Temper tantrums

[desi]

As for stopping a two year old's temper tantrum my wife and I try to keep them in the conversation with kid choices so they feel they are making a difference and don't get bored. Should we get this or that, both same kind of peanut butter. We gotta get bread, here would you be a big girl and hold it for mommy?

Since our children were old enough to understand it we've warned them about adults who try to steal children at the store when they are not by their mommys and daddys. This is handy when they decide to throw a tantrum. We usually just start walking off at a brisk pace and say 'see you later, I gotta get going.' When that happens the waterworks usually dry up quick and they start tagging along again.

 

[Blessed75]

This is handy when they decide to throw a tantrum. We usually just start walking off at a brisk pace and say 'see you later, I gotta get going.' When that happens the waterworks usually dry up quick and they start tagging along again.

My parents used this tactic on me and i have to say that it worked quite well.

 

[water_ripple]

That adult temper tantrum is a good idea. For my oldest daughter, 9, I told her I'd act retarded at her teacher conferences if she doesn't stop sassing. She's quite agreeable now.

LOL!!

 

[HeatherJay]

Just out of curiosity, why have you looked for alternatives? Do you find that you spank for the wrong reasons? As you seem to understand, spanking is a biblically based method of dealing with willfully rebellious behavior so why would you feel the need to find an alternative to a biblically based method?

Thanks,
God bless

Well, yes, sometimes I do find myself tempted to spank them for the wrong reasons...namely my own frustration. I think it is wrong to spank them just because I lose MY temper (isn't that just an adult form of a temper tantrum?) I do agree that there are times when spanking is appropriate. Mainly rudeness and backtalk...I will not tolerate disrespect and they know that, even the 2 year old (she doesn't really talkback yet, but she knows that good manners...please, thank you, yes maam, yes sir, etc...are very important). But, the normal day to day things...arguing with her sister, getting into things...those things for me are better handled with time outs or the loss of priviledges (sp?).

Love, Heather

 

[water_ripple]

Well, yes, sometimes I do find myself tempted to spank them for the wrong reasons...namely my own frustration. I think it is wrong to spank them just because I lose MY temper (isn't that just an adult form of a temper tantrum?) I do agree that there are times when spanking is appropriate. Mainly rudeness and backtalk...I will not tolerate disrespect and they know that, even the 2 year old (she doesn't really talkback yet, but she knows that good manners...please, thank you, yes maam, yes sir, etc...are very important). But, the normal day to day things...arguing with her sister, getting into things...those things for me are better handled with time outs or the loss of priviledges (sp?).

Love, Heather

I agree with you here. I do sometimes spank my child, but when I am angry I give her a time out. I never want to spank her when I am angry. I would never intentionally do anything to hurt her, and I simply eliminate the chance by not spanking when I am angry.

 

[Reformationist]

Since our children were old enough to understand it we've warned them about adults who try to steal children at the store when they are not by their mommys and daddys. This is handy when they decide to throw a tantrum. We usually just start walking off at a brisk pace and say 'see you later, I gotta get going.' When that happens the waterworks usually dry up quick and they start tagging along again.

You control your child's misbehavior by scaring them into thinking there's a possibility they'll be kidnapped???!!!

Did I misunderstand you?

 

[Reformationist]

Well, yes, sometimes I do find myself tempted to spank them for the wrong reasons...namely my own frustration. I think it is wrong to spank them just because I lose MY temper (isn't that just an adult form of a temper tantrum?) I do agree that there are times when spanking is appropriate. Mainly rudeness and backtalk...I will not tolerate disrespect and they know that, even the 2 year old (she doesn't really talkback yet, but she knows that good manners...please, thank you, yes maam, yes sir, etc...are very important). But, the normal day to day things...arguing with her sister, getting into things...those things for me are better handled with time outs or the loss of priviledges (sp?).

