Self-righteousness vs Humility

[James_Lai]

Right. And there's also a lot that goes into "knowing" (thinking, really) that the bible is true in the first place, along with the existential angst of actually dealing with real pain in this seemingly God forsaken world.

Wouldn't you agree? So, existentially speaking, why be surprised? Both existential experience AND the contents of the Bible suggests that we keep our expectations of Christian behaviour within a sober view. Sometimes we can be more charitable to other's failings; sometimes we can legitimately scrutinize them as well with rigour.

Yes. But before you get into existential understanding, ideals vs reality, goals vs costs etc consideration, the first question is, do you truly accept this way knowing what it means and what it requires of you? I read Jesus, and so all the multiple versions of distortions and primitivizations to adapt to current situations and to current people are mind-blowing… It hurts

 

[BNR32FAN]

Yes… I think, and I might be wrong of course, that the bottom line is Jesus wants a lot of us… It’s clear as day what He wants, most people if not all don’t really want to go that path. They want a convenient way where they do what they want all the while pretending - sincerely or knowingly - that they’re following Jesus. This is pretty appalling to observe

You mean like going to mosques and Buddhist temples? Are you familiar with the first two commandments?

““You shall have no other gods before Me. “You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing lovingkindness to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭20:3-6‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

he How can you judge other Christians if your not practicing what you preach?

 

[James_Lai]

You mean like going to mosques and Buddhist temples? Are you familiar with the first two commandments?

““You shall have no other gods before Me. “You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children, on the third and the fourth generations of those who hate Me, but showing lovingkindness to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments.”
‭‭Exodus‬ ‭20:3-6‬ ‭NASB1995‬‬

he How can you judge other Christians if your not practicing what you preach?

I’m not a Christian, never claimed to be. I’m trying to listen to Jesus, that’s all. My status here is “seeker”.

So forgive me my bluntness I only ask questions about what truly worries me.

 

[BNR32FAN]

I’m not a Christian, never claimed to be. I’m trying to listen to Jesus, that’s all. My status here is “seeker”.

So forgive me my bluntness I only ask questions about what truly worries me.

Ok fair enough I’m sorry I misunderstood your position

 

[James_Lai]

Can you be more specific? What do you consider to be the opposite of Jesus’ teachings?

I think I’m being very specific. An example will take away from my question, because it’s not about a specific thing or things.

I will try to explain again. Jesus Christ was teaching things and as I see, the absolute majority of people who say they are following Him, are not.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Yes. But before you get into existential understanding, ideals vs reality, goals vs costs etc consideration, the first question is, do you truly accept this way knowing what it means and what it requires of you? I read Jesus, and so all the multiple versions of distortions and primitivizations to adapt to current situations and to current people are mind-blowing… It hurts

Yes, it does hurt. It hurts today just as surely as it did the day Jesus was historically crucified by way of the combined misunderstandings and misgivings of His fellow people and those of the ruling Romans.

Moreover, what we find in the New Testament reminds us to be on guard against false brethren, false teachers, false apostles, false prophets and ... terrible situations that we all find ourselves caught in this painful world. Then too, we're reminded to be on guard against the deceptions of our own hearts that might lead us astray to, more sadly, hurt other people.

 

[BNR32FAN]

I’m not a Christian, never claimed to be. I’m trying to listen to Jesus, that’s all. My status here is “seeker”.

So forgive me my bluntness I only ask questions about what truly worries me.

There are many Christians who follow Christ’s words, I personally know a lot of people who do. Unfortunately your right there are many more who don’t and it makes those who do so much harder to find. If you want to truly see the Holy Spirit at work in people come to FAAC in Arlington Tx you’ll find some real servants of Christ there.

 

[James_Lai]

Okay, example. So I have friends who are Christian, and very deep Christians, not nominal or superficial ones. At least they are pretty serious about their faith. Mission work in the past, active in church, studying the Bible etc etc. I know them long long time. I sometimes see actions towards me or others or positions in life that contradict Jesus 100%. Not a sin, but serious actions and positions and stands that are direct opposite of Jesus. How come? To me it says they are NOT followers of Jesus no matter how much they are convinced they are or how many Christian culture and activity they perform…

It’s like me stating I love my kids and putting cyanide in their juice… The two things just don’t go together like water and fire.

To me it’s obvious as day.

 

[BNR32FAN]

I think I’m being very specific. An example will take away from my question, because it’s not about a specific thing or things.

