administration!

Just because Islamic terror dominates the headlines, does that mean no one cares about domestic terrorism? Can we stop playing the race card and trying to bait each other?
Why are you differentiating between "Islamic terrorism" and "domestic terrorism"?
If an extremist goes on a killing rampage in the US is it an "islamic terror" event or a "domestic terror" event.

Sorry to report this but 95% of muslim extremist terror events are happenning in war zones...see WAR ZONES. The US is NOT a war zone and comparing the situations is ludicrous.

I'm willing to stop playing the race card once the administration stops playing the islamophobe card.
 
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redleghunter

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rambot

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Have them dress in their KKK suits and drop them on W 127th St, New York, NY 10027.

See how long they last.
Sadly, that wouldn't make Americans safer....they need to be removed from your country.

Also.....
KKK has suits now?

Sounds classy :oldthumbsup:
 
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redleghunter

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rambot

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On a serious note? Good to see the FBI has infiltrated these domestic terror groups. Both cases were foiled.
I agree. I think your security services are doing a really, really great job and keeping america pretty safe. There are all kind of terrorist plots thwarted every year...and that's a good thing, regardless of the perp.
 
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Cimorene

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It's not surprising Trump hasn't mentioned either of them. I don't think he has ever given any kind of public sympathy for the victims of the Quebec mosque shooting. I think he made a private call but said nothing publicly. Had the terrorist been Muslim he probably would have. The terrorist was a white guy who his friends have described as being a Trump loving nationalist. Trump has found the time to whine about Nordstroms, SNL, the NY Times & a bunch of other stuff along those lines but I don't think he ever Tweeted out anything about that attack. Then he whines & he lies & says that the media hasn't covered terrorist attacks by Muslims that got a TON of media attn.
 
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redleghunter

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Sadly, that wouldn't make Americans safer....they need to be removed from your country.

Also.....
KKK has suits now?

Sounds classy :oldthumbsup:
Removed? We could send them to Gitmo or Canada.:)

However, I understand you are applying irony. That's fine but no matter how terrible these men are they are American citizens and due process applies.

Now if the US allowed such men travel to another nation knowing their violent tendencies, then you would have a point.

A nation cannot control people growing up to be dangerous jerks no matter how hard they try. I'm sure your country has your fair share as well.
 
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dgiharris

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1) Occupy Democrats has a very, very low rating for their 'truthful' reporting and is essentially the alt-left. They like to twist things up.

Source and examples please and is this your attempt to discredit this actual event/article?

Can we just focus on this actual posting?

2) Does Trump have to mention every single potential terrorist? I mean, how many times did Obama not mention things?

Ask yourself this question? If these people were Muslim instead of white, would Trump have mentioned them? If the answer is yes, then he should mention them, if the answer is no then he should not.

I submit that the answer would be a resounding YES!!!!

3) No one has doubted that white people can be terrorists or cause domestic terror.

This is not a true statement. The narrative in this country is that our MAJOR threat are Muslims and Illegals. White domestic terrorist groups aren't even called terrorist groups they are called "extremists" and then they are equated to minority groups as if they are just the different side of the same coin. No. No they are not.

I don't care about race, all I care about is probability of occurrence x frequency. And the data clearly shows that we have MORE to fear from domestic homegrown terrorists than Muslims from another country.

4) I am SICK and TIRED of garbage like this. The left is being completely divisive. Should it matter the color of the skin or nationality of a terrorist? Just because Islamic terror dominates the headlines, does that mean no one cares about domestic terrorism? Can we stop playing the race card and trying to bait each other?

All I want is for reality and data and facts and evidence to drive the narrative. That is all I want. And your reaction is exactly why this is a problem. You see this as "garbage" and "the race card" when the reality is that your viewpoints are making us less safe. All the focus and energy in this country is being steered towards Islamaphobia instead of ALL TERRORISM to include domestic homegrown terrorism.

ANd yes, every time the nation focuses on "non-existent" Muslim threats we make ourselves less safe because we allow our own homegrown domestic terrorists to slip through the cracks.

Again, I just want data, facts, evidence, and reality to drive the narrative, not emotion and fear. That is all I want.
 
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Cimorene

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1) Occupy Democrats has a very, very low rating for their 'truthful' reporting and is essentially the alt-left. They like to twist things up.

2) Does Trump have to mention every single potential terrorist? I mean, how many times did Obama not mention things?

3) No one has doubted that white people can be terrorists or cause domestic terror. Trump isn't just focused on "let's get all the Mexicans and Muslims out!" No, he's a HUGE supporter of our law enforcement and plans to support them to stop these sorts of things from happening.

4) I am SICK and TIRED of garbage like this. The left is being completely divisive. Should it matter the color of the skin or nationality of a terrorist? Just because Islamic terror dominates the headlines, does that mean no one cares about domestic terrorism? Can we stop playing the race card and trying to bait each other?

