Space is actually expanding equally and at the same rate or speed everywhere...

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Thanks, thank you, but I was wondering if you maybe have and answer for post #36 though, maybe, possibly, maybe...?

I don't know what you're asking. Gravity attracts mass to mass.

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

In a picture of the known universe, it is laid out with strings and strands and clusters connecting those strands and strings of, galaxies, etc, or "normal matter" (for the most part anyway), etc, and then empty areas, where dark matter may be a force pushing out maybe causing the expansion on supra-galactic scales, and I'm wondering if gravity is still a force even on those supra-galactic scales, that is trying to draw things back toward each other or back together, but maybe against the force or forces that are causing the expansion, etc, on supra-galactic scales, etc...?

Could gravity still be a "force(al) factor" I guess you could say, even on those supra-galactic scales, etc, that is maybe against the force or forces pushing everything apart (or trying to push everything apart), or out and away from one another, etc...? Even on those supra-galactic scales, etc...?

Could gravity still be a factor, and could it be partially responsible for what we see in a picture of the known universe and how it is laid out with all of it's (connecting) strings and clusters, etc...? And why there even are strings and clusters maybe, etc...?

Gravity is the long-range attractive force that has structured galaxies, clusters, superclusters, etc. But at large scales, it's not sufficient to overcome the expansion of space.

 

[Neogaia777]

Gravity is the long-range attractive force that has structured galaxies, clusters, superclusters, etc. But at large scales, it's not sufficient to overcome the expansion of space.

How do we know that for sure...?

Cause wouldn't that depend a great deal on the rate of the expansion happening equally and uniformly everywhere, etc...?

How have we come to know that...? If we have yet...?

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

How do we know that for sure...?

Cause wouldn't that depend a great deal on the rate of the expansion happening equally and uniformly everywhere, etc...?

How have we come to know that...? If we have yet...?

We know because galaxies hold together, but above that scale (roughly) stuff is moving apart at an accelerating rate. When the cosmologists do the maths comparing the strength of gravity and the expansion rate, it's clear. If you want to know how all this stuff is worked out, there are lots of readable popular science articles about it online.

 

[loveofourlord]

Why is that and what is the explanation for that do you think...?

I made the a balloon anaology. Again paint dots evenly on a balloon, then blow up the balloon from any point on the balloon it looks like everything is expanding away from you, since as the skin expands the space between the dots increases. it's a product of how the observer sees it, every dot will see the balloon as everything expanding from it.

The classic example is if you make a grid of dots, then expand the distance between the dots, then compare how they look to be now compared to before from a single dots point of view, regardless of which one you chose they all seem to have expanded away from it.

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-f883c67e3a029bdfda825f6e07018635

 

[Neogaia777]

I made the a balloon anaology. Again paint dots evenly on a balloon, then blow up the balloon from any point on the balloon it looks like everything is expanding away from you, since as the skin expands the space between the dots increases. it's a product of how the observer sees it, every dot will see the balloon as everything expanding from it.

The classic example is if you make a grid of dots, then expand the distance between the dots, then compare how they look to be now compared to before from a single dots point of view, regardless of which one you chose they all seem to have expanded away from it.

https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-f883c67e3a029bdfda825f6e07018635

The balloon analogy is inadequate as it is still expanding from a center, and space is not, and we should be able to see something of that center in the dispersal pattern unless were not seeing very much of it at all...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

We know because galaxies hold together, but above that scale (roughly) stuff is moving apart at an accelerating rate. When the cosmologists do the maths comparing the strength of gravity and the expansion rate, it's clear. If you want to know how all this stuff is worked out, there are lots of readable popular science articles about it online.

How do we know the expansion rate from our point of view, or whether is truly increasing or not, since it only appears that way to us from our perspective or point of view, out from us etc, which is not the way it is really happening etc...

And on supra-galactic scales it would be happening rather slowly right, so what if even a very weak force of gravity is pulling or trying to pull it all back in at the same time and is partially responsible for what were seeing at supra-galactic scales, the layout of it all, etc, it's clusters and strings and areas of dark pockets etc...

God Bless!

 

[Neogaia777]

How do we know the expansion rate from our point of view, or whether is truly increasing or not, since it only appears that way to us from our perspective or point of view, out from us etc, which is not the way it is really happening etc...

And on supra-galactic scales it would be happening rather slowly right, so what if even a very weak force of gravity is pulling or trying to pull it all back in at the same time and is partially responsible for what were seeing at supra-galactic scales, the layout of it all, etc, it's clusters and strings and areas of dark pockets etc...

God Bless!

Because what we see is things further away from us moving faster away from us we assume it's accelerating, when it may not be that way, there are just simply more of those expanding places "in between us" the further a thing is away from us, it could be happening at the same rate equally and uniformly everywhere...

