Superiority Complex.

[Livindesert]

For me, I know Orthodox Christianity is it because, well, there is nowhere else to go after this.

Not from the Baha'i point of view But we still view what we consider prior dispensations to be valid paths to lead one to God.

 

[Josiah14]

Well, again, I go with what God has said in God's word. He says, directly, that you can conquer sin and that the things He commands are not out of reach.

I understand that runs contrary to Christian views, but it is in the Bible.

Christians do not decy this claim made in the Scriptures. Rather, we assert, you CAN conquer sin... with God's help.

Sin, really, is a failure to allow God to dwell in your heart (nous). In as much as you conquer sin, you commune with God, so, you cannot conquer sin on your own, for to do so, you have to accept God, and humility is necessary for this. This is the same, whether in the Old Testament or the New.

The difference in the NT is that death has been turned from a curse into a blessing. I mean, that death has become the way by which a Christian can enter into Eternity with God, rather than a tragic consequence of sin. Christ took human suffering and made it the means by which we are reunited to God.

 

[Josiah14]

Not from the Baha'i point of view But we still view what we consider prior dispensations to be valid paths to lead one to God.

So, what do you say about religions like Christianity and Islam, which assert themselves as the only way to God, and that other religions will, if followed exactly, lead one away from God?

 

[b&wpac4]

Sin, really, is a failure to allow God to dwell in your heart (nous). In as much as you conquer sin, you commune with God, so, you cannot conquer sin on your own, for to do so, you have to accept God, and humility is necessary for this. This is the same, whether in the Old Testament or the New.

That's fine. I can even agree with that in principal. That being said, to me all the tools I need are in Judaism. Jesus is not necessary, the sacrifice is not necessary.

 

[Livindesert]

So, what do you say about religions like Christianity and Islam, which assert themselves as the only way to God, and that other religions will, if followed exactly, lead one away from God?

Everyone says they are the only way even Baha'u'llah(who we view as Jesus's second comming). Ultimately there is no Christian, Jew , or Baha'i only the religion of God. So each Prophet is just refreshing the religion of God as needed for the time and place it is in.

So we don't view Christianity,Judaism, and Islam as false we say they are true but believe ours is the "freshest/most potent" of the religion of God.

 

[Josiah14]

That's fine. I can even agree with that in principal. That being said, to me all the tools I need are in Judaism. Jesus is not necessary, the sacrifice is not necessary.

Without Christ's sacrifice, you cannot conquer death.

 

[b&wpac4]

Without Christ's sacrifice, you cannot conquer death.

The resurrection of the dead is in the prophets. It appears that I can.

 

[Josiah14]

Everyone says they are the only way even Baha'u'llah(who we view as Jesus's second comming). Ultimately there is no Christian, Jew , or Baha'i only the religion of God. So each Prophet is just refreshing the religion of God as needed for the time and place it is in.

So we don't view Christianity,Judaism, and Islam as false we say they are true but believe ours is the "freshest/most potent" of the religion of God.

Interesting. I have never spoken before to anyone who practiced Baha'i.

Christianity would assert that Christ is the only True God, and that the only way to God is by Christ. However, as God is everywhere present and filling all things, it is possible for one outside the Church to find God and follow Him to the extent that is possible without being guided by the Holy Tradition. In other words, Baha'i cannot be another way to God, but one may still follow Christ despite being brought up in the baha'i faith, and there may be elements in Baha'i that would lead a person to Christ. The fullness, however, is in the Eastern Orthodox Church. In other words, Eastern Orthodox Christianity is not only the freshest and most potent, but it is also not sullied with false doctrines and deceptions.

 

[Livindesert]

Interesting. I have never spoken before to anyone who practiced Baha'i.

Christianity would assert that Christ is the only True God, and that the only way to God is by Christ. However, as God is everywhere present and filling all things, it is possible for one outside the Church to find God and follow Him to the extent that is possible without being guided by the Holy Tradition. In other words, Baha'i cannot be another way to God, but one may still follow Christ despite being brought up in the baha'i faith, and there may be elements in Baha'i that would lead a person to Christ. The fullness, however, is in the Eastern Orthodox Church. In other words, Eastern Orthodox Christianity is not only the freshest and most potent, but it is also not sullied with false doctrines and deceptions.

I can agree to disagree over who is the freshest and most potent

 

[Josiah14]

I can agree to disagree over who is the freshest and most potent

Werd. Christianity is revealed, not philosophized, hypothesized, or theorized. May God guide you.

 

[Livindesert]

Werd. Christianity is revealed, not philosophized, hypothesized, or theorized. May God guide you.

So is the Baha'i faith

 

[Livindesert]

I did not mean to derail the thread I just wished to show that telling someone they need to look at a new view like people are telling b&wpac4 to do is not a good argument. I could tell a Christian all day that they need to view the Bible through our scriptures but that would not convince anyone of the validity of my claims. Just some thoughts.

 

[Josiah14]

The resurrection of the dead is in the prophets. It appears that I can.

Well, as you can probably guess, I would say that in the resurrection, the prophets prophesied of Christ. But, I think here, friend, we can accept our differences. I think everything to be said, for now, has been said.

I'm glad you came here to post. I enjoyed seeing your P.O.V.

 

[Josiah14]

I did not mean to derail the thread I just wished to show that telling someone they need to look at a new view like people are telling b&wpac4 to do is not a good argument. I could tell a Christian all day that they need to view the Bible through our scriptures but that would not convince anyone of the validity of my claims. Just some thoughts.

That depends on whether the person you talk to actually decides to test your claim by reading Baha'i literature and practicing the faith.

In ancient Greece, philosophy was practiced and tested through living out the philosophical ideas presented. Then, through personal experience, people would develop their own philosophies about life. I believe this is the only way to test religion - to try it out.

 

[Josiah14]

I did not mean to derail the thread I just wished to show that telling someone they need to look at a new view like people are telling b&wpac4 to do is not a good argument. I could tell a Christian all day that they need to view the Bible through our scriptures but that would not convince anyone of the validity of my claims. Just some thoughts.

Dont worry about derailing the thread. I think this thread was coming to an end even before your latest posts. It was a very good and interesting exchange, for what it's worth.

 

[Livindesert]

That depends on whether the person you talk to actually decides to test your claim by reading Baha'i literature and practicing the faith.

In ancient Greece, philosophy was practiced and tested through living out the philosophical ideas presented. Then, through personal experience, people would develop their own philosophies about life. I believe this is the only way to test religion - to try it out.

The proof of the pudding is in the eating

 

[Josiah14]

The proof of the pudding is in the eating

Well said. I'll have to use that line sometime.

 

[sentipente]

Keep seeking! Humans don't need to interpret prophetic language. If you have to ask what Spiritual application is, you don't yet have the Spirit of Truth. Keep seeking ...

Just as I thought. You are a self-proclaimed something, but I have no idea what it could be.

 

[Dragons87]

That's fine. I can even agree with that in principal. That being said, to me all the tools I need are in Judaism. Jesus is not necessary, the sacrifice is not necessary.

Haha! I think I'm getting to understand how you feel! It's kind of like saying to Catholics and Orthodox: "No, tradition is not necessary to achieve salvation, nor the veneration of saints."

 

[b&wpac4]

Haha! I think I'm getting to understand how you feel! It's kind of like saying to Catholics and Orthodox: "No, tradition is not necessary to achieve salvation, nor the veneration of saints."

I find the Catholic vs. Orthodox debate very interesting. The Catholic/Orthodox vs Protestant debate is far far less interesting.