Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
The only ones who do that would be the KJVO!I don’t think people make an idol of the Bible. That to me is a silly argument as it is God’s Word.
I think it is much more problematic those who minimize God’s Word.
NO true Christian sees Jesus as a created being, for he was and is God Incarnate!Without wishing to sidetrack the debate, I always thought roughly half of trinitarian churchgoers believed Jesus was a created being if you like, at some point pre the biblical beginning(creation) and they solely referred to Christ as the Son of God. This is based on what I have experienced, in many protestant denominations. I do not view it as surprising, as I myself have never heard it plainly stated otherwise in any sermon I have heard preached in many various denominational churches.
Only the Bible is the inspired word from God to us, His special revelation of Himself.So do you believe that God is limited by the bible and that he only reveals himself through it alone and in no other way, and that if the bible were suddenly to be destroyed tomorrow that there would be no more God or Christianity? No Jesus? None of it ever happened? Because the very foundation of our faith (being the bible in this scenario) as Christians is no more? That God exists and Jesus was resurrected *only* because the bible tells us it is true? And that if we can't concoct all sorts of fantastic explanations to "prove" that there are no historical or scientific errors, or that there are no contradictions anywhere at all in scripture...if *biblical* (vs. *God*) inerrancy were disproved, then our entire faith would utterly collapse?
Because there *are* people that sincerely believe the above.
In fact, I just this morning read a survey from Lifeway that showed that something like 76% of evangelicals believe that Jesus Christ was *created* by God, and a large percentage believe that the Holy Spirit is simply a powerful force rather than a divine being (God), and all sorts of other similar things. And having participated in numerous conversations here on CF, I don't doubt at all the accuracy of the survey or find it difficult to imagine that many people confuse the authority of scripture with the authority of God himself.
And when people speak of God's Word, there is a difference between God's "logos" (translated as Word, but represents Jesus) and God's "biblos" (also translated as Word, but represents written scripture) and yet many people make no distinction between the two because it's not clear in English translations that there is a difference.
It's not a silly argument because this mix-up creates all sorts of confusion and even outright heresies due to the "sola" God being the bible rather than God.
Only the Bible is the inspired word from God to us, His special revelation of Himself.
The KJVO people are wrongly judgmental. The Holy Spirit can help an true seeker of God's truths in almost any Bible translation. I was even told by two KJVO pastors I needed to condemn all of the other translations and Evangelist Billy Graham in order to continue intending their Baptist church.The only ones who do that would be the KJVO!
The Jewish sabbath was NEVER given in the NT to the Church, but all of the other 9 Comkmandments were back back over unto the church in the NT!Most SDAers thing there religion is God's favorite, but that is not true for many reasons.
My Responses to Some Seventh Day Adventist’ Teachings
(by Bible Lover Bill)
***The Sabbath time (Friday evening until Sundown Saturday) has the most blessings.
Back on July 16, 1999, after I read “The Marked Bible” book's Tenth Chapter
and I decided to keep the Sabbath and seek out a church that did.,
The church I chose just happened to have a discussion about the Sabbath in the Pastor's Class
(one of 27 chapters of the doctrines book they were using).
I was “told” by the Holy Spirit that I had had my best intercessory prayer times in the past
during the Sabbath time
and I felt a wonderful peace about that
as I remembered when I did most of my unselfish praying.
When there is no Sabbath keeping church I can go to so I do the following:
By living Proverbs 3:5-6, I plan to begin Friday evening thinking more about and communicating with God
more than I usually do.
During the Sabbath time,
I sometimes watch a Christian film (either Friday evening or Saturday morning).
I listen to Rejoice radio or Word of Truth radio, do intercessory prayer,
watch Bible study programs via the Internet, or/and do ministry as the Holy Spirit urges.
I usually do not look at the Sports news or go shopping or do other selfish things
during “God's cathedral of time”.
I also usually do a Bible study tool for most of Saturday
because for me that is not work at all.
I usually don't have time to do such during the 6 days before.
Sometimes I take a nap.
Most of the time when I do the above list,
I have been blessed much more than when I have gone to a Sabbath keeping church
to have a wonderful Sabbath
because most attenders of such churches are legalistically keeping the Sabbath
only for 2-5 hours.
Same thing for Sunday church goers.
(Most of the time since 2000, I have gone to such too
usually for Bible teaching, which was a weakness in SDA churches.)
I have rebuked those who are against those who don’t worship on the day they do.
It is not a Salvation issue right now.
But Jesus Christ said that if we love Him, we would obey His commandments
and He was the one that wrote the Ten Commandments twice on Tablets (God the Father is a spirit).
He also said that He did not come to destroy God’s Law (not including the ordinances)
and they are indicated in the 1,050 commandments of the New Testament.
***Ignored or misunderstood Commandment is the 4th Commandment of the Ten Commandments.
The Day was blessed and sanctified in Genesis 1 and was changed by King Constantine and a Roman Catholic Pope.
The Two Great Commandments and the Ten Commandments are actually all through the Bible
in certain verses (directly quoted or implied) and examples.
I changed my main God-focus day on July 16, 1999, but I still go to churches that meet on Sunday too.
I do not use the Sabbath time (from Friday sundown until Saturday sundown)
the way it was done in the Old Testament Times by the Israelites.
Jesus Christ and the Apostle Paul did not just rest during the Sabbath time.
Keeping the Sabbath like Jesus Christ and the Apostle Paul did is no yoke or bondage.
And circumcision is not in the Ten Commandments.
The rules and ordinances for the Israelites are not for today's Christians.
