Rules adjustment

[murjahel]

Very respectfully this is no where near correct... besides it misses the greater point that water baptism is commanded to be done but this thread is not the place for that discussion... care to join my peanut gallery thread to discuss it? seriously

that discussion is against the rules... for it portrays water baptism as something necessary for salvation... it needs removed...

 

[Edial]

Murjahel, PLEASE read what he said.

He said if the thread is closed he will open another one.

This does NOT mean he is planning on breaking rules.
This means he wants to continue discussing water baptism.

 

[ByTheSpirit]

The rule defines what a thread can and cannot say... a thread is closed not at my veto, but at the disobedience to the rule on teaching that water baptism is mandatory for salvation...

this a quote still in an open thread, that this person above says if closed he will start another thread and say the same things... is that going to be allowed, Edial??

read what he said there:

We have seen from other passages that faith must accompany baptism for baptism to be effective:

1 Peter 3:21 English Standard Version (ESV)

21 Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ,

Let's break down this last verse from Peter to gain a better understanding of what he is writing to us. You see if you remove the portions contained within the commas (which are added only to give a brief explanation) we get this:

Baptism... now saves you... through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

It is through your faith in Jesus as the Son of God (Romans 1:4) that we are saved in baptism. This is what Jesus was saying in Mark 16:16 (quoted above). Those who BELIEVE & are BAPTIZED will be saved...

But what about the other half of the scripture, doesn't that prove only belief is necessary?

Not quite. You see, if someone doesn't believe then nothing can save them. Baptism alone doesn't save you. That is why Jesus left baptism out of that last half the equation.

Also, what does the scripture say is necessary? Let's not focus on what is not, but what Jesus says is.

"Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved"

Again, Jesus says salvation comes to those who:

1) Believe
&
2) are baptized.
That is the scripture.​

Those statements break the rule we are discussing... Why are we allowing blatant rebellion against it, now... and why has this above quote not been deleted with the rest of his supportive teachings trying to prove this errant idea?

The baptism that saves, mentioned by Peter, is the spiritual baptism that occurs at salvation. The water baptism is the symbolic testimony to what happened at salvation to be portrayed for a witness, not the actual saving feature, but a representation of it.

I very clearly state in that quote you posted that baptism alone (that is as a work) can not save. Besides the fact, baptism is not a work I do. It is something I submit to. I can't baptize myself... I am pretty sure I said in that thread that the power of baptism lay in the faith that supports it. It is a demonstration of faith.

Anyway, I'll let Ed and them decide. If my thread is closed as you desire I will start a new one and reword how I said things. No biggie, I'm not trying to debate with you here. We can discuss it in another place.

 

[murjahel]

Murjahel, PLEASE read what he said.

He said if the thread is closed he will open another one.

This does NOT mean he is planning on breaking rules.
This means he wants to continue discussing water baptism.

Which one of us is reading into what he said... ?

did he say the new thread would not break the rules like you assume?
or
did he say the new thread would break the rules like I assume?

perhaps you ought to ask him who assumed correctly so it can be understood correctly...

 

[geetrue]

You silly people, repent!

resentment definition - Bing

(also called ranklement or bitterness) is the experience of a negative emotion (anger or hatred, for instance) felt as a result of a real or imagined wrong ...

Oswald Chambers said that disciples should have no resentment ...

Kiss and make up ...

 

[Edial]

OK guys.
On this note we are closing this thread.
Thank you all.