sabbath was made....

[Adventist Dissident]

Numbers 23:19-20 (King James Version)

19God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good? 20Behold, I have received commandment to bless: and he hath blessed; and I cannot reverse it.


1 Chronicles 17:27

27Now therefore let it please thee to bless the house of thy servant, that it may be before thee for ever: for thou blessest, O LORD, and it shall be blessed for ever.


both these text tell us that when a blessing is pronunced it is pronounced forever

 

[Byfaithalone1]

Numbers 23:19-20 (King James Version)19God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good? 20Behold, I have received commandment to bless: and he hath blessed; and I cannot reverse it.

The context?

No misfortune is seen in Jacob,
no misery observed in Israel.
The LORD their God is with them;
the shout of the King is among them
​

1 Chronicles 17:27

27Now therefore let it please thee to bless the house of thy servant, that it may be before thee for ever: for thou blessest, O LORD, and it shall be blessed for ever.

The context?

"There is no one like you, O LORD, and there is no God but you, as we have heard with our own ears. 21 And who is like your people Israel—the one nation on earth whose God went out to redeem a people for himself, and to make a name for yourself, and to perform great and awesome wonders by driving out nations from before your people, whom you redeemed from Egypt? 22 You made your people Israel your very own forever, and you, O LORD, have become their God.

23 "And now, LORD, let the promise you have made concerning your servant and his house be established forever. Do as you promised, 24 so that it will be established and that your name will be great forever. Then men will say, 'The LORD Almighty, the God over Israel, is Israel's God!' And the house of your servant David will be established before you. 25 "You, my God, have revealed to your servant that you will build a house for him. So your servant has found courage to pray to you. 26 O LORD, you are God! You have promised these good things to your servant.
​

both these text tell us that when a blessing is pronunced it is pronounced forever

How do you partake in the blessing of:

* Circumcision (Romans 4)
* Grain and drink offerings (Joel 2)
* Feast of Weeks (Deuteronomy 16)
* The other feasts that are "Lord appointed" (Leviticus 23)
​

BFA

 

[Byfaithalone1]

there was no need to remind them to spend time with God

No, I agree with you that there wasn't. It seems quite possible (as discussed in Genesis 3:8) that Adam and Eve were regularly able to commune with God in the cool of the day. It seems that they could have done so every day (and not just one day out of seven).

Prior to sin, from what would Adam and Eve have needed to rest?

the problem is that it is not my opions the scripture says it was blessed and made holy, that is not my opionin, the question is weather the blessing and holiness was a 1 time event or was it ment to be a repeating pattern. that is the issue.

I won't try and change your mind. For me, I've found no evidence that anything special occurred on the 14th day of the newly created world.

Not gonna work.

I won't try and change your mind. For me, Matthew 5 is quite persuasive.

BFA

 

[VictorC]

Victor why do you want to make this personal? i simply do not believe as you do. i don't see it. When are you going to learn that simply because you post it and believe does mean you are correct. every time you get in a corner you fall back on personall attacks & you change the subject. i have successfully countered your arguments. you must go back to the drawing board. it won't work the way you want to do it.

My post wasn't a personal attack. I believe you comprehend the position I have explained, and it remains your option to engage in dialogue concerning it if that isn't the case. A claim that you have countered an argument before using that option and showing that you understand what I have repeatedly brought to your attention isn't consistent with a claim that countering it was "successful".

It is entirely reasonable to question your motive, as I don't understand why you aren't interested in the blessing of the seventh day, a blessing that is as permanent as the rest itself. Why would you want the sabbath instead of it?

 

[Byfaithalone1]

Did God-commanded sabbath observance include animal sacrifices? Should it today?

BFA

 

[VictorC]

Did God-commanded sabbath observance include animal sacrifices? Should it today?

Only if one wants to comply with the law's mandate to keep the sabbath holy as described therein.

 

[VictorC]

It is entirely reasonable to question your motive, as I don't understand why you aren't interested in the blessing of the seventh day, a blessing that is as permanent as the rest itself. Why would you want the sabbath instead of it?

I'm curious about your reasoning, icedragon.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

i want both, not either or

 

[Byfaithalone1]

i want both, not either or

Both of what?

BFA

 

[VictorC]

i want both, not either or

I have come to conclude that they're mutually exclusive. The blessing of the seventh day of creation is inherently 28 times greater than the sabbath, and that number grows greater with each passing day on account of its permanence. I prefer the seventh day over the sabbath any day.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

i am sorry you have come to that conclusion, i can tell you from experiance they are not.

