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PastorGadget

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Stopped by Walmart today on the way home from church to pick up a few things, and they were having a $5 sale on older DVDs. Although they got panned by the critics and barely broke even at the box office, I picked up both Daredevil and Elektra. I've had the Daredevil soundtrack ever since it first came out, because it has some very good hard rock on there, as well as two early tracks by Evanescence. That band had a hit with "Bring Me to Life", and they had two great videos for that song -- one with Daredevil and one without. But as I watched Daredevil with the boys tonight, I remembered the other Evanescence song on that album, "My Immortal." They only played part of it, but I vaguely remembered more parts of the lyrics.

After everyone went to bed this evening, I got out the Daredevil soundtrack for the first time in two years and listened to "My Immortal." I teared up a little, and, yes, it made me sad. Here's the lyrics to "My Immortal":

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]I'm so tired of being here[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Suppressed by all my childish fears[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]And if you have to leave[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]I wish that you would just leave[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]'Cause your presence still lingers here[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]And it won't leave me alone[/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]These wounds won't seem to heal[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]This pain is just too real[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]There's just too much that time cannot erase[/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][Chorus:][/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]When you cried I'd wipe away all of your tears[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]When you'd scream I'd fight away all of your fears[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]And I held your hand through all of these years[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]But you still have[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]All of me[/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]You used to captivate me[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]By your resonating light[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Now I'm bound by the life you left behind[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Your face it haunts[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]My once pleasant dreams[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]Your voice it chased away[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]All the sanity in me[/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]These wounds won't seem to heal[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]This pain is just too real[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]There's just too much that time cannot erase[/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][Chorus][/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]I've tried so hard to tell myself that you're gone[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]But though you're still with me[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]I've been alone all along[/FONT]

[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif][Chorus][/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]I haven't been "alone all along," but it is very hard to tell myself that my wife is gone, that there will be wounds that time just won't heal. I understand a lot of the reasons why my wife chose to take her own life, but I'm not sure I'll ever understand why our love was not enough to keep her here.[/FONT]

Pastor Gadget
 
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FaithfulWife

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Pastor Gadget~

It's late and I need to go to bed, but I think I can address this one. When I was a child, I was beaten by my parents--meaning that they took broom handles and hit me with them on a daily basis. My goal in life was to live long enough to get out of the house--and I did! I used to wonder why my parents didn't "love me enough" to not hurt me--or love me enough to face their own demons so that they wouldn't hurt me. In fact, to be honest, I suffered and wrestled with that question for years and sometimes still sort of do!

Nonetheless, as I got older and understood the world a bit more, I discovered something. Love isn't so much a thing that is measured in "quantity" and some amount of it is "enough." Either someone LOVES or they don't. And I don't mean that they make a conscious decision to not love--I mean either there is LOVE and it exists to that person's fullest extent and they act on it--or there isn't love and it just isn't there and they don't act on it. Love is a decision to act, not a smooshy, pie-in-the-sky "feeling" so I have no doubt WHATSOEVER that your wife did LOVE you. It existed, she decided to love you, and she acted on it!! That's clear. It's just that her fullest extent did not exceed her overwhelming pain at the moment when she took her life. It's not a comparison. She LOVED.

Okay? Good night!


~Faithful
 
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kaykay637

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Faithful wife, good thoughts. Glad you overcame your background without bitterness and letting it rule your life.

Pastor Gadget, sometimes the pain is just so great that love doesn't overcome. Let me try to illustrate it in the natural. For example, we had a friend that died of cancer a few years ago. He was in a lot of physical pain before he died. I imagine at some point he wanted to just go on and be with the Lord. He had a wonderful wife and teen-age son (as well as 2 grown children) I'm sure he didn't want to leave them, but the pain was so great it overshadowed everything else. He couldn't concentrate on the love because of the agonizing pain, but it didn't negate his great love for his family.

Maybe this isn't the best example, but hope it in some small way illustrates what I'm trying to express. Sometimes the pain (emotional or physical is just sooo great...)

Yet....I still understand what you are saying. It's a question you would be be bound to ask in your circumstances, I think.
 
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PastorGadget

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I had a bit of a tough one today, as I awoke thinking about the scene of finding my wife and desperately trying to save her while calling 911, and then the time following the ambulance to the hospital, the fragile state of my mind and heart that night as I waited for the doctor, the feeling of having my heart wrenched from my chest when I knew she was gone from me, the strength that God plainly gave me because I had none of my own that night, the phone calls, the tears... It was a rough thing to have that stuck in my head all day long. When people would ask, "Hi, How're ya doin'?" I'd say plainly, "Crappy."