I do whatever The Holy Spirit urges, and that can be even doing Internet ministry most of awake time.
I don't feel that Internet ministry is work because I usually have enjoyable times.
I usually spend many hours doing ETRSF Bible study tool developing
because such is wonderful to me and not work.
I do not look at Yahoo Sports news and much less at the other news as I do the other days.
I do intercessory prayer whenever The Holy Spirit urges.
I watch much less TV during that time than the other days, and much more Christian TV then than the secular.
Sometimes I have the worship music of Rejoice radio or DayStar on much much more than the other days.
Sometimes we take a one day trip somewhere on Saturday or I take a nap in the afternoon.
Results of the above: A lot of divine peace, divine joy, and more spiritual understandings,
more of such than I receive the other days of the week
which are usually for my fulltime Internet ministries.
Try such and you might like it too.
More free information about the Sabbath, go to Box .
The Jewish sabbath was NEVER given in the NT to the Church, but all of the other 9 Comkmandments were back back over unto the church in the NT!
Without wishing to sidetrack the debate, I always thought roughly half of trinitarian churchgoers believed Jesus was a created being if you like, at some point pre the biblical beginning(creation) and they solely referred to Christ as the Son of God. This is based on what I have experienced, in many protestant denominations. I do not view it as surprising, as I myself have never heard it plainly stated otherwise in any sermon I have heard preached in many various denominational churches.
The only ones who do that would be the KJVO!
The Jewish sabbath was NEVER given in the NT to the Church,
I don't know why you would have a problem with the concept of picking and choosing what part of the bible we prefer to believe
I notice that you left out the other half of my quote.
If you have such a problem with it, then why do you cherry-pick only the scripture that seems to support your sabbath-central theology
The thing about "sola scripture" is that it typically means the entire bible and not just the parts
Without wishing to sidetrack the debate, I always thought roughly half of trinitarian churchgoers believed Jesus was a created being if you like, at some point pre the biblical beginning(creation) and they solely referred to Christ as the Son of God. This is based on what I have experienced, in many protestant denominations
Oh I have met seventh day Adventists who believe only the Father is the one true God, you want to broaden your horizonsI have heard and read a great many denominational statements on the person of Christ (God the Son) and have only found a small handful of people that do not admit that God the Son is infinite - from eternity past... with beginning as Hebrews 7 states.
Without wishing to sidetrack the debate, I always thought roughly half of trinitarian churchgoers believed Jesus was a created being if you like, at some point pre the biblical beginning(creation) and they solely referred to Christ as the Son of God. This is based on what I have experienced, in many protestant denominations
Oh I have met seventh day Adventists who believe only the Father is the one true God,
Im afraid it is not possible to have a serious discussion with you based on the bible. As soon as you are presented with scripture you do not understand, or goes against your denominational beliefs you do sommersaults with it, in order to get it to state what you want it to state.I have heard and read a great many denominational statements on the person of Christ (God the Son) and have only found a small handful of people that do not admit that God the Son is infinite - from eternity past... with beginning as Hebrews 7 states.
A handful in a denomination of over 20 million.. I have found folks in different groups that think the world is flat as well. Is that supposed to prove that all the world or all Christians or the SDA denomination teaches such things?
Let's be serious in this discussion please.
I have a problem with it because it is what the "believe whatever you feel and don't worry so much about what the Bible says" group chooses.
I have a problem with it because it is what the "I don't like sola-scriptura testing of the Bible to see if a given doctrine is true or false" group chooses to do.
I have a problem with it - because it is foundational to the dark ages persecution of the saints.
I know this comes as a bit of a surprise to you -- but for many others on this board it is merely stating "the obvious"
The first part of you post brings up a detail, a topic, that deserves specific focus - for those who imagine that "pick and choose" is anything remotely approved of under the standard practice of exegesis and truthful accurate rendering of the text and testing of doctrine.
I suppose I could "quote the entire Bible every time I wanted to demonstrate a point" but that would wash out the entire benefit. As both agree.
It is far better to be succinct - and zero in with laser focus on "the fact" and what the Bible says about it.
In response - someone will likely point to some other verse saying that they think that verse modifies or deletes some other verse. I love adding clarity for them on that suggestion when the opportunity arises.
In fact it does not mean "quote the entire Bible any time you want to make a point".
But it does mean that what scripture says on a given topic is to have bearing on the subject. I point to "details" that make it impossible to be at war with God's Sabbath Commandment for the objective unbiased Bible student.
Those "details" are so irrefutable that the "need" to be ignored by those who choose to be at war with God's Commandments for their argument to fly. Thus my preference is "scripture" and not "feelings" as the test of doctrine.
Romans 10 "Faith comes from hearing and hearing by the Word of God"
in Christ,
Bob
However, you do need to take the whole of scripture into account when interpreting the parts of it,
Without wishing to sidetrack the debate, I always thought roughly half of trinitarian churchgoers believed Jesus was a created being if you like, at some point pre the biblical beginning(creation) and they solely referred to Christ as the Son of God. This is based on what I have experienced, in many protestant denominations
About Jesus Christ-- Box
Let me enlighten you, roughly half(conservative figure) of people who attend trinitarian churches solely term Christ the Son of God. And at least 95% of people in those churches will accept anyone as a Christian if they only term Christ the son of God. The internet is very different of course, head theology is what matters most hereI have heard and read a great many denominational statements on the person of Christ (God the Son) and have only found a small handful of people that do not admit that God the Son is infinite - from eternity past... with beginning as Hebrews 7 states.
Jesus is the creator - John 1:1-5
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?