Speaking curses over yourself?

[Dave-W]

The WOF teaching of name it claim it turns God into our servant rather than the other way around. Speaking curses over yourself inadvertantly is part of that errant theology.

Derek Prince once described this approach as turning God into a "...cosmic vending machine. You put your scripture in the slot, pull the lever and out pops your blessing."

 

[Alive_Again]

The Word says that Peter saw that the lame man had faith to be healed. That is typically the first requirement.

There were a series of interpretations that came from the Lord to Gary Carpenter after many hours of praying in the Spirit. They were very instructive and have been called the "Face to Face Sessions". A portion of these sessions contained the following utterance:

"You must understand this, receive this concept for it is truth: I flow into faith! I MYSELF, flow into faith! When the woman with the issue of blood touched Jesus, she touched Him with the touch of faith. I flowed from Him into her..."

Rather than getting lost in descriptions of the mechanics of faith, in response to the OP, the reason for a "proper confession" is to keep yourself in agreement with the promise of healing.

It's probably more profitable to remind a believer of the promise and to instruct them on how to call for it, and then how to follow through in their belief until the manifestation comes.

It's important to note that no one is making God their servant. The proper way to look at this is that the promises of God often do not just fall on you. They must be appropriated by faith. If you meet the conditions, God wants you to reach for it. He's pleased that you would dare to believe. It is by violence that your inheritance is taken from the enemy

 

[Alive_Again]

The WOF teaching of name it claim it turns God into our servant rather than the other way around. Speaking curses over yourself inadvertantly is part of that errant theology.

As Derek would say, the enemy comes into defeat you in the realm of thought. Your response are the promises of God spoken in faith. The are both a sword and a shield. So when the winds of adversity blow and the floods come and your house shakes, you want to stick with God's version of reality, both in word and deed. If you're doubleminded and you don't bridle your tongue, then it's all in vain.

When the enemy causes you to doubt your salvation, you answer with the Word concerning your safety in Christ. When lack is staring you in the face, then your confession is that Jesus became poor for you so you could inherit the riches of His kingdom (your needs to be met). When you're at a loss for wisdom and understanding, you call for it with what the Word says about wisdom and understanding for the child of God. When you need guidance, you ask and then you acknowledge God as your provider of guidance and instruction.

You can choose to think of it as a vending machine, but that is a derogatory view your Heavenly provision. It's your armor.

It's for the one submitted to God and for the one that believes in the promise. There's nothing ugly or negative about that. To assume one is just doing his own thing is presumptuous. Everybody moves away from the servant mentality from time to time and it's better to give each other the benefit of the doubt. It's better to look at the lovely version and not something out of balance. It's better not to be negatively critical.

Derek Prince once described this approach as turning God into a "...cosmic vending machine. You put your scripture in the slot, pull the lever and out pops your blessing."

I have enjoyed Derek's teachings and he believes in faith. Any comparison to "vending machine" appropriation of the promises of God is missing a little explanation that goes with it.

 

[Alithis]

Yes, speak it into existence.

not quite what i meant either

 

[Alithis]

I have yet to see a scripture that supports healing in the spiritual. What is meant by "the spiritual?"

The only reference I can see in scripture about that is that when we are born again our dead spirit is made alive in Christ, enabling us to be able to have fellowship with God in the Spirit. The Bible doesn't seem to mention anything resembling a "spiritual" realm. The only other reference to "spiritual healing" is within spiritualism which is a form of occult.

In my view, a person is either healed or they are not. Healing is that part of the body returning to normal function whether through restoration or the sickness/disease leaving. If that hasn't happened, then God has not yet started the healing process, or the actual recovery is not apparent yet while it is happening under the surface. Recovery and healing means that the person does not get any sicker but starts to improve. Instant healing is in the domain of miracles and is a different function of the Holy Spirit.

ahh yes ..i see we have a terminology mix up lol.

all i mean by "healing in the spiritual" .. is a faith that believes that what has been decreed in the heavens will be made manifest in the physical .
on the same lines or reasoning of .. -"and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, ".. though in the flesh we do not see us as seated in heavenly places ..in the spirit ,by faith it is already so ...
thus in that line of thinking .. when we pray we should harbor no doubt that what we pray is answered by the lord in the heavens ... though we might not at that instant see the manifestation .. but as our faith grows i believe we shall become utterly expectant of that manifestation in the flesh .is all i meant .

although having said that i also see "spiritual healing " as a term to describe when some one is healed of a past emotional hurt which has no physical appearance yet has allowed demonic activity through bitterness wrought by Unforgiveness to take hold and cause physical ailment .. thus heal the hurt by forgiveness .. cast the spirit out and the healing is done .. their body will quickly recover ..

all food for thought bro..
i must say i am very excited thee days of learning all this anew and looking for opportunity to walk in it and not only boringly theorize about it .. as most in nz have done for ,ohhhh, must be 20 odd years now ...