Fortunately, I have been asked to give a short message about some of Jesus' words from the Cross at our Good Friday service. I have been assigned to speak on our Saviors words to the thief: "Assuredly I say to you, today you will be with me in Paradise." (Luke 23:43) That promise has kept me going through so many tough times, because I know that no matter how awfully I may handle things right now, so long as I return to Him humble and penitent, then He will accept me just as I am. When I have a day like today, I cling to that hope and to the vision my lovely wife had for building a better future for our church and community.

Thanks for letting me share.

P.S. - FaithfulWife, you are a blessing. I praise God for adults and children who come from such homes and such parents, and yet who manage to find hope and strength and love. God has blessed you. He has also blessed us through you.

Pastor Gadget
 
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kaykay637

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Well, just hang in, Pastor Gadget. The Lord and time, a lot of time can bring you a large amount of healing and healing from the traumatic memories. This is stupid, but I think about the old Righteous Bros. song-Unchained Melody ..."time goes by so slowly and time can do so much." It's applicable here, believe me.

The "first" Easter after my son Aaron died hit me surprisingly hard. Easter is so bright with promise of the resurrection etc. I expected it to be reassuring, but mostly it just hurt...

Prayers continuing for you...
 
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PastorGadget

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He Lives--and through Him she is alive and with HIM. May God bless you richly this Easter remembering that this day she is with Him in Paradise!



At the Good Friday service, we read all of Isaiah 53, which is a prophecy of our Lord and the suffering He would face for our sins. Three verses stood out especially for me:
3 He is despised and rejected by men,
A Man of sorrows and acquainted with grief.
And we hid, as it were, our faces from Him;
He was despised, and we did not esteem Him.

4 Surely He has borne our griefs
And carried our sorrows;
Yet we esteemed Him stricken,
Smitten by God, and afflicted.

5 But He was wounded for our transgressions,
He was bruised for our iniquities;
The chastisement for our peace was upon Him,
And by His stripes we are healed.


Of course, we well remember the shortest sentence, the shortest verse in the Bible:
Jesus wept. -- John 11:35
When I reflect on these two verses, I cannot help but think about the anguish of our Lord and Savior as He faced that last night in the garden of Gethsemane, knowing that the weight of the world's sins were soon to be laid upon His shoulders. Well He knew what He faced, well He knew the sorrow of a God who grieves that His children turn away from Him. Well He knew, too, that despite His sacrifice, some thousands of years hence we would still be facing an unrepentant and hardened generation who turn from the Lord of Hosts as from an embarrassment. This is the "man of sorrows" who faced the Cross and bore our pain and grief, the payment of our sins, so that we could stand in victory someday. We spend this season glorifying Him, and yet He took this season to glorify us.

When I reflect on my own grief, the measure of pain and sorrow I bear, I know Jesus doesn't think they are small or unworthy of notice. He cares for my heart, with gentle hands that once healed lepers and took nails for me, with gentle voice that called forth Lazarus from the grave and then prayed to have this cup taken from Him, with a gentle heart that cared enough to heal any and all who came His way and yet a heart that wept. My Savior knows my pain, and He knows that although I will bear it for quite a while, someday He will decide it is His to bear. Then I will cast my cares upon Him and find my load a whole lot lighter. For now, He will give me the strength to handle my woes, because He knows I will lean upon Him the whole while.

Blessings and peace on this blessed Resurrection Day!

Pastor Gadget
 
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PastorGadget

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This has been an up and down week. Big surprise, eh? One day I am flying high, thinking about today and tomorrow, and then the next day or later that night I am focused on yesterday.

I just finished reading Chuck Swindoll's excellent study of First Peter, called "Hope Again: When Life Hurts and Dreams Fade." I had actually started reading before my wife died, and I was perhaps a third of the way through it. Then I set it aside in all the turmoil that first few weeks. Now I have finished it, and I thank God that I did. I can read that letter from Peter with more appreciation, and I can see how sadly applicable Peter's lessons are for me and mine right now.

Although I am now also halfway through Zig Ziglar's "Confessions of a Grieving Christian," I am so far a bit left behind by it. His family's solid faith and the "advanced warning" they had about Suzan's death make me envious. I had no such warning, no such time to grieve a little at a time, to let go a little at a time. I had no chance to help my wife and I find peace with her impending death in this world. My world was wrenched apart at the seams so suddenly it might just as well have been a car accident or a drive-by shooting.

