Should gays be allowed to adopt?

[stan1980]

I've noticed that there seems to be quite a few gay posters on this forum, so seems like a good place to ask the question. In principle i think it's fine, and i'm sure a gay couple could make great parents. But, i just remember when i was a kid, i'm pretty sure i would have had to put up with a lot teasing if i had gay parents. Is it fair to put a kid through this?

Having said that, society is changing, but i'm not sure if it's changed enough just yet to allow it.

 

[Apollo Celestio]

Absolutely. There is no good reason they should not. Kids tease people about everything. When I was a kid, they would tease you if your forehead was a little large, or your eyes were green.. Kids are kids.

 

[Beanieboy]

Gay can adopt.

Is it fair to them if they are teased at school?
Who is in the wrong? The kids teasing, or the kids being teased?

And who is wrong for raising teasing children that think that is acceptable, heterosexual parents, or homosexual parents?

I still remember the outrage of simply mentioning Heather Has Two Mommies, a book that is devised to simply explain that some kids have two moms, two dads, two moms and two dads (divorced and remarried heterosexuals), one mom only, one dad only, etc.

One can believe whatever they want, but such things exist.

I usually show a short documentary to my class when discussing What Constitutes a Family? The children are from gay homes. Two girls, who were friends, were accused of being lesbians because one of the girls moms were, and took it as an opportunity to educate the other kids, explaining that being teasing and name calling was harmful (something the kids from heterosexual parents should have instilled in them).

Is it fair for gay people to raise kids?
I think a better question is, is it fair for heterosexual parents to be raising homophobic children that think certain people can be teased because they aren't their neighbor.

 

[NeTrips]

I am against adoption by homosexuals. It is wrong to force kids into houses where kids are taught not only that sin is ok but where it is glorified.

 

[clarksided]

As opposed to forcing them to shuffle through foster care and group homes and ending up on the streets?

As they grow up, the kids will eventually know what "God" thinks of homosexuals. Opposition to homosexuality is pretty vocal and public. If that's all you've got, it's pretty weak.

 

[Flashlight]

I think it is better for kids to grow up in a loving household with gay parents than to have no family at all.

 

[StrawberryShortcake2]

I think it is better for kids to grow up in a loving household with gay parents than to have no family at all.

I completely agree with you.

 

[NeTrips]

As opposed to forcing them to shuffle through foster care and group homes and ending up on the streets?

so unless gays adopt them they are doomed to a life on the streets? That's the best you got?

 

[m9lc]

so unless gays adopt them they are doomed to a life on the streets? That's the best you got?

It's certainly a more likely fate if they have to go through foster care.

Anyway, as to gays adopting? I don't know, honestly. On one hand, all research suggests that gays are perfectly capable parents, certainly better than foster care. On the other hand, you do have the ethical issue of children having to put up with teasing from classmates for having gay parents.

Yes, kids always tease, but kids with gay parents will certainly receive more serious teasing, since many of the kids will have redneck parents who will have given them the idea that making fun of them is the right thing to do (i.e., "Daddy told me that your parents are going to Hell!"). Teasing kids with gay parents is going to be much more venomous than teasing kids because they wear glasses.

This issue is nothing new; it happened in the civil rights movement when integration first started. We forced the black children of America to go to the frontlines of the battle for equal rights when we put them into formerly all-white schools, and they had to endure the harassment and the insults.

It's honestly a really morally ambiguous issue, and I can't say that I know for sure what the answer to it is. In the end, though, I'd say that enduring the teasing is a lot better than having to go through foster care, and in the long run, it will provide children with parents that are respected by society in the future.

 

[NeTrips]

It's certainly a more likely fate if they have to go through foster care.

So unless gays adopt them, they are going to stay in foster care? Might as well just ban adoptions by straight couples then....

Anyway, as to gays adopting? I don't know, honestly. On one hand, all research suggests that gays are perfectly capable parents, certainly better than foster care. On the other hand, you do have the ethical issue of children having to put up with teasing from classmates for having gay parents.

Please provide links to "all research" in order to validate this suspicious claim.

Yes, kids always tease, but kids with gay parents will certainly receive more serious teasing, since many of the kids will have redneck parents who will have given them the idea that making fun of them is the right thing to do (i.e., "Daddy told me that your parents are going to Hell!"). Teasing kids with gay parents is going to be much more venomous than teasing kids because they wear glasses.

so those who believe homosexuality is sinful are rednecks? Any more gems of wisdom?

This issue is nothing new; it happened in the civil rights movement when integration first started. We forced the black children of America to go to the frontlines of the battle for equal rights when we put them into formerly all-white schools, and they had to endure the harassment and the insults.

Please do not equate the civil rights movement with gay activism. It is not even remotely similar. hitch your wagon to someone else's efforts or let them stand on their own.

 

[trivista]

I am against adoption by homosexuals. It is wrong to force kids into houses where kids are taught not only that sin is ok but where it is glorified.

