Religion doesn't make sense to me anymore

[Rajni]

If so many different christians believe so many different things, then some of us must have it wrong? Will we be punished for it?

While I'm no longer a practicing Christian, I spent most of my life as a Christian of one sort or another.

Your question about punishment reminds me of another forum here on CF you might be interested in checking out, titled Unorthodox Theology. The punishment factor (i.e., "hell") is, and has been, discussed extensively over there; I used to post there a lot myself.

Long story short, there's a small branch of Christianity (Christian Universalism) that does not believe in endless torment after death, and that everyone will be saved. Elaboration on that theme, however, is only permitted over there at the Unorthodox section, so if you're interested in looking into it, that's the forum check out (or send me a PM, either way!)

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[CounselorForChrist]

I think most christians are the wrong denomination. I notice lots of people leave christianity that tend to be in more... "out there" denominations. Those people usually are tired of extreme views. I am non-denominational and I RARELY hear of anyone leaving because we go by the bible. Not any other book or by what some person says or anything else like that.

On a side note most people who leave I notice are angry and/or depressed. They just don't seem to have that much faith in God. Instead they worry about what every other christians does or thinks even though we are to focus on God, not what others thing/say/do.

While most people would say "Its easy to say that unless you been there!", trust me I've been there and beyond.

 

[EagerBeaverElle]

I certainly don't want to leave God! I couldn't imagine not being able to pray to Him when i need to. I just don't agree with the bible (or at least alot of things in it). To me it just leaves no room for us to make judgement calls. I feel like when i read the bible and i don't agree with what it says that i hurt my faith and i feel further away from God.

 

[EagerBeaverElle]

Just another question...in simple terms, is the bible a rule book or merely meant as guidance?

 

[Ukrainia]

Thanks for the very thorough reply ukrania. I would like explain my reasoning for rejecting the biblical viewpoints on the various social issues, but it would take all night.

If so many different christians believe so many different things, then some of us must have it wrong? Will we be punished for it?

First, I think it's good for church bodies to adhere to teachings on which they stand firm on. If Christianity is true, some things are of course therefore not true. If Christianity is the best way to know God and to live one's life, than it follows that people have made false idols and often live their lives unethically.

However, it does not then follow, that people should not question or disagree with church bodies. It does not follow that church bodies should ostracize those who have questions and concerns regarding church theology. And it is neither loving nor Biblical to say that only one very narrow interpretation the Bible is required or you’ll go to hell.

I do think a Biblical message is one that does place Jesus first. I don’t think their such a thing as Christianity without Christ as Savior. Beyond at, obviously, I have my own theological positions but I also think there is a wide range of disagreement that can be had without making the assumption that there is something wrong with such people or that such people should be punished. If the message of Christ emphasizes love, debating one’s theological ideas should also be done in a manner conforming with that. That doesn’t mean one can’t call a spade a spade – Jesus himself had choice words for the Pharisees and others. But even a stern rebuke can be done in a loving manner.

 

[Tnmusicman]

Thank you for your response Mark. I am just so confused. Is it wrong to question the Bible? Our church teaches that we should believe like children and not question the word of God. But I honestly can't do that. I can't force myself to think like a child. And our pastors at church are experts at avoiding hard questions-its impossible to get a definitive answer out of them! I just cant be another mindless christian zombie!

The word of God says "TEST everything and hold fast to what is true" so I would listen to the Bible quicker than the church.

 

[Amber Bird]

Just another question...in simple terms, is the bible a rule book or merely meant as guidance?

My point of view is this. Since the Bible was compiled by councils of sinful mortals who claimed divine inspiration in electing what of God's words were fit for inclusion in it, thereby acting as editors-in-chief of God, it's to be taken as a guidebook.
Because if it was a rule book a lot of Fundamentalists would find themselves in prison for obeying God's law over that of man's.


Also, if it were a rule book I don't think the spirit would have insured these markers that imply it is more to be seen as a guidebook, would remain in print within it. Especially Thessalonians 5.


I think if someone was meant to obey and believe everything, including scripture without question, then the scripture would not advise the faithful to do just the opposite.


1 Thessalonians 5:21 Test everything. Hold on to the good.



Jeremiah 23:16 This is what the LORD Almighty says: "Do not listen to what the prophets are prophesying to you; they fill you with false hopes. They speak visions from their own minds, not from the mouth of the LORD.

 

[SharonL]

There is nothing wrong with your thinking. God knows your heart and you sound like you have a heart for God.

The best thing for you to do at this moment in time is to just put aside all the church rules and laws and turn to the open arms of Jesus for a personal relationship. The Bible is the Word of God - mis-understood as it is, but the Bible was written over a period of 1,600 years with the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

The Bible tells us that Jesus walk by your side and will never leave you, He is closer than your shadow and a heartbeat away. You can talk to him all day long, He always hears you. A church has no right to ask you not to join another church. You need to go where you are comfortable and if you are not comfortable in church, just put your hand in the hand of Jesus and let the HOly Spirit guide you until you can find a place where you are comfortable.

You don't have to be on bended knee with Bible in hand to worship - your daily walk is worship, just let the Joy of the Lord shine through your spirit and ask the Holy Spirit to lead you - you will be fine - this period of time where you are questioning just may be the leading of the Holy Spirit to get you where He wants you to be and can do God's work.

Don't think you are losing your soul because you have some questions, but don't let the enemy tell you that the Bible is not God's Word either - the answers are there, just take your time in seeking the answers. God is patient and does not want you to accept the church if you are uncomfortable in their teachings, you are uncomfortable for a reason - just let the Holy Spirit show you the reason.

 

[EagerBeaverElle]

Thank you so much for your kind words Sharon. I feel much better after reading everybody's posts. Im certain now that God has a place and purpose for free thinkers as well. I just love the way He brings people together! Thank you everyone goodnight

 

[SithDoughnut]

Here's the problem I'm seeing: you're focusing on what you think you should believe rather than what you actually believe. Focusing on what you "should" believe is pointless; you can't force yourself to believe something that you don't. Instead, it far more productive (and probably healthier) to work out exactly what you believe right now, and then figure out if those beliefs fit the world around you. That doesn't mean you should stop being a Christian, but it doesn't mean you should force yourself to be one either. You are what you are, and no amount of stress is going to change that.

Now I'm an atheist, so I obviously don't believe in God, but I figure that if God exists and he wants you to believe in certain things, you'll end up believing them one way or another. If he doesn't exist, or would rather you do this yourself, then you'll find your own way to a conclusion without all this pressure hanging over you. It's a win-win situation, really.

Your issue is less complex than you might think. All you need to do is stop, work out what you really believe, and then you can learn about the things you're not sure about. I suspect, given your OP, that you already have a pretty decent idea of where you stand - now you just need to accept that.

 

[Tomas de Torquemada]

I am a 22 year old girl, brought up in a christian community and have always followed the 'church rules'. But the more I learn about all the atrocities that have been commited by 'men of God' throughout history the more I am beginning to question everything christianity stands for.

I still believe in God and our saviour Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit, but i cannot reconcile the Holy trinity with religion. Religion is not holy it is man made! The bible frustrates me! Its full of contradictions and so sexist! And most christians I know are judgemental and arrogant and do not have the slightest bit of compassion or tollerance.

And it is simply impossible to be happy if i am constantly feeling anguish and guilt for every sin i commit. I am pro-choice. I don't believe in marriage. I dont believe being gay is wrong. I DONT believe in women being submissive to men. And i will NOT repent for these beliefs! Does that make me a sinner condemned to hell for all eternity??? Please help me find answers.

For the purposes of this forum, we have defined christian as nicene-compliant. You are not; so in the parlance of the forum, you are not a christian.


What it does make you is a pretty standard issue Gnostic. Its kind of impressive how every time that heresy is resurrected it always seems to take on the same form.

 

[Tomas de Torquemada]

As for whether or not your obstinacy damns you, the standard rubrics tell us yes, it does.

 

[Tinker Grey]

For the purposes of this forum, we have defined christian as nicene-compliant. You are not; so in the parlance of the forum, you are not a christian.


What it does make you is a pretty standard issue Gnostic. Its kind of impressive how every time that heresy is resurrected it always seems to take on the same form.

As for whether or not your obstinacy damns you, the standard rubrics tell us yes, it does.

If I understood her post correctly, she does believe in the Holy Trinity. She doesn't see how it fits with religion.

I don't anything else even touches on Nicene compliance. Since nothing else touches on it, and she is NOT denying the Trinity AFAICT, then she IS a Christian and is NOT "damned".

 

[Tomas de Torquemada]

If I understood her post correctly, she does believe in the Holy Trinity. She doesn't see how it fits with religion.

Ah. My error. Misread her first post. You are considered a christian for the purposes of this forum. Your denomination could best be described by the historical Gnostics.

As to whether there is forgiveness without contrition, the rubrics say don't count on it. And to count on it, is a sin of presumption.

 

[EagerBeaverElle]

Thank you Tinker Grey! Sorry for any confusion.

 

[Puptart]

Your OP is consonant with many liberal Christians. I'd recommend getting some support in the sub-forum "Whosoever will may come" (WWMC) up the in the denominational section of the Christians Only section.

This.

 

[Rajni]

As to whether there is forgiveness without contrition, the rubrics say don't count on it. And to count on it, is a sin of presumption.

Hmmm... I seem to recall Pope John Paul II expressing numerous times a far more positive outlook in the soteriological department.

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[Tomas de Torquemada]

Our positions are not in disagreement. We do not presume to limit God's mercy. But from what we know, there is no forgiveness without contrition.

 

[CounselorForChrist]

Also I'd have this moved the Christian Advice section since only christians can post in it. Having it here means non believers will try to motivate you to leave christianity.

 

[Tinker Grey]

Also I'd have this moved the Christian Advice section since only christians can post in it. Having it here means non believers will try to motivate you to leave christianity.

Interesting. As I count it, 6 non-Christians have posted and not one has attempted to motivate her to leave Christianity.