2 things.
1. You told me that if I watched this super long rah rah Trump video you'd never write about politics here again. So I watched the whole thing. So you didn't mean what you said?
2. I see it's your bday, so Happy Birthday!
 
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Saucy

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The fact that these two guys got caught and stopped shows people were being viligent. In all these race games, we forget that real lives are at risk.

The way I see it, no one in America doubts that domestic terrorists exist. But they arent often guided by religious beliefs. Pages like Occupy Democrats and the left love to say "white Christians".

But none of these shootings were done in the name of Christ. Someone tried to say Tim McVeigh was a Christian, white terrorist. No, he wasn't a Christian.

If we are to stop all the bad things from happening, then we need to call things as they are. You tell me my point makes us more dangerous?

I think the left is playing a dangerous game. The want to play the political correctness game and deny that these people killing in the name of Allah.

There is a very real Muslim threat. Isis IS here. They're being investigated by the FBI in every single state.

Trump tries to put on a temporary ban from the 7 countries Obama and the country decided were the largest state sponsors of terror. Instead he's called a racist.

He wants to build a wall and add border security. Instead he's called racist.

The left does not care what Trump does. Their single goal is to destroy Trump and get him impeached.
 
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Saucy

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2 things.
1. You told me that if I watched this super long rah rah Trump video you'd never write about politics here again. So I watched the whole thing. So you didn't mean what you said?
2. I see it's your bday, so Happy Birthday!
Thank you! And I apologize, I didnt see where you saw it. Backing out now.
 
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Vylo

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The way I see it, no one in America doubts that domestic terrorists exist. But they arent often guided by religious beliefs.

Huh? Terrorists are very often guided or motivated by religious belief.

I think the left is playing a dangerous game. The want to play the political correctness game and deny that these people killing in the name of Allah.

No we don't. We just realize its not all of them, most of them, or even a large minority.
 
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dgiharris

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The fact that these two guys got caught and stopped shows people were being viligent.
Exactly agreed, however the point you are missing is that the current "narrative" (i.e. our focus on Muslims instead of EVERYONE) makes it less likely that these people would have been caught. The current narrative is making us less safe

In all these race games, we forget that real lives are at risk.
The "Race Game" as you call it is perpetrated by the GOP types trying to shift all attention and blame to Muslims.

The way I see it, no one in America doubts that domestic terrorists exist..
This is where you are wrong. The current narrative "downplays" domestic terrorists and focuses majority of attention at a disproportionate level on Muslims. That is the problem. You can't scream Muslim terrorists 99% of the time and then say in the next breath "We take all terrorism seriously". that is being disingenuous.


The way I see it, no one in America doubts that domestic terrorists exist. But they arent often guided by religious beliefs. Pages like Occupy Democrats and the left love to say "white Christians".

But none of these shootings were done in the name of Christ. Someone tried to say Tim McVeigh was a Christian, white terrorist. No, he wasn't a Christian..

Ahh the True Scotsman logical fallacy. Was wondering when that was going to come up.

When someone steps into a mosque just once in their entire life, or is of Arab descent, or was born in a Muslim country or even has parents that came from a Muslim country we are quick to label them Muslim. However we don't use the same logic in describing Christians. Tim McVeigh was confirmed raised Roman Catholic. If he were raised Muslim he would be labeled Muslim regardless of if he professed to be an atheist. So "liberals" are just using the same logical standards that conservatives are using but conservatives just don't like it.

If we are to stop all the bad things from happening, then we need to call things as they are. You tell me my point makes us more dangerous?

I think the left is playing a dangerous game. The want to play the political correctness game and deny that these people killing in the name of Allah.

There is a very real Muslim threat. Isis IS here. They're being investigated by the FBI in every single state.

Trump tries to put on a temporary ban from the 7 countries Obama and the country decided were the largest state sponsors of terror. Instead he's called a racist.

He wants to build a wall and add border security. Instead he's called racist.

The left does not care what Trump does. Their single goal is to destroy Trump and get him impeached.


If we are to stop all the bad things from happening, then we need to call things as they are. You tell me my point makes us more dangerous?.

The reason your point makes us more dangerous is because you are logically inconsistent. You use one set of standards when something fits your narrative and a completely different set of standards for things that do not.

All I ask is that you simply apply the same logic and reasoning and "standards" to everything. Apparently that is too much for the GOP.

There is a very real Muslim threat. Isis IS here. .
You are clueless to the argumentative problem with the above statement. YOu are basically equating all MUSLIMS to ISIS in the above statement. Your narrative and your tiny mind can't help but view Muslims as dangerous. There are 3.3 Million Muslims in the country. If there were a "credible" Muslim threat that you keep alluding to then where are the thousands upon thousands of daily attacks? Let me put this in perspective for you. There are only 1.3 Million law enforcement officers in the US. So Muslims in this country outnumber the law enforcement by almost 3 to 1.

