Here is another hindrance to Gods order Paid salaried ministers
I know this may not seem to be a hindrance to Gods order but it is
When one man calked “the pastor” and a few others get paid a wage to minister over the body this makes their function more vital than others and creates a schism in the body again. Why would the believers seek to be minister to one another as God says they should and commands they should (1 Cor 14:26-38, 1 Peter 4:10,11), if they pay the one man pastor to do do so? This also makes them dependant on men and those so called “pastors” who are salaried professionals. But if all the body was to function under Christ headship they would soon realize that they don’t need to have one man paid or exalted above them to do it
Bit when speaking of this issue, many will get very defensive especially those who make their living off the income they make from others. But we need to look closer at this. To begin with Jesus said,
“..freely ye have received, freely give.”(Matthew 10:8)
No man can buy his salvation or pay to get a ministry from God. God gives to men freely salvation and gifts and all good things. And no man should charge money to preach the gospel. Paul echoed this also when he said,
“What is my reward then? Verily that, when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge, that I abuse not my power in the gospel. “(1 Corinthians 9:13)
Paul himself worked often to support himself and help others as scripture states ,
“For ye remember, brethren, our labour and travail: for labouring night and day, because we would not be chargeable unto any of you, we preached unto you the gospel of God. “ 1 Thessalonians 2:9)
Paul didnt like the idea of being chargeable to men and he gave a good example to others of working and not coveting any mans wealth, as he said when he spoke to the Ephesian elders,
“ I have coveted no man’s silver, or gold, or apparel. 34 Yea, ye yourselves know, that these hands have ministered unto my necessities, and to them that were with me. 35 I have shewed you all things, how that so labouring ye ought to support the weak, and to remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he said, It is more blessed to give than to receive. “(Acts 20: 34-36)
Elders are local men generally who can work . And this is clearly the example Paul was giving to then. Paul said " i have shown you in all things", Paul gave an example to them in his own life. What example would this be if these elders wet simply dependent on others gold or silver and did not work at all? Paul even said ,
“For yourselves know how ye ought to follow us: for we behaved not ourselves disorderly among you; 8 Neither did we eat any man’s bread for nought; but wrought with labour and travail night and day, that we might not be chargeable to any of you: 9 Not because we have not power, but to make ourselves an ensample unto you to follow us. 10 For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, that if any would not work, neither should he eat. 11 For we hear that there are some which walk among you disorderly, working not at all, but are busybodies”(2 Thessalonians 3:7-11)
Here Paul includes himself when he says, he laboured with his own hands not to be chargeable to any and gave an example to others, that if ANY man dies not work he should not eat. And he rebukes those who work not at all. This doesn’t sound like Paul was telling some to set themselves over all and be paid to do so. This command to work seems to be for all the church he wrote to and no specific division between them or putting a single elder over all and paying salary.
“And that ye study to be quiet, and to do your own business, and to work with your own hands, as we commanded you” (1 Thessalinians 4:12)
We have already seen that Paul told the Ephesian elders to work and Paul himself worked also . However Paul did say that he was not chargeable to any man but then he said, “Not because we have not power, but to make ourselves an ensample unto you to follow us”. This would still be a good example for many today. But what does Paul mean when he implies that he could have the power to take benefits? The answer is in his letter to the Corinthians in chapter 9, where he said,
“ Am I not an apostle? ...2 If I be not an apostle unto others, yet doubtless I am to you: for the seal of mine apostleship are ye in the Lord. 3 Mine answer to them that do examine me is this, 4 Have we not power to eat and to drink? 5 Have we not power to lead about a sister, a wife, as well as other apostles, and as the brethren of the Lord, and Cephas? 6 Or I only and Barnabas, have not we power to forbear working...”
Here Paul is specifically referring to apostles and preachers, who may have an Itinerant ministry. Paul say of This issue, “Have we not power to lead about a sister, a wife, as well as other apostles”. This leading about a wife is connected to itinerant work . If an apostle went to a new place he may not have work there or he may be itinerant and continually moving or on a temporary work. Paul would be implying that the brethren should help out such men. These men are the preachers many times.
The word “preached” means, “to herald, as a town cryer” (check strongs on this) Preaching is to cry out like a town cryer this is not the local elders he is referring to but specifically apostles and perhaps evangelist also .
