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St. Maximus - logoi

jckstraw72

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sooo any Maximian scholars out there? im doing a paper on St. Maximus' cosmology, and im confused about the thought-wills and the logoi. some things i read say they are the same thing, and some try to make a distinction between them, but if there is a distinction i dont understand what it is. any help?
 

icxn

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I'm not a Maximian scholar by any means but I can understand the confusion since λόγοι is a loaded term. Philokalia translates the word in the context of the creative work of God as the "divine principles" (think of reasons) by which everything was created. It can also be translated as the qualities or properties of created things.
 
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MariaRegina

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no i havent. what book would that be in?

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]A good place to start is Hierotheos´ [/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]A Night in the Desert of the Holy Mountain[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]: [/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]discussion with a hermit on Jesus prayer[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif], which was translated by Esther Williams[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif].[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]

Here Metropolitan Hierotheos introduces the struggle to control thoughts, and how the reason (logiki) interacts with thoughts (logismoi) which can disturb the nous (heart, soul).

On page 193, he states:

[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Thoughts - Logismi:[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif] The thoughts which are connected with images as well as with the various stimulations originating from the senses and the imagination. The thoughts logismoi evolve to sin through the stages of desire, action and passion. They are called logismoi because they act in the reason (logiki). [/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]
[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]He continues this discussion more in depth in one of his other books: [/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Orthodox Psychotherapy: the science of the Fathers[/FONT][FONT=Arial, sans-serif]. This book is translated by Effie Mavromichali.

I hope this helps.
[/FONT]
 
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MariaRegina

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I can understand now how Orthodox Priests do not recommend the use of the imagination and so frown on western types of meditation such as the Rosary where many folks call to mind images of the mysteries involved.

Therefore, I was concerned when Father Joseph Huneycutt in his book on Defeating Sin gave a meditation on the Two Trees which dealt with use of the imagination. I found it very distracting as it was so westernized. Not surprisingly, he recommended that meditation for Anglicans and Roman Catholics.
 
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MariaRegina

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Another book which might be helpful is: Confronting & Controlling Thoughts: According to the Fathers of the Philokalia by Father Anthony M. Coniaris, Life and Light Publishing, 2004.

This little book is a real gem, and it specifically mentions logismi and how to control them.
 
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JeremiahsBulldog

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jckstraw72,

I know my post comes too late for your paper, but I see several terms in these posts, and I just wanted to make a clarification.

We must distinguish between four different but related words; Logos, Logoi, Logiki, and Logismoi.

Logos, refers to the divine hypostasis of God the Son. When God the Father created all things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, (as we recite in the Creed), He created them through God the Logos/Son. In the Creed, we recite, "...Through Whom (Logos) all things were made."

Logoi, is a concept popularized by St. Maximos the Confessor (c 580 - 662). The logoi are God's "thought-forms" or "thought-wills" for every created thing. That is, there is a logos which is a "blueprint" for each created thing. The closest Western concept is that of the exemplars. Both concepts were borrowed from Neo-platonism.

But in typical patristic fashion, St. Maximos altered the concept to fit it into a proper Orthodox worldview. In Orthodox theology we make a distinction between God's essence and His energies. Whenever created things interact with God--in the act of creation, miracles, conversion, salvation, and so on--they always interact with His energies, never His essence.

The logoi are contained not in the essence, but in the energies, of God the Logos. They are willed by God into existence. They in turn become the designs from which created things derive their existence and purpose. The goal of all created things is to return to their logoi, their true purpose. Man is the mediator between material creation and God. By his repentance, he conforms to the Logos/Son, and brings all material things to conformity with their logoi, which are contained in the will/energy of the Logos.

Logiki, refers to our logical faculty, and our imagination.

Logismoi, refer to our thoughts.

There is an excellent article on the logoi, with extended quotes from St. Maximus, here:

St. Maximus, Van Til, Aquinas, & Logos/logoi
 
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Goatee

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jckstraw72,

I know my post comes too late for your paper, but I see several terms in these posts, and I just wanted to make a clarification.

We must distinguish between four different but related words; Logos, Logoi, Logiki, and Logismoi.

Logos, refers to the divine hypostasis of God the Son. When God the Father created all things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, (as we recite in the Creed), He created them through God the Logos/Son. In the Creed, we recite, "...Through Whom (Logos) all things were made."

Logoi, is a concept popularized by St. Maximos the Confessor (c 580 - 662). The logoi are God's "thought-forms" or "thought-wills" for every created thing. That is, there is a logos which is a "blueprint" for each created thing. The closest Western concept is that of the exemplars. Both concepts were borrowed from Neo-platonism.

But in typical patristic fashion, St. Maximos altered the concept to fit it into a proper Orthodox worldview. In Orthodox theology we make a distinction between God's essence and His energies. Whenever created things interact with God--in the act of creation, miracles, conversion, salvation, and so on--they always interact with His energies, never His essence.

The logoi are contained not in the essence, but in the energies, of God the Logos. They are willed by God into existence. They in turn become the designs from which created things derive their existence and purpose. The goal of all created things is to return to their logoi, their true purpose. Man is the mediator between material creation and God. By his repentance, he conforms to the Logos/Son, and brings all material things to conformity with their logoi, which are contained in the will/energy of the Logos.

Logiki, refers to our logical faculty, and our imagination.

Logismoi, refer to our thoughts.

There is an excellent article on the logoi, with extended quotes from St. Maximus, here:

St. Maximus, Van Til, Aquinas, & Logos/logoi

6 yrs late! Lol
 
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Anhelyna

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cake-of-sixth-birthdayanniversary-clipart-vector_csp13929457.jpg
 
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