But clearly the huge difference is the matter of choice. Zig's daughter not only had some time to say farewell, but she also had no choice in the matter. She was going to die, and postpone things as best they could, the doctors could do nothing. My wife chose quite suddenly to end her own life. One hour she's here, and the next she is not, all by her choice. I hate to sound callous, and I don't wish to belittle the Ziglar family's pain, but in my view they had it easy. Further, I feel like his book is more like "preaching to the choir" than any special revelation about how we as Christians ought to find hope beyond the death of our loved ones.

Nonetheless, I wil finish that book, too. It keeps my mind off of other things, and I need all the help I can get getting to sleep at night.

Yes, it's hard for me to accept that matter of choice, and yes, I do feel betrayed and angry and, honestly, very lonely. Thank you all for your prayers. They truly do help.
 
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kaykay637

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Continued prayers for you, Pastor Gadget. Yeah, moving through grief has many stages, many emotions as you are obviouisly finding out.

I do hear what you are saying about "no advance warning." No chance to absorb it, to say "good-bye" or anything else you might have wished to say. Now...obviously, dealing with a suicide packs its own kind of issues to be sure. And anger and betrayal seems to me to be some things you would be likely to be dealing with for sure.

I DO feel that some grief is easier to deal with than others ...(not that it's ever easy though.)

My son (who was our only child) did not, of course, die by a suicide so I can't totally relate there, but I can tell you that I can very much relate to the sudden, very traumatic, unexpected nature of a death and the subsequent grief. He and 2 of his friends died in a freak car accident. (I may have said that before. Don't remember.) Two policemen showed up on our doorstep (one was the police chaplain) and informed us that our extremely beloved only child (age 16) was gone. Nothing prepares you for a moment like that. Three months later, I would still wake up in the morning remembering that he was gone and still feel a sense of shock and disbelief.
Those are just some of the emotions which accompany a traumatic sudden death I think.

I suppose that all forms of grief carries its own pain. I'm sure it's also hard in a different way to see a loved one suffer a long, lingering death. However, I would have liked to have had the opportunity to say "good-bye." Does that make sense?

For me, I think the value of Zig's book WAS his positive faith, the way he was able to "kick it up to the next level" of faith. By that, I mean, to recognize the transient, temporary nature of this life in contrast to eternity. Which ultimately is the ONLY comfort when we lose someone in death no matter how.

Pastor Gadget, is there anyone you can counsel with about your feelings? Sometimes we just really need to talk about what we are feeling and feel "heard" by someone. My husband and I didn't seek counseling after the death of our son and in retrospect, I think that would have been beneficial. Our friends really tried to stand by us during the aftermath of our son's death. They did a really good job of that, but I sensed that they were NOT comfortable with us discussing the death. So we didn't usually "go there" with anyone except each other. But we need someone we can "go there" with, ya know. I pray for you that you either have a person like that in your life already or that the Lord will lead you to someone. (Of course, even talking on an internet forum like this can be helpful, but I think you need "live" help also.) I know it's a hard, hard road. Prayers and blessings~~
kaykay
 
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PastorGadget

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I did read some more of Zig Ziglar's book, and I was around Chapter 13 -- "Giving to Others Out of Your Grief" -- after lunch a week ago. That afternoon, a lady acquaintance from church came by and said hello. In the course of our conversation, she mentioned how much trouble her 70-year-old mother was still having with grieving for her late husband, who had died 4 years ago. I thought of some of the things Zig had been saying about the different ways we grieve, and how important it is to keep alive the spirit of the person who passed on. So I mentioned to book to this lady, and she asked if I'd write down the title so she could order it. I thought about the time it might take for her to get it by special order, and the time lost by getting home and ordering through Amazon or something.

"I tell you what," I said to her. "I'll give you my copy. And when you and your mom are done with it, you can bring it back."

"I can't take that from you," she said. "You haven't even finished it."

"Look," I replied. "I am at a good place right now, and I can always get another copy for myself, or check it out from the library sometime. More importantly, you and your mom really need this book. Take it with my blessing." And so she did.

I have ordered another book from Amazon to help me along: "Grieving a Suicide: A Loved One's Search for Comfort, Answers & Hope" by Albert Y. Hsu. I got to read a sample chapter the other day, and I found him very grounded in Scripture like Zig, but more familiar with where I'm at right now. I'll let you know how it goes.

I am feeling a bit frazzled these days, because my few days off are filled with stuff to do with Mom (my mother-in-law), my step-son, my own kids, or my own bills and stuff dealing with my wife's estate. Seems I always have more errands to run than a "soccer mom" but I only have one kid at home, and he doesn't play sports! Besides the emotional release that will come once the estate is all settled and we move away from here, I also look forward to returning to a relatively more simple life.

