Should the SDA Forum Be Split?

[RC_NewProtestants]

We currently have very few rules and very little moderators. To assume that the building process is the same as the finished structure is very short sighted.

 

[TrustAndObey]

Let me ask you this RC....if the consensus ends up being that we split, are you guys just planning on appealing that decision?

I gotta get to bed, 'night all.

 

[honorthesabbath]

I just want to say something in defense of Honor real quick because I think that it needs to be said.

She is a very passionate person. She's also a very busy person that owns her own business and is an activist extraordinaire. She doesn't get to frequent here because she's very limited on time.

So when she does post here, it comes straight from the gut and she doesn't mess around with how she says something.

Someone commented on her use of caps and exclamation points, and all I can say to that is, you should see her when she's HAPPY! LOL

I've seen her take the life of a complete stranger into her hands and go up against our government to save his life. I've never been so impressed with another human being in my life, and that's the truth.

A prisoner in Oklahoma is being denied medical treatment for a very serious problem. He's 65, spitting up blood, can't walk......and they're refusing to bring him food now too.

He has absolutely no family fighting for him, and they were prepared to let him die.

Now they know there's a force to be reckoned with on the outside and Honor helped organize a huge group of people to send in letters (to the prisoner and the warden), make phone calls, etc.

That prisoner IS going to get treatment because Honor isn't going to rest until he does.

So the passion that some of you have such disdain for is one of the reasons I love her so much, and if YOU were in trouble, I know she wouldn't hesitate to do the same for you.

Trust me, if you were facing a terrible injustice, Honor is exactly the type of person you'd want getting your back.

That being said, I know it's very difficult to read people on a message board. I've already told her several times that if I didn't know her in person, I don't think I'd like her. HA!

But when Traditionals feel like we're under attack a lot, eventually this is what's going to happen.

She isnt the only one that feels like she needs to strike back, but I guess some of us are hoping that we can just split amicably and avoid the confrontation...which obviously gets pretty heated.

I'm asking you to let us have our own forum and work WITH us to get it.

Thank you Lainie--but you didn't have to tell them anything. We both know why they hate me and it has nothing to do with CAPS or !!!!!!!'s--lol. I hit them where they live and it gets real uncomfortable for them to be exposed.

But thank you again for your defense.

 

[SassySDA]

I'm willing to wager that you guys don't even know each other personally, so where does this disdain come from?

You would lose that bet.

 

[RC_NewProtestants]

Let me ask you this RC....if the consensus ends up being that we split, are you guys just planning on appealing that decision?

I gotta get to bed, 'night all.

Why? If every poll merely supplants the previous polls there is never a need to appeal as things could change with any poll.

 

[NightEternal]

I hit them where they live and it gets real uncomfortable for them to be exposed.

You give yourself far too much credit.

 

[moicherie]

Wow! I was last on this site 6/6/06 (probably a bad omen) and since then I see we are as united as always. (Ok excuse the sarcasm). Having just read most of the posts here it would be a shame to split. Reminds me of the reasons for regional conferences. People would rather the problem 'disappear' down the road then deal with the real issue of why they cannot 'hang' with their fellow Adventists who look or in this case think differently.
'We have faced the real enemy and it is us'

 

[reddogs]

The Adventist Forum has experienced periods of discord between Progressive and Traditional Adventists.

Should the Adventist section be split, with separate forums entirely (not just sub-forums) for Progressive and Traditional Adventists?

We have gotten a good core or "wise men (and women)" who keep things flowing in a loving and orderly manner so there is no reason for the split, only evil wants us seperated.

Red

 

[sentipente]

You guys might as well admit that you're fighting this because you want to be able to debate with us. We're tired though and we're sick of defending the same fundamental beliefs most of the people on this forum were baptized after agreeing with.

They can't debate with you if you don't debate with them. You should consider that you simply don't like to see their views be unchallenged. Since the internet is too large to police trying to challenge every "false" view is an exercise in futility. So, the best approach is to simply carry on as if they don't exist. You can't wish them out of existence.