The preachers were the one who herald the good news and they are sent to do such a thing. As We read,
“15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent?...”(Romans 10:15)
Again we see the being “sent” aspect the very word apostle means “one who is sent, or sent one.( Check concordance again) This is not limited to apostles, evangelist and others may be sent also. But the preachers of the gospel will often be moving from place to place . This is different than local elders and other aspects in the body ministry . Apostles can also be local elders as Peter was (1Peter 5:1), and yet still have itinerant aspects ( About leading about a wife ) .
But some will say “wait a minute , Paul preached all through the night in Acts” . This is true, but lets examine this closer. The verse used is ,
“And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight”(Acts 20:7)
The word , “preached” here, is found only once in the New Testament, and it means, “check my concordance meaning diagrams?? To have a discussion. So this is not the same word as “preach” the gospel or to herald as a town cryer. Paul had a dialogue or discussion with them all through the night . He was about to go and wanted to share and discuss much. This is far from justifying a one man pastor ministry over all. The kind if preaching that is referred to for gospel preachers is seen when Paul preached on Mars Hill (Acts 27:22-33), or when Peter preached on the day if Pentecost (Acts 3:??). Paul speaks if this preaching round about in his itinerant work when he says,
“Through mighty signs and wonders, by the power of the Spirit of God; so that from Jerusalem, and round about unto Illyricum, I have fully preached the gospel of Christ. “(Romans 15:19)
The expression , “round about” shows the itinerant aspect . Paul was not alone in this all the apostles and other evangelist and even prophets could be involved in such work. Paul speaks of the gospel preachers besides himself when he says,
“For the Son of God, Jesus Christ, who was preached among you by us, even by me and Silvanus and Timotheus, was not yea and nay, but in him was yea.“( 2 Corinthians 1:19)
Remember that Timotheus and Silvanus were apostles and as such were sent ones and preachers, (1 Thessalonians 1:1, and 1 Thessalonians 2:6)
Again we see the apostolic itinerant work. And again this word “preached “ means, “of uncertain affinity; to herald (as a public crier), especially divine truth (the gospel):--preacher(-er), proclaim, publish.”(Strongs concordance dictionary).
And Paul as an apostle itinerant worker could receive help for his ministry but he did not choose this very often.
But as far as reaping done canal things from men in itinerant work, Paul says,
“ If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal “1 Corinthians 9:11)
It was a small thing after sowing spiritual truth to receive some carnal benefit from them. This was not a regular wage or salary. But most likely some shelter, food and whatever else would be beneficial for his work. Again Paul days,
“If others be partakers of this power over you, are not we rather? Nevertheless we have not used this power; but suffer all things, lest we should hinder the gospel of Christ”1 Corinthians 9:12)
Paul could have taken some benefit from them as allowed of God to do so in such itinerant apostolic work. But he did not use this. Paul did not want to place any unnessisary burdens on believers and. some of the churches were poor and would not be able to support others. Paul didnt want people to think he was after their money or some wage. The very thought of only preaching to others if he got paid was a horrible thought to Paul, and he did not want to give this impression at all,
“What is my reward then? Verily that, when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge, that I abuse not my power in the gospel. “1 Corinthians 9:18)
But how many ministers today are not itinerant preachers, or some who are. And they won’t take on ministry until they are guaranteed a certain sum of money. Freely we have received, and freely we should give.
Paul clarifies in this chapter that he is speaking of more itinerant workers like apostles and evangelist by extension, the preachers,
“Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel. 15 But I have used none of these things: neither have I written these things, that it should be so done unto me”1(1 Corinthians 9:14,15)
It is worth noting that even though God allows apostles and preachers who go about preaching the gospel to receive some carnal benefit, for their itinerant work. Because of the type of work they do they may not be permanently situated in a town or area, so they need to be helped in the work, a place to stay and food would be good and whatever else they need. This is far different than getting a salary for years week after week. Paul also worked night and day sometimes. But local elders are situated in that town and can work. But Paul did not use this right here. What a good example for others today, espescially when we see so much merchandising of the gospel and shameful things in connection to taking money from others.
Jesus taught his apostles how to do itinerant work and they learned that the Lord provides for those who he sends. This again had to do specifically with itinerant or traveling ministry as they were “sent out”.
But we are warned about this in scripture in different places, we read if heir kings and merchandisers if the gospel and those who take of the believers.