Had a sobering thought the other night. My brother-in-law and mother-in-law have both expressed the opinion that someday I will "move on" and find a new wife. My first wife (from whom I am divorced) was white, and my late wife was black. So one night, completely out of the blue, Mom says to me with a mischievous grin, "So what will the next one be?" Without missing a beat, I said, "I'm thinking Asian for a change." We both busted up laughing. But the sad part is that I probably won't be fit for many women, because my late wife is so much a part of my identity as a pastor. She encouraged me to pursue pastoral ministry, she helped me envision a future with us as pastor and pastor's wife (plus "PK's": pastor's kids). She even picked out some of my clothes for the pulpit and for other occasions. She also was very instrumental in challenging me to be more proactive about social justice and moral change in our society. At her memorial service, I spoke about her vision -- which really has become my vision.

So the thought then occurred to me that I might meet a wonderful Christian woman, and then I'd spend so much time talking about my late wife and how important she will always be... Well, no woman in her right mind would want to play second-fiddle to the memory of another woman. And yet, honestly, I believe Mom and brother-in-law are right: I actually am open to the possibility of having another wife someday. I think it's more likely that I probably won't get married again for the reasons I just mentioned, but I am not outright opposed to it. My late wife once joked with me that I ought to move on if she died. I just never thought I'd be faced with the possibility so soon.

I'm doing alright these days. I went through a rough patch a couple weeks ago, then just the past few days I have pulled up again. I feel like the Spirit is preparing me for something. Not sure what, but I guess I'll just have to wait and see. It sure is nice to feel good again. Just wish my wife was here to share it.

Pastor Gadget
 
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PastorGadget,

When I first was going through the divorce from my first husband, I think almost everyone who asked me "How are you?" and really meant it heard me talk on and on about him, what I thought, what he was doing, what I was doing, how I felt about all that, etc. The point being that at first, relatively close to the divorce, it WAS what was happening in my life! So that was in fact what I was discussing.

As a little more time went by, I still discussed it fairly frequently with some regularity because the divorce played a LARGE ROLE in shaping who I was to become. It was very instrumental in making me the woman I am today!

Now, it has been many, many years. I am remarried to a wonderful man whom I love with my whole heart. I no longer discuss all the details of the divorce and the woman I have become because of it...because there have been additional things since then that have shaped me too!

I believe it may be similar for you. Right now you discuss your previous wife a lot because she was VERY instrumental in shaping the man and pastor that you are today. Right now you discuss your previous wife a lot because that is what you are dealing with and working through, and it just IS who you are right now! As a little time goes by, you will no longer be as sharply defined by this event as you are right now--additional things will occur adding to the godly man that you are. And slowly, over time, those will become part of what you discuss as well.

Right now, you would not be a great partner for another wife because you are still deeply in love with your previous wife. Furthermore, I can honestly say that I never "lost" my love for my ex--it adapted and gradually became more like casual, friendly interest. As time goes by you will not lose your "love" for your previous wife--but you may very well find another, different lady whom you love VERY, VERY much in HER OWN unique way.
________

Now--I have a present for you that I saw on another site that I really liked, so I'm sharing it with you:

"The quiet companionship of a comforting person is like balm to the soul. Like Mother Earth, she absorbs the shock of pain and erases the wounds, and even the scars, with time. These kindred spirits seem to be able to take our hand and walk with us through the difficult places they have already traveled. They keep us from the loneliness that pervades our experiences, waiting for a word that we have passed through safely. And best of all, they never bring it up again but let the past take care of the past. Their eyes are on tomorrow, their hands on the present time so that we never hear empty echoes and are never reminded that we were unhappy. And then, we in quiet ways, can reach back and take someone's hand."

~ I take you by the hand with all my heart....you have spoken comfort to us. ~
 
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kaykay637

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Glad you found someone to pass along Zig's book to, and hopefully, the one you ordered will "scratch where you itch" so to speak. Hopefully, it will since it is more specific to your situation.

Some things minister to us at different times. The book that most "scratched where I itched" immediately after my son's death was When God Doesn't make Sense by James Dobson. I read many, many grief books and I did also want to read stories by other parents who had lost a child because that was my specific situation. So hopefully, this new book will address some of your specific issues right now. Hugs and prayers to you~
 
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PastorGadget

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I got the opportunity tonight to see a speech and Q&A with Carla Fine, author of No Time to Say Goodbye. I was struck by how similar her story is to mine -- workaholic spouses who took their own lives in the prime of their careers. Also, I enjoyed listening to her respond to questions about coming to grips with never knowing the full reasons for our loved ones' suicides. It was a good chance to connect with some folks on the counseling end of suicide survival, and a good encouragement to get to the local survivors support group. But as I was driving home, I got to thinking about something she said, how if she had her husband right there in front of her, she'd berate him for being so stupid as to take his life before he had a chance to experience all that has gone on in the past 20+ years. We all chuckled, but her point hit home.