Love, Heather

I absolutely agree and I think that sounds like a great way to deal with it. If I may (I say this because most people get very defensive if they feel they are being told how to raise their children), as they get older you might want to recognize that willful rebellion, the only biblically supported spanking offense, is not always so easy to recognize as blatant, outward defiance. The good rule of thumb (not that you can't ever extend grace) for determining the willfulness of a child's rebellion is to first determine if the standard, expected level of compliance has been learned. It would be wrong for me to spank my children for doing something they didn't know was wrong. However, children learn quite quickly what is acceptable and what is not. I sometimes catch my son doing something that he knows he isn't supposed to be doing. The reason I know is because the minute I catch him he tries to stop doing it without bringing attention to himself. For instance, he knows not to open the entertainment unit doors and mess with the stuff inside. If I leave the room and come back in and see him in there he will look at me with a shocked look in his eyes and immediately close the door as if it's a boiling pot of water. He knows he was doing something he has been told not to do. That is a spanking offense. I didn't spank him the first time he did it. I didn't start spanking him for it until I knew that he understood that he should not do it.

Anyway, my point is, willful disobedience comes in many forms. A child who ignores their parents rules is being willfully defiant. If I tell my daughter, she's six, to go clean up her toys and when I go back to check on her progress she's sitting there playing with them she gets a spanking because she was openly disobeying me. Granted, she was being very passive about it. She didn't tell me no. My oldest son, he's seven, is famous for this. My wife will tell him it's time to come inside. He'll say, "Yes ma'am" and then he'll take his sweet, easy time coming in. That is a spanking offense. He was being very passive, saying what my wife wanted to hear, but openly defying her by disregarding her command to come inside.

Just some food for thought.

God bless

 

[Reformationist]

I agree with you here. I do sometimes spank my child, but when I am angry I give her a time out. I never want to spank her when I am angry. I would never intentionally do anything to hurt her, and I simply eliminate the chance by not spanking when I am angry.

That is a great rule to follow water_ripple. One thing that I have started trying to do more often is apologize to my children when I break the rules. It helps them understand that I make mistakes just like they do and it's important for us, as parents, to set the proper godly example for dealing with making a mistake.

God bless

 

[HeatherJay]

That is a great rule to follow water_ripple. One thing that I have started trying to do more often is apologize to my children when I break the rules. It helps them understand that I make mistakes just like they do and it's important for us, as parents, to set the proper godly example for dealing with making a mistake.

God bless

Reformationist, you are so right about apologizing to our kids when we make mistakes. This is something that I've made a conscious effort to do...when I do lose my temper and shout at them, or when I make a mistake and punish them before I understand the situation (blaming one when it might have been the fault of the other), etc. It's important that they know that we're not perfect just because we're grown. We should set an example that when we do something wrong we should admit it and then ask for forgiveness. I've seen the way this has helped my girls, especially my 4 year old. Now, more often than not, when she does get punished, she will come to me or her Daddy and say "I'm sorry." This just really amazes me because I was one of those moms that would MAKE her apologize to her sister, or MAKE her apologize to me or her daddy, and now, it's sincere and she does it on her own. Also, it's really been a lesson to me...and I've had to realize that just because I'm bigger than her and I'm her mom, that doesn't make me any less accountable when I do make a mistake. This doesn't mean that we're any less strict about the rules and the consequences, but it does show the kids that we respect them too.

Love, Heather

 

[water_ripple]

Reformationist, you are so right about apologizing to our kids when we make mistakes. This is something that I've made a conscious effort to do...when I do lose my temper and shout at them, or when I make a mistake and punish them before I understand the situation (blaming one when it might have been the fault of the other), etc. It's important that they know that we're not perfect just because we're grown. We should set an example that when we do something wrong we should admit it and then ask for forgiveness. I've seen the way this has helped my girls, especially my 4 year old. Now, more often than not, when she does get punished, she will come to me or her Daddy and say "I'm sorry." This just really amazes me because I was one of those moms that would MAKE her apologize to her sister, or MAKE her apologize to me or her daddy, and now, it's sincere and she does it on her own. Also, it's really been a lesson to me...and I've had to realize that just because I'm bigger than her and I'm her mom, that doesn't make me any less accountable when I do make a mistake. This doesn't mean that we're any less strict about the rules and the consequences, but it does show the kids that we respect them too.

Love, Heather

I totaly agree with you and Reformationist. Not only does this promote feelings to seek forgiveness, but also sets the example. It reinforces the idea that all people do make mistakes, and how important it is to try and not hurt others. This is also IMO a good early lesson to teach to children on the spiritual walk with Christ. As parents it is our job to set the example just as we are to follow the example of Jesus in our walk with God.