“But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you,...2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of. 3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their “(2 Peter 1-3)
We are warned in various passages of scripture to beware of those who make the gospel chargeable or who make merchandise of the saints. Such men have caused a great stain in our modern world and they lead many astray today. They are covetous and follow the way of Balaam preaching for reward (Jude 1:11). They have fake words and put on a pretense trusting scripture to make others give them money. This is not the way God intends for ministry to function and Pauls words echo here when he said, “ when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge”.
Jesus sent them out with nothing and God took care of themwe read,
“These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand. 8 Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give. 9 Provide neither gold, nor silver, nor brass in your purses, 10 Nor scrip for your journey, neither two coats, neither shoes, nor yet staves: for the workman is worthy of his meat.(Matthew 10:5-10 )
Here we see clearly the way Jesus sent the apostles out as itinerant workers. They were sent out, into a city, and to rely on the Lord.
And when they came back We read that they were taken care of,
“And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing”(Luke 22:35)
This is far different than what many do today where they are in an assembly local , not itinerant and they receive yearly wages and salaries . Did Jesus tell them to not preach unless they got a wage or salary? Did he promise them money ? Paul said having good and rainment let is be content( verse). If food and rainment are what God promises ( verse) why would done press for more here ?
The Bible warns of hirelings
There are men spoken of as “hirelings” in the old and new testaments,
“As a servant earnestly desireth the shadow, and as an hireling looketh for the reward of his work: “(Job 7:2)
The word “hireling” means, “sakyir-from 7936; a man at wages by the day or year:--hired (man, servant), hireling.”(strongs concordance dictionary.
These men look for the reward of his work. But what did Paul say about his reward? He said,
“What is my reward then? Verily that, when I preach the gospel, I may make the gospel of Christ without charge...”(verse)
Men like Paul and John and all true ministers reward was to see the believers in faith and walking in the truth (3 John 1:4),
But these hirelings do not care for the flock and are in it for financial gain. We read about this from The Lord himself,
“ I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep. 12 But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep. 13 The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep. 14 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep,...”(John 10:11-13)
DOUBLE HONOUR?
Many try to use a verse In 1 Timothy that Paul uses and try to apply it to their paid pastor over all. Although it dies not justify paying a salary to pastor gifting. Double honour does not mean double pay.In fact Paul speaks of elders “, plural here not just one man.
This verse says,
“ 17 Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine”(1 Timothy 5:17)
The word “honour” in this context means to “value someone” by analogy, to esteem” them implying that they are very precious, , (strongs concordance dictionary )
Interesting they do two things labour in word and doctrine. And this rule is as they are led by the anointing that teaches all things. The rule is to live from and in the new creation under Christ headship. Jesus Christ works effectually in every part of the body and in elders for the helping of the saints. The word rule here is not as the gentiles rule over others. The word rule used for the gentile rule has the meaning of control or to subjugate. This is not how elders are to be. They are to be an example in word and doctrine. Their function is more ministerial not magisterial. But that is another thread I have already touched on some of these things.
Paul uses a similar verse that can give a clue to what he is getting at in 1 Timothy about double honour, when he says,
“And we beseech you, brethren, to know them which labour among you, and are over you in the Lord, and admonish you; 13 And to esteem them very highly in love for their work’s sake”(1 Thessalonians 5:12-13)
First if all Paul says they should know those who labour among them. he is speaking of a plurality of men here not just one pastor gifting. this is how ministers come to be “Known” as they labour among them. when doing this their giftings are seen and heard. To be over them, echos of overseers who watch over This is very similar to the verse in 1 Timothy , to esteem them very highly is to honor them, and the word implies esteem and value in its meaning . Yes honouring someone can be to help them in areas of life life and needs etc. but in 1 Timothy 6:1 we read that servants are to honour their masters. This is the sane agrees word Paul used in chapter 5 for honoring elders that labour on word and doctrine. But we would not say that servants are to pay their masters, this would make no sense. But to honour them would. Paul also used the word “double” honour. To say they should have double pay or a double wage would make no sense, but the double aspect may refer to Paul’s twofold reason that they labour in the word and doctrine.
