Seven Days: Why is "I don't know" unacceptable?

[SkyWriting]

The doctrine that the sun was created day 4 is extra-biblical, on day four God 'set' the sun, moon and the stars in the heavens. Just as the atmosphere was adjusted day 1 to let in the light in was still being adjust to make the heavenly lights clearly and regularly seen. The wording and the progression is unmistakable.

OK...You're not actually saying anything here. That void and progression is unmistakable.
What is "set?"
What actually happened?
What Literally happened?

God had the sun on a shelf and "set" it on the vault dome of the sky and gave it a push?
You seem to be headed away from historical dictation.
Now you saying God "tuned in" the sun on day 4?

 

[mark kennedy]

OK...You're not actually saying anything here. That void and progression is unmistakable.
What is "set?"
What actually happened?
What Literally happened?

God had the sun on a shelf and "set" it on the vault dome of the sky and gave it a push?
You seem to be headed away from historical dictation.
Now you saying God "tuned in" the sun on day 4?

He didn't do anything to the Sun moon or stars. After the original creation there was no need. Do you really think God made the earth and the heavens and there was no Sun moon or stars for four days? When we watch the Sun set the sun didn't actually do anything it was just moved out of sight because of the rotation of the earth. When God starts creation the earth is covered in water and darkness and progressively the heavens come into view until day four when the final adjust ments are made to the firmament. Then the heavenly objects are clearly set. If they were being worked on directly the word would be created or made. Just as the Sun appears to set at twilight in the evening of the fourth day they were for the first time clearly seen and regularly are to this day.

 

[SkyWriting]

He didn't do anything to the Sun moon or stars. After the original creation there was no need. Do you really think God made the earth and the heavens and there was no Sun moon or stars for four days? When we watch the Sun set the sun didn't actually do anything it was just moved out of sight because of the rotation of the earth. When God starts creation the earth is covered in water and darkness and progressively the heavens come into view until day four when the final adjust ments are made to the firmament. Then the heavenly objects are clearly set. If they were being worked on directly the word would be created or made. Just as the Sun appears to set at twilight in the evening of the fourth day they were for the first time clearly seen and regularly are to this day.

Literally, what happened on day four?
What actually happened?
What Literally happened?

14 Then God said, “Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night, and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years; 15 and let them be for lights in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth”; and it was so. 16 God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also. 17 God placed them in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth, 18 and to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness; and God saw that it was good. 19 There was evening and there was morning, a fourth day.

Genesis 1:16
New International Version
God made two great lights--the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars.
(Not really, says Kennedy)

New Living Translation
God made two great lights--the larger one to govern the day, and the smaller one to govern the night. He also made the stars.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
English Standard Version
And God made the two great lights—the greater light to rule the day and the lesser light to rule the night—and the stars.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
New American Standard Bible
God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
King James Bible
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
Holman Christian Standard Bible
God made the two great lights--the greater light to have dominion over the day and the lesser light to have dominion over the night--as well as the stars.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
International Standard Version
God fashioned two great lights—the larger light to shine during the day and the smaller light to shine during the night—as well as stars.

NET Bible
God made two great lights--the greater light to rule over the day and the lesser light to rule over the night. He made the stars also.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
God made the two bright lights: the larger light to rule the day and the smaller light to rule the night. He also made the stars.

JPS Tanakh 1917
And God made the two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night; and the stars.

New American Standard 1977
And God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also.

Jubilee Bible 2000
And God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night; he made the stars also.

King James 2000 Bible
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

American King James Version
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

American Standard Version
And God made the two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

Douay-Rheims Bible
And God made two great lights: a greater light to rule the day; and a lesser light to rule the night: and the stars.

Darby Bible Translation
And God made the two great lights, the great light to rule the day, and the small light to rule the night, -- and the stars.

English Revised Version
And God made the two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

Webster's Bible Translation
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

World English Bible
God made the two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night. He also made the stars.

