Super-Continent Pangaea

[joshua 1 9]

That gif is very weird!

Tarsiers are pretty weird. A rather primitive form of primate.

 

[bhsmte]

Evidence that atheists are unwilling to accept the truth. What I do not understand is that God takes responsibility for hardening the heart of Pharaoh: "I will harden his heart". He is the one that gives people over to a reprobate mind. "just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind"

Acts 28:27
FOR THE HEART OF THIS PEOPLE HAS BECOME DULL, AND WITH THEIR EARS THEY SCARCELY HEAR, AND THEY HAVE CLOSED THEIR EYES; OTHERWISE THEY MIGHT SEE WITH THEIR EYES, AND HEAR WITH THEIR EARS, AND UNDERSTAND WITH THEIR HEART AND RETURN, AND I WOULD HEAL THEM."'

You have not demonstrated any truth, with evidence.

You are really, really good at making empty claims though.

 

[joshua 1 9]

You have not demonstrated any truth

Personal attacks are a violation of the rules. I am not the subject of this conversation. People have to be willing to accept and receive the truth. IF people do not want to know the truth then there is nothing I can do to get them to receive life and health and healing. That is a choice that God gives them and that is a decision that only they can make.

Deu 30 "…19"I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live, you and your descendants, 20 by loving the LORD your God, by obeying His voice, and by holding fast to Him; for this is your life and the length of your days, that you may live in the land which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them.""

 

[bhsmte]

Personal attacks are a violation of the rules. I am not the subject of this conversation. People have to be willing to accept and receive the truth. IF people do not want to know the truth then there is nothing I can do to get them to receive life and health and healing. That is a choice that God gives them and that is a decision that only they can make.

Deu 30 "…19"I call heaven and earth to witness against you today, that I have set before you life and death, the blessing and the curse. So choose life in order that you may live, you and your descendants, 20 by loving the LORD your God, by obeying His voice, and by holding fast to Him; for this is your life and the length of your days, that you may live in the land which the LORD swore to your fathers, to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, to give them.""

Stating that you have yet to demonstrate any truth, is not a personal attack.

It is reality.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Stating that you have yet to demonstrate any truth, is not a personal attack.

The Bible says that: "God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:" Why would God do this? Why would God allow a strong delusion like this? We are told: "because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved". If people do not love the truth, if they choose to be given over to a strong delusion than that is their decision. They have made their own choice for themselves. I give people the truth and they have to decide for themselves. Whatever choice they make is no reflection on me. Their blood is on their own hands.

"if you do warn the wicked person and they do not turn from their wickedness or from their evil ways, they will die for their sin; but you will have saved yourself." Eze 3:19

 

[bhsmte]

The Bible says that: "God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:" Why would God do this? Why would God allow a strong delusion like this? We are told: "because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved". If people do not love the truth, if they choose to be given over to a strong delusion than that is their decision. They have made their own choice for themselves. I give people the truth and they have to decide for themselves. Whatever choice they make is no reflection on me. Their blood is on their own hands.

"if you do warn the wicked person and they do not turn from their wickedness or from their evil ways, they will die for their sin; but you will have saved yourself." Eze 3:19

Preaching is empty to me.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Preaching is empty to me.

I do not do this for you. I read and study for my own benefit and what I get out of it.

 

[bhsmte]

I do not do this for you. I read and study for my own benefit and what I get out of it.

Preaching to yourself then?

Got it.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Preaching to yourself then?

Close, I allow people to chip away and point out any weakness so I can strengthen and make more accurate what I believe.

 

[Jimmy D]

The proper translation is that the High Hills were covered. Current belief is that Eden is still underwater, in the Persian Gulf. We know that 15,000 years ago the Persian Gulf was dry land. So the theory is there was a land damn holding the water back and then that land damn failed and the area flooded back in the days of Noah.

