Should there be an Urgency to Fix Education in the U.S.?

[OldWiseGuy]

“The main purpose of the American school is to provide for the fullest possible development of each learner for living morally, creatively, and productively in a democratic society.”
Quote from ASCD.

Then they should do that without delay.

 

[CaspianSails]

I have observed that many discussion threads on this forum end up discussing education in some form (often off topic). Because of this, I thought it would be helpful to have a discussion specifically relating to education and its perceived positive or negative effects. I want to make the topic broad enough to allow a wide range of ideas and opinions. As long as we stick to the general topic of education, it shouldn't be considered off topic.


Many young people today are struggling to perform well in school. When students do well, it hardly makes the news; but there is increased attention upon the educational attainment of students and their knowledge base.What is your opinion concerning the urgency of the problem?


If interested, please take the poll.


Some stats to consider:


For the First Time: 90% completed High School or More

It is a very urgent matter and the fact that in public schools and most universities and colleges education is secondary to progressive indoctrination. It is why many college students do not understand basic math and science but know how to organize a protest.


Nations Report Card—4th Grade Math by State

 

[Caliban]

There's probably some information out there about that.

Care to contribute evidence?

 

[Richard T]

Here's a stat we should consider. Why Do 60% of Community College Students Need Remedial Coursework? | CommunityCollegeReview.com
Yes, education is failing in most school districts for a whole host of reasons. For k-12, school choice would help. Another thing that would help would be to require 2 hours of math and/or English per day, to every student that was below average.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

It is mostly a funding issue since people don't like to work for free.

"Every farm needs a boy", to work for free.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Care to contribute evidence?

Your question, you look it up.

 

[Caliban]

Your question, you look it up.

When a person makes a claim, they should support it with evidence. If you're not going to do that, why comment at all?

 

[OldWiseGuy]

When a person makes a claim, they should support it with evidence. If you're not going to do that, why comment at all?

Hardly an actionable claim, wouldn't you say?

 

[Caliban]

Hardly an actionable claim, wouldn't you say?

Hardly an actionable claim, wouldn't you say?

Hitchens Razor:

“What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence."

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Hitchens Razor:

“What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence."

Then dismiss my comment. Problem solved.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

Here's a stat we should consider. Why Do 60% of Community College Students Need Remedial Coursework? | CommunityCollegeReview.com
Yes, education is failing in most school districts for a whole host of reasons. For k-12, school choice would help. Another thing that would help would be to require 2 hours of math and/or English per day, to every student that was below average.

We need to get to the root cause why they are below average before assigning them more work. Most kids I know in the school system that are struggling has to do with their home environment in some way. More work won't help them. My parents divorced when I was in the 7th grade, I failed most classes for that year. It was then a teacher at the end of the year that talked to me and eventually convinced me I was hurting myself more than hurting my parents. I am thankful for that teacher because who knows where I would have ended up on the path I was on. Kids that have more serious issues at home are not going to do better in school until the home life improves. Many times teachers and administrators get blamed when they are trying to teach kids that don't know if they will eat that evening, are worried about getting beaten that evening or are just neglected.

 

[Jay Sea]

I didn't say give them guns.

I did not beleive you meant them to have guns only that military style discipline leads to rigidity and blindly following the rules. We need to be fully human so Yeshua's way can be in our hearts and minds and not some other lesser substitute.

In Love
Jay

 

[OldWiseGuy]

We need to get to the root cause why they are below average before assigning them more work. Most kids I know in the school system that are struggling has to do with their home environment in some way. More work won't help them. My parents divorced when I was in the 7th grade, I failed most classes for that year. It was then a teacher at the end of the year that talked to me and eventually convinced me I was hurting myself more than hurting my parents. I am thankful for that teacher because who knows where I would have ended up on the path I was on. Kids that have more serious issues at home are not going to do better in school until the home life improves. Many times teachers and administrators get blamed when they are trying to teach kids that don't know if they will eat that evening, are worried about getting beaten that evening or are just neglected.

It's the job of the school guidance counselor to discover these things. The school knows much more about each student than most realize.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

The largest predictor of a students success is not IQ but the parents level of education and literacy.

That was the job of the system when they were in school.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

I did not beleive you meant them to have guns only that military style discipline leads to rigidity and blindly following the rules. We need to be fully human so Yeshua's way can be in our hearts and minds and not some other lesser substitute.

In Love
Jay

"Blindly following the rules"...of success, is a good thing. Which is actually what I meant.

 

[Caliban]

We need to get to the root cause why they are below average before assigning them more work. Most kids I know in the school system that are struggling has to do with their home environment in some way. More work won't help them. My parents divorced when I was in the 7th grade, I failed most classes for that year. It was then a teacher at the end of the year that talked to me and eventually convinced me I was hurting myself more than hurting my parents. I am thankful for that teacher because who knows where I would have ended up on the path I was on. Kids that have more serious issues at home are not going to do better in school until the home life improves. Many times teachers and administrators get blamed when they are trying to teach kids that don't know if they will eat that evening, are worried about getting beaten that evening or are just neglected.

Students experience horrible things at home--violence, physical and mental abuse, and everything you can imagine. Expecting students to pull themselves up by their proverbial bootstraps is to misunderstand the problem. It is great that you had a helpful teacher. It seems like you are thinking about this issue in the right way.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

We need to get to the root cause why they are below average before assigning them more work. Most kids I know in the school system that are struggling has to do with their home environment in some way. More work won't help them. My parents divorced when I was in the 7th grade, I failed most classes for that year. It was then a teacher at the end of the year that talked to me and eventually convinced me I was hurting myself more than hurting my parents. I am thankful for that teacher because who knows where I would have ended up on the path I was on. Kids that have more serious issues at home are not going to do better in school until the home life improves. Many times teachers and administrators get blamed when they are trying to teach kids that don't know if they will eat that evening, are worried about getting beaten that evening or are just neglected.

I was failing several courses as a HS senior, not because of home life but because I had lost all interest in school. A teacher who I didn't particularly like cornered me and told me that I was failing his class and that I wouldn't graduate if I didn't pass it. I wanted to graduate and get the heck out there so I knuckled down on all of my classes... and drew a B from him. If not for him I likely wouldn't have graduated with my class.

 

[Clizby WampusCat]

It's the job of the school guidance counselor to discover these things. The school knows much more about each student than most realize.

Ok, but you cannot make most children care about school work when their family life is terrible.

 

[OldWiseGuy]

Ok, but you cannot make most children care about school work when their family life is terrible.

True, and that fact should be considered seriously. If the kid is going to be a scholastic casualty, so be it. He or she can still succeed in life. I had to 'shoot my way out of high school', and I've done pretty well. Of course I had that 'privilege' thing going for me.