Young's Literal Translation
And God maketh the two great luminaries, the great luminary for the rule of the day, and the small luminary -- and the stars -- for the rule of the night;

19 There was evening and there was morning, a fourth day.

Lets get into another issue. You claim 24 hours days.
From WHO's perspective are we watching 24 hours pass?
Is God standing somewhere on the equator with the sun rising and falling?
Becasue unless you are litterally standing on dirt, you won't see the sun
rise or fall. Anywhere off the planet, the sun shines 24/7.
Are you telling me that God was standing on earth while He
was Creating the Cosmos? Did he mark off the rotations by noting
each time the future city of Jerusalem spun by?
(God sees all time at once)

 

[mark kennedy]

Literally, what happened on day four?
What actually happened?
What Literally happened?

14 Then God said, “Let there be lights in the expanse of the heavens to separate the day from the night, and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years; 15 and let them be for lights in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth”; and it was so. 16 God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also. 17 God placed them in the expanse of the heavens to give light on the earth, 18 and to govern the day and the night, and to separate the light from the darkness; and God saw that it was good. 19 There was evening and there was morning, a fourth day.

Genesis 1:16
New International Version
God made two great lights--the greater light to govern the day and the lesser light to govern the night. He also made the stars.
(Not really, says Kennedy)

New Living Translation
God made two great lights--the larger one to govern the day, and the smaller one to govern the night. He also made the stars.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
English Standard Version
And God made the two great lights—the greater light to rule the day and the lesser light to rule the night—and the stars.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
New American Standard Bible
God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
King James Bible
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
Holman Christian Standard Bible
God made the two great lights--the greater light to have dominion over the day and the lesser light to have dominion over the night--as well as the stars.
(Not really, says Kennedy)
International Standard Version
God fashioned two great lights—the larger light to shine during the day and the smaller light to shine during the night—as well as stars.

NET Bible
God made two great lights--the greater light to rule over the day and the lesser light to rule over the night. He made the stars also.

GOD'S WORD® Translation
God made the two bright lights: the larger light to rule the day and the smaller light to rule the night. He also made the stars.

JPS Tanakh 1917
And God made the two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night; and the stars.

New American Standard 1977
And God made the two great lights, the greater light to govern the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made the stars also.

Jubilee Bible 2000
And God made two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night; he made the stars also.

King James 2000 Bible
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

American King James Version
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

American Standard Version
And God made the two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

Douay-Rheims Bible
And God made two great lights: a greater light to rule the day; and a lesser light to rule the night: and the stars.

Darby Bible Translation
And God made the two great lights, the great light to rule the day, and the small light to rule the night, -- and the stars.

English Revised Version
And God made the two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

Webster's Bible Translation
And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.

World English Bible
God made the two great lights: the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night. He also made the stars.

Young's Literal Translation
And God maketh the two great luminaries, the great luminary for the rule of the day, and the small luminary -- and the stars -- for the rule of the night;

19 There was evening and there was morning, a fourth day.

Lets get into another issue. You claim 24 hours days.
From WHO's perspective are we watching 24 hours pass?
Is God standing somewhere on the equator with the sun rising and falling?
Becasue unless you are litterally standing on dirt, you won't see the sun
rise or fall. Anywhere off the planet, the sun shines 24/7.
Are you telling me that God was standing on earth while He
was Creating the Cosmos? Did he mark off the rotations by noting
each time the future city of Jerusalem spun by?
(God sees all time at once)

The perspective is from the surface of the earth. The last update as to God's physical presence was havering above the face of the deep. Lets say you and I are in a dark room no light can get in the window because of the shades and thick curtains. I pull back the curtains and it's no longer pitch black. Then I pull up the shades and then we can actually see what's outside.

That literally. 'makes' them visible but the only thing I actually did anything to were the shades and curtains which in this analogy are the clouds and atmosphere.

The passage only once uses the word `asah H6213, it's in Gen. 1:16. Yes really says Mark Kennedy, but this isn't bara (בָּרָא bara' H1254) which means to create out of nothing.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[pat34lee]

Are you telling me that God was standing on earth while He
was Creating the Cosmos? Did he mark off the rotations by noting
each time the future city of Jerusalem spun by?
(God sees all time at once)

Are you saying there is something complex there that the
Creator of everything, including time, space and matter
didn't think of it, or that he couldn't determine 24 hours
without a clock or sun or moon?

 

[juvenissun]

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/7-day-creation-literal-or-figurative.7682639/

I see the above thread has found new life. It's one of those topics that will be discussed forever. While my position is that the first chapters of Genesis refer to the historical events surrounding God's creative acts, I find the "literal or figurative" debate to be a false dichotomy.