 

[sentipente]

Jon, I've reported 2 posts today that are totally against the rules and absolute flaming....and has anything been done about them? Nope.

Maybe the mods don't agree with your assessment. Maybe they are giving this forum enough rope to hang itself. There could be a number of reasons.

 

[reddogs]

Tall and Ice, I understand what you are both saying and I respect your noble motivations. What you propose sounds wonderful, but I just don't see it playing out in reality. I don't think separation is shameful at all, just a practical necessity. You don't think the church in North America has been divided for years now? Go to a conservative church in southern Tennessee and then go to a progressive church in southern California, or the Loma Linda area. I think you will see that having them separate only makes sense, as taking a member of either church, placing them in the opposite environment and expecting them to be able to relate to each other on any level theologically, worship-style wise, philosophically or in lifestyle issues would almost be asking for the impossible.

I agree personal attacks are wrong and it should not be allowed. How we will work that out remains to be seen, but I favor the temporary forum ban idea. I have always tried to respect the concept of going after theology and ideas only and not the person, even if I was not always sucessful. However, now it seems this is becoming off-limits as well:



If the Traditionals are dead set against discussing the issues and doctrinal debate, maintaining a forum format where this will take place anywhere seems pointless and hopeless. Woob wants to formulate a list of heresies that are off-limits. Well, I consider the sinful nature of Christ to be heresy. I consider sinless perfection theology to be heresy. I consider making our salvation dependent upon sanctification to be heresy. Will I support censorship and not allowing these beliefs to be discussed on the boards as Woob suggests? Not at all. Do I want the right to be able to challenge those beliefs in the forums? You better believe it.

Therefore, a separate forum is my vote. Sorry. It's the only sensible solution to me. I have nothing to say to people who think I am a devil or that I am not a true Adventist (or, in Woob's case, not even a Christian.) I'm sick of being demonized. I have been an active member in the SDA church for almost 20 years, and I will be damned if I am going to let people pronounce me an apostate Adventist after only dialoging with me for a few months.

Pardon my strong language, but this is righteous indignation speaking. Now certain people can run back to thier Tradtional sub-hideyhole and gossip about how I swore.

However, like I said, if the majority votes against separation, I will go along with it and work towards the original plan.

And Woob, the reason I deleted my apology post was because I was tired of people like you continually throwing it back in my face and using it against me when you really didn't even understand what I was apologizing for in the first place.

I vote total separation.

Night, with all the love God allows me to muster I say that only those who want to help Satans work of dividing his believers would want us seperated. You are my friend and brother in Christ and when eternal life comes I want us all to be together, because God will not allow those who truly love him to miss out. I say lets all go there with our combined understanding as God is who gives us the "wisdom" in all things when we pray and ask him so our eyes are openned, even in this little group of believers....

Red

 

[sentipente]

I agree, we are ALL SDA's, it just seems that some of us SDA's want to change what the rest of us (traditional) SDA's believe.

No one wants to change what you believe against your will. But you have to agree that if the traditional SDA position was complete Christ would have come already. The continued delay should cause you to WANT a second look. Don't you think so? (At first I wrote "Don't you think?" to mean the same thing, then I realized you would probably take my abbreviation as an insult. Do you see where this is taking us?)

 

[honorthesabbath]

Red--it saddens me that the this forum is going to stay the SAME. What has it profitted us so far?

These liberals are mean-spirited aggressors and I for one am done with them. I hope you can handle what keeping this forum intact is going to do. Their agression is only going to increase now--just watch. This forum is going to be a hell on earth and then the TSDA's will leave. (Which is what night and his cronies have always wanted from the beginning). They want the world to think that THEIR doctrine is official GC doctrine and it is NOT!

This sickens me to the core! I guess Ice's underground campaign has worked. I know he he sent e-mails to ALL registered SDA's. I thought only REGULARS were allowed to vote. Moicheri's vote should NOT count--Ice recruited him here just to vote against us.

Mocheri's even admits to not posting here since 2006.
This is WRONG!

