Replacement Theology Found in Scripture?

bugkiller · Oct 12, 2012

What is totally awesome is the Christian is graft into the Root (Jesus) and not Israel. Read the text and read what is there.

I do find it rather interesting the Jew must also be graft in. IOW they are not part of the tree.

bugkiller

bugkiller · Oct 12, 2012

The given illustration is nicely done but both examples are wrong. Sorry.

bugkiller

LittleLambofJesus · Oct 13, 2012

LittleLambofJesus said:
The Jewish Jesus Blog: Replacement Theology
Replacement Theology 101

The Jews were not replaced as to a people, their religious system had been replaced.
Their nation had been replaced. The Temple had been replaced. The Sacrifice system had been replaced. The High priesthood had been replaced. This means all Jews must be born again and come into the Kingdom of God or they would have no connection to God at all (John 3:3-5). If they rejected to come into the Kingdom they would all perish. And if they chose to remain in unbelief they would remain cut out of the olive tree as dead branches. I then saw how Gentiles replaced cut off Jews and were added in where they were cut off.

Super Kal said:
that makes sense

A favorite Christian commentator of mine has been labeled "anti-Jewish" and a "replacement theologist" for his view of the religious OC Mosaic Preisthood being replaced by the NC Priesthood of Jesus along the order of Melchizedek.

J Preston Eby, Eby minstry, Eby heresies, Eby writings, Preston Eby, Manifest Sons of God heresy, Latter Rain heresy

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]The anti-semitic MSOG movement that Eby claims to govern his ministry incorrectly and boldly appropriates the title "elect" from that of the remnant of Israel described during the Tribulation's Time of Jacob's Trouble, and applies it to themselves in true Replacement Theology fashion.[/SIZE][/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]Eby's writing ministry includes a monthly message titled KINGDOM BIBLE STUDIES as well as a number of booklets on various subjects. We discuss this subject below.[/SIZE][/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The Royal Priesthood[/FONT][/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]
http://www.kingdombiblestudies.org/priest/RP1.htm

And just what is God's purpose? He declares, "Ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto Me above all people: for all the earth is Mine: and ye shall be unto Me A KINGDOM OF PRIESTS." Since kingship was virtually the only type of government or state known in the ancient world, "kingdom" could well be translated today as a "government" or "state." A GOVERNMENT OF PRIESTS! A PRIESTLY STATE! A HOLY NATION OF PRIESTS! God offered to Israel this glory of being a "kingdom of priests."

[/SIZE][/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]Eby attempts to carry the OT priesthood in Israel to the current day church. This is classical Replacement Theology and incorrectly appropriates the program that God set up for Israel prior to the time of the Cross when Jesus Christ became our priest and mediator between man and God.[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]Eby inserts this new priesthood into the New Testament church in order to support the heretical MSOG theology of latter day apostles and prophets...............[/SIZE][/FONT]

.

James4_14 · Oct 13, 2012

There is no replacement theology.

***Rom 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

bugkiller · Oct 13, 2012

From what I read about Eby material is he is wrong. First as Christian I am not subject to the law (covenant with the COI) spirtually or physically. I did not say go do evil. Sin is still sin. Not being governed by the OC is not sin. The flesh has never been subject to the law according to the words found in my Bible. This is a major problem in the organized church. Sure enough grace is preached, but preformanced to the law is demanded. This is a manipulative control tactic that works based on fear and ignorance. No thank you.

bugkiller

LittleLambofJesus · Oct 13, 2012

bugkiller said:
From what I read about Eby material is he is wrong.
First as Christian I am not subject to the law (covenant with the COI) spirtually or physically. I did not say go do evil. Sin is still sin. Not being governed by the OC is not sin. The flesh has never been subject to the law according to the words found in my Bible. This is a major problem in the organized church. Sure enough grace is preached, but preformanced to the law is demanded. This is a manipulative control tactic that works based on fear and ignorance. No thank you.

bugkiller

I didn't see where Preston Eby implied he or anyone be subject to the OC Law given to the COI or it's priesthood.

..

James4_14 · Oct 13, 2012

bugkiller said:
What is totally awesome is the Christian is graft into the Root (Jesus) and not Israel. Read the text and read what is there.

I do find it rather interesting the Jew must also be graft in. IOW they are not part of the tree.

bugkiller

The Olive Tree DOES represent Israel. The root of the tree is Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and the promises made to them....not Jesus. This is about dispensational blessing in the Kingdom when Christ returns to set up His Kingdom as King over Israel. The Gentiles were graft in to make them jealous.

Our calling did not begin until 63AD when Paul was given a new revelation concerning a new calling. Individual salvation is not in view but the "ekklesia" involved and the blessings thereof. Our calling is bound for the Heaven far above all. That is not the "Kingdom of Heaven" here on earth.

Lion King · Oct 13, 2012

bugkiller said:
What is totally awesome is the Christian is graft into the Root (Jesus) and not Israel. Read the text and read what is there.