I have fun discussing my view and the views of others when the participants have the right attitude. But I think of such discussions as speculation. If pressed with, "What really happened?" my answer would be, "I don't know."

So why do so many seem to find that an unsatisfactory answer?

Something you may shrug it off with I don't know and suffer no loss. Such as scientific questions.

But there are questions you can not afford to say that. For example, agnostics is not acceptable to Christianity.

Also, there are questions to which a wrong answer gets zero (not negative point), the I don't know answer gets zero, but an educated guess may get some points.

In either case, say something could be better than saying I don't know.

 

[Archie the Preacher]

I must respectfully differ. Following is my reasoning.

Something you may shrug it off with I don't know and suffer no loss. Such as scientific questions.

To shrug off a scientific question with "I don't know" is to admit ignorance of the subject. When one does that, one cannot claim to "know" about the subject. The one exception to this is if one knows "Nobody knows", which is honest.

But there are questions you can not afford to say that. For example, agnostics is not acceptable to Christianity.

Forgive me; I don't understand this one at all.

Also, there are questions to which a wrong answer gets zero (not negative point), the I don't know answer gets zero, but an educated guess may get some points.

Unless the 'educated guess' is so far afield it embarrasses all other people presumably on one's side. I suppose it has value in a quiz show where one wants to 'go down swinging' but it's pretty lame in a serious discussion.

In either case, say something could be better than saying I don't know.

Doing some homework and having the actual answer is far better. Even if the answer isn't politically correct for the audience.

 

[SkyWriting]

Are you saying there is something complex there that the
Creator of everything, including time, space and matter
didn't think of it, or that he couldn't determine 24 hours
without a clock or sun or moon?

Correct. There is no "24 hours" without reference to the sun.

 

[SkyWriting]

The perspective is from the surface of the earth. The last update as to God's physical presence was havering above the face of the deep. Lets say you and I are in a dark room no light can get in the window because of the shades and thick curtains. I pull back the curtains and it's no longer pitch black. Then I pull up the shades and then we can actually see what's outside.

That literally. 'makes' them visible but the only thing I actually did anything to were the shades and curtains which in this analogy are the clouds and atmosphere.

The passage only once uses the word `asah H6213, it's in Gen. 1:16. Yes really says Mark Kennedy, but this isn't bara (בָּרָא bara' H1254) which means to create out of nothing.

Grace and peace,
Mark

What shades?

Literally, what happened on day four?
What actually happened?
What Literally happened?

 

[Aman777]

What shades?

Literally, what happened on day four?
What actually happened?
What Literally happened?

God (Trinity) through Jesus, (Lord God) lit the first Stars, on the 4th Day/Age. Gen 1:16. This is how we know how long one of God's Days/Ages is to God, in man's time. Last year, the European Space Agency discovered it was at least 560 Million years AFTER the Big Bang when the first Stars fired up their furnaces. www.space.com › Science & Astronomy

This means that the big bang was on God's 3rd Day Gen 2:4...but the first Stars didn't light up until the 4th Day. Gen 1:16 It's testable proof that only God, the Holy Spirit, knew and correctly communicated that message to us through Genesis chapter 1 in the last days of our world. UNLESS anyone can explain HOW ancient men, who lived thousands of years before Science, knew and wrote it to agree with the latest discoveries of Science.

We live in a time when every new discovery of Science is first shown in Genesis Chapter 1. That is because Genesis Chapter 1 is the ENTIRE History of God's Six Days/Ages including FUTURE events which NOT happen until AFTER Jesus returns to give Christians dominion or rule every "every living creature" including Angels: Gen 1:28

1Co 6:3 Know ye not that we shall judge angels?

Each of God's Days/Ages is Billions of years, in length in man's time, which is subject to the movement of the Stars within our Cosmos. God is beyond our world and NOT subject to the movement of the Stars and He is preparing a place for Christians to live AFTER our world is burned. ll Peter 3:10 We live today at the end of the present 6th Day, but God's saying the following words is FUTURE to our time:

Gen 1:31 And God saw every thing that He had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morning were the sixth day.

I promise that when God says it is very good, it is absolutely perfect, forever. Amen?