It is worth noting for those who still contend for a paid pastor over all that this does not speak of a regular salary or wage. And it does not speak of a single pastor gifting over all. Paul says elders "plural" here. What if there are four or five mature elders that do this in the small gatherings of those days, is Paul saying that they should all be paid a salary ? No, this would go beyond Paul’s word here. And this would also mean that all servants should pay their masters wages as well.
We can say that from time to time believers can bless others and help them in things they need and older men in the gatherings who labour in the word can be included in this. But the word still means honour or value esteem not pay or wage to the elders of the assembly .
If some press this section of honoring elders still, a remote possiblity could be looked at that Paul may be implying older men who cannot work anymore and who have been in oversight and who labour in the word being helped out. In theses days they did not have a welfare or old age pension like today. But this would not be applied to elders on general who Paul said should work with their own hands (Acts 20) . However this interpretation does not seem to be Paul’s intent. To honour is to highly esteem them in value and since they minister spiritual things in word and doctrine this spiritual fruit would be their reward.
One last thought here Paul did say that he took wages at a certain tone bit he considered this robbery and he did not take them for himself,
“...Have I committed an offence in abasing myself that ye might be exalted, because I have preached to you the gospel of God freely? 8 I robbed other churches, taking wages of them, to do you service. 9 And when I was present with you, and wanted, I was chargeable to no man: for that which was lacking to me”(2 Cor 11:7-9
First, remember Paul as a itinerant worker could take benefits from others but he chose not to do this often. In fact when he did take benefits from others (most likely food shelter and what was needed for ministry ), he felt like he was ribbing them of he didn’t like to do this he didn’t want to be chargeable to anyone. He may have felt like some gave him more than was needed and so he felt like he robbed them. thus could be referring to his benefits from those at Thessolonia, , but Paul was an admirable person in this, he wanted others to be blessed as they gave he himself said he was content in whatever state (Philippians 4;15-20).
The word wages here implies to take rations for a soldier. This would have been things to help out and even money,but Paul did this for them not himself. So this was not at all like some regular salary for himself. And as we already discussed, itinerant traveling apostles and other itinerant ministries would be in need of help in these things , and god sends no man a ware faring at his own charges, when he sends them out.
When paul saw the false ministers in Corinth he expoised some of their marks, the same marks are for today as well of these men.
"...For ye suffer fools gladly, seeing ye yourselves are wise.20 For ye suffer, if a man bring you into bondage, if a man devour you, if a man take of you, if a man exalt himself, if a man smite you on the face." ( 2 Corinthans 11;19,20 KJV)
notice there marks, they exalt themselves, ( how many do this today over all) , and in this talk they "take of you". Does this sound like Paul would have justified them having salaried ministers over them taking their money. Paul as an itinerant minister could have taken some benefit for his needs as God provides for sent ones. But even he did not do this there and gave an example to them as well.
"And when I was present with you, and wanted, I was chargeable to no man: for that which was lacking to me the brethren which came from Macedonia supplied: and in all things I have kept myself from being burdensome unto you, and so will I keep myself." (2 Corinthans 11:9 KJV)
To sum this up the paid ministers issue
God calls elders to work with their own hands (Acts 20). They are made overseers by the Spirit and in plurality in every church. Many church gatherings were poor and could not pay for a full time plurality if payed salaried ministers. We don’t read of salaried ministers full time pay in the early church . Elders who labour in word and doctrine should be honoured, valued and highly esteemed. But the ones that need to be helped put in their work are the apostles or evangelist or those who are in itinerant work who are sent out and travel from place to place preaching the gospel. But they also can work as Paul did and the gospel should always be preached if they are sent and not for money. Ministers do not want to be hirelings who only preach for their living and financial gain. All ministry should be content with what they have. And it is more blessed than to receive.
Objections:
1. But some will say, "wait, how are we suppose to survive as ministers then?".
Answer: if you are a local elder, get a job work with your own hands. And if God send you out in an itinerant work, and you sow spiritual things he will provide for your carnal things. Also you may still have to work as Paul did.
2. But the church has been paying ministers for a long time.
Answer: but scripture teaches other things, we cannot base our understanding on men's commands and tradition if it makes the word of God of no effect.
3. So what are ministers to do? they will be on the street and their families etc the assembly may suffer.
Answer: This may take some time to adjust. But if the body is willing to help support them until they get work, that is good and eventually they should all meet in homes and edify eachother as Gods order shows a clear pattern for doing so in scripture. The large buildings may be used in some cases for the poor and sick and as evangelistic places. But church meetings with a meal and fellowship and mutual edification and prayer should be in homes generally.