I do find it rather interesting the Jew must also be graft in. IOW they are not part of the tree.

bugkiller

I'm not sure on your last statement, though. I thought the Jews were the natural branches and the gentiles were the wild branches grafted into the tree? Are the natural branches not part of the tree?

bugkiller · Oct 13, 2012

Naw the evidence is that both Paul and Peter were preaching to the Gentiles long befor 63 AD.

Romans 11 does not refer to Abraham as the root.

bugkiller

bugkiller · Oct 13, 2012

There are two olive trees being talked about besides the wild olive tree. Jesus is the Root of the olive tree one must be graft into.

If one is going to say every time the tree or olive tree appears they will be confused. The Christian is not graft into Israel. For additional help please read John 10:1-16 epecially v 16 and Ehpesians 2:10-20 with heavy emphasis on v 19. Note that we are not fellowchitizes with Israelites but the saints.

We are not obligated to the covenant made with their fathers.

bugkiller

bugkiller · Oct 13, 2012

Well then I may have misread the post about Eby and the quoted material. I read the bolded part of the post as his material. The OC Priest hood does not carry over to the NC.

Oh BTW did those sooners ever give those horns a lashing.

bugkiller

Frogster · Oct 13, 2012

James4_14 said:
The Olive Tree DOES represent Israel. The root of the tree is Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and the promises made to them....not Jesus. This is about dispensational blessing in the Kingdom when Christ returns to set up His Kingdom as King over Israel. The Gentiles were graft in to make them jealous.

Our calling did not begin until 63AD when Paul was given a new revelation concerning a new calling. Individual salvation is not in view but the "ekklesia" involved and the blessings thereof. Our calling is bound for the Heaven far above all. That is not the "Kingdom of Heaven" here on earth.

our calling, the gentiles, the gospel of gal 3:8, goes back to gen 12:3, all nations, given to abraham the gentile.

Frogster · Oct 13, 2012

Lion King said:
I'm not sure on your last statement, though. I thought the Jews were the natural branches and the gentiles were the wild branches grafted into the tree? Are the natural branches not part of the tree?

both are branches, u have to apply the definition equally.

Frogster · Oct 13, 2012

bugkiller said:
Well then I may have misread the post about Eby and the quoted material. I read the bolded part of the post as his material. The OC Priest hood does not carry over to the NC.

Oh BTW did those sooners ever give those horns a lashing.

bugkiller

LittleLambofJesus · Oct 13, 2012

bugkiller said:
Well then I may have misread the post about Eby and the quoted material. I read the bolded part of the post as his material. The OC Priest hood does not carry over to the NC.

Oh BTW did those sooners ever give those horns a lashing.

bugkiller

We made steaks and burgers from the Longhorns' carcasses

James4_14 · Oct 14, 2012

Frogster said:
our calling, the gentiles, the gospel of gal 3:8, goes back to gen 12:3, all nations, given to abraham the gentile.

ABRAM was a Gentile until he crossed the Euphrates and his name was changed to Abraham. It was not until his father, Terah, died that he did this. When he crossed the Euphrates he put off the "old man" and put on the new. The fact that God gave up the world (Romans 1:17-26) to unGodliness necessitated this call (of Abraham) so He would have a people to His name.

All through the Acts period and associated epistles Israel was first and foremost. The four Gospels were a continuation of the Old Testament with one great exception as seen in Hebrews 1:1 in the fact God spoke IN SON to the Hebrews:
***Matt 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
***Rom 15:8 Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision (Israel) for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers:
It this particular time period of Acts the Gentiles were not Israelites.
At Acts 28 Israel was divorced. Please read this chapter without fail and understand.
Please take note of the change here:
***Acts 28:20 For this cause therefore have I called for you, to see you, and to speak with you: because that for the hope of Israel I am bound with this chain.
That was Paul's calling at that time before Acts 28. He was in prison. When the representatives of the Jews in Rome rejected his plea to them as seen in Acts 28 his mission and message changed to:
***Eph 3:1 For this cause I Paul, the prisoner of Jesus Christ for you Gentiles,
Compare:
***Acts 28:28 Be it known therefore unto you, that the salvation (bringing message) of God is sent unto the Gentiles (ethnos...nations), and that they will hear it.

These "Gentiles" are not the Gentiles as opposed to Israel, for now Israel is numbered among the nations.
Paul wrote 7 epistles post Acts 28. They are Ephesians, Colossians, Philippians, Philemon, 1 and 2 Timothy and Titus.
Paul was given a special revelation concerning our body of believers today. We have nothing in store for us concerning the promises made to Abraham as did Israel. Their promises were for an Earthly Kingdom over which Christ will be King. Our calling is to the heaven far above all:
***Col 3:1-4
1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.
2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.
4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

This is the new relationship. Please note the tenses of the verbs:
***Eph 3:5-6
5 Which in other ages was notmade knownunto the sons of men, as it is now(AD 63...close enough) revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;
6 That (the subject of the revelation is) the Gentiles should befellowheirs(joint-heirs..Gr. sunkleronomos),and of the same body(members of a joint body.Gr. sussomos [only here]..and NOT joined to an existing Jewish body but of twain..ONE..NEW..MAN!),and (joint-)partakers (Gr. Summetochosjoint partakers) of his promise in Christ by the gospel:
That is a three-fold equality now. Israel was divorced.Lo-Ammi (Hosea 1:9) at Acts 28:28 and distinctions are wiped out! There are just believers and unbelievers today.