 

[mark kennedy]

What shades?

Literally, what happened on day four?
What actually happened?
What Literally happened?

The heavens and the earth, including the sun, were created 'in the beginning'. It could have been moments before or billions of years before creation week. Day four God doesn't create the sun, God 'sets' it in the sky which is God's work in the firmament, clearing the clouds and making the heavenly bodies regularly visible. At the outset the earth was covered in water and darkness, the perspective of Genesis is from the surface of the earth.

Creation: 'Created', 'Made' and 'Set'

Day 1: God 'lets' the light in, thus creating the first day (Gen. 1:4).
Day 2: God creates the upper atmosphere, called the 'firmament' (Gen. 1:7).
Day 3: God separates the land from the seas and creates plant life (Gen. 1:10).
Day 4: God then, 'sets', the heavenly lights in the visible sky (Gen. 1:17).
Day 5: God creates the birds of the air and marine life (Gen. 1:21).
Day 6: Finally, God creates the beasts of the field and Man (Gen. 1:25).​

The phrase, 'heaven and the earth', is a Hebrew expression meaning the universe. All we really get from this passage is that the cosmos and earth were created, 'in the beginning'. The perspective of creation week is from the surface of the earth, starting with the Spirit of God hovering over the deep (Gen. 1:2). In the chapter there are three words used for God's work in creation. The first is 'created' ('bara' H1254) a very precise term used only of God. It is used once to describe the creation of the universe (Gen 1:1), then again to describe the creation of life (Gen 1:21). Finally, in the closing verses, it is used three times for the creation of Adam and Eve (Gen. 1:27). The word translated, 'made' (asah 6213), has a much broader range of meaning and is used to speak of the creation of the 'firmament' 3 (Gen 1:7), the sun, moon and stars (Gen 1:16), procreation where offspring are made 'after his/their kind' (Gen 1:25) and as a general reference to creation in it's vast array (Gen 1:31).

Then there is a third term when God 'set' (nathan H2414), the lights of the sun, moon and stars so that their light is reqularly visible from the surface of the earth. In this way the narrative shifts from the very precise word for 'created' to the more general 'made', and then the much broader use of 'set'.

Firmament - (raqiya` H754) The visible arch of the sky. From 'raqa`' (H7554), which means, 'to pound the earth, as a sign of passion or by analogy, to expand by hammering. By implication, to overlay like thin sheets of metal'. The term is used to speak of hammered gold and silver (Exo 39:3; Jer 10:9).

Set (nathan H5414) A primitive root; to give, used with greatest latitude of application (Gen 1:17, Gen 9:13, Gen 18:8, Gen 30:40, Gen 41:41). Elsewhere translated ‘put’, ‘make’, ‘cause’, etc. This act of creation on Day 4 is God’s handiwork, God doing what only God can do, but is nevertheless, not when they were brought into existence.
​

The only things 'created' were the heavens and the earth, life in general and man in particular:

Create ‘bara’ (H1254) - 'This verb has profound thological significance, since it has only God as it’s subject. Only God can create in the sense implied by bara. The verb expresses the idea of creation out of nothing...all other verbs for “creating” allow a much broader range of meaning. a careful study of the passages where bara occurs shows that in the few non-poetic uses, primarily in Genesis, the writer uses scientifically precise language to demonstrate that God brought the object or concept into being from previously nonexistent material. Things created, made and set by God: the heavens and the earth (Gen. 1:1; Isa. 40:26; 42:5; 45:18; 65:17); man (Gen. 1:27; 5:2; 6:7; Deut. 4:32; Ps. 89:47; Isa. 43:7; 45:12); Israel (Isa. 43:1; Mal. 2:10); a new thing (Jer. 31:22); cloud and smoke (Isa. 4:5); north and south (Ps. 89:12); salvation and righteousness (Isa. 45:8); speech (Isa. 57:19); darkness (Isa. 45:7); wind (Amos 4:13); and a new heart (Ps. 51:10).' (Vine 51)
​

Sometimes it helps to actually study the text. There is a progression of thought here, specific words are used for created, made and set. Knowing the difference in meaning can make sense of the text if you let it.

Grace and peace,
Mark

 

[Aman777]

Day 1: God 'lets' the light in, thus creating the first day (Gen. 1:4).

