Same tree?

[Mercy74]

This is a Garden that God planted. And it was good. "But there are weeds" was not said.

Something far worse than a wicked weed grew, a tree that bore fruit that causes death to the partaker. A serpent persuading Eve to eat it? Why did a poisonous serpent wish Eve to eat from a poisonous tree?

 

[Tone]

Let us reason together. Shall we? If every tree was good for food then no fruit should be rejected or forbidden. Mark 7:19 and I Timothy 4:4

So you're saying that in Genesis 2:9, it doesn't necessarily follow that the tree of life is one of the trees that was good for food. Seems like you are thinking about clean and unclean foods. People are often confused into believing that everything that could be eaten, is food...but, of course, this is not true. And when Scripture says something like all foods gave been sanctified by Yah, it is simply saying that, yeah, everything that has already been establised as clean in Torah, is clean...so all FOOD is indeed clean and sanctified, but (as a side note) pigs were never meant as food.

Anyways, I only brought all that up, because you seem to be using that argument in the case of the two specific trees mentioned in the Eden account and I can see your point, however, I am hesitant to fully come out and say that something that may in fact be Yah's work, could be the work of hashatan.

 

[dlamberth]

Something far worse than a wicked weed grew, a tree that bore fruit that causes death to the partaker. A serpent persuading Eve to eat it? Why did a poisonous serpent wish Eve to eat from a poisonous tree?

God created all things. And buy eating the Tree of Knowledge Humans became conscious. Is Eve is the awakener? One would think from some of these post that Human Consciousness is a crime against the Human order. From the myth story, God didn't give us moral Consciousness, the tree did.

 

[Tone]

Who planted the tares? Who is the enemy or our adversary? Do goats transform into sheep? They seem to be eternal qualities, the nature of things.

I see what you are saying here too. If the forbidden tree bears fruit unto death, and our Yah is the Elohim of the living and He is Life and His work is the propogation of life, then how can it be of His workmanship?

But remember, He did not force Eve to eat of it...it was out of His hands. And it was the serpent that enticed her, but he was in the tree...he didn't go and abduct Eve and bring her to the tree.

So I wonder what Eve was doing around there, in such close proximity; unless maybe, since both trees were in the midst of the garden, she was on her way to the tree of life and she was sidetracked...ugh...if only she found her way to the tree of life...

But would that have been according to plan? Who knows...

Luke 11:52
"Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering."

Matthew 19:14
"Yahshua said, 'Let the little children come to me, and do not hinder them, for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these.'"

 

[Robban]

deleted there may be issue with copyright[

 

[Mercy74]

So you're saying that in Genesis 2:9, it doesn't necessarily follow that the tree of life is one of the trees that was good for food. Seems like you are thinking about clean and unclean foods. People are often confused into believing that everything that could be eaten, is food...but, of course, this is not true. And when Scripture says something like all foods gave been sanctified by Yah, it is simply saying that, yeah, everything that has already been establised as clean in Torah, is clean...so all FOOD is indeed clean and sanctified, but (as a side note) pigs were never meant as food.

Anyways, I only brought all that up, because you seem to be using that argument in the case of the two specific trees mentioned in the Eden account and I can see your point, however, I am hesitant to fully come out and say that something that may in fact be Yah's work, could be the work of hashatan.

Genesis 1:31

 

[Mercy74]

God created all things. And buy eating the Tree of Knowledge Humans became conscious. Is Eve is the awakener. One would think from some of these post that Human Consciousness is a crime against the Human order. From the myth story, God didn't give us moral Consciousness, the tree did.

Obedience is better than sacrifice.

 

[Mercy74]

Man was conscious of the wisdom of the spiritual worlds and the the physical "natural" world.

After he sinned, his stature was diminished, and he shrunk from contact with higher worlds.

Man,s consciousness then became focused on his physical
needs alone.


(A mini-clip from Zohar)

The wages of sin (disobedience) is death. The forbidden tree was forbidden?

 

[Robban]

The wages of sin (disobedience) is death. The forbidden tree was forbidden?

Thank God there is an escape hatch,

repentence.

 

[Mercy74]

So you're saying that in Genesis 2:9, it doesn't necessarily follow that the tree of life is one of the trees that was good for food. Seems like you are thinking about clean and unclean foods. People are often confused into believing that everything that could be eaten, is food...but, of course, this is not true. And when Scripture says something like all foods gave been sanctified by Yah, it is simply saying that, yeah, everything that has already been establised as clean in Torah, is clean...so all FOOD is indeed clean and sanctified, but (as a side note) pigs were never meant as food.