According to this 'theory' when did the land dam break and the Persian gulf flood? According to you Noah's flood was around 3000 BC correct? I think that you'll find the Persian gulf flooded about 12000 years ago.

Strike One!

Adam and then Noah were the real beginning of artificial selection. Farming spread from the Middle East to Europe and to the rest of the world from there.

Agriculture was widespread throughout the world for thousands of years before Adam,Noah and eden existed according to your (Ussher's) timescale.

Strike Two!

"Plows are thought to have been invented in Mesopotamia in approximately 3000 BC. "
http://patentpending.blogs.com/patent_pending_blog/2004/10/history_of_the_.html

Genesis 2:15(NASB)
15 Then the Lord God took the man and put him into the garden of Eden to cultivate it and keep it.

........................................

You can plow with wood and stones, but you really need metal to get the job done.
Did they have cycles during the stone age also?

I realize you had to try and shoe horn this whole 'ploughing' thing in to make your timeline add up when you realized that agriculture was already widespread before the time of your 'Eden' but even that fails.....

From your link
The two-man plow - one man pulling on a rope in front, the other pressing the plow’s point into the ground - made its appearance in the Middle East around 7000 BC. Later, a cross-beam was added for greater rigidity and control.

Note - 7000 BC.

Strike Three!

I suggest you give this line of reasoning up mate, it falls at every hurdle. Not only that it has diverged so far from what Genesis actually says (first man, worldwide flood, all the animals on the Ark, etc, etc) it strips away the any meaningful message intended in the original myths.

Finally, and most importantly, why even bother with the bible if you're going to view everything through a naturalistic and historical lens? You may as just stick with wikipedia, it seems it's more accurate.

 

[joshua 1 9]

I think that you'll find the Persian gulf flooded about 12000 years ago.

12,000 years ago was when the ice melted and the ocean level was substantially higher. The theory is that the Persian gulf did not actually flood at this time because of a land damn at the Straight of Hormuz that gave way at the time of Noah's flood. Mountains or high hills are formed when plates merge. In this case we have the Arab plate and the India plate.

 

[Jimmy D]

12,000 years ago was when the ice melted and the ocean level was substantially higher. The theory is that the Persian gulf did not actually flood at this time because of a land damn at the Straight of Hormuz that gave way at the time of Noah's flood. Mountains or high hills are formed when plates merge. In this case we have the Arab plate and the India plate.

What theory? Yours?

Do you remember posting this image?

When was this flood of yours exactly?

 

[bhsmte]

Close, I allow people to chip away and point out any weakness so I can strengthen and make more accurate what I believe.

Good luck with that.

 

[Jimmy D]

What theory? Yours?

Do you remember posting this image?

When was this flood of yours exactly?

Joshua, you failed to address this. How can your timeline be consistant? You claim science supports Ussher's chronology but your own sources suggest you are thousands of years out on many key points.

Science confirms the last major rise in sea levels in the Gulf was 8000 years ago.

Science confirms agriculture was widespread throughout Europe thousands of years before and after this event.

 

[Jimmy D]

12,000 years ago was when the ice melted and the ocean level was substantially higher. The theory is that the Persian gulf did not actually flood at this time because of a land damn at the Straight of Hormuz that gave way at the time of Noah's flood.

Why are you ignoring the evidence Joshua? I took the trouble of looking at your 'evidence'.

You claim science supports Ussher's chronology but your own sources suggest you are thousands of years out on many key points.

Science confirms the last major rise in sea levels in the Gulf was about 8000 years ago, you are claiming 4000 years ago....

Science confirms agriculture was widespread throughout Europe thousands of years before and after this event, including agricultural machinery.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Why are you ignoring the evidence Joshua?