You left out Jesus Who IS the Light of the first Day. Jesus speaks of this time when it was just the Father and the Son, when He prayed to His Father in the Garden, just before His crucifixion:

Jhn 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou Me with thine own self with the glory (Heb-Brightness, a Physical trait) which I had with Thee before the world was.

*** Day 2: God creates the upper atmosphere, called the 'firmament' (Gen. 1:7).

Doesn't agree with was is written since the firmament protected the interior of Adam's Earth, from the Water which totally surrounded the First Earth, Gen 1:6-9 which was totally destroyed in the flood. ll Peter 3:3-7

*** Day 3: God separates the land from the seas and creates plant life (Gen. 1:10).

Amen, but BEFORE the plants herbs and rain, Jesus formed Adam from the dust of the ground and breathed Life into the first man. Gen 2:4-7 If you read those verses and still have questions, I will be happy to explain.

*** Day 4: God then, 'sets', the heavenly lights in the visible sky (Gen. 1:17).

Amen. Lord God (YHWH/Jesus) lights the first Stars on the 4th Day while Adam watched. Gen 1:16 Dating is possible since Science knows that it was some 13.8 Billion years ago, IN MAN'S time AFTER the Big Bang, which is shown in Gen 2:4 and also shows the formation of the THIRD Heaven, where Jesus is today, preparing our Mansions, for us.
Jhn 14:2 We love Him because He loved us first.

***Day 5: God creates the birds of the air and marine life (Gen. 1:21).

Not quite since you left out the "every living creature that moveth" from the water on the 5th Day. Gen 1:21

Gen 1:21 And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after Their (Trinity) kind, and every winged fowl after His (Jesus) kind: and God saw that it was good.

Only God is "good" which is better understood as Perfect.
Mar 10:18

*** Day 6: Finally, God creates the beasts of the field and Man (Gen. 1:25).

False. It was Lord God who formed Adam, the beasts of the field and the bird COMMON ANCESTORS with His own physical Hands and Adam named them. Gen 2:19 Jesus IS the Incarnation of the invisible Spirit we call God. His name in Genesis is "Lord God" or in Hebrew, YHWH and He came to Earth and died for us on the present Day of Salvation. This 6th Day/Age will continue until the last sinner to be saved IS saved and safely in Heaven according to Gen 2:1.

That is what Genesis actually teaches. Check it out and God bless you.

 

[SkyWriting]

The heavens and the earth, including the sun, were created 'in the beginning'. It could have been moments before or billions of years before creation week. Day four God doesn't create the sun, God 'sets' it in the sky which is God's work in the firmament, clearing the clouds and making the heavenly bodies regularly visible. At the outset the earth was covered in water and darkness, the perspective of Genesis is from the surface of the earth.

Creation: 'Created', 'Made' and 'Set'

Day 1: God 'lets' the light in, thus creating the first day (Gen. 1:4).
Day 2: God creates the upper atmosphere, called the 'firmament' (Gen. 1:7).
Day 3: God separates the land from the seas and creates plant life (Gen. 1:10).
Day 4: God then, 'sets', the heavenly lights in the visible sky (Gen. 1:17).
Day 5: God creates the birds of the air and marine life (Gen. 1:21).
Day 6: Finally, God creates the beasts of the field and Man (Gen. 1:25).​

The phrase, 'heaven and the earth', is a Hebrew expression meaning the universe. All we really get from this passage is that the cosmos and earth were created, 'in the beginning'. The perspective of creation week is from the surface of the earth, starting with the Spirit of God hovering over the deep (Gen. 1:2). In the chapter there are three words used for God's work in creation. The first is 'created' ('bara' H1254) a very precise term used only of God. It is used once to describe the creation of the universe (Gen 1:1), then again to describe the creation of life (Gen 1:21). Finally, in the closing verses, it is used three times for the creation of Adam and Eve (Gen. 1:27). The word translated, 'made' (asah 6213), has a much broader range of meaning and is used to speak of the creation of the 'firmament' 3 (Gen 1:7), the sun, moon and stars (Gen 1:16), procreation where offspring are made 'after his/their kind' (Gen 1:25) and as a general reference to creation in it's vast array (Gen 1:31).