Are you also against adoption by fundamentalists who teach demonstrable lies to there kids as well?

 

[m9lc]

So unless gays adopt them, they are going to stay in foster care? Might as well just ban adoptions by straight couples then....

Foster care exists, so yes, these cases obviously exist.

Please provide links to "all research" in order to validate this suspicious claim.

http://www.samesexmarriage.ca/docs/Justice_Child_Development.pdf
http://www.canada.com/topics/bodyan...=56c4d812-2c73-4c1a-986c-395c7b4ae1a1&k=24128
http://www.psych.org/edu/other_res/lib_archives/archives/200214.pdf
http://www.nllfs.org/publications/pdf/tenyearolds.pdf

There's some for you.

so those who believe homosexuality is sinful are rednecks? Any more gems of wisdom?

Just an example.

Please do not equate the civil rights movement with gay activism. It is not even remotely similar. hitch your wagon to someone else's efforts or let them stand on their own.

Goodness, does even mentioning the civil rights movement just flip an angry switch in your mind? The comparison was in support of your opinion, for Heaven's sake.

I was making a comparison. Both of them are cases in which a movement of people looking for rights forced children to suffer for it. Seriously, just shut up and open your mind for once.

(PS: It takes a suspension of disbelief to say that they are "not even remotely similar". Take this for instance.)

 

[NeTrips]

Are you also against adoption by fundamentalists who teach demonstrable lies to there kids as well?

Only if the lies are embracing sin.

I am somewhat against adoption by those lacking the ability to know the difference between "there" and "their" however.

 

[m9lc]

Only if the lies are embracing sin.

I am somewhat against adoption by those lacking the ability to know the difference between "there" and "their" however.

I have decided
to lie for Jesus...

 

[NeTrips]

Foster care exists, so yes, these cases obviously exist.

But your argument was an either or, no other alternatives. Perhaps you'd care to rethink?

http://www.samesexmarriage.ca/docs/Justice_Child_Development.pdf
http://www.canada.com/topics/bodyan...=56c4d812-2c73-4c1a-986c-395c7b4ae1a1&k=24128
http://www.psych.org/edu/other_res/lib_archives/archives/200214.pdf
http://www.nllfs.org/publications/pdf/tenyearolds.pdf

There's some for you.

but you argued "all" and have failed to substantiate. Retraction or edit please.

Goodness, does even mentioning the civil rights movement just flip an angry switch in your mind? The comparison was in support of your opinion, for Heaven's sake.

I was making a comparison. Both of them are cases in which a movement of people looking for rights forced children to suffer for it. Seriously, just shut up and open your mind for once.

Bite me and make a valid argument for once.

(PS: It takes a suspension of disbelief to say that they are "not even remotely similar". Take this for instance.)

race is involuntary, immutable, and innocuous–none of which is true of homosexuality.

 

[NeTrips]

I have decided
to lie for Jesus...

no, you do that for yourself.

 

[Apollo Celestio]

So, do you sin? It's only sinners throwing stones at other sinners to deny them it. It's not ideal, but it should be permissible. They won't spread the "gay-ness", they won't chastise the child for being heterosexual. Unless they value their "gay" identity over the child or something.. That being said, I am not a supporter of homosexual acts, or say it's not a sin. But this is a another issue.

 

[m9lc]

But your argument was an either or, no other alternatives. Perhaps you'd care to rethink?

No it wasn't. I merely said that it's possible that children who would otherwise be in households with gay parents would be put through foster care instead, and end up on the streets because of their lack of a stable family.

And before you come back trying to tell me why I didn't say that, I'll just say right now that's what I meant to say, before you continue this pointless argument.

but you argued "all" and have failed to substantiate. Retraction or edit please.

How about you show me legitimate research that doesn't support that.

Bite me and make a valid argument for once.

And where is your support for my argument being invalid? Tell me, what is false about the statement that both the civil rights and the gay rights movements have made children suffer for their goals? Why are you even debating this? (If you can even call it "debating".)

race is involuntary, immutable, and innocuous–none of which is true of homosexuality.

Interracial marriage is neither involuntary, nor immutable, nor innocuous.

 

[Ohioprof]

I am a gay adoptive parent. My daughter just turned 6. Gay people already can adopt; gay people can adopt as single parents in every state except Florida. The laws and policies are more complicated and varied when it comes to gay couples. In some places, not others, a same-sex partner can adopt as a second parent. It's ironic and weird that nearly every state allows gay single people to adopt but not couples. You'd think that two parents are better than one, but go figure. We are a wonderful, happy family, my daughter and I and our 4 cats.

 

[BigBadWlf]

So unless gays adopt them, they are going to stay in foster care? ....

And where else do they go?

Please provide links to "all research" in order to validate this suspicious claim.