4. But what about all the money for missions given.
Answer: this is still ok to help others and the body can still gather help for other provisions for the poor or ministry that is itinerant etc.
5. But, I teach tithing in our church and that is partly how i make money to survive
Answer: tithing is not a new testament practice. Tithing was for the Jews and particularly for the Levites. Only the Levites have a COMMAND to take tithes of the people that is of the Jews according to the law (Hebrews 7:5) But this issue will have to be a whole different thread.
6. But how can most of Christendom be wrong and you right?
Answer: the bible is right and i believe it. We should not follow the traditions of men over the scriptures, no matter how many people do.
7. What about all the money we need for other salaries for secretaries and workers and for the building fund and to pay for our hydro etc etc. ?
Answer: The body of Christ has bound them selves up greatly and made a big mess. If the building is paid for already and minour cost involved, it may be still useful to use it for evangelism and other events, and for the poor. But if not then either sell it and use the funds to help others in the body and the poor and gather in homes around Christ and wait on him. The funds from the building should go to the whole body and not just one Pastor who has it all in his name. That's my suggestion, one man should not get the funds completely.
As far as others salaries. This also may take some time. If you are willing to follow Gods order help eachother in the transition and for a while support the people who rely on these funds. But in all this i say consider Pauls words,
"Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ." Colossians 2:8
8. But we are registered with the government and get tax breaks etc. isnt this a good thing?
Answer: No this binds up the order of God from freely happening and to join hands with the shadow of Egypt is not good. God warned his people when they trust in the world in the past and said
"Woe to the rebellious children, saith the Lord, that take counsel, but not of me; and that cover with a covering, but not of my spirit, that they may add sin to sin: 2 That walk to go down into Egypt, and have not asked at my mouth; to strengthen themselves in the strength of Pharaoh, and to trust in the shadow of Egypt! 3 Therefore shall the strength of Pharaoh be your shame, and the trust in the shadow of Egypt your confusion." Isaiah 30:1-3
what is going to happen if churches in the United States and Canada and all over the world have to marry gay men? Will they compromise Gods truth for financial tax exemptions? There are other issues with the idea of being registered with the government. But this would take a whole thread to discuss this as well
9. I dont care what you write ,I am a pastor and I feel it is ok to take money for my survival and I dont have a problem with getting a salary.
Answer: read what I wrote again and consider Gods order. You also should not be in an exalted place over the entire body as scripture warns. Every member of the body can minister and share and elders (plural) should be able to teach and minister in their gifts as they walk in the anointing also. But if the whole body can edify itself under Christ headship ( Ephesians 4;15,16 1 Cor 14:26-37 Romans 12 etc etc) and all elders can oversee and by sound doctrine exhort and convince the gainsayers (Titus 1), then why do you think your ministry is to be above the rest? Did not God give apostles, prophets, evangelist, pastors and teaches to the body? Why is your one function dominant? Where do we see a one man minister over the whole church getting a salary in the new testament?
10. Some may feel, "But this is frightening to me, I am worried about how i can support my family and I have no other skills etc"
Answer: God is aware of all these things and he cares for you, let the body of believers be sensitive to this also and help their ministers and others who rely on the salaries and money to make the transition. It may take some time , but work towards this.
11. But I went to bible school and paid to get a degree and to become a pastor and I have a masters of Divinity and I can be a paid pastor.
Answer: this again is a long thread in itself. But elder/overseers are to be home grown, not some professional who comes from afar and gets hired. they have to be known among the body and meet the requirements for overseers. This is also not just one man, elders (plural) is the order of God (Acts 14:23). The body would know them for a while and they the brothers and sisters. They are known as they use the God given gifts they have. No man can buy his way into a oversight role or to be a pastor. A pastor gift is one of the five fold gifts given only by God. You cannot just go to a school and take a course for being a pastor. And Jesus said call no man master. How can men take such flattering titles to themsleves as Master of Divinity" or "reverend"
"Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ" (Matthew 23:10)
"For I know not to give flattering titles; in so doing my maker would soon take me away." (Job 32:22)
'He sent redemption unto his people: he hath commanded his covenant for ever: holy and reverend is his name." (Psalm 111:9)
God bless