Then there is a third term when God 'set' (nathan H2414), the lights of the sun, moon and stars so that their light is reqularly visible from the surface of the earth. In this way the narrative shifts from the very precise word for 'created' to the more general 'made', and then the much broader use of 'set'.

Firmament - (raqiya` H754) The visible arch of the sky. From 'raqa`' (H7554), which means, 'to pound the earth, as a sign of passion or by analogy, to expand by hammering. By implication, to overlay like thin sheets of metal'. The term is used to speak of hammered gold and silver (Exo 39:3; Jer 10:9).

Set (nathan H5414) A primitive root; to give, used with greatest latitude of application (Gen 1:17, Gen 9:13, Gen 18:8, Gen 30:40, Gen 41:41). Elsewhere translated ‘put’, ‘make’, ‘cause’, etc. This act of creation on Day 4 is God’s handiwork, God doing what only God can do, but is nevertheless, not when they were brought into existence.
​

The only things 'created' were the heavens and the earth, life in general and man in particular:

Create ‘bara’ (H1254) - 'This verb has profound thological significance, since it has only God as it’s subject. Only God can create in the sense implied by bara. The verb expresses the idea of creation out of nothing...all other verbs for “creating” allow a much broader range of meaning. a careful study of the passages where bara occurs shows that in the few non-poetic uses, primarily in Genesis, the writer uses scientifically precise language to demonstrate that God brought the object or concept into being from previously nonexistent material. Things created, made and set by God: the heavens and the earth (Gen. 1:1; Isa. 40:26; 42:5; 45:18; 65:17); man (Gen. 1:27; 5:2; 6:7; Deut. 4:32; Ps. 89:47; Isa. 43:7; 45:12); Israel (Isa. 43:1; Mal. 2:10); a new thing (Jer. 31:22); cloud and smoke (Isa. 4:5); north and south (Ps. 89:12); salvation and righteousness (Isa. 45:8); speech (Isa. 57:19); darkness (Isa. 45:7); wind (Amos 4:13); and a new heart (Ps. 51:10).' (Vine 51)
​

Sometimes it helps to actually study the text. There is a progression of thought here, specific words are used for created, made and set. Knowing the difference in meaning can make sense of the text if you let it.

Grace and peace,
Mark

I got it that time. Thanks for your patience!

"Time" as we know it, seems to have began
when Adam sinned, which is why death was
assured on that day.

16 The LORD God commanded the man, saying,
"From any tree of the garden you may eat freely;
17 but from the tree of the knowledge of good and
evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat
from it you will surely die."

12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through
one man and death through sin, so also death was
passed on to all men, because all sinned. 13For sin
was in the world before the Law was given; but sin
is not taken into account when there is no law.

 

[Archie the Preacher]

Correct. There is no "24 hours" without reference to the sun.

Without question, there is no such occurrence of 'evening' and 'morning' - which derives from 'sundown' and 'sunup' - without the Sun.

 

[Archie the Preacher]

The heavens and the earth, including the sun, were created 'in the beginning'. It could have been moments before or billions of years before creation week. Day four God doesn't create the sun, God 'sets' it in the sky which is God's work in the firmament, clearing the clouds and making the heavenly bodies regularly visible. At the outset the earth was covered in water and darkness, the perspective of Genesis is from the surface of the earth.

So, your argument is the star called 'Sol' existed from Day One, but just wasn't in the right place to be the Earth's "Sun" until Day Four. That still rules out the relative movement of Sun and Earth to provide 'evening' and 'morning'. Your explanation is still self-contradictory.

 

[Aman777]

Without question, there is no such occurrence of 'evening' and 'morning' - which derives from 'sundown' and 'sunup' - without the Sun.

In the creation story the evening is when something is begun and morning is the end of the work. It's the beginning and end of a "work of God". The present 6th Day/Age continues because God is STILL creating Adam (mankind) in Christ Spiritually, just as Gen 1:27 states. That is because the present 6th Day IS the Day/Age of Salvation.

2Co 6:2 (For He saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the Day of Salvation have I succoured (helped) thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)

When His perfect work is finished at the end of the present 6th Day, ALL the "host of Heaven" will be safely in Heaven and the present Universe will already have been burned. Gen 2:1

Gen 2:1 ¶ Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, (Heb-brought to perfection)...and ALL the host of them.