 

[Byfaithalone1]

i am sorry you have come to that conclusion, i can tell you from experiance they are not.

Sorry to butt in. Just wanted to say I'm happy that your special time each Saturday is a blessing for you and that I certainly would not want to rob you of that blessing. OK. I'm butting out now.

BFA

 

[VictorC]

i am sorry you have come to that conclusion, i can tell you from experiance they are not.

The conclusion I arrived at was done using Scripture's testimony, and that is what I have based my posts to you on. What do you mean by an experience that is contrary to Scripture?

 

[Adventist Dissident]

well since you've proven not to be able to interpret scripture very well we should doubt you conclusion

 

[VictorC]

well since you've proven not to be able to interpret scripture very well we should doubt you conclusion

It should be noted that you haven't offered any comments about what you found wrong with the implied interpretation I provided. In addition, you appealed to a personal experience that is outside the testimony of Scripture and remains undefined. Neither of these have been addressed, and I still have my curiosity concerning your motive to dismiss the permanent blessing in God's rest (the seventh day) unanswered as well.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

It should be noted that you haven't offered any comments about what you found wrong with the implied interpretation I provided

you have not provided any other text othern deut 4 and 5 and i proptly effectively counter your invalid interperetation.

. In addition, you appealed to a personal experience that is outside the testimony of Scripture and remains undefined.

And they over came by the blood of the lamb and the word of there testiomy.
the personal encounters and testimonies of christ and his blessings are proof in and of themselves. when jesus told peter to go find the fish with the coin, it was the going and looking that verifed the words of the Lord. peter own experiance confirmed what was spoken. same with the leper and the blind man who was told to wash his eye, his blessing was obtained by obediance. and that obediance proved the words were true. his own experiance testifed the validity was true. so you can't say personal experiance is invalid. personal experiance confirms that the blessing of the 7th day is still there to all who believe. the lord's presence is in the day. no believer in Christ need worry that the blessing of the sabbath is different the the blessing of christ, they are one and the same. it is just more of Jesus. so how can that be a bad thing. i want all of God people, including you victor, to have as much of the blessings of chist a possible, i am sorry you want to cheat yourself of one of Gods blessings, but that is your own issue. if you don't what it that is your problem, if you want to deny other the blessing then that is everyones problem.


Neither of these have been addressed, and I

still have my curiosity concerning your motive to dismiss the permanent blessing in God's rest (the seventh day) unanswered as well.

this is just pure fiction on your part there is no dismissing of the permanate rest. this is just foolishness and not worthy of any further comment.

 

[VictorC]

you have not provided any other text othern deut 4 and 5 and i proptly effectively counter your invalid interperetation.

We've examined these two chapters of Deuteronomy, as well as Genesis 2, Mark 2, and Hebrews 4. We may have used citations from other Scriptures as well, but this conversation has stagnated enough at times that I don't remember everywhere we have studied. Many of the responses that you have provided have not answered the points raised to your attention, and there is nowhere that you have shown any interpretation nor Scripture invalid.

And they over came by the blood of the lamb and the word of there testiomy.
the personal encounters and testimonies of christ and his blessings are proof in and of themselves. when jesus told peter to go find the fish with the coin, it was the going and looking that verifed the words of the Lord. peter own experiance confirmed what was spoken. same with the leper and the blind man who was told to wash his eye, his blessing was obtained by obediance. and that obediance proved the words were true. his own experiance testifed the validity was true. so you can't say personal experiance is invalid. personal experiance confirms that the blessing of the 7th day is still there to all who believe.

I was asking what your personal experience that nullified Scripture was, and in return I see that there really isn't anything that you have experienced. This is merely ramblings unrelated to the topic.

the lord's presence is in the day. no believer in Christ need worry that the blessing of the sabbath is different the the blessing of christ, they are one and the same. it is just more of Jesus. so how can that be a bad thing. i want all of God people, including you victor, to have as much of the blessings of chist a possible, i am sorry you want to cheat yourself of one of Gods blessings, but that is your own issue. if you don't what it that is your problem, if you want to deny other the blessing then that is everyones problem.

I'm not intent to deprive you of a perceived blessing, but it isn't actually germane to the topic of this thread, and you don't seem to acknowledge that most of us have the blessing of the seventh day that was never found in the sabbath, and we aren't bound to what Scripture describes as a shadow of the reality that is inherently superior.