 

[Reformationist]

Reformationist, you are so right about apologizing to our kids when we make mistakes. This is something that I've made a conscious effort to do...when I do lose my temper and shout at them, or when I make a mistake and punish them before I understand the situation (blaming one when it might have been the fault of the other), etc. It's important that they know that we're not perfect just because we're grown. We should set an example that when we do something wrong we should admit it and then ask for forgiveness. I've seen the way this has helped my girls, especially my 4 year old. Now, more often than not, when she does get punished, she will come to me or her Daddy and say "I'm sorry." This just really amazes me because I was one of those moms that would MAKE her apologize to her sister, or MAKE her apologize to me or her daddy, and now, it's sincere and she does it on her own. Also, it's really been a lesson to me...and I've had to realize that just because I'm bigger than her and I'm her mom, that doesn't make me any less accountable when I do make a mistake. This doesn't mean that we're any less strict about the rules and the consequences, but it does show the kids that we respect them too.

Love, Heather

Nicely said. I'd also like to add that it's important for our children to understand that not only are we not perfect, we are not expected to be perfect.

I think that it's extremely helpful and important, as you noted, to set the example for our children, which is something I often fail at miserably. I often expect more of them then I do myself. Once I was putting something together, the source of many an adult temper tantrum for me, and I hit my thumb with a hammer and got mad and screamed obscenities and threw the hammer across the yard. As is always the case, I looked over and, lo and behold, there was my 4 year old daughter watching me intently. She never likes to be apart from me and so she often follows me around. I saw the look of confusion on her face and I said, "I'm sorry baby. Daddy didn't mean to act like that." She said, "That's okay daddy. I forgive you." The next day I was secretly watching her play with her dolls (I often do this because it's the source of great amusement for me to see her "be the mommy") and I saw her get frustrated and chunk her doll across the room. My first instict was to rush in there in a fury and fuss at her and take her dolls away, you know, to "teach her a lesson." Well, thanks be to the grace of God, I sublimated that and realized where I'd seen that behavior before. I was none too pleased to realize that I was the example for that behavior. Well, I walked in and said, "Sweetie, you shouldn't treat your stuff like that. If you have a problem controlling your temper I can help you out by taking your dolls away until you learn to respect them." Many would say that I should have done nothing because she learned that behavior from me. The problem is they don't differentiate between positional respect and personal respect. Regardless of my mistakes I still have a responsibility to train my children to behave in a godly way. Obviously not setting a good example will be a hit to my credibility as a person of integrity but it does not negate my equally important responsibility of teaching them the proper way to interact with difficulties. My children, by virtue of me having God granted authority over them, will submit to my positional authority and respect me. I have to earn personal respect. Showing your children that you, too, have rules to follow and authority to submit to, i.e., God, His Law, those He has placed in positions of authority like the government and law enforcement, etc, when those rules are broken is one way of gaining that personal respect.

Anyway, nicely said Heather.

God bless,
Don

 

[HeatherJay]

Well, thank you, Don And nicely said yourself. You sound like a wonderful father.

Love, Heather

 

[Reformationist]

Well, thank you, Don And nicely said yourself. You sound like a wonderful father.

Love, Heather

Well, I've got a wonderful wife and she loves me enough to help me learn to be the man that God wants me to be, even if I'm unappreciative some times.

But thanks for the compliment. Please pray that I can apply all the things as well as I can run my mouth about them.

God bless

 

[straightforward]

I have a 2yr old who also likes to throw fits. The spanking just makes him angry and he yells more (I don't spank him hard but hard enough for him to know) because he is not getting his way. And that is when I direct him to his time out. Usually this gets his attention. He might not stop his tantrum as he goes but he sure goes. I don't even need to carry him to it (and if I carry him to his time out he usually stops the fit because he knows he's really in trouble when that happens) I can point in the direction of the couch or his bed and he knows what I'm saying whether or not he can hear it over his fit. When he makes it to the destination on his own it only takes a little while before he's stopped crying and figured out that what he wants is not worth the fit. I think the reason doctors will suggest the time out is because some kids will go into a tantrum over the littlest thing...esp. the things that are not worth a spanking. My son doesn't talk a lot so sometimes he is just throwing a fit because I have not understood him. Now, I don't want to give him control and I don't want him to think that a tantrum is the way to communicate...so he gets a time out until he can do what he needs to do to let me know what he's trying to communicate. BTW...I tried to show him what a real tantrum looks like and we both laughed. It didn't accomplish much...but at the same time when it's something really stupid that doesn't even merit a tantrum I can get him to stop real quick if I make him laugh and then we can get on with a civil request for whatever it was he wanted. He doesn't ask for much more than food or drink (he doesn't do much more than...what I call...snack but that would be another thread for me to start!) or to go outside...which is when I tell him that mom has to do her chores before she can go outside and he handles that pretty well.

