Jesus told that man that for a reason, because he was trusting in his money. It's not something you can apply across the board. It's also something that has to be voluntary to matter. Taxes aren't voluntary.
You're forgetting one big thing here...Jesus DID NOT say, "Government officials go and tax the rich man regardless of his will!"Well...what did Jesus say?
18A certain ruler asked him, “Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?”
19“Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone. 20You know the commandments: ‘You shall not commit adultery, you shall not murder, you shall not steal, you shall not give false testimony, honor your father and mother.’ a ”
21“All these I have kept since I was a boy,” he said.
22When Jesus heard this, he said to him, “You still lack one thing. Sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me.”
23When he heard this, he became very sad, because he was very wealthy. 24Jesus looked at him and said, “How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God! 25Indeed, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”
This wasn't 10, 20. 30, 40 , 95% but ALL
So was Jesus the 1st thief of the rich?
Yes that's an exhortation to be generous and helpful if you have the means. It is not a mandate for worldly leaders go ahead and tax anybody who has anything into the ground.Most Christians (love to) assume, that it only applied to that particular poor rich guy (pardon the pun!), lol!
But then we also have this verse:
1 John 3:16-18
This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers and sisters. 17 If anyone has material possessions and sees a brother or sister in need but has no pity on them, how can the love of God be in that person? 18 Dear children, let us not love with words or speech but with actions and in truth.
And let's not forget about Zacchaeus.
I think that if taxation was "theft" Jesus would have spoken against it when he took on that topic specifically.
It's not true that "I see".What's not true? Please be specific.
Why should we be forced to pay for programs that we may or may not use, even programs that we may or may not agree with? Giving to the disadvantaged is something every Christian should do in one way or another, but if it's compulsory, or if a lot of the funds go to government bureaucrats, that's a whole other issue.It's not true that "I see".
Good question. But if the government stopped funding programs that some individuals disagreed with we wouldn't have any programs at all.Why should we be forced to pay for programs that we may or may not use, even programs that we may or may not agree with? Giving to the disadvantaged is something every Christian should do in one way or another, but if it's compulsory, or if a lot of the funds go to government bureaucrats, that's a whole other issue.
I think that's the point.Good question. But if the government stopped funding programs that some individuals disagreed with we wouldn't have any programs at all.
I dunno.You can find he potentially did when he stated about having wealth you need to understand....not to have your faith put in what you've got stored up for the worldly system can break into it where moth and rust does corrupt and where thieves can break in and steal. Matt 6:19
First it all depends on what you mean by taxation. God is all in favour of services given would rightly need to be provided for...(in modern setting today the paying for essential services...police, teachers, road repair, and the list can go on. When people work they deserve pay....HOWEVER rolling out the candies at election time providing all free things violates others principles of God which says if a man doesn't work neither than should he eat. 2 Thess 3:10
So the question is...what do you mean by taxation? Forcing people to give up wealth and have it dished out to individuals from which the other didn't benefit any way from them providing a service? That's a whole different ball park than the other and thus does become thievery. That's NOT TO SAY the wealthy shouldn't help those in need who haven't provided a service but it's a heart thing of giving from FREE WILL. Not a force thing by government demanding.
In order to have adequate funding when that "may use" becomes the reality.Why should we be forced to pay for programs that we may or may not use..
If that's what they ask then that's what I'd give. They printed/coined it, it's ultimately theirs. They can devalue it if they really want to.By that logic, then jack the tax rate to 100% and give all the cash back to the government.
I wouldn't and didn't say you're being brainwashed but rather just listening to others. I felt that was better than thinking you came up with this on your own as it would absolve you from the responsibility for it, so I was actually trying to give you the benefit of the doubt. In either case you do agree with a lot of those folks.I am a bit taken back that you think I'm listening to people and being brainwashed. I arrived at these conclusions on my own, and they simply happened to be supported by others.
If you want to fight for true prosperity and freedom of others then use God's Word which is sharper than any two-edged sword. The "oppression of socialism" is not a real thing in the US so you're tilting at windmills and being distracted from serving God by fighting imaginary boogie men.I fight for the prosperity and freedom of others, including the poor and those who are trying to make ends meet. They do not deserve to have their labor stripped from them. I am fighting against the oppression of socialism, which seeks to place the state equal to God and bring about the 2nd coming of Christ without Him present. I will never bow to fallible man, I will never become a subject.