What we see, and what we've based most of our assumptions on because of that, might not be right and could be in error... Because we've been basing on it what we see from where we are at, which is not the way it's actually happening...

And that's part of what I'm trying to explain...

Peace

 

[Neogaia777]

Because what we see is things further away from us moving faster away from us we assume it's accelerating, when it may not be that way, there are just simply more of those expanding places "in between us" the further a thing is away from us, it could be happening at the same rate equally and uniformly everywhere...

What we see, and what we've based most of our assumptions on because of that, might not be right and could be in error... Because we've been basing on it what we see from where we are at, which is not the way it's actually happening...

And that's part of what I'm trying to explain...

Peace

On supra-galactic scales most especially, the expansion is happening rather slowly, and I still don't think some of you guys are quite fully understanding equal expansion everywhere from nowhere as the center really either...? The space of spaces "in-between" are expanding is all, and is is giving us a "false impression of acceleration"...

If you were to try looking at it from everywhere and nowhere...? Anyway...

Peace

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

How do we know the expansion rate from our point of view, or whether is truly increasing or not, since it only appears that way to us from our perspective or point of view, out from us etc, which is not the way it is really happening etc...

How Scientists Know the Universe is Expanding.

And on supra-galactic scales it would be happening rather slowly right, so what if even a very weak force of gravity is pulling or trying to pull it all back in at the same time and is partially responsible for what were seeing at supra-galactic scales, the layout of it all, etc, it's clusters and strings and areas of dark pockets etc...

The force of gravity reduces with the square of the distance, but the expansion force is uniform with distance. So even though the expansion force is tiny, the gravitational force of a galaxy becomes less than that at less than intergalactic distances.

 

[Neogaia777]

How Scientists Know the Universe is Expanding.

The force of gravity reduces with the square of the distance, but the expansion force is uniform with distance. So even though the expansion force is tiny, the gravitational force of a galaxy becomes less than that at less than intergalactic distances.

I'm not arguing that it's expanding, but whether or not the rate or speed of that expansion is accelerating or not? or whether it's a constant? and a constant that is moving very slowly on supra-galactic scales? because if is pretty slow, relatively speaking, then could gravity, even weak forces of gravity between galaxies and such and whatnot, and all the "normal matter", still be attracted by gravity to each other, at a rate, or in a way, that might counter the slow rate expansion? If it's a slow constant everywhere etc?

But all the normal matter is doing it (trying to gather or pull itself back together) (or inward) "around" the dark pockets or dark areas that we see in a pic of the known or observable universe thus far? Which are "pushing outward" on the rest of it, etc, (the dark matter or areas or pockets of dark matter pushing out on, well, each other, but also all the normal matter or normal space, or where we see the strings and clusters, in between and or around those pockets, etc) (and those are trying to come back in on themselves etc) (but have to go around the dark areas or pockets, which are pushing out on it, or pushing out on it, and itself, and everything else, etc)? Equally and uniformly and at one constant rate of slow speeds at those scales everywhere, etc...?

Peace

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

I'm not arguing that it's expanding, but whether or not the rate or speed of that expansion is accelerating or not? or whether it's a constant? and a constant that is moving very slowly on supra-galactic scales? because if is pretty slow, relatively speaking, then could gravity, even weak forces of gravity between galaxies and such and whatnot, and all the "normal matter", still be attracted by gravity to each other, at a rate, or in a way, that might counter the slow rate expansion? If it's a slow constant everywhere etc?

But all the normal matter is doing it (trying to gather or pull itself back together) (or inward) "around" the dark pockets or dark areas that we see in a pic of the known or observable universe thus far? Which are "pushing outward" on the rest of it, etc, (the dark matter or areas or pockets of dark matter pushing out on, well, each other, but also all the normal matter or normal space, or where we see the strings and clusters, in between and or around those pockets, etc) (and those are trying to come back in on themselves etc) (but have to go around the dark areas or pockets, which are pushing out on it, or pushing out on it, and itself, and everything else, etc)? Equally and uniformly and at one constant rate of slow speeds at those scales everywhere, etc...?

Observations suggest that the expansion of the universe is accelerating.

If you'd like to ask a concise and coherent question, I might be able to say more, but I don't see myself as a Google front-end, so I might not do so.

 

[Neogaia777]

Observations suggest that the expansion of the universe is accelerating.

Observations of what? and from where? from where we are at? cause of course it would appear that way from where we are at, but we've already discussed that?

It would appear that way from wherever you were at, but that's not how it really is or is really happening, etc...?

Peace

 

[FrumiousBandersnatch]

Observations of what? and from where? from where we are at? cause of course it would appear that way from where we are at, but we've already discussed that?

It would appear that way from wherever you were at, but that's not how it really is or is really happening, etc...?

This should help.

 

[Neogaia777]

This should help.

Thanks,

Peace