 

[ToBeBlessed]

As Derek would say, the enemy comes into defeat you in the realm of thought. Your response are the promises of God spoken in faith. The are both a sword and a shield. So when the winds of adversity blow and the floods come and your house shakes, you want to stick with God's version of reality, both in word and deed. If you're doubleminded and you don't bridle your tongue, then it's all in vain.

When the enemy causes you to doubt your salvation, you answer with the Word concerning your safety in Christ. When lack is staring you in the face, then your confession is that Jesus became poor for you so you could inherit the riches of His kingdom (your needs to be met). When you're at a loss for wisdom and understanding, you call for it with what the Word says about wisdom and understanding for the child of God. When you need guidance, you ask and then you acknowledge God as your provider of guidance and instruction.

You can choose to think of it as a vending machine, but that is a derogatory view your Heavenly provision. It's your armor.

It's for the one submitted to God and for the one that believes in the promise. There's nothing ugly or negative about that. To assume one is just doing his own thing is presumptuous. Everybody moves away from the servant mentality from time to time and it's better to give each other the benefit of the doubt. It's better to look at the lovely version and not something out of balance. It's better not to be negatively critical.



I have enjoyed Derek's teachings and he believes in faith. Any comparison to "vending machine" appropriation of the promises of God is missing a little explanation that goes with it.

However with WOF beliefs they believe that anything that is said negative will also affect them, negatively. In that respect, it is NOT FAITH, because all the things in our lives work for the glory of God. God gives us trials to make us stronger.

When people say "Don't say that you are sick!" and "Don't speak that into existence" they think they are in control. Does God speak into existance bad blessings for His children? There words, It's not about God at that point. What is currently happening may be God's will and one could easily thwart that.

You really cannot have it both ways. You cannot call belief in God, because you are scared that disbelief will bring you the opposite, faith. Faith is in good and bad times. Faith is not waving according to circumstance or blessings or lack of blessing. So, it's not true faith. It's a type of believing what you want to happen, like positive thinking. People that believe in positive thinking believe that the thought brings it about.

 

[Alive_Again]

However with WOF beliefs they believe that anything that is said negative will also affect them, negatively.

We're just talking about staying in agreement with the provision of God for our lives. There's something called "binding and loosing". What you speak can provide an opening for blessing or cursing from either kingdom, depending on who's report you're agreeing with.

It's not superstition. Try the WWJD to what you might say. Do you think Jesus, the pattern Son would say things like we do? He came to show us the way through Him. Can you picture Jesus saying, "I'm such a schmuck! I'm an idiot! He said what He meant and He meant what He said.

In that respect, it is NOT FAITH, because all the things in our lives work for the glory of God. God gives us trials to make us stronger.

I think that all things can be turned for the glory of God, but I don't believe all things ARE for the glory of God. The enemy gets away with a lot of junk that was never God's will. He does permit trials, but they are to be overcome, and not to overcome us. We're supposed to come against the things that would defeat us.

It is important to ascertain God's will in matters because some of the stuff we loosed in our lives are there by permission. Some repair is needed sometimes and our mouths can be our own enemy.

Does God speak into existance bad blessings for His children? There words, It's not about God at that point. What is currently happening may be God's will and one could easily thwart that.

In James it says that we curse men made in the similitude of God (with our mouths). Fire from Hell, and he's talking to believers! It's not just stuff said to others. Do a check on your words and determine if you're cursing our own life in some area.

Do you think the cursing James speaks of is some believer going, "I curse you by...!" No, they are speaking outside of the flow of God's Spirit. That's what I'm talking about. The fruits of that take on many forms.

It's a type of believing what you want to happen, like positive thinking. People that believe in positive thinking believe that the thought brings it about.

There is also the decree and establish higher walk that believers are supposed to be engaging in. This is to establish the kingdom around us and in our lives.

One thing I learned very quickly (though not quickly enough) as a newly Spirit baptized believer. Much of what God has (already) given in His sight doesn't just fall on us. It must be received, and a lot of it is done through warfare.

The enemy got over on me for a long time. "If I'm a Christian, and God's Word is true, how come so many promises aren't being fulfilled in my life? I'm obviously not abiding, walking in love, a child of God, etc." I fought with that for many months. Then I found some faith teaching and as I considered it, God quickened it, expecting me to apply it to my own life and to lay hold on these things (by grace).

