Tattoos

[faroukfarouk]

Not so much faith-based, but personal history based. One is already in Japanese, I got Amerika-no-Heishi in kana/kanji (American Soldier). I was originally planning on Pro Deo et Patria on my right arm, then I was thinking maybe Kami-sama to Kokoku no tabe ni (literally, for the sake of God and Country), and I've been leaning toward dropping the patriotic reference in favor of a more faith based approach, having done my time and ready to be done. Beside, (needing to check my conjugation) Shinje, Kibou and Ai are all single kanji, the more patriotice phrase is almost a full sentence.

Sounds very interesting; do you have a good parlor near you? and did you use it for your existing ones? maybe you're expecting to use the same one for your next one?

Blessings.

 

[bushinoki]

There are several good parlors in the area. I'm going to look into seeing if the one I used for my first two is still open, but it's been about seven years, as I was stationed here at Ft. Carson from 2006-2010, and was recently re-stationed here earlier this year.

There's one I won't use, the B Street parlor, because I've heard a few infection stories and the one time I went in to look, the place just looked filthy. B Street is also that street with a reputation for Ft. Carson (the strip club is on it, as well as the discount divorce lawyer and shady used car lot). That's your PSA on tattoos for this thread, if you're going to get one, you need to choose a good parlor/artist with a good reputation, that uses near surgical cleanliness standards.

 

[faroukfarouk]

There are several good parlors in the area. I'm going to look into seeing if the one I used for my first two is still open, but it's been about seven years, as I was stationed here at Ft. Carson from 2006-2010, and was recently re-stationed here earlier this year.

There's one I won't use, the B Street parlor, because I've heard a few infection stories and the one time I went in to look, the place just looked filthy. B Street is also that street with a reputation for Ft. Carson (the strip club is on it, as well as the discount divorce lawyer and shady used car lot). That's your PSA on tattoos for this thread, if you're going to get one, you need to choose a good parlor/artist with a good reputation, that uses near surgical cleanliness standards.

Good points to bear in mind!

Do a lot of your comrades that you know in the military have tattoos? It seems to be as popular as ever among military people, but this is just my impression. With the admission of more women to the military, this may have increased the proportion of tattooed military personnel, from what I've read.

Blessings.

 

[faroukfarouk]

I already have two, and I'm planning at least one more, though I haven't decided exactly what form it's going to take, although I'm leaning toward "Faith, Hope, Love" in Japanese. I feel no conviction whatsoever over getting another tattoo.

Sounds like you are pretty confident about going under the needle for faith based ink.

 

[dragongunner]

We had some folks in my old "pentecostal" church who had tattoo's, and no one put up a fuss or said anything bad about them. All who had them though kept them covered, they were in my talks with some, ashamed they had. They even wore long sleeve shirts in summer so not to be seen. For me there is no way I would ever be talked into one, nor do I feel they are right for men and woman of God, but I use the word "feel", and this is for me. So I would never do it, it would go against my conscience that God has given me. I have friends who are christians and have various tattoo's and see nothing wrong, however I hate seeing them, they simply discuss me as much at smoking. I just don't see Mary the mother of Jesus going to a tattoo parlor for any type. I don't see Jesus getting one or his apostles either….to me there is something very wrong, and I can't imagine the Lord ever giving me permission to do so no matter how much I prayed about it. So those of you who do, and think its right, thats your right….but realize there are some christians that don't agree with them, and we don't want to see them. But hey, its the cool thing these days, along with all kinds of body piercings….I always liked the scripture, "come out from among them and be ye separate saith the Lord, touch not the unclean thing and I will make you my sons and daughters." But this is my "feelings", no one has to agree, we all will stand before God and give account, the least of my worries are going to be if someone has a tattoo, if God tells ya its ok and to do it then have at it. Just don't tell me that its OK to have one and theres nothing wrong with them.

 

[bushinoki]

Farouk, yes a lot of military personnel do have tattoos of some kind. It actually became an issue when they revised AR 670-1, the regulation governing appearance, because it became a career hindrance to those who joined under the old rules. There are still rules about what is acceptable, there always been (nothing derogatory, racist, etc..), but there was a flood this last spring of people trying to get memos done documenting their tattoos below the knees and elbows. They've since backed off on some things, such as people who have grandfathered tattoos still being able to apply for commissioned/warrant officer.