I will try to explain again. Jesus Christ was teaching things and as I see, the absolute majority of people who say they are following Him, are not.

Well the reason I asked is because you’ll often see people starting with a similar OP then they’ll start promoting believe only theology where they claim that all you have to do is believe in Christ and you’ll be saved no matter what. Those people will claim that those are Jesus’ teachings but in reality that’s only bits & pieces of what He actually taught. So that’s why everyone here was asking you to please clarify because there are many different claims as to what Jesus actually taught.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Okay, example. So I have friends who are Christian, and very deep Christians, not nominal or superficial ones. At least they are pretty serious about their faith. Mission work in the past, active in church, studying the Bible etc etc. I know them long long time. I sometimes see actions towards me or others or positions in life that contradict Jesus 100%. Not a sin, but serious actions and positions and stands that are direct opposite of Jesus. How come? To me it says they are NOT followers of Jesus no matter how much they are convinced they are or how many Christian culture and activity they perform…

It’s like me stating I love my kids and putting cyanide in their juice… The two things just don’t go together like water and fire.

To me it’s obvious as day.

You really need to be more specific what did the people actually do that was against Christ?

 

[James_Lai]

Yes, it does hurt. It hurts today just as surely as it did the day Jesus was historically crucified by way of the combined misunderstandings and misgivings of His fellow people and those of the ruling Romans.

Moreover, what we find in the New Testament reminds us to be on guard against false brethren, false teachers, false apostles, false prophets and ... terrible situations that we all find ourselves caught in this painful world. Then too, we're reminded to be on guard against the deceptions of our own hearts that might lead us astray to, more sadly, hurt other people.

Good warning. Well, before we go into the application of the warning, it’s are you willing to follow Jesus as is or are you doing your own thing calling it Christianity and avoiding following Him?

 

[James_Lai]

You really need to be more specific what did the people actually do that was against Christ?

Does it really matter? Could be a number of things. Jesus teaches one thing, you hold to the opposite.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Does it really matter? Could be a number of things. Jesus teaches one thing, you hold to the opposite.

Yes it does matter if you want people to assess their actions we have to know exactly what they did.

 

[BNR32FAN]

Does it really matter? Could be a number of things. Jesus teaches one thing, you hold to the opposite.

You know after following Jesus for 3 years Peter denied Him 3 times. Would you say that he wasn’t a true follower of Christ?

 

[James_Lai]

Well the reason I asked is because you’ll often see people starting with a similar OP then they’ll start promoting believe only theology where they claim that all you have to do is believe in Christ and you’ll be saved no matter what. Those people will claim that those are Jesus’ teachings but in reality that’s only bits & pieces of what He actually taught. So that’s why everyone here was asking you to please clarify because there are many different claims as to what Jesus actually taught.

I understand what you mean. I don’t want to retell the Gospels but it’s laid out there pretty well. It’s too too radical for most people’s liking and so they adapt it to their convenience

 

[James_Lai]

You know after following Jesus for 3 years Peter denied Him 3 times. Would you say that he wasn’t a true follower of Christ?

In the gospels, you read on several occasions people around Him could not understand His teachings even being close to Him, so He goes on to explain it to them again and again.

 

[James_Lai]

Yes it does matter if you want people to assess their actions we have to know exactly what they did.

You can put there whatever goes against Jesus…

 

[BNR32FAN]

I understand what you mean. I don’t want to retell the Gospels but it’s laid out there pretty well. It’s too too radical for most people’s liking and so they adapt it to their convenience

I completely agree I see it all the time and what’s worse is they often use Christ’s sacrifice as an excuse to sin by saying “ahh it’s ok Jesus died for my sins” so then they go ahead and willfully indulge in sin. But we have to remember that there’s still hope for anyone who still has air in his lungs to repent and be saved.

 

[James_Lai]

I think the bottom line is a follower of Jesus in today’s world will end up suffering a lot, maybe even dying. It’s a revolution of spirituality and of society. People want to have their ways and only take snippets of Jesus teachings or Jesus-sounding teachings to create something completely different. “Christianity Light”. So light it lost Jesus

 

[BNR32FAN]

In the gospels, you read on several occasions people around Him could not understand His teachings even being close to Him, so He goes on to explain it to them again and again.

That’s very true His disciples often had to ask Him what He meant by His parables but then again they didn’t have the indwelling Holy Spirit at the time so they had to openly ask Him exactly what He meant.