 

[Dave-W]

There's something called "binding and loosing". What you speak can provide an opening for blessing or cursing from either kingdom, depending on who's report you're agreeing with.

"Binding and loosing" has nothing to do with this topic at all. That teaching popped up because whoever made it up had NO idea of what that phrase meant in the first century.

 

[johnpaul7779]

Good point. Why did she ask then? LOL

A few years ago, I got in an argument with my wife right before going to church. As I approached the door of the church, one of the greeters asked how I was doing. I think he regretted asking when I decided to be honest to see what his response would be.

"Laugh and the world laughs with you
Weep and you weep alone
For the sad old earth must borrow its mirth
But has troubles enough of its own"

 

[Strong in Him]

The other day, I was asked how I was doing and told the old friend about my back problems to which they quickly replied,"Don't speak curses over yourself"

You weren't speaking curses over yourself, you were answering their question.

I had heard similar teaching through the years, but was never shown in Scripture where this teaching comes from.

I've heard this before too, in fact I think someone even said it to me on this forum once.
I don't believe it, myself. I know that if we repeat negative stuff about ourselves regularly we may start to believe it, and I know we are encouraged to have a right view of ourselves. But you were telling them how your back was - fact. If you'd had a slight twinge and were sure you were heading for a wheelchair, that might have been different. Also there are people who have problems with self esteem, or who may struggle with depression. I don't believe they are cursing themselves; they are just calling it as they see it. Yes, their perspective and rational thinking is flawed, but I don't think God would regard them as calling down curses on themselves.

I have a cold at the moment, I know I have; that's a fact. If I said, "oh it's bound to get worse. I'm probably looking at double pneumonia, I'd better clear my diary for the next month; some might say that was a curse. But it's not a curse to state facts.

 

[Messy]

The WOF teaching of name it claim it turns God into our servant rather than the other way around. Speaking curses over yourself inadvertantly is part of that errant theology.

Derek Prince once described this approach as turning God into a "...cosmic vending machine. You put your scripture in the slot, pull the lever and out pops your blessing."

Maybe if you want to use Him to get what you want, which is stupid because then it doesn't work. If you pray according to His will you can believe you already received it.

 

[Alive_Again]

If you've been to the doctor and you simply say what the doctor told you, that in itself if not a curse (assuming he's a real doctor!).

It has been demonstrated in scripture that God paid for all of man's needs in the atonement. Prior to that, He made a provision for His people the Jews. It was based on adherence to the Law. In the New Covenant it is by the Blood and the cross, and your submission to His Lordshp.

The common theme in both versions is that if you hearken diligently to God's voice, you'll have a hearing heart. You'll hear the promise to His people (in our case via the gospel) which includes healing for your body. It must be preached though and it must be received.

The enemy has no right to afflict a believer unless we give him that right. So assuming that is not the case, it is better to use the armor of the promises of God for your body. You can agree that you have an infirmity in your body, but that it does not have the right to be there. But it should be laid hold of by warfare.

You can plant the seed of promise into your heart for healing, and you must believe from seed to harvest that healing is yours. You can still take your medicine while the seed grows from start to finish.

Don't get me wrong, sometimes He just drops it on you, but that is often not the case. The promise is still there for you.

 

[Alithis]

perhaps we should define what it is to"curse" from a spirit filled bible perspective.

 

[Alive_Again]

In my view, a person is either healed or they are not. Healing is that part of the body returning to normal function whether through restoration or the sickness/disease leaving. If that hasn't happened, then God has not yet started the healing process, or the actual recovery is not apparent yet while it is happening under the surface.

All of your needs are already met according to His riches in glory. It's already past tense. We usually assume we're talking about finances, but includes physical healing. It is already yours. It has been bought and paid for.

Just like God told the Israelites, the land of promise was already theirs, even though they didn't actually possess it yet.

A great covenant has been provided to by precious promises of God.

Your spirit must receive the Word of God before faith comes. The Word is a seed. Although God can and has sped up the growth process, it usually does not grow to maturity in one day. Your spirit "births" the seed of the Word in the same way a woman births a child. Since the promise must be believed in order to receive, you must be in agreement with that during the gestation process.

I have learned that in the presence of the glory, that things speed up tremendously. Jesus carried that glory and the unlimited anointing He carried often brought some very quick births! The people who were healed heard the preaching of the Word first, then they believed and came forward and received a quick manifestation. Not all received an immediate manifestation (Centurion's servant and the lepers).

You can always claim the promise of God by your personal faith and receive from God anytime. But if you combine your faith with the anointing, things tend to move much quicker.