As for my confidence, dragongunner pointed it out, it's as much a cultural thing as anything else. I won't put anything on my body "just because", everything I'm putting on my body has meaning. But I was born in 1980. I have one foot in Generation X and the other in Millennial. Telling someone my age or younger not to get tattoos is like telling the Japanese they can't practice taiko drumming, aikido or kendo. It's become a part of our culture.

And since I've now opened that can of worms, I am going to stand by my conviction that "cultural relevancy" has to do with keeping the core truth of the Gospel, but allowing cultural forms to shape how we express that truth.

 

[faroukfarouk]

Farouk, yes a lot of military personnel do have tattoos of some kind. It actually became an issue when they revised AR 670-1, the regulation governing appearance, because it became a career hindrance to those who joined under the old rules. There are still rules about what is acceptable, there always been (nothing derogatory, racist, etc..), but there was a flood this last spring of people trying to get memos done documenting their tattoos below the knees and elbows. They've since backed off on some things, such as people who have grandfathered tattoos still being able to apply for commissioned/warrant officer.

As for my confidence, dragongunner pointed it out, it's as much a cultural thing as anything else. I won't put anything on my body "just because", everything I'm putting on my body has meaning. But I was born in 1980. I have one foot in Generation X and the other in Millennial. Telling someone my age or younger not to get tattoos is like telling the Japanese they can't practice taiko drumming, aikido or kendo. It's become a part of our culture.

And since I've now opened that can of worms, I am going to stand by my conviction that "cultural relevancy" has to do with keeping the core truth of the Gospel, but allowing cultural forms to shape how we express that truth.

bushinoki:

Well, yes, this is how I feel about the medium.

Rather than fighting against this hugely widespread medium, many Christians now embrace it and express themselves with faith based ink that is very much proven to be effective in witness conversation, right?

It's still an individual thing; no one should told they 'ought' to get a tattoo.

But so many now do.

Blessings.

 

[bushinoki]

Farouk, I agree. No one should be forced to get a tattoo. Like I said, mine all have meaning to me. I haven't put anything on my body I'm going to regret having. No one should feel pressured to put something on their body that they are either stuck with or will have to pay a small fortune to have removed.

 

[faroukfarouk]

[.]

 

[faroukfarouk]

Farouk, I agree. No one should be forced to get a tattoo. Like I said, mine all have meaning to me. I haven't put anything on my body I'm going to regret having. No one should feel pressured to put something on their body that they are either stuck with or will have to pay a small fortune to have removed.

bushinoki:

On the other hand, among military personnel, having it done, does seem to have become sort of voluntary rite of passage for a large proportion, including — even especially? — among women, and among military spouses, doesn't it?

 

[bushinoki]

I wouldn't say rite of passage. Who joins the military is a matter of the economy and the times. A lot of military spouses already have their tattoos upon entering the military community. This is a matter of many older adults joining the military in their mid-20s versus the traditional 18-20 year old joining while single. Many military spouses get their tattoos after their spouse enlists, but these are tattoos they likely would have gotten anyway.

With military personnel it is slightly different. I had planned on getting certain tattoos even before I enlisted, I just never had the money for them. I only got the American Soldier one because I joined, however, I got something that was unique and had meaning to me. There was never any pressure on me to get something specific, although a few people have suggested I get something featuring a red castle, the emblem of the US Army Corps of Engineers. A lot of personnel never get anything military related as it is. It actually amazes some people when they see me in PTs or a short-sleeve shirt and they see I have tattoos. These people all say the same thing, "You don't seem the type."

 

[faroukfarouk]

I wouldn't say rite of passage. Who joins the military is a matter of the economy and the times. A lot of military spouses already have their tattoos upon entering the military community. This is a matter of many older adults joining the military in their mid-20s versus the traditional 18-20 year old joining while single. Many military spouses get their tattoos after their spouse enlists, but these are tattoos they likely would have gotten anyway.

With military personnel it is slightly different. I had planned on getting certain tattoos even before I enlisted, I just never had the money for them. I only got the American Soldier one because I joined, however, I got something that was unique and had meaning to me. There was never any pressure on me to get something specific, although a few people have suggested I get something featuring a red castle, the emblem of the US Army Corps of Engineers. A lot of personnel never get anything military related as it is. It actually amazes some people when they see me in PTs or a short-sleeve shirt and they see I have tattoos. These people all say the same thing, "You don't seem the type."

So who IS the "type" to have them?

It does seem that a high proportion of military spouses have them, though, for whatever reason.

 

[bushinoki]

I'm not sure whom I would classify as the "type". I think it just surprises some people because I'm an anomaly in the combat engineer world. While most 12Bs (Combat Engineers) have a certain cunning, and, in my experience, slightly higher intelligence, they are not the most academic in nature. I, on the other hand, have a very academic personality, and only in basic/OSUT, did I ever have what the average 12B would consider a "decent" PT score. My last PT Test, I barely passed.

As for the military spouses, a significant number of their sponsors also have tattoos, as well as the marks of multiple body piercings. The tattoos are not a problem as long as they are within regs, or in some cases a waiver is granted, and the piercing marks are not a problem as long as they are not wearing them while in uniform or while utilizing on post services (PX, gas station, etc.). A large part of it might simply be the corporate world is not ready to lay down its' bias against tattoos and body piercing. It's also been the economy that has driven many service members into the military. Many of these people likely would not have joined if it hadn't been for the lack of entry level jobs that pays a living wage.

Most of the soldiers I know would go nuts in a corporate office. It's not just the corporate cultural taboo against tattoos either. It's the corporate culture as a whole. And while there are those that might find it counter-intuitive that these same people who thrive in the military would hate corporate culture, it's because the military, while having a similar structure to many corporations, is entirely mission driven, and that accomplishing the military mission is a culture unto itself and different than anything the corporate world has to offer.

 

[faroukfarouk]

I'm not sure whom I would classify as the "type". I think it just surprises some people because I'm an anomaly in the combat engineer world. While most 12Bs (Combat Engineers) have a certain cunning, and, in my experience, slightly higher intelligence, they are not the most academic in nature. I, on the other hand, have a very academic personality, and only in basic/OSUT, did I ever have what the average 12B would consider a "decent" PT score. My last PT Test, I barely passed.

As for the military spouses, a significant number of their sponsors also have tattoos, as well as the marks of multiple body piercings. The tattoos are not a problem as long as they are within regs, or in some cases a waiver is granted, and the piercing marks are not a problem as long as they are not wearing them while in uniform or while utilizing on post services (PX, gas station, etc.). A large part of it might simply be the corporate world is not ready to lay down its' bias against tattoos and body piercing. It's also been the economy that has driven many service members into the military. Many of these people likely would not have joined if it hadn't been for the lack of entry level jobs that pays a living wage.

Most of the soldiers I know would go nuts in a corporate office. It's not just the corporate cultural taboo against tattoos either. It's the corporate culture as a whole. And while there are those that might find it counter-intuitive that these same people who thrive in the military would hate corporate culture, it's because the military, while having a similar structure to many corporations, is entirely mission driven, and that accomplishing the military mission is a culture unto itself and different than anything the corporate world has to offer.

Interesting comments about the military versus the corporate world.

I think that these days in offices plenty of women, including those with responsible positions, would have double pierced ears, etc., (and if the truth is known some ink under their long sleeves as well.

 

[bushinoki]

But, you still aren't seeing much of other piercings (nose, lips, etc), and you don't see much of the men with piercings. And a tattoo that isn't easily completely covered is entirely a rarity.

 

[faroukfarouk]

There are several good parlors in the area. I'm going to look into seeing if the one I used for my first two is still open..

It's good to check parlors out and not only compare quotes but get the feel of whether you trust the establishment.

 

[MissRowy]

The place I had my last tattoos done is still going...I need mine redone as its fading....but it costs money and I need to save money

 

[Alithis]

or you could ask the lord HIS will .. and do that with the money .

 

[faroukfarouk]

or you could ask the lord HIS will .. and do that with the money .

...and maybe you'll also accept MissRowy as a Divine mouthpiece to tell you how you must spend your money?

It's a matter for the individual conscience before God.

 

[faroukfarouk]

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