I don't know that I can suggest anything but I sure will be checking out any other suggestions that will come along on this thread...it is very timely for me.

 

[Reformationist]

Yesterday I was at my daughter's soccer practice and I was talking with a couple of other parents about our children's proclivity to be rebellious. One of the mothers of the girls on my daughter's team was saying that she was reading the book "How to negotiate with your child." I have to tell you, I am shocked when I hear people entertain this kind of literature. Now, for the record, I have not read the book but judging by the title (I know you shouldn't judge a book by it's cover

) I'd say it's more in line with these ridiculous "your children are people too, Dr. Spock" type books.

I reeeeaaaally wanted to say, "Ma'am, do you want to see how to negotiate with your child? You say to them, 'I told you what to do now go do it. If you don't go do it, you've just negotiated your way into a spanking.'"

I think people are too hung up on treating their children like equals. People, your child is not your equal. They are under your authority. They are equal in value to God but it was God that put you in authority over your children. It's not a democracy (as my sweet, little southern momma used to regularly tell me

).

The prior poster made some comments about her son displaying an unacceptable attitude when being punished that I all too often see in alot of children nowadays. When my children are being punished or spanked I certainly don't expect them to be happy about it but there is one aspect to their response that is significant to take note of. If I spank my children they are more than justified to cry. If, they start displaying irrational behavior about receiving punishment (something my dauther used to do), then it's quite obvious that they have not truly accepted that they deserve the punishment or spanking.

Although my children are young, 7, 6, and 2 (this month), they have learned to accept their punishment with an appropriate attitude. Even my youngest obeys me when I tell him to come to me and put his hand out to be smacked. He just does it. He doesn't hesitate. That doesn't mean he fully understands all aspects of what he did wrong but he does accept that he did something wrong. I rarely have to call him twice.

Anyway, just something else to consider. Just for the record, if I comment in disagreement with another parent's method of child rearing it doesn't mean I'm saying you're a bad parent or that I have all the answers. I have just read a lot of biblically based books on parenting and I have found that bible based methods, which include corporal punishment, are the most consistantly effective.

For those of you who may think it sounds like I spank my children too much let me assure you that none of my children are afraid of me and I do alot more than just spank them. I spend a lot of time with them. My wife goes to school from 5:30 p.m. to 10:30 p.m., Monday through Friday so I get alot of opportunities to practice my parenting and spend quality, loving, productive time with my children, catagories in which I include spanking.

I believe that a spanking that is administered properly in the proper spirit is an expression of love, although I'm pretty positive that my children would prefer a hug over a spanking.

God bless

 

[straightforward]

Speaking of books...Has anyone here read the book by Dr.Greg Cynaumon called 'Discover Your Childs DQ Factor'? (DQ stands for Discipline Quotient). I have not made it all the way through the book yet but it is a pretty interesting read and written with a Christian world-view. It goes into why certain children misbehave certain ways and how (depending on why they are misbehaving) certain methods of discipline may or may not be productive. For example, some children misbehave for attention so those children would be getting attention (even if negative) when they get a lecture but are more apt to respond to a time out or a grounding to their room (where they receive a minimum of attention). There are four major types that are pointed out in this book and it has alot of information in it that has helped me as a parent to see things about my reaction that I had not seen before and also how to head some of these things off with good parenting skills. Anyway, just thought I'd mention it.

 

[Beckijhn]

I don't have much time to write but I wanted to mention Cynthia Tobias' book You_Can't_Make_Me. She has some killer insight into the mind of strong willed children (having been one and having taught for a lot of years).

My own daughter started throwing fits at a young age and it took me a long time ot figure her out - she just thinks differently than my other two. Fit throwing at any age is wrong! If only I'd figured her out earlier LOL so much time wasted with screaming and yelling and time outs.

 

[water_ripple]

I think people are too hung up on treating their children like equals. People, your child is not your equal. They are under your authority. They are equal in value to God but it was God that put you in authority over your children. It's not a democracy (as my sweet, little southern momma used to regularly tell me

).