***Eph 2:12-16
12 That at that time ye (Gentiles)were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
13 But now (AD 63)in Christ Jesus ye (Gentiles) who sometimes (once)were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
14 For he is our peace, who hath madeboth (Jew and Gentile).one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition (death to any Gentile that passed this stone barrier) between us;
15 Having abolished in his flesh (His death) the enmity, even the law of (dogmatic) commandments contained in ordinances; for to make(Gr. poiema-CREATE) in himself of twain (of the twoJew and Gentile).. one.new!!!. man,.so making peace;
16 And that he might reconcile both (Jew and Gentile) unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity (of the law of dogmatic commandments) thereby (by the cross):
***2 Cor 5:17.old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
The relationship is like a new heaven and new Earth.
Our calling was top secret until revealed to Paul in 63AD:
***Eph 3:8-9
8 Unto me (Paul and Paul only), who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I (Paul) should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

The difference IS in the dispensations.

This is not replacement theology. When God is ready we will be manifested to the Heaven far above all and He WILL!! turn back to Israel. He has made them promises and He WILL!! keep them.
Replacement theology makes God a liar.

bugkiller · Oct 14, 2012

LittleLambofJesus said:
We made steaks and burgers from the Longhorns' carcasses

Could I say without getting into trouble - shame on you but at least this year they are good for something. Maybe it will be our turn next year. wood and canvas is a little tough to eat though.

Nothing like a little friendly teasing. I expect a return engagement, friend.

bugkiller

Lion King · Oct 14, 2012

Frogster said:
both are branches, u have to apply the definition equally.

Yes, both the Israelites and the Gentiles are branches of the olive tree, but the Jews are the natural branches, are they not?

MamaZ · Oct 14, 2012

LinkH said:
Let's not confuse the promise to be heir of the world with God's covenant with Israel.

Consider Deuteronomy 18
17 The Lord said to me: What they say is good. 18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put my words in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him. 19 I myself will call to account anyone who does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name.
(NIV)

How will God approach the Israelite who does not believe the Prophet, like unto Moses, the prophet named Yeshua. Will He say to them, you are no longer Israel, and therefore this passage does not apply to you. Does God only apply this passage to the church now, since the church is Israel?

No, God made a covenant with Israel, and if a Jew does not believe in Yeshua, God will hold Him to account.

Why would Paul have told the Galatians that if they were to be circumcised, they would take upon themselves the obligation to obey the whole law if the law had been abrogated and the covenant were not still in effect? Why would Romans still speak of Jews being judged by the law?

Fortunately for the nation of Israel, the Bible contains promises of God restoring the nation after they had sinned. According to Romans 11, we are in a time now where the Gentiles are being brought it. It was God's plan to include Gentiles, not just Israelis, in the body of Messiah. Through Israel's disobedience, Gentiles are coming in.

God is using us (I am of Gentile descent as far as I know) to provoke Israel to jealousy. Therefore, He still cares for Israel. One day, the blindness will be lifted from Israel, and God will provide salvation for that nation.

There is salvation in no other name but the name of Jesus (Iesous, Yeshua). No flesh shall be saved by the works of the law.

How do you explain what you are arguing in light of Romans 11.

God has already provided salvation to Isreal. Christ Jesus the King of Kings and Lord of Lords. There will be one body. If you read further into the scripture you will read where God divorced Isreal. Hosea I believe. not too sure though. This is why there are two covenants. The Old and the New. you read in revelations about the 144 thousand that are predestined as well as we all are. We also read that not all who say they are Isreal are really. The 144000 are Jews. God still loves Isreal. But now they have to come through the only door and gate. Christ.

Frogster · Oct 14, 2012

Lion King said:
Yes, both the Israelites and the Gentiles are branches of the olive tree, but the Jews are the natural branches, are they not?

overpress here, a branch is a branch.

besidess, it's not about flesh anymore, it's about a new creation, 2 cor 5:17.

not flesh.

. Rom 9:8 This means that it is not the children of the flesh who are the children of God, but the children of the promise are counted as offspring.

Replacement Theology Found in Scripture?

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

Veteran

Well-Known Member

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

Veteran

Veni, vidi, vici

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Galatians is the best!

Galatians is the best!

Galatians is the best!

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

Veteran

Well-Known Member

Veni, vidi, vici

MamaZ

Guest

Galatians is the best!

Similar threads

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency