Reliability of Jay Dyer

[ArmyMatt]

What's a little heresy between friends, like Fr Kimel and company?

well, Fr Kimel is hurting, so I wouldn’t lump them in the same category

 

[abacabb3]

well, Fr Kimel is hurting, so I wouldn’t lump them in the same category

Hurting? I hope he is not sick. I don't understand the reference.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Hurting? I hope he is not sick. I don't understand the reference.

his son took his own life, hence Fr Aiden listening to DBH’s nonsense

 

[Justin-H.S.]

DBH’s nonsense

Oh? DBH is nonsense?

Interesting. I liked his Atheist Delusion book. It was much better than Dawkin's God Delusion. But, I have heard DBH wasn't very reliable when it comes to Orthodoxy because of his...tendency to push long dead heresies like Universalism.

 

[ArmyMatt]

Oh? DBH is nonsense?

Interesting. I liked his Atheist Delusion book. It was much better than Dawkin's God Delusion. But, I have heard DBH wasn't very reliable when it comes to Orthodoxy because of his...tendency to push long dead heresies like Universalism.

yes, he’s nonsense. doesn’t mean everything from him is wrong or whatever. and his apologetic stuff against atheists is pretty good.

 

[Justin-H.S.]

A recent debate. Dyer debates “Pastor P” on sola scriptura. Dyer is like Orthodoxwiki personified.

 

[ArmyMatt]

thanks, will give this a look

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I know this opinion might be about as popular as the Snickers bar floating in the swimming pool, but honestly, why do we all have this need to have "A guy" to go to online? Why do we need "Orthodox influencers" of a sort? It seems like all of us are always yearning for a talking head on YouTube or we run to AFR. Can't we just read the Fathers? Do we need the Father Heers's of the world? Can't we just appeal to antiquity and prayer and our parish priest, etc.? We were talking about this at church a few weeks back, a former deacon I know who is our choir guy now. He says to all the young converts----Stay off the #amn internet, kids! For the love of Pete!"

 

[Cody J Dunbar]

I know this opinion might be about as popular as the Snickers bar floating in the swimming pool, but honestly, why do we all have this need to have "A guy" to go to online? Why do we need "Orthodox influencers" of a sort? It seems like all of us are always yearning for a talking head on YouTube or we run to AFR. Can't we just read the Fathers? Do we need the Father Heers's of the world? Can't we just appeal to antiquity and prayer and our parish priest, etc.? We were talking about this at church a few weeks back, a former deacon I know who is our choir guy now. He says to all the young converts----Stay off the #amn internet, kids! For the love of Pete!"

Who said it's about having a guy on the internet to turn to? These "Orthodox influencers" bring people to orthodoxy. Most people here in America at least don't know Orthodoxy exists or who the church fathers are, for that matter. So the likelihood that they are going to visit a parish and talk to a priest or start reading the fathers is slim to none. A lot of folks hear about orthodoxy for the first time online. They may come for one of the online personalities, but if they are truly seeking the Lord, then they stay for the right reasons. If not, they get drowned out by the real church. As far as I am concerned, I don't think it matters why people come in the door. It's why they stay that is important.

On another note, I know quite a few people who could learn a thing or two from these "internet types." Since I converted, I have noticed that many Orthodox people are weak when it comes to apologetics. The ones who are not are usually converts themselves. The popular Influencers are typically popular for this reason because they are good at what they do, and they relate to people who are discovering orthodoxy. I know this thread is about dyer, but there are plenty of great examples to point to that don't have the same issues he does.

 

[Justin-H.S.]

I found Orthodoxy through YouTube because I was searching for the true church that Christ built. It was only then that I sought out a parish (which providentially happened to be five miles from home). I never would’ve even known to look for an Orthodox parish unless I had been introduced to it online.

Now, that I am Orthodox I find myself getting away from online Orthodoxy more and more. But, I still watch some videos here and there because I’m a sensor and respond better to that medium.

Online Orthodoxy is good for “cramming.” We in the states (especially in rural areas) feel like we’ve been left behind mired in a milieu of Protestant and Catholic culture that there’s a bunch of info we missed out on. This being the Information Age, what better way to discover the true Church than through the Internet? At least we are using the internet to find Orthodoxy rather than watching cat videos nonstop.

There’s an elitism of the people who found Orthodoxy through other means vs. the unwashed masses who find it online.

 

[Cody J Dunbar]

Yeah, I mean, I didn't find it online I found it through a friend who found it online. He was teaching apologetics at several different protestant churches. He told me that whenever he had a hard question or the was something he couldn't make sense of, he would watch a dude named Fr. Spyridon. eventually, he made the discernment that if he was turning to Orthodox sources for all the answers and guidance then why wasn't he Orthodox? He became a catechumen rapidly after that realization. A lot of protestants have similar experiences.