When in Rome you do as the Romans do. I think it is dishonest to be an Atheist. Their attitude is to deny everything and demand to see more evidence. Then Golden rule is to treat others as you want them to treat you. The way atheists treat others must be the way they want people to treat them. When you give them rock solid evidence they deny the truth and they deny science. I do not have any problems with agnostics because I feel that is a more honest approach. Here we have atheists acting like agnostics and agnostics acting like atheists. I know that you have been more open minded but there are people here that are extremely narrow and closed minded and I am not allowed to deal with them as individuals. If that is the way they want to treat others then it is only fair that they get treated the same.

 

[Armoured]

Tarsiers are pretty weird. A rather primitive form of primate.

Creationists who believe there exist "primitive" forms of creatures. Even they don't believe their own nonsense when you get right down to it.

 

[DogmaHunter]

When in Rome you do as the Romans do. I think it is dishonest to be an Atheist. Their attitude is to deny everything and demand to see more evidence. Then Golden rule is to treat others as you want them to treat you. The way atheists treat others must be the way they want people to treat them. When you give them rock solid evidence they deny the truth and they deny science. I do not have any problems with agnostics because I feel that is a more honest approach. Here we have atheists acting like agnostics and agnostics acting like atheists. I know that you have been more open minded but there are people here that are extremely narrow and closed minded and I am not allowed to deal with them as individuals. If that is the way they want to treat others then it is only fair that they get treated the same.

Will you please just address the points raised in the post you are replying to, instead of writing this preaching nonsense?

 

[joshua 1 9]

Science confirms the last major rise in sea levels in the Gulf was about 8000 years ago, you are claiming 4000 years ago....

You need to pay more close attention. I am ONLY talking about the Persian Gulf. As I said there was a LAND DAMN at the strait of hormuz. So the Persian Gulf was not actually flooded until Noah's flood. I would assume there was some sort of an earthquake at the time. The Strait of Hormuz is on the fault line between the Arab Plate and the India Plate. So the plates must have shifted apart enough to allow the water to flow into what is now the Persian Gulf. This is what the photos show from the satellites that we now have in orbit around the earth. We have photos from things like Google Earth that we can study. The Bible says: "fountains of the great deep broken up," Broken up here means: 1) "to split, cleave, break open, divide, break through, rip up, break up, tear". The Bible then is consistent with the Science that we have on this right now. Consistent with what we know about plate technics and with what the space satellite photos show us. Mountains or high hills are formed by plate convergence.

Another evidence they use is the archeology of the cities that were built on the shore of the Persian Gulf. They were founded at a time right after Noah's flood. This would indicate that people had to move to higher ground and build new cities because the area they had been living in was now underwater.

They actually have plans to build a damn at the Strait of Hormuz for a cost of 2.5 Billion dollars. This would restore "Eden" the plain that is now under the Persian Gulf. The rivers would become established again and this would become fertile farm land for producing food and the damn would provide energy.

“Edin” was a paradise, the cradle of mankind, according to Sumerian myths (Hamblin, 1987).

 

[Jimmy D]

When in Rome you do as the Romans do. I think it is dishonest to be an Atheist. Their attitude is to deny everything and demand to see more evidence. Then Golden rule is to treat others as you want them to treat you. The way atheists treat others must be the way they want people to treat them. When you give them rock solid evidence they deny the truth and they deny science. I do not have any problems with agnostics because I feel that is a more honest approach. Here we have atheists acting like agnostics and agnostics acting like atheists. I know that you have been more open minded but there are people here that are extremely narrow and closed minded and I am not allowed to deal with them as individuals. If that is the way they want to treat others then it is only fair that they get treated the same.

I'm not asking for evidence, I'm asking you to acknowledge my evidence, so spare me your hypocritical lecturing. I have given you rock solid evidence, in fact, most of the evidence comes from your own links.

Merely conflating one thing with another (the rise of neolithic culture with Genesis 2 for example) does not 'prove' the bible true. At best such a comparison could offer us an insight into the origins of the myths therein.

Your ideas don't even allow for that though, your attempts to connect biblical events to specific events in the history of the middle east are demonstrably wrong.