 

[Adventist Dissident]

the first step is to get if off the main page. we don't want the that to be peoples first impression.

 

[sentipente]

They want the world to think that THEIR doctrine is official GC doctrine and it is NOT!

You should also consider the possibility that both sides may be wrong. Let's not be blind people. It has been 2000 years since the church has been waiting for the second coming. It has been 134 years since this church was formed. Something is not right. Somebody needs to be bold enough to try to correct it. Will that somebody be us or will we leave it to others?

 

[moicherie]

Red--it saddens me that the this forum is going to stay the SAME. What has it profitted us so far?

These liberals are mean-spirited aggressors and I for one am done with them. I hope you can handle what keeping this forum intact is going to do. Their agression is only going to increase now--just watch. This forum is going to be a hell on earth and then the TSDA's will leave. (Which is what night and his cronies have always wanted from the beginning). They want the world to think that THEIR doctrine is official GC doctrine and it is NOT!

This sickens me to the core! I guess Ice's underground campaign has worked. I know he he sent e-mails to ALL registered SDA's. I thought only REGULARS were allowed to vote. Moicheri's vote should NOT count--Ice recruited him here just to vote against us.

Mocheri's even admits to not posting here since 2006.
This is WRONG!

If you wanted only regulars to post you should have asked for that to be a requirement not complain when things don't go your way after the fact.
Whether you realise it or not your post is mean spirited and says more about you than it does about liberal Adventists.
Official GC doctrine changes over the years, you do realise the church did not start off with 28 fundamentals don't you?

 

[Mankin]

If you wanted only regulars to post you should have asked for that to be a requirement not complain when things don't go your way after the fact.
Whether you realise it or not your post is mean spirited and says more about you than it does about liberal Adventists.
Official GC doctrine changes over the years, you do realise the church did not start off with 28 fundamentals don't you?

I completely agree with you. No one hates you honor, a better word is that some people dislike you because of some of your posts.

 

[happywiththelord]

This is just sickening.

Nice timing Moicherie...havent been here in how long and suddenly you decide to show up when a split is about to happen and start saying it shouldnt.

In my opinion, the progressive believers sooo dont want this split and they are doing everything in there power to stop it.

The traditionals had the votes to make a split possible and then all of a sudden progressives who havent been here in a VERY long time start coming in here and putting there two cents in.

or maybe they want so much chaos that the whole sda forum gets shut down and then nobody will learn of the sda church and what it believes. since its obvious they dont agree with the church views, they must want it to collapse (the church that is). And by not having a forum here where people can come and ask questions about sda's, our message cant get out and that makes less education on the truth and that means people stop coming to our faith.

I truly see this as disturbing. Both scenarios.

Like I said before, the traditionals and progressives cannot coexist in the same forum. Its like expecting Jews and Musleums to share a forum. It would never work because there core beliefs are so different. In the sda forum its worse because it says we are the same belief but we are obviously not! Its like a sheep in wolves clothing so to speak.

Even Jesus said there comes a time where you are to dust off your sandals and move on. Its not being wimpy or scared, etc. Its just plain sense! Things aren't going to change. So dont come back and accuse me or the other Traditionals about being scared, afraid, etc. Even Jesus knows there are times to move on when what you are doing isn't working.

SPLIT THE FORUM ALREADY!

Lets finally put to an end all the bickering over doctrine since obviously we dont agree and are not like minded and get to teaching the world what we do believe. The traditionals with there mainstream adventist, general conference believing beliefs and then who knows what for the progressives. I dont know what to call yourselves, but its obvious you dont need to carry the adventist name. So you better open a poll amongst yourselves to figure out a name. Because people, your not Adventist. (maybe in name you think you are, but not in beliefs!)
Why are some progressives afraid of splitting the forum? I dont truly understand. Is it because they wont be able to spread their beliefs around and try to pass it off as mainstream adventism and get people all confused anymore?

 

[sentipente]

The traditionals with there mainstream adventist, general conference believing beliefs

Do you have permission from the GC to make that claim?

 

[happywiththelord]

Do you have permission from the GC to make you claims?