Completely irrelevant. The semantics of "subject" vs. "citizen" are not relevant - all people, including citizens, are subject to their governmental authority. However that authority chooses to tax them is up to that authority and all who are subject to them are bound to comply. God's Word teaches us in that pesky Romans chapter 13 that we are to be subject to these authorities and to pay tax to them for that service they provide us.The Imperial Tax, in the context of Matthew 22, was levied against non-Roman subjects (ie: The Jews), whereas Roman citizens did not have to pay the tax. This is why I preface that we are citizens and not subjects.
I think you mean 2 Corinthians 9 (or as Trump would say, "two Corinthians..." LOL)1 Corinthians 9
One cannot cheerfully give by force. If the state takes from me under threat, then that is theft. If the state seeks to offer me a service which I can choose to participate in or not, then my willfully donations to my churches and charities are cheerfully given.
This is a load of malarkey. If you are subject to God then you would obey Him and if you obey Him then you would be subject to the earthly authorities He has placed above you.Your tactic a rhetoric is the same used by 19th century slave holders to justify slavery. Those running the state are my equal; they are everyone's equal. Therefore I shall be subject to no man, and only to God.
Where if anywhere in Scripture does Yahuweh the Creator OR Jesus "promote the common good" as opposed to working all things forMany of the posts here are very disheartening. While I don't think that they represent the teachings of Jesus personally, I fear that some people will think they do and that that will weaken their faith. I hate seeing the Gospel interpreted in a way that does not promote the common good.
If that's what they ask then that's what I'd give. They printed/coined it, it's ultimately theirs. They can devalue it if they really want to.
I wouldn't and didn't say you're being brainwashed but rather just listening to others. I felt that was better than thinking you came up with this on your own as it would absolve you from the responsibility for it, so I was actually trying to give you the benefit of the doubt. In either case you do agree with a lot of those folks.
If you want to fight for true prosperity and freedom of others then use God's Word which is sharper than any two-edged sword. The "oppression of socialism" is not a real thing in the US so you're tilting at windmills and being distracted from serving God by fighting imaginary boogie men.
Completely irrelevant. The semantics of "subject" vs. "citizen" are not relevant - all people, including citizens, are subject to their governmental authority. However that authority chooses to tax them is up to that authority and all who are subject to them are bound to comply. God's Word teaches us in that pesky Romans chapter 13 that we are to be subject to these authorities and to pay tax to them for that service they provide us.
Like it or not, you ARE a subject, even as a citizen. You don't like it? Go find a piece of unclaimed land that is not protected or served by any other governmental authority and set up your own libertarian paradise. Good luck with that. (Of course you won't - you're perfectly content with how God has it set up with you being a subject of the USA's government but you will leverage your libertarian propaganda in an effort to remove responsibility from yourself and shift it to others, which is the ultimate goal of libertarianism in reality).
I think you mean 2 Corinthians 9 (or as Trump would say, "two Corinthians..." LOL)
You're wrong again. God's Word does not instruct on having a choice or options. It simply states to subject yourself to the authorities that God has placed above you because they are His ministers to justice AND that you must pay the tax demanded of you because this is their compensation. It's very clear, black and white, right there in the Word of God.
This is a load of malarkey. If you are subject to God then you would obey Him and if you obey Him then you would be subject to the earthly authorities He has placed above you.
Once more, from the Word of God:
Romans 13
1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.
3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same:
4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil.
5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake.
6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.
7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.
You buck against this clear instruction from God and He says right here that by resisting you "resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation."
You are in grave error. If you want to be libertarian in your politics then have at it, but don't pretend it's in line with Christianity when God's Word provides clear and direct instruction that goes directly AGAINST your libertarian viewpoint and message.
We saw how private charity worked for 5000.years or more--with disastrous results.
The government supports your charitable taxdonations by making them tax deductible. They are basically Revenue sharing with you when you make a deductible contribution. And they allow the tax deduction even when churches make people listen to sermons or attend services in order to get the aid. In my town children had to have their feet washed by do-gooders, some of whom.are self-righteous, in order to get school supplies. That makes me sick. God reveals himself to different people in different ways. and what I know for sure is that God would never want me or anyone else to use the Bible to justify selfishness or to let children go hungry in school.
Many of the posts here are very disheartening. While I don't think that they represent the teachings of Jesus personally, I fear that some people will think they do and that that will weaken their faith. I hate seeing the Gospel interpreted in a way that does not promote the common good.
Atheist leaders? Who are they?Atheists cannot be ministers of God. So your narrative shows that our current atheist leaders need not apply here. And what is their message? Disarmament, higher taxation, continued oppression of the poor, and open borders. Whatever evils shall come from their mouths we should oppose, for they are in opposition to the inalienable rights provided to us by God.