To this day you have not acknowledged that the seventh day of creation came long before the sabbath did, and I am personally an advocate of the permanent rest from the seventh day that remained a promise yet to attain by those who already had the sabbath - and this was a point that was shown to you from Hebrews 4:1-4. Scripture's testimony is that the blessing given to the seventh day is vastly different than the blessing that was bestowed on the sabbath; the seventh day's rest and blessing is eternal since its origin, while the sabbath was only one day out of a week and antithetical to permanent.

this is just pure fiction on your part there is no dismissing of the permanate rest. this is just foolishness and not worthy of any further comment.

Why then do you advocate the sabbath in its place?
Allow me to boil this discussion down to its bare essence:

• Genesis records the seventh day as God's rest that has never ended, and Hebrews 4 affirms this.
• Jesus stated that the sabbath was made for man (Mark 2:27), and this alone sets it apart as a created entity separate from the seventh day of creation. Moses documents the sabbath's origin with the manna experience, and the law consistently delineates the sabbath apart from the creation account of the seventh day.

These are plain facts that aren't subject to interpretation, and what I'm finding is that you seem to treat the seventh day as if it were the same as the sabbath. I believe this assumption you have is the reason you don't understand what either BFA or I have posted to you. The manner in which you interchange "seventh day" and "sabbath" in most of your posts supports this perception of confusing the two with each other.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

We've examined these two chapters of Deuteronomy, as well as Genesis 2, Mark 2, and Hebrews 4. We may have used citations from other Scriptures as well, but this conversation has stagnated enough at times that I don't remember everywhere we have studied. Many of the responses that you have provided have not answered the points raised to your attention, and there is nowhere that you have shown any interpretation nor Scripture invalid.

I was asking what your personal experience that nullified Scripture was, and in return I see that there really isn't anything that you have experienced. This is merely ramblings unrelated to the topic.

I'm not intent to deprive you of a perceived blessing, but it isn't actually germane to the topic of this thread, and you don't seem to acknowledge that most of us have the blessing of the seventh day that was never found in the sabbath, and we aren't bound to what Scripture describes as a shadow of the reality that is inherently superior.

To this day you have not acknowledged that the seventh day of creation came long before the sabbath did, and I am personally an advocate of the permanent rest from the seventh day that remained a promise yet to attain by those who already had the sabbath - and this was a point that was shown to you from Hebrews 4:1-4. Scripture's testimony is that the blessing given to the seventh day is vastly different than the blessing that was bestowed on the sabbath; the seventh day's rest and blessing is eternal since its origin, while the sabbath was only one day out of a week and antithetical to permanent.

Why then do you advocate the sabbath in its place?

Allow me to boil this discussion down to its bare essence:

• Genesis records the seventh day as God's rest that has never ended, and Hebrews 4 affirms this.
• Jesus stated that the sabbath was made for man (Mark 2:27), and this alone sets it apart as a created entity separate from the seventh day of creation. Moses documents the sabbath's origin with the manna experience, and the law consistently delineates the sabbath apart from the creation account of the seventh day.

These are plain facts that aren't subject to interpretation, and what I'm finding is that you seem to treat the seventh day as if it were the same as the sabbath. I believe this assumption you have is the reason you don't understand what either BFA or I have posted to you. The manner in which you interchange "seventh day" and "sabbath" in most of your posts supports this perception of confusing the two with each other.

you are so easy. never know when to let things die. we are now rehashing old stuff. it is time to end this. you will never admit you are wrong or that people can see it a differently. you will go on preptually fighting even if it gets you no where. you must always have the last word. i got what i came here for and leave more convince then ever you do not have a leg to stand on. that is the problem with your approach. it dosen't change a thing. I am putting you back on ignore. for it is of no value to contiune this line of conversation.

 

[VictorC]

you are so easy. never know when to let things die. we are now rehashing old stuff. it is time to end this. you will never admit you are wrong or that people can see it a differently. you will go on preptually fighting even if it gets you no where. you must always have the last word. i got what i came here for and leave more convince then ever you do not have a leg to stand on. that is the problem with your approach. it dosen't change a thing. I am putting you back on ignore. for it is of no value to contiune this line of conversation.

You're certainly welcome to handle this conversation as you wish.
But as long as you're unable to unravel Scripture's testimony to arrive at a different conclusion, you don't have grounds to call my conclusion wrong.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

can't see you