She likened life to a book. You wouldn't stop reading a book before you'd get to the end, would you? Think of all the interesting things you'd miss out on! Sure, this part of the book is hard to read, but there's no telling what the rest of the book will bring. So why stop reading now?!?

Carla also talked about how the decision to end one's life is most often a momentary thing, spontaneous and unplanned. I thought about that on the way home and a few things came to mind:
  • A moment of despair vs. a lifetime of hopes
  • A moment of loneliness vs. a lifetime of people to meet and love
  • A moment of fear vs. a lifetime of comfort
  • A moment of pain vs. a lifetime of normal life
  • A momentary lapse of reason vs. a lifetime of learning and growing
  • A moment of feeling abandoned by God vs. a lifetime of knowing He is always with us
The worst thing for me is that my wife probably felt like she was solving her own problems with disability and our family's problems with finances and taking care of her. It was perhaps just a fleeting thought that caught hold of her imagination, and her despair took hold and expanded the irrational into something so large that it just HAD to be truth -- and yet it wasn't. People say that suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem, and that is so true in the case of a disabled person who cannot see that her family loves and WANTS to care for her. The embarassment and discomfort of having someone else care for you is nothing compared to the pain we survivors must endure as a group. In fact, I would gladly trade the loss of my wife for her disability, any day of the week. I wish I could have gotten my wife to see that her physical and emotional problems were workable, that they were something that is, unfortunately, just a part of life.

Looking back at my own emotional roller coaster in life, I think about the times I was despondent and on the edge of suicide myself, but I always looked forward, never forgot that for every time I'd been hurt there were five or ten times I'd been loved. I look back at my life and realize that I would have missed out on so much:
  • If I had killed myself when I got a divorce three years ago, then I wouldn't have returned to the church, wouldn't have made the new friends I've made, wouldn't have met and married my new and now lamented wife.
  • If I had killed myself when I was struggling in grad school, I wouldn't have met my first wife, wouldn't have had two wonderful kids, wouldn't have met one of my lifelong friends, wouldn't have done so many fun things over the course of my first marriage.
  • If I had killed myself when I was dumped by a girl I thought I might marry in college, I wouldn't have gone to grad school, never taught a class in college, and all the things above.
  • If I had killed myself when I was stationed overseas in the Army, alone and afraid of the world, I never would have been awarded a medal, wouldn't have gone to college, wouldn't have come to see the world political situation so clearly once I got into intelligence work.
  • If I had killed myself when I had an emotional breakdown in high school, I would have missed out on the new friends I met after high school, and wouldn't have joined the Army and learned the discipline that keeps me going today...
And that's just over the last 28 years. Imagine what more is in store for me over the next 28 years! I never have been one to completely give up on a book. I may put it down for a while, but I will eventually come back to it and finish it. It took me 40 years to get around to reading the whole Bible. And I am so glad I have read the whole thing! It's a great book! So why wouldn't I want to keep "reading" my own life? Yes, it'll have its ups and downs, its triumphs, blessings, and, yes, disciplines. But it is so true:
And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. -- Romans 8:28

All things -- good and bad -- work together for good to those who love God... That is, the end result is good. There will be bad times and there will be good times, but overall, all those times work together for good. My late wife knew that verse, and I tried to explain it to her, but I don't think she really took it to heart. Now it has become my blessing, along with:
Behold, the eye of the LORD is on those who fear Him,
On those who hope in His mercy,
To deliver their soul from death,
And to keep them alive in famine.
-- Psalm 33:18-19
We are not promised that those who fear the Lord will not experience famine, only that He will keep us alive when we are in a famine. Famine of the soul is perhaps even harder than a famine of food, because that is when we typically lose hope. But we are told here that for those who hope in God's mercy, God will keep His eye on them, deliver their souls from death, and keep them alive through the harshest times. We need to keep that hope alive.

Pastor Gadget
 
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kaykay637

Hi, everybody! Have a blessed day!
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Pastor Gadget, you made some excellent points about suicide. In fact, I'm going to provide a link to this for someone I know who struggles with suicidal thoughts. I truly believe that the Lord is going to use you to minister to people in various situations regarding this.


I am soooooo glad you got to hear someone else speak who has been through what you have.
That is so beneficial, I think. Hope it helped.
 
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