Speak lovingly of Mary

[WarriorAngel]

http://members.aol.com/linden59/bvm.html









Speak lovingly.

 

[Sphinx777]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bosouX_d8Y&NR=1

​

 

[Amylisa]

Nice website, Warrior Angel. Thanks for the link!

Thanks for sharing the video, Sphinx777. I love "Ave Maria." Have you heard Josh Groban sing it? Absolutely beautiful.

 

[CaliforniaJosiah]

IMHO, speaking "lovingly" includes speaking respectfully.
And respectfully means truthfully.


IMHO, dogmatically insisting on unsubstantiated, late rumors lacks truth, respect or love. In spite of the sincere intention.


Someone MAY desire to flatter me by telling others that I have a Ph.D. from Harvard. I don't. Thus, such doesn't flatter me, it embarrass me and is disrespectful to the truth (I have a B.S - no jokes please - from the University of California). You INTENTION may be good, but the result is not. My mommie taught me to always ask, "Is it true and is it helpful?" She told me to not spread rumors - even well intentioned ones. And I try not to do that - especially about one whom I love, adore and hold in highest esteem, such as Our Blessed Lady.


That's MY perspective, anyway....


Pax


- Josiah



.

 

[Quijote]

Nice website, Warrior Angel. Thanks for the link!

Thanks for sharing the video, Sphinx777. I love "Ave Maria." Have you heard Josh Groban sing it? Absolutely beautiful.

I've heard it and I agree, it IS beautiful.

 

[WarriorAngel]

She told me to not spread rumors - even well intentioned ones. And I try not to do that - especially about one whom I love, adore and hold in highest esteem, such as Our Blessed Lady.

This is a close cousin to what my dad said...
'If you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.'

And if your post was not intended to cause doubt, which is rumor since it comes from you as an opinion in this regard, it still does throw out doubt on something you are not equipped to discern absolutely.

So where we may doubt something, and it is true, we should reflect on the fact we may make an error and that error could could cause others to stumble.


I love Ave Maria...that was beautiful!

 

[Uphill Battle]

This is a close cousin to what my dad said...
'If you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.'

Good thing for CF that nobody follows that, or this place would be DEAD.

And if your post was not intended to cause doubt, which is rumor since it comes from you as an opinion in this regard, it still does throw out doubt on something you are not equipped to discern absolutely.

ah... I love this allusion. ":what we say is ok, it's fact, what you say isn't, it's opinion." It's standard RC PR. (I just love acronyms!)

So where we may doubt something, and it is true, we should reflect on the fact we may make an error and that error could could cause others to stumble.

yes.... we ALL should, don't you think?

I love Ave Maria...that was beautiful!

I'm sure you are not suprised that I don't.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Good thing for CF that nobody follows that, or this place would be DEAD.
ah... I love this allusion. ":what we say is ok, it's fact, what you say isn't, it's opinion." It's standard RC PR. (I just love acronyms!)

yes.... we ALL should, don't you think?

I'm sure you are not suprised that I don't.

My concern is..
If it is true and we hold derision towards it, it might not be good to attack it.

If it is false and we said nothing against it, we are still safe.

Prudence.

Whether we agree or not isnt the issue i was stating. But that if it is genuine, and we slam at it, will it cause us to stumble?
We do not know.

I believe it, but if someone tells me that we shouldnt spread rumors, but indirectly do just that...it is doing just that we say not to do. But thats imo.

IE..its an ironic post.

 

[Uphill Battle]

My concern is..
If it is true and we hold derision towards it, it might not be good to attack it.

if it WERE true to us, we would NOT attack it. Let's play the other side of the coin, using your train of thought. Is it ok to say nothing against Universalism? Mormanism? JW? Oneness? (pick your poison... I'm not, I just know that a few of these are definitively contrarian to RC position.) obviously not. RC apologetic encircles RC doctrine. In doctrinal discussion, you WILL say something derisive about another position (mean spirited or not. Contempt will be shown for an opposing viewpoint.)

If it is false and we said nothing against it, we are still safe.

Prudence.

you think? If someone is preaching the "all paths lead to heaven" you think there is no harm in letting it be said? To not oppose blatent falsehood and blasphemy? I have a different view of what does, and doesn't constitute harm, I guess. Minor details, I don't care much about. Someone can speak in tongues if they want, even if I don't, for example, but false gospel is false gospel, and must be opposed.