Anyways, I only brought all that up, because you seem to be using that argument in the case of the two specific trees mentioned in the Eden account and I can see your point, however, I am hesitant to fully come out and say that something that may in fact be Yah's work, could be the work of hashatan.

The tree of life is a spiritual tree.

 

[Robban]

"Could a snake (on a pole) cause death (by not looking at it)
or give life (by looking at it)?

Ultimately God is control over everything,
and He has the ability to bring beneficence or detructruction
to the world employing any of the creatures He created.

(Numbers 21:5-9)

 

[Mercy74]

"Could a snake (on a pole) cause death (by not looking at it)
or give life (by looking at it)?

Ultimately God is control over everything,
and He has the ability to bring beneficence or detructruction
to the world employing any of the creatures He created.

(Numbers 21:5-9)

The pole was the anecdote not the disease or poison.

 

[Tone]

Notice wisdom and folly (personified as women here) are located in the same spot:

Proverbs 9

"Wisdom has built its seven pillars.
2 She has prepared her meat and mixed her wine;
she has also set her table.
3 She has sent out her servants, and she calls
from the highest point of the city,"


"Folly is an unruly woman;
she is simple and knows nothing.
14 She sits at the door of her house,
on a seat at the highest point of the city,"

At the "highest point of the city", like the two trees in the midst of the garden; just thought it interesting.

 

[Robban]

The pole was the anecdote not the disease or poison.

It wases not the snake itself that brought the cure.
Rather,
at the time Israel would look upward and subject their heart to their Father in Heaven, they would be cured;
but if not they would waste away.

Moses copper snake was eventually deified by certain Jews,
they mistakenly believed that it possessed divine healing powers.

Later the righteous King Hezekiah of Judah had it destroyed.
(2 Kings 18:4)

 

[Mercy74]

Notice wisdom and folly (personified as women here) are located in the same spot:

Proverbs 9

"Wisdom has built its seven pillars.
2 She has prepared her meat and mixed her wine;
she has also set her table.
3 She has sent out her servants, and she calls
from the highest point of the city,"


"Folly is an unruly woman;
she is simple and knows nothing.
14 She sits at the door of her house,
on a seat at the highest point of the city,"

At the "highest point of the city", like the two trees in the midst of the garden; just thought it interesting.

Wisdom is described as an "her",however we know wisdom has no gender. On the other hand folly is clearly an unruly woman. G_d is not a man that HE should lie, we know that G_d is spirit. Numbers 23:19

 

[dlamberth]

Obedience is better than sacrifice.

As I life in God, living in the Original Blessings has a way of replacing Obedience with Love and the Life force with in life itSelf. It's enjoying God as God enjoys Himself. And it's in the same enjoyment in which God enjoys Himself, God enjoys all things.

 

[Tone]

I watched the movie "Ready Player One" yesterday and it occurred to me that the Eden account can be understood as a test. Other than informing and instructing them about the consequences, the Creator seemed to withdraw from them and allow them to take their course. I mean, if you were going to hand over your wonderful creation, wouldn't you test the prospective steward beforehand?

So when it comes to times of testing, I believe that He steps back and allows us to exercise our faith to the fullest...and in this, He humbles Himself and gives of His power.

*I said this in another thread; valid here too.

 

[Robban]

I watched the movie "Ready Player One" yesterday and it occurred to me that the Eden account can be understood as a test. Other than informing and instructing them about the consequences, the Creator seemed to withdraw from them and allow them to take their course. I mean, if you were going to hand over your wonderful creation, wouldn't you test the prospective steward beforehand?

So when it comes to times of testing, I believe that He steps back and allows us to exercise our faith to the fullest...and in this, He humbles Himself and gives of His power.

*I said this in another thread; valid here too.

Why curse the earth before leaving?

There is this,
The divine presence withdrew to the highest of heavens,

and was gradually drawn down again to manifest at Sinai.

Were His word to depart but for a moment,
all would become nought and nothingness.


The way you describe, is that not Deism?
A God far off, just leaves us to get on with it,

 

[Hazelelponi]

No. Not the same tree. Matthew 7:18 states:

A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.

Also:

1 Corinthians 15:45-48

Ligonier Ministries

^^^ good read for thought.

 

[Tone]

Why curse the earth before leaving?

There is this,
The divine presence withdrew to the highest of heavens,

and was gradually drawn down again to manifest at Sinai.

Were His word to depart but for a moment,
all would become nought and nothingness.


The way you describe, is that not Deism?
A God far off, just leaves us to get on with it,

I was a speaking of the time of Eve's testing (trial)...the account says she and the serpent were having a conversation and the Creator didn't intervene. Then, after they (Adam & Eve) both had eaten of the tree, the Creator returns.