On another note, as Justin said, I would rather watch videos on orthodoxy than spend my time watching dumb videos or watching TV. This could be a topic of its own, having nothing to do with Dyer.

 

[ArmyMatt]

I know this opinion might be about as popular as the Snickers bar floating in the swimming pool, but honestly, why do we all have this need to have "A guy" to go to online? Why do we need "Orthodox influencers" of a sort? It seems like all of us are always yearning for a talking head on YouTube or we run to AFR. Can't we just read the Fathers? Do we need the Father Heers's of the world? Can't we just appeal to antiquity and prayer and our parish priest, etc.? We were talking about this at church a few weeks back, a former deacon I know who is our choir guy now. He says to all the young converts----Stay off the #amn internet, kids! For the love of Pete!"

I dunno that it’s a need, just the most common way info is shared. social media, podcasts, and the blogosphere just kinda moved folks in that direction.

welcome back, by the way.

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Who said it's about having a guy on the internet to turn to? These "Orthodox influencers" bring people to orthodoxy. Most people here in America at least don't know Orthodoxy exists or who the church fathers are, for that matter. So the likelihood that they are going to visit a parish and talk to a priest or start reading the fathers is slim to none. A lot of folks hear about orthodoxy for the first time online. They may come for one of the online personalities, but if they are truly seeking the Lord, then they stay for the right reasons. If not, they get drowned out by the real church. As far as I am concerned, I don't think it matters why people come in the door. It's why they stay that is important.

On another note, I know quite a few people who could learn a thing or two from these "internet types." Since I converted, I have noticed that many Orthodox people are weak when it comes to apologetics. The ones who are not are usually converts themselves. The popular Influencers are typically popular for this reason because they are good at what they do, and they relate to people who are discovering orthodoxy. I know this thread is about dyer, but there are plenty of great examples to point to that don't have the same issues he does.

I didn't need YouTube to find the Faith. I found it in a Catholic bookstore, a book by Father John Meyendorff. The Holy Spirit had sent me through a journey of discontent with Catholicism for years, and one history book after another compelled me away from the church I grew up in. I'm not anti-YouTube. I watch it daily. And I've watched plenty of Orthodox folks on there. But at my parish, we see a lot of misconceptions, strange ideas, and very un-Orthodox thinking coming to young people, and 9 times out of 10 it comes from these influencer folks. Many of the young people in my parish didn't come to our church after they heard some influencer online. They came by word of mouth. I guess in some quarters of this country there are still people who talk and read. Who knew?!

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

Yeah, I mean, I didn't find it online I found it through a friend who found it online. He was teaching apologetics at several different protestant churches. He told me that whenever he had a hard question or the was something he couldn't make sense of, he would watch a dude named Fr. Spyridon. eventually, he made the discernment that if he was turning to Orthodox sources for all the answers and guidance then why wasn't he Orthodox? He became a catechumen rapidly after that realization. A lot of protestants have similar experiences.

On another note, as Justin said, I would rather watch videos on orthodoxy than spend my time watching dumb videos or watching TV. This could be a topic of its own, having nothing to do with Dyer.

Father Spyridon is pretty solid. I've listened to him mannnnny times. Maybe it's me becoming a curmudgeon the older I get, but I like to investigate things myself. I see people coming into forums like this asking questions they could easily read up on or, heck, Google, and they just ask in here or go to YouTube. I remember reading hundreds upon hundreds of pages through books I bought or ordered, and I learned so much on top of what I was looking for all along.

I think you're right, though, that watching an Orthodox priest on YouTube is far better than watching some of the nonsense that's on there. Me? I watch YouTube more for guitar reviews and other things. Travel. But when it comes to theology, I like to go straight to the Fathers, Bible, or saints for most Orthodox inquiries. But, I'm a throwback I suppose. Generation X. What're ya gonna do!?

 

[gurneyhalleck1]

I found Orthodoxy through YouTube because I was searching for the true church that Christ built. It was only then that I sought out a parish (which providentially happened to be five miles from home). I never would’ve even known to look for an Orthodox parish unless I had been introduced to it online.

Now, that I am Orthodox I find myself getting away from online Orthodoxy more and more. But, I still watch some videos here and there because I’m a sensor and respond better to that medium.

Online Orthodoxy is good for “cramming.” We in the states (especially in rural areas) feel like we’ve been left behind mired in a milieu of Protestant and Catholic culture that there’s a bunch of info we missed out on. This being the Information Age, what better way to discover the true Church than through the Internet? At least we are using the internet to find Orthodoxy rather than watching cat videos nonstop.

There’s an elitism of the people who found Orthodoxy through other means vs. the unwashed masses who find it online.

Orthodoxy five miles from home. I can't fathom such a blessing! Mine is around 55......

 

[Justin-H.S.]

Orthodoxy five miles from home. I can't fathom such a blessing! Mine is around 55......

God provides to each accordingly.

Also, it helps to live in an area that saw a lot of immigration from Eastern Europe.