Whether we agree or not isnt the issue i was stating. But that if it is genuine, and we slam at it, will it cause us to stumble?

cause who to stumble? The slammer, or the one listening? I would assume the one challanging it is either rightly or wrongly confident in wha they believe.

We do not know.

I believe it, but if someone tells me that we shouldnt spread rumors, but indirectly do just that...it is doing just that we say not to do. But thats imo.

IE..its an ironic post.

the topic is ironic. Both sides point at the other as quoting fairy tales, and caution their opponent not to quote as truth what they can't know for sure is or isn't.

amusing, really.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Well, UB...
Is there any harm is speaking lovingly about the Mother of God [Jesus is God]...?

So, is that really something [regardless of the paths to get there] we should all do?

Think about it.

 

[Uphill Battle]

Well, UB...
Is there any harm is speaking lovingly about the Mother of God [Jesus is God]...?

So, is that really something [regardless of the paths to get there] we should all do?

Think about it.

This just takes us full circle to CJ's post.

no, there is no harm speaking lovingly about Mary.

there IS harm in attributing to Mary, something false.

There is harm in attributing things to ANYONE that is false, really, even if well intentioned or "respectful."

for instance, if I attribute to the Apostle Paul as the ACTUAL first Pope, Catholics will have a fit. But hey, it was loving and respectfully said about The Apostle Paul!

the focus isn't on the attitude with us. It's the content.

 

[CaliforniaJosiah]

This just takes us full circle to CJ's post.

no, there is no harm speaking lovingly about Mary.

there IS harm in attributing to Mary, something false.

There is harm in attributing things to ANYONE that is false, really, even if well intentioned or "respectful."

for instance, if I attribute to the Apostle Paul as the ACTUAL first Pope, Catholics will have a fit. But hey, it was loving and respectfully said about The Apostle Paul!

the focus isn't on the attitude with us. It's the content.

I'm glad to be back at CF - and suddenly recall your EXCELLENT posts....




.

 

[Uphill Battle]

I'm glad to be back at CF - and suddenly recall your EXCELLENT posts....




.

Oh, heavens no, don't say it. My posts are rather pedestrian by comparison to yours! I can only pray that we score points for brevity.

 

[jckstraw72]

hot dangit people. do you have to turn everything into a petty argument? you all hate the Papacy and yet act as if you are all Popes who know the real deal behind Mary that somehow God forgot to let out for 1800 yrs or so.

 

[Uphill Battle]

hot dangit people. do you have to turn everything into a petty argument? you all hate the Papacy and yet act as if you are all Popes who know the real deal behind Mary that somehow God forgot to let out for 1800 yrs or so.

last time I checked... it isn't us that claims to have all the answers. All we ask is that if you are going to assert something, you back it up beyond "because we said so."

is that so hard?

 

[WarriorAngel]

This just takes us full circle to CJ's post.

no, there is no harm speaking lovingly about Mary.

there IS harm in attributing to Mary, something false.

There is harm in attributing things to ANYONE that is false, really, even if well intentioned or "respectful."

for instance, if I attribute to the Apostle Paul as the ACTUAL first Pope, Catholics will have a fit. But hey, it was loving and respectfully said about The Apostle Paul!

the focus isn't on the attitude with us. It's the content.

False?
How do you proove that?

I know from experience she brought me back to Jesus again.

I say again, because she brot her Son to the world [thru doing God's will] the first time.
She is a relentless evangelist of Jesus. All she does, says, or points to - is to her Son.

As a parent, i know you never stop loving your child.

You will seen that the apparitions are all centered around Jesus. Everything about her represents Jesus. He is the center of our lives. He is the core of our existence. He is the Son of the Eternal Father. He is our hope and the world has no other hope but Jesus Christ! That is what the apparitions show us. The Blessed Virgin draws us to Jesus. She is God's Greatest Evangelist

No other human can claim to have brought us Jesus...
Not without her first accepting and doing God's will.

But we give ourselves high fives when we see someone turn to God thru our efforts...
But we feel Mary is less than this, and so we denigrate her to the level below our own stature.

Yes, you have the ability to help others turn to God thru what you do and say but what makes us better than Mary?

Not only does she live on eternally, but we must remember her and about her in order to know Jesus.