Norvel Hayes stepped right out of God's presence and in his living room declared new skin for his daughter. Every moment the past after his return he could feel the pull of fleshly doubt. Yet he declared the promise of God. It took just over a month of fighting the good fight of faith for his daughter to manifest a healing that was already hers.

There are a number of ways to mix faith with the promises of God. One is by decree (See Mk 11:23).

It's very common for "healed" believers to undergo warfare for healing for an infirmity that has attacked their body (deservedly or not). It might take days or weeks to overcome. The response for a believer (one believing) is to declare your healing.

Instant healing is in the domain of miracles and is a different function of the Holy Spirit.

BTW, I used to believe that until Kenneth Hagin shared what Jesus told him. Hagin was given a special anointing to minister healing (not miracles). The person in question had missing parts. Hagin's healing anointing was not what was needed, but rather the anointing for miracles. This is why he was unable to minister to her physical need.

So the gap from healing to miracles is not based on time, but one is a restoration of what is there and the miracle it seems is for something not present at all!

 

[SavedByGrace3]

There was a vampire movie some time ago where someone tried to use a cross on the vampire. The vampire laughed and said "You have to believe for that to work."
Not to take lessons from vampires... but he had a point.
Confession (whether blessing or curse) does not work if you do not believe. And if you do believe something (as we all do) then out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. You will not be able to stop it.

Lastly, if faith is of the reborn spirit, then I would suggest there are no curses in there. The sprint of Christ in us has nothing but good fruit. The abundance of this heart is good, and pure, and holy. It is the nature of God. if you read the list of the fruit of the spirit in Galatians, you will find nothing about cursing. That would be a flesh thing, and since the flesh has no power to believe... not to worry there.

So I would not sweat the curses thing.
But we all have to be watchful of idle words. Yes?
I would entertain any counter arguments.

Dids

 

[Alive_Again]

Lastly, if faith is of the reborn spirit, then I would suggest there are no curses in there. The sprint of Christ in us has nothing but good fruit.

It all comes down to what you yield to. Strife can enter in and people readily repeat words they're hearing. The fruit of that is evil.

I have had discernment of spirits working and have heard normally fruitful believers utter horrible curses. It was like some kind of putrid filth was coming from their mouth. They could have said anything and I knew it was the enemy. Usually it's just some kind of "news'. It's a report and often they're from the enemy. We can choose God's report and it's a blessing.

Remember James said that we curse our brothers made in the similitude of God. He was talking to believers.

You can curse your own field by not bridling your lips under pressure.

"This car or house will never sell. I have trouble getting up in the morning. My son never listens to me. My daughter only does what she wants to do. My boss thinks I'm ineffective. I have worst memory for names. My wife gossips to her best friend constantly. My car won't pass inspection. My pastor doesn't speak of the deep things of God. My employees don't care if they come to work on time. Everyone is intimidated by me at church. Whatever can go wrong..."

You can literally commission evil spirits to send fiery darts against loved ones, erratic drivers, co-workers, etc. You can bless them too. It's all about what you yield to.

if you read the list of the fruit of the spirit in Galatians, you will find nothing about cursing. That would be a flesh thing, and since the flesh has no power to believe... not to worry there.

The flesh has trouble believing God, but it often receives from the current of unbelief prevalent in the world.

I remember a lesson Kenneth Hagin mentioned when he was ministering to a person. He'd bind up a spirit (ministers of the curse) and then he'd say, "Bend over and see if you can touch your toes." Now the Lord is visible in the spirit realm to Hagin, and He's getting ticked off. Hagin realized the word "IF" kept the manifestation of the healing from coming to fruition.

If you extend words and actions of doubt over your everyday life, you can abort some of your provision. You're wanting to partake of a specific promise, but your actions, especially your mouth doesn't line up. So you short-circuit the promise. Just like Hagin ministering, God's ready to move, but when we speak contrary to the blessing, we allow the curse to prevail.

Finally, when you utter something akin to the list I made above, you speak counter to a provision in the Word of God. It's a curse. Not only does it keep from displacing something the enemy has been working, it can "loose" the enemy to steal from you based on what you say.

It's vital to understand that we utter blessing and cursing from our mouths so we can take the message of bridling your tongue with the proper seriousness.

 

[CGL1023]

The other day, I was asked how I was doing and told the old friend about my back problems to which they quickly replied,"Don't speak curses over yourself." I had heard similar teaching through the years, but was never shown in Scripture where this teaching comes from. As a side note, doctors did an MRI of my back and there are actual, real problems with it. Can anyone give me some better understanding on the teaching she is talking about with Scripture references?

