Seat of Moses ?

[Mercymessianicjudiasm]

OK. And the dispute never made it into our law nor do we have any evidence that the matter even made it before the judges. Frankly, we don't have any record of it and, to me, it sounds like a discourse on a street corner. That's the relevant fact- one group of Jews arguing with another.

Fyi- there is no Statute of Limitations for murder, releasing the accused could legally mean the accused could be prosecuted in the future.

 

[Open Heart]

I asked you a question, I never said my question was related to your response.

Please be so kind as not to quote what you aren't replying to. It only creates confusion.

My answer is that I don't really care about the question or what its answer is. Yeshua went willingly to his death. It was part of God's plan for the Romans to execute him.

 

[danny ski]

Fyi- there is no Statute of Limitations for murder, releasing the accused could legally mean the accused could be prosecuted in the future.

I was only commenting on the alleged dispute between Jesus and the Pharisees. The "trial" holds little interest to me as he was sentenced and executed under the Roman authority.

 

[chunkofcoal]

Yeshua also said practice what you preach; be ware of the "leaven" from the Pharisees. A little leaven affects the whole lump. Leaven causes holy bread to become "puffed up" or rise. Moses taught us how to eat "unleavened" bread. There is more evidence to support the idea of respecting or honoring the "seat of Moses" than listening to hypocrites. I respect and honor the Office of the President but that does not make me a Trump fan. I respect the Office of the President, but I obey Yeshua, Yeshua told me to honor those that sit in the seat of Moses. Do you think Trump sits in the seat of Moses?

No, I don't think Trump sits in Moses seat.
And Yeshua said the Scribes and Pharisees sit in Moses seat.

 

[chunkofcoal]

Every teacher knows that teaching is much more about what your students observe you do than what they hear you say. My students forget what I say but they remember what I do. It is very important for a good teacher to "model" good behavior (James 3:1).

A teacher should model good behavior but when one is teaching the Word of the Lord, the words are pretty important.

 

[chunkofcoal]

We do what we can in the absence of the Temple. As for out of context, we only have half of the story and it's a second hand transmission at best. A precision in law is a very important issue among us, hence so many Jewish lawyers. The bottom line is that Jesus disagreed with a legal interpretation among his religious brethren. Nothing special about it. There were disagreements between various schools that ended up in street wars and murder. This one was pretty mild by the standards of the day. But, we really have nothing to go on because the disagreement never made it beyond his circle.

I read an article about that recently - they were thinking Yeshua was a Pharisee and made mention of all the debating that was going on in those days. They said sometimes it wasn't so much that the people were in opposition, but that instead they were searching for the truth.

 

[Open Heart]

I read an article about that recently - they were thinking Yeshua was a Pharisee and made mention of all the debating that was going on in those days. They said sometimes it wasn't so much that the people were in opposition, but that instead they were searching for the truth.

Yes. One of my favorite books is by an Orthodox Rabbi named Harvey Falk -- "Jesus the Pharisee." He documents that Yeshua was a Pharisee of the school of Hillel and got into the typical arguments with the Pharisees of the school of Shammai, who ran the Sanhedrin during that time in history.

I think if Christians could just understand how the halakhic debates ran at that time, it would give them so much more context for the gospels. But unfortunately, the typical Christian has been taught that they should be able to just open up the Bible and read it and the Holy Spirit will reveal its truth to them, no studying needed.

 

[chunkofcoal]

Yes. One of my favorite books is by an Orthodox Rabbi named Harvey Falk -- "Jesus the Pharisee." He documents that Yeshua was a Pharisee of the school of Hillel and got into the typical arguments with the Pharisees of the school of Shammai, who ran the Sanhedrin during that time in history.

I might have to check that out. Thank you!

 

[Heber Book List]

Yes. One of my favorite books is by an Orthodox Rabbi named Harvey Falk -- "Jesus the Pharisee." He documents that Yeshua was a Pharisee of the school of Hillel and got into the typical arguments with the Pharisees of the school of Shammai, who ran the Sanhedrin during that time in history.

I think if Christians could just understand how the halakhic debates ran at that time, it would give them so much more context for the gospels. But unfortunately, the typical Christian has been taught that they should be able to just open up the Bible and read it and the Holy Spirit will reveal its truth to them, no studying needed.

I have a book written by a Jewish academic that makes a convincing argument that Yeshua was close to the Essenes, though not actually one.

 

[Heber Book List]

I think if Christians could just understand how the halakhic debates ran at that time, it would give them so much more context for the gospels. But unfortunately, the typical Christian has been taught that they should be able to just open up the Bible and read it and the Holy Spirit will reveal its truth to them, no studying needed.