Without her, whom even Jesus loves and honors, we wouldn't have our Savior.

And let's not think that God choose her indiscriminately. Because all signs pointed to that very date she conceived as pre ordained.

Jeremiah tells us God knew us before we were in the womb. This means we were already in God's thots. His Fiat.

Therefore Mary too was already choosen for the task to raise, nurture, and love the Son, Who is God. Her role was not as any mother. God didnt send His beloved Son to just anyone. For sciptures tell us that Jesus 'obeyed' her.

If Jesus obeyed her, then do we, ignore her or disobey her desires [which are to love Christ, of course]
She is not only who she is, but a permanent reminder to mankind to do God's will. Even when the future means pain and sorrow.

Speak of Mary lovingly.

She - which you do not understand it seems - requests that we look to her because thru her, we see her Son.

'My soul doth magnify the Lord' She says scriptures.

We cannot ignore even the smallest part of scriptures in order to understand them fully.

God Bless.

 

[jckstraw72]

last time I checked... it isn't us that claims to have all the answers. All we ask is that if you are going to assert something, you back it up beyond "because we said so."

is that so hard?

you assert that the entire Church got way off track, even into the Reformation age, and somehow you know better than the millions of Christians that came before you.

 

[Uphill Battle]

False?
How do you proove that?

I don't. I just don't ascribe my beliefs to something that is asserted outside of scriptures. You knew that though, right?

I know from experience she brought me back to Jesus again.

I say again, because she brot her Son to the world [thru doing God's will] the first time.
She is a relentless evangelist of Jesus. All she does, says, or points to - is to her Son.

As a parent, i know you never stop loving your child.

the typical position of ascribing more of the incarnation to Mary, than to God.

No other human can claim to have brought us Jesus...

no human at all can.

Not without her first accepting and doing God's will.

yes, I know all about the "If Mary didn't say yes, mankind would be lost because Jesus couldn't have come" line of thinking. I reject it as ridiculous.

But we give ourselves high fives when we see someone turn to God thru our efforts...
But we feel Mary is less than this, and so we denigrate her to the level below our own stature.

you're ascribing to others what you can't know. I myself take NO credit whatsoever for any of the process.

Yes, you have the ability to help others turn to God thru what you do and say but what makes us better than Mary?

never said any such thing. I never once said I'm better than Mary. In fact, I know for a fact that I'm not. Not because I know Mary, but because I know myself.

Not only does she live on eternally, but we must remember her and about her in order to know Jesus.

Without her, whom even Jesus loves and honors, we wouldn't have our Savior.

I knew it! It was going to come up. "Mary had say so in the incarnation, if she wasn't willing, God would be thwarted! Bwahahahaha!

And let's not think that God choose her indiscriminately. Because all signs pointed to that very date she conceived as pre ordained.

Jeremiah tells us God knew us before we were in the womb. This means we were already in God's thots. His Fiat.

Therefore Mary too was already choosen for the task to raise, nurture, and love the Son, Who is God. Her role was not as any mother. God didnt send His beloved Son to just anyone. For sciptures tell us that Jesus 'obeyed' her.

If Jesus obeyed her, then do we, ignore her or disobey her desires [which are to love Christ, of course]
She is not only who she is, but a permanent reminder to mankind to do God's will. Even when the future means pain and sorrow.

you're not saying anything I don't agree with in this statement.

Speak of Mary lovingly

and I do. She is blessed among all women. I just don't speak of her as comediatrix, dipenser of graces, or any of the titles or attributes that RC has tossed at her.

She - which you do not understand it seems - requests that we look to her because thru her, we see her Son.

'My soul doth magnify the Lord' She says scriptures.

We cannot ignore even the smallest part of scriptures in order to understand them fully.

God Bless.

I do believe that passage is being hijacked to fit what you want it to say.

you assert that the entire Church got way off track, even into the Reformation age, and somehow you know better than the millions of Christians that came before you.

Where?

 

[jckstraw72]

Where?

i really dont feel like playing your games. you know exactly what im talking about.

 

[NoDoubt]

This bears repeating as it seems to have been overlooked.

WarriorAngel, if she has brought you back to Jesus, then she has accomplished her mission. Now how about focusing on Him once again and giving HIM the attention and the glory only HE deserves?

It's not about putting down Mary. It's about praising Jesus.

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=XeRbdIbfZpM&feature=related