Oh please. It’s not like you haven’t been presented extensive evidence showing that children raised by gay and lesbians parents are healthy happy and well adjusted individuals and they remain so into adult hood.


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Badgett, M. V. Lee. 1998. “The Economic Well- Being of Lesbian, Gay, and Bisexual Adults’ Families.” Pp. 231–48 in Lesbian, Gay and Bisexual Identities in Families: Psychological Perspectives, edited by C.J. Patterson and A.R. D’Augelli. New York: OxfordUniversity Press.

Bailey, J. Michael, David Bobrow, Marilyn Wolfe, and Sarah Mikach. 1995. “Sexual Orientation of Adult Sons of Gay Fathers.” DevelopmentalPsychology 31:124–29.


Baumrind, Diana. 1995. “Commentary on Sexual Orientation: Research and Social Policy Implications.” Developmental Psychology 31:130–36.

Belcastro, Philip A., Theresa Gramlich, Thomas Nicholson, Jimmie Price, and Richard Wilson. 1993. “A Review of Data Based Studies Addressing the Affects [sic] of Homosexual Parenting on Children’s Sexual and Social Functioning.” Journal of Divorce and Remarriage 20:105–22.

Benkov, Laura. 1994. Reinventing the Family:Lesbian and Gay Parents. New York: Crown.

Bigner, Jerry J. and R. Brooke Jacobsen. 1989. “Parenting Behaviors of Homosexual and Heterosexual Fathers.” Journal of Homosexuality 18:73–86.

Bigner, Jerry J. and R. Brooke Jacobsen. 1992. “Adult Responses to Child Behavior
and Attitudes toward Fathering: Gay and Nongay Fathers.” Journal of Homosexuality
23:99–112.

Black, Dan A., Gary Gates, Seth Sanders, and Lowell Taylor. 2000. “Demographics of the Gay and Lesbian Population in the United States: Evidence from Available Systematic Data Sources.” Demography 37:139–54.

Bonvillain, Nancy. 1998. Women and Men: Cultural Constructs of Gender. 2d ed. Upper Saddle River, NJ: Prentice Hall.

Bozett, Frederick W. 1987a. “Children of Gay Fathers.” Pp. 39–57 in Gay and Lesbian Parents, edited by F. W. Bozett. New York: Praeger.

Bozett, Frederick W. 1987b. “Gay Fathers.” Pp. 3–22 in Gayand Lesbian Parents, edited by F. W. Bozett. New York: Praeger.

Bozett, Frederick W. 1989. “Gay Fathers: A Review of the Literature.” Pp. 137–62 in Homosexuality and the Family, edited by F. W. Bozett. New York: Haworth Press.

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Mother Families.” Human Reproduction 12:1349–59.

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Adjustment.” Journal of Family Psychology12:402–19.

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Chodorow, Nancy. 1978. The Reproduction of Mothering: Psychoanalysis and the Sociologyof Gender. Berkeley, CA: University of California Press.

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LoughboroughUniversity, Leicestershire, UK.

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I have about 12 more pages of references on the subject. They all conclude hath children raised by gays and lesbian parents are well balanced well adjusted and happy individuals who remain so into adulthood.

so those who believe homosexuality is sinful are rednecks? Any more gems of wisdom?

I think the point was that it is not “teasing’ that is the problem, rather it is the fact that the parents of such children are teaching that hate and bigotry are acceptable

Please do not equate the civil rights movement with gay activism. It is not even remotely similar. hitch your wagon to someone else's efforts or let them stand on their own.

Why not? The arguments and rhetoric used against civil rights is the same as the arguments and rhetoric used to justify hatred against homosexuals.

"I still hear people say that I should not be talking about the rights of lesbian and gay people and I should stick to the issue of racial justice, But I hasten to remind them that Martin Luther King Jr. said, 'Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.' I appeal to everyone who believes in Martin Luther King Jr.'s dream to make room at the table of brother- and sisterhood for lesbian and gay people,"
Coretta Scott King

“Discrimination is discrimination, no matter who the victim is, and it is always wrong. There are no ‘special rights’ in America, despite the attempts by many to divide blacks and the gay community with the argument that the latter are seeking some imaginary ‘special rights’ at the expense of blacks.”
Julian Bond – Chair of the NAACP


So many parallels exist between what's happening in the gay-rights movement and what occurred in previous civil-rights movements. The same angry and emotional arguments being made against homosexuals who want the right to marry were made against blacks who wanted to attend the same schools, eat in the same restaurants, hold the same kinds of jobs and live in the same neighborhoods as whites, and against women who wanted to vote, serve on juries, attend medical school, and be hired for the same jobs as men: "It's not natural. It will upset the social order, and destroy our way of life. It's against religious teachings."
Sheryl McCarthey


"Homophobia is like racism and anti-Semitism and other forms of bigotry in that it seeks to dehumanize a large group of people, to deny their humanity, their dignity and personhood,"
Coretta Scott King