I wouldn't use the word "curses". In Mark 11:23 it says ... "he will have whatever he says"(NKJV); I am taught that 'if you say it, you own it'. That may sound a little extreme but that keeps me from dwelling on physical issues or going to doctors. I simply thank the Lord for His watching over me throughout the day. I don't expect to meet many like minded individuals. I don't try to promote this to others as the whole issue is controversial if not incendiary.

 

[Strong in Him]

I wouldn't use the word "curses". In Mark 11:23 it says ... "he will have whatever he says"(NKJV);

Not exactly.
The disciples commented that the fig tree that Jesus had cursed had withered, and Jesus replied;
"Have faith in God. I tell you the truth, if anyone says to this mountain 'go, throw yourself into the sea' and does not doubt in his heart but believes that what he says will happen, it will be done for him."

Jesus is talking about having faith in God, asking for something and not doubting that you will receive it - not saying that you are whatever you say about yourself.
This also has to be balanced with verses that say "whatever you ask in my name". Asking in Jesus' name means asking with his authority and according to his will.

I am taught that 'if you say it, you own it'.

I've heard that as well.
I think that is extreme - if not slightly ridiculous. If I say that my foot is sore, that doesn't make my foot hurt. My foot pain is due to a long standing physical injury which required surgery; saying that it hurts is just saying that it hurts. If I didn't say that, doctors wouldn't know there was anything wrong and healers wouldn't know what to pray for me.

That may sound a little extreme but that keeps me from dwelling on physical issues or going to doctors.

Going to the doctors' is not wrong. Sometimes it's necessary.

I simply thank the Lord for His watching over me throughout the day.

Me too. That doesn't mean I can't also go to the doctors'.

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Actually Mark 11:23 does not say you can say something and it will come to pass.
It says if you believe that everything you say comes to pass, you will have what you say.
That is the God kind of faith, the kind of faith that calls things that be not as if they were. You have to believe that the things you say come to pass. The faith is in the act of saying, not the individual thing.
VERY few people have exhibited this kind of faith. Do you believe that everything you say comes to pass? Try it:
Speak to that speck of dust on your monitor.
Tell it to move to the right just smidgen.
Did it move?
NO?

Don't worry about cursing that apple tree out there in the yard... not just yet.

When you get the God kind of faith that Jesus had, then worry.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

Actually Mark 11:23 does not say you can say something and it will come to pass.
It says if you believe that everything you say comes to pass, you will have what you say.
That is the God kind of faith, the kind of faith that calls things that be not as if they were. You have to believe that the things you say come to pass. The faith is in the act of saying, not the individual thing.
VERY few people have exhibited this kind of faith. Do you believe that everything you say comes to pass? Try it:
Speak to that speck of dust on your monitor.
Tell it to move to the right just smidgen.
Did it move?
NO?

Don't worry about cursing that apple tree out there in the yard... not just yet.

When you get the God kind of faith that Jesus had, then worry.

I don't think that we can say just anything and expect it to come to pass.

Jesus said, "My meat is to do the will of Him who sent me." What this means that if Jesus said anything expecting it to come to pass, it had to be in the centre of the Father's will for His ministry. Even Jesus could not expect anything He said outside of the Father's will to come to pass.

I'd love a 2015 Superduper Roadhog 8 cylinder Special sports car, and I can speak it into being, and then believe as hard as I can for it, but it will never come because it would not fit into God's will for my life and ministry. Mainly because I would have to believe for a large American style salary to afford to run it!

It takes time and prayer to know what God's will is. The example of the early 20th Century Methodist Holiness preacher Guy Bevington is good for spending extended time finding out God's will before he could have the faith to believe it could happen.

God will not give us anything that we would have just to consume on our own lusts (see the book of James), no matter how hard we believe for it, or how often we try to speak it into being.

But we have already been provided with everything we need for life, holiness, and effective ministry for Christ. When we know that we are moving in the will of God, then, because He knows what we have need of before we ask Him, we find that everything we need is always available when we need it.

I have found that God has always provided for my needs, including a good job that pays all the bills, freehold home, reliable motor vehicle, reliable computers, food on the table every day, good clothes to wear, etc., without me having to speak them into being, or striving to believe and believe and believe for them. They just turn up when I need them.

When I was a mature student (in my 30s) at university, I got down to my last $100. I believed that He wanted me to continue, so I just talked to Him about it. Three days later, I got a telephone call offering me a part-time job which paid my accommodation and bills for the rest of that year, and then I gained a typing teacher's diploma which gave me a good part-time teaching job in a private secretarial school teaching keyboarding while I finished my final year at university. I did not have to speak these things into being, nor did I have the sweat and strive trying to believe for them. They happened because I was moving in God's will, and He provided what I needed to continue.