The problem is that we have two millennia of misunderstood texts, so that people now believe that the original, erroneous understandings are the only truth, and that the truth we now teach them is a lie.

Years of leading Bible study groups and preaching, and working with students, always seemed to come back to this problem. Interestingly, when I taught or preached on the Tanach (in a Church setting) it was accepted with no question - probably because 90% of Christians do not read much of the Tanach and, where the Tanach is used to teach Christian truths, the argument against it is that it is the 'Old' testament and o doesn't apply to us today (except of course certain favourite parts, usually depending on the time of the year).

 

[pat34lee]

Remember that Yeshua ceremonially washed his hands, as did most of the disciples.

Reference?

 

[Mercymessianicjudiasm]

The problem is that we have two millennia of misunderstood texts, so that people now believe that the original, erroneous understandings are the only truth, and that the truth we now teach them is a lie.

Years of leading Bible study groups and preaching, and working with students, always seemed to come back to this problem. Interestingly, when I taught or preached on the Tanach (in a Church setting) it was accepted with no question - probably because 90% of Christians do not read much of the Tanach and, where the Tanach is used to teach Christian truths, the argument against it is that it is the 'Old' testament and o doesn't apply to us today (except of course certain favourite parts, usually depending on the time of the year).

Where are you getting this stuff? I guess because anyone says anything that makes everything true? You know what happened 2000 years ago because you were never there? Those who were actually there wrote about what occurred.

 

[Mercymessianicjudiasm]

I have a book written by a Jewish academic that makes a convincing argument that Yeshua was close to the Essenes, though not actually one.

Because the person who wrote that book was alive 2000 years ago and personally witnessed everything ?

 

[Heber Book List]

Because the person who wrote that book was alive 2000 years ago and personally witnessed everything ?

No.

 

[Mercymessianicjudiasm]

I might have to check that out. Thank you!

I guess i should write a book called "Yeshua was not a Pharisee but a rabbi." It might be a best seller (John 1:38).

 

[Heber Book List]

Where are you getting this stuff? I guess because anyone says anything that makes everything true? You know what happened 2000 years ago because you were never there? Those who were actually there wrote about what occurred.

In the translations some errors do occur in the texts, as is clear to anyone who studies scripture, but the prime problem is the exegesis by ministers and others in relation to the texts we have. How do you think Replacement Theology started, for example?

 

[Mercymessianicjudiasm]

In the translations some errors do occur in the texts, as is clear to anyone who studies scripture, but the prime problem is the exegesis by ministers and others others in relation to the texts we have. How do you think Replacement Theology started, for example?

You are wrong! There are no errors in scripture. You agree with "replacement theology" when you claim there are errors and then replace what is clearly written in scripture with your own ideas that are not written. It is arrogant to think everyone or anyone who studies scripture must agree with you, I study Torah and I do not agree with you.

 

[Heber Book List]

You are wrong! There are no errors in scripture. You agree with "replacement theology" when you claim there are errors and then replace what is clearly written in scripture with your own ideas that are not written. It is arrogant to think everyone or anyone who studies scripture must agree with you, I study Torah and I do not agree with you.

Calm down, for goodness sake! Replacent theology goes back to Martin Luther, but more nearer our time it was taught in theological colleges as a clear Biblical Truth, and continues to be taught in some Theological Colleges to this day! This is NOT Biblical truth!

You are greatly mistaken, or you are being abusive, in accusing me of agreeing with Replacement Theology - if the latter, please cease. I have fought against RT for over 20 years!

Millions of people do not agree with me, or you, or possibly anyone else on these fora - so what is the problem? Have you read 1 Corinthians 11:19, yet?

Can you explain the discrepancy between Luke and Paul regarding the events following on from the Damascus Road? Can you tell me who Barabbas was? Can you tell me which is correct in 1 Samuel 6:19 - 70 men, or 50,000? Can you explain two different sets of 10 commandments between Exodus and Deuteronomy? Just a few that come to mind without trying too hard!

It is bedtime here. Night nights

 

[Heber Book List]

.

 

[Heber Book List]

You are wrong! There are no errors in scripture. You agree with "replacement theology" when you claim there are errors and then replace what is clearly written in scripture with your own ideas that are not written. It is arrogant to think everyone or anyone who studies scripture must agree with you, I study Torah and I do not agree with you.

I have checked, and cannot see quite where I have insisted you must agree with me, or that anyone else should have to agree with me. When you have have calmed down, would you please be kind enough to find the relevant post where I insisted that you, or anyone else on these fora, must agree with me on anything?