So if what you say is true, where are all the attacks?

They're being investigated by the FBI in every single state..

What we are arguing is that the data and facts show that domestic terrorism is more of a problem then ISIS. And as such resources should be allocated accordingly. Why is this even an argument? Oh right, I forgot because your side is being emotional and not data driven.

Trump tries to put on a temporary ban from the 7 countries Obama and the country decided were the largest state sponsors of terror. Instead he's called a racist.

Really? That is why he was called a racist? Because he tried to put a temp ban on 7 Muslim countries, countries comprised of States that had nothing to do with 9/11.

He wants to build a wall and add border security. Instead he's called racist.
He is called a racist because he called all Mexicans rapists, murderers, and criminals and speaks about them in other deragotory fashions. He also supports policies like "Stop and Frisk" which is super racist and UNCONSTITUTIONAL and hurts the black and brown communities more so than the "crime" it is supposed to prevent.

*sigh* why do I even bother arguing the obvious. You are part of the problem. Rather than argue from a point of honesty you are arguing from a distorted reality in which you casually ignore the real reasons.

The left does not care what Trump does. Their single goal is to destroy Trump and get him impeached.

Quite the opposite. The Left Cares what Trump does because Trump's actions are scaring the begeezus out of all of us. He has spent more time playing golf in one month than Obama has in 4 years!!!! He has classified national security briefings in public at his country club during a national security crisis (N Korea missile launch). He has spent more time on the golf course than he has getting Intel Briefs and has publically stated he prefers to get his Intel from Fox News (this is akin to preferring bologna to fresh cut steak). He has threatened our allies, he has ties with Russia that should be investigated, his staff have questionable racial views and backgrounds, he keeps tweeting stuff that he shouldn't as President, he keeps spouting EASILY VERIFIABLE FALSEHOODS in press conferences, and he keeps displaying behaviors that hint strongly at mental instability (meglomania and extreme narcissism)....

Trump is coming off as incompetent and a man child and it is scaring the hell out of us and at this point I'd rather have Pence than Trump simply because at least Pence is sane. So please stop acting like the Left has no grounds for its viewpoints. And truth be told, many GOP types are now regreting their votes as well...
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Ahh the True Scotsman logical fallacy. Was wondering when that was going to come up.

You and I have discussed this on numerous occasions, putting more focus on Islamic extremism (as opposed to other forms) isn't always a case of "conservative hypocrisy" as a some on the far-left would like to portray it as.

Some of it comes from the mentality like Bill Maher and Sam Harris have (and as I have) which is, it's fine to acknowledge that all religions have their extremists, and extremists make up only a tiny fraction of the group (and therefore don't necessarily represent the whole group), however, it's the huge difference in the attitudes of the "non-extremists" of the groups that is cause for concern and why it's perfectly valid to focus more on one group than another.

If 1=Peace Loving Moderate and 10=Rabid Extremists...it's true that only a tiny fraction from the various faiths live in the 9-10 range...however, if the remainder from Religion A are in that 2-3 range, and the remainder from religion B are in the 6-7 range, it's perfectly reasonable to have more concerns about religion B.

Obviously we know that Trump isn't coming at it from that position, he's coming from it from the position of pandering to certain types of folks...

...but there is a valid case that can be made for having more concerns about Islam than Christianity. A person (or people) don't have to be full-blown ISIS members to have beliefs that are concerning or that make it difficult to integrate with westernized society. For example, look at the surveys of British Muslims and look at their attitudes on the gender roles, gays, freedom of speech, and separation of church and state. When 68% say that cartoonists should be locked up, over 50% say that people shouldn't be able to criticize their faith (under penalty of law), and 75% believe that men are above women, and just under half say that gays should be incarcerated, that's pretty troubling. Now, these aren't full blown ISIS terrorists by any means, they can look at what ISIS is doing and honestly say "that's wrong and we want no part of that", however, that doesn't mean they're moderates by westernized standards and it doesn't mean that having people with those mindsets coming in, in droves, won't cause some issues.


In terms of how it applies to the No True Scotsman fallacy accusation...what's the threshold/cutoff, in terms of overlapping ideals, at which we can say "okay, that person really isn't 'a scotsman'"?

If someone claimed to be a Christian, but said their beliefs were that the universe is just materialized vanilla pudding balanced on the back of a giant squid, we'd all obviously look at the person and say "okay, that's not a real Christian"...so how small can that overlap be where we can look at it and say "that's not a real XYZ".
 
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Rion

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No it shouldn't. It isn't the left trying to divide people by doing travel bans.

Do you deny that the left has, in recent years, become obsessed with identity politics? Because I consider that divisive.
 
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