I agree that our children are not our equals. They lack life experience to make appropratie decisions, and if they do not have an example to follow the results can be detremental. A child that does not recieve discipline and left to their own limited devices usually end up making bad decisions all their lives. If a child does not recieve discipline how in the world will they be aware of the consequences of complicated adult decisions? Trial and error? Yikes!

And possibly the line of thinking: well this behavior has hurt people in the past, but I want (a shirt in a store as an example) now how can I go about it without suffering the consequences? IMO I think if one decides their child is their equal the parent could be setting the child up for failure. Children do not have the capacity for complicated decisions, and I think it's sad when some choose not to govern their children. I want my children to have a better life than I did, but refusing to discipline isn't the answer. Many times I was left to my own devices, and made bad decisions. I sufferd the consequences too, and even though I didn't like the thought of being told what to do I think perhaps they should've made me. Sometimes I did things just to see how much I could get away with.

I do believe that our children have feelings of their own that are very important. I think it is important to consider the feelings of a child. I do not however feel that discipline should be witheld because of feelings. If they've made an error I feel it is my responsiblity to discipline the behavior by burden of example. I also think it is important to discipline with love and in the spirit of Christ.

For those of you who may think it sounds like I spank my children too much let me assure you that none of my children are afraid of me and I do alot more than just spank them. I spend a lot of time with them. My wife goes to school from 5:30 p.m. to 10:30 p.m., Monday through Friday so I get alot of opportunities to practice my parenting and spend quality, loving, productive time with my children, catagories in which I include spanking.

IMO raising children is the most difficult task on earth and the most rewarding. It has brought a great joy into my life and I thank God that He has blessed me. Rasing kids (in my experience) has been quite the balancing act. I am a stay at home mom so I am with my kids a lot as well. I think discipline and love go hand in hand, and I care enough for my children to set an example. I am not perfect by any means: Sometimes a curse slips out, and I apologize...sometimes I will yell for no good reason except that I am angry, and I apologize. Sometimes I will have an adult temper tantrum, and I apologize.

Then I also reinforce my apology with a hug and a kiss.

This is simply my approach to parenting and does not in any way mean that I think others who approach differently are incorrect or unfit. Everybody is different and that's okay.

 

[HeatherJay]

I agree, Water. And, Reformationist, I'm willing to bet that the kisses and hugs that you give your kids far outnumber the spankings.

Another point that I think is important to make is this: Don't hold a grudge over your child. If they do something wrong, explain to them why they're in trouble, punish them, and then FORGIVE them...move on. It really pains me when I see some parents who continue to remind their children how bad they were yesterday, or what a mess they made at breakfast that morning. As Reformationist mentioned a post or two ago, it's our responsibility to try and set a Godly example for them. Forgiveness!

Obviously, this post is directed at noone in particular in this forum...it's just something that I see from time to time and it troubles me to no end.

Love, Heather

 

[Etharia]

Allow me to add a semi-child's point of view.

Whenever any of the seven children (myself and my six siblings) disobeyed, on top of the punishment, my mom would always take us aside, individually, and help us to pray for forgiveness and then give us a hug afterward. This helped us to know that, although we were wrong and deserved to be punished, our mom loved us and we can always be forgiven by our heavenly Father.

Also, at some point you will have to deal with your children lying to you. I know a woman who would not punish her children for disobeying, if they told her that they had done it. This she said, was to promote telling the truth. However, all this taught them was that they could do whatever they wanted without consequences. I suggest that you have a punishment for the disobeydience and one for the lying. Then, if they are truthful and come to you and tell you what they've done, they avoid one punishment, but are still disceplined for the rebellion.

One more thing, make sure that your children know that forgiveness is a decision and not a feeling. When you forgive, you make a descision to forgive. It has nothing to do with how you feel. You can, actually make yourself forive others and this tends to take away at least most of the anger and resentment. We were never allowed to get away with, "But I don't forgive her, I'm still mad" because we were taught that forgiveness is a decision of the heart. And the same thing goes for repentance.

Well, I don't know if I helped anyone, but that's my opinion.
I like coming to this section of the forums to get ideas. I'm 19 and so I think a lot about being a mom and wife. It's nice to see what everyone says and to get new ideas for when I get the privilage of being a mommy and wife.