The last sinner to be born again Spiritually in Christ is among ALL the host of Heaven. Do you think that last sinner has already been saved? IF NOT, then the Father Son and Holy Spirit haven't rested (Heb-ceased) from ALL of His work of creation as the next two verses confirm. That's God's Scriptural Truth. Amen?

 

[Archie the Preacher]

In the creation story the evening is when something is begun and morning is the end of the work. It's the beginning and end of a "work of God". The present 6th Day/Age continues because God is STILL creating Adam (mankind) in Christ Spiritually, just as Gen 1:27 states. That is because the present 6th Day IS the Day/Age of Salvation.

So, you are saying the wording of Genesis (chapter one) is illustrative or metaphorical rather than a second by second account of Creation, exclusive of anything else?

 

[Aman777]

So, you are saying the wording of Genesis (chapter one) is illustrative or metaphorical rather than a second by second account of Creation, exclusive of anything else?

To be precise, Genesis chapter one is the Outline AND the History of the Six Creative Days of God's Creation. The "details" concerning these Days/Ages are found in the rest of God's Holy Word. From Gen 2:4 until the end of Revelation is hidden the details of the events shown in the FIRST 34 verses of Scripture. God has but 7 Days/Ages and the 7th Day/Age is far into the future. We live today at Gen 1:27 on the present 6th Day/Age in the creation because God is STILL creating Adam (Heb-mankind) in His Image, which is in Jesus Christ, Spiritually. Until the perfect 3rd Heaven is filled, His work will continue today, the 6th Day, the Day/Age of Salvation.

God told us of our future and HOW His Spirit would be given to ALL of mankind, including unbelievers, TE's and Darwinists, in the last days before Jesus returns at Armageddon.

Act 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of My Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:

God's Truth DOES agree in every way with every discovery of Science and History IF you can understand Genesis chapter one. Closely read the prophecy of Gen 1:28-31 and realize that it tells us of events which are future to 2016. God wrote our History 3k years ago. It's testable proof of the Literal God. His name is Jesus Christ. God Bless you

 

[juvenissun]

juvenissun said:Something you may shrug it off with I don't know and suffer no loss. Such as scientific questions.

To shrug off a scientific question with "I don't know" is to admit ignorance of the subject. When one does that, one cannot claim to "know" about the subject. The one exception to this is if one knows "Nobody knows", which is honest.

All scientists (and engineers) say "I don't know" all the time. There is nothing strange about it. That is why the question in the OP was raised.

But, this one addresses to the OP: As an engineer, he may say "I don't know" to an issue. BUT, that should not be the end of it if it is a real concern. We are not sure what does the "DAY" means in Genesis 1, but we can assume an answer and explore the consequences. It is hard. But just like to find the solution to a scientific or engineering problem, nothing is easy. We may say "I don't know" in conversation. But we should never say that, particularly to a question of faith, in our heart.

I assumed several answers to the "DAY" question in the past years. Now, I can give an answer to that question without much hesitation. It may not be a correct one or even be a good one, but at least, I don't have to say "I don't know" any more.

 

[Archie the Preacher]

All scientists (and engineers) say "I don't know" all the time. There is nothing strange about it. That is why the question in the OP was raised.

But, this one addresses to the OP: As an engineer, he may say "I don't know" to an issue. BUT, that should not be the end of it if it is a real concern. We are not sure what does the "DAY" means in Genesis 1, but we can assume an answer and explore the consequences. It is hard. But just like to find the solution to a scientific or engineering problem, nothing is easy. We may say "I don't know" in conversation. But we should never say that, particularly to a question of faith, in our heart.

I assumed several answers to the "DAY" question in the past years. Now, I can give an answer to that question without much hesitation. It may not be a correct one or even be a good one, but at least, I don't have to say "I don't know" any more.

If by this you mean, "No one knows for sure, but there are several theories" I'll go along with you.

My response was based on a misperception, to wit: I've had people tell me, when asked if they know anything solid about the "Big Bang" (Cosmic Egg) theory of the Universe, "I don't know" and proceed to inform me it is Satanic. I find it illogical and rather stupid to smear any thing on the basis of no knowledge except something brainwashed into them without grounds or foundation.

So forgive me for misunderstanding your intent, if you please.