Rejection of Mary as your mediator (2)

[LittleLambofJesus]

Originally Posted by Albion
But EVERYONE considers her to be significant. What I was cautioning about was kiting or linking these things together and then proclaiming that the one requires a belief in the next.

I don't believe that is true, as I don't consider her that significant in relation to all the people in the Bible.
The Muslims mention her quite a bit, I am not really a big fan of Islam. How does their version of the "mary" stack up with the Bible's version? Peace.

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-religion/0701730/posts


When Mary is born, the mother says: And I consecrate her with all of her posterity under thy protection, O Lord, against Satan!"
The Qu'ran passes over Joseph in the life of Mary, but the Muslim tradition knows his name and has some familiarity with him. In this tradition, Joseph is made to speak to Mary, who is a virgin. As he inquired how she conceived Jesus without a father, Mary answered:

 

[Asinner]

that can't be answered in a one off. And I'm really not sure where you're going with this. Better to speak your piece, instead of a word game.

I want to know who you believe Christ is. No word game, UB. It is a question that is relevant to this thread and can be answered in one sentence.

Love,
Christina

 

[Uphill Battle]

I want to know who you believe Christ is. No word game, UB. It is a question that is relevant to this thread and can be answered in one sentence.

Love,
Christina

Son of God, Messiah, Alpha and Omega, fully God, fully Man, wonderful councilor, the lamb that takes away the sin of the world.....

I really don't know what it is you're looking for. There are so many things that Christ IS.

 

[Asinner]

Son of God, Messiah, Alpha and Omega, fully God, fully Man, wonderful councilor, the lamb that takes away the sin of the world.....

I really don't know what it is you're looking for. There are so many things that Christ IS.

I emboldened what is significant to this discussion.

 

[Uphill Battle]

I emboldened what is significant to this discussion.

which has no bearing on the topic of whether or not Mary could stop the incarnation from happening.

but we've been down this road before.

 

[Asinner]

which has no bearing on the topic of whether or not Mary could stop the incarnation from happening.

but we've been down this road before.

Did Eve have any bearing on eating of the fruit?

 

[Uphill Battle]

Did Eve have any bearing on eating of the fruit?

Irrelevant. Eve is not Mary, Mary is not Eve.

in Eve's example, you have God saying "you shall not."

in Mary's example, you hav eGod saying "this is what's going to happen."

 

[Asinner]

Irrelevant. Eve is not Mary, Mary is not Eve.

in Eve's example, you have God saying "you shall not."

in Mary's example, you hav eGod saying "this is what's going to happen."

Interesting, but my bible doesn't retell it as you do.

 

[Uphill Battle]

Interesting, but my bible doesn't retell it as you do.

luke 1:31 You will be with child and give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus.

luke 1:35The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[c] the Son of God.

near as I can figure it out, the angel never said "If that's alright with you... if not, back to the drawing board.

 

[Asinner]

luke 1:31 You will be with child and give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus.

luke 1:35The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[c] the Son of God.

near as I can figure it out, the angel never said "If that's alright with you... if not, back to the drawing board.

You conveniently skipped her reply.

 

[Asinner]

In context . . .




Luke 1:
26 Now in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent by God to a city of Galilee named Nazareth, 27 to a virgin betrothed to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David. The virgin’s name was Mary. 28 And having come in, the angel said to her, “Rejoice, highly favored one, the Lord is with you; blessed are you among women!”[c]
29 But when she saw him,[d] she was troubled at his saying, and considered what manner of greeting this was. 30 Then the angel said to her, “Do not be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. 31 And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bring forth a Son, and shall call His name JESUS. 32 He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Highest; and the Lord God will give Him the throne of His father David. 33 And He will reign over the house of Jacob forever, and of His kingdom there will be no end.”
34 Then Mary said to the angel, “How can this be, since I do not know a man?”
35 And the angel answered and said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Highest will overshadow you; therefore, also, that Holy One who is to be born will be called the Son of God. 36 Now indeed, Elizabeth your relative has also conceived a son in her old age; and this is now the sixth month for her who was called barren. 37 For with God nothing will be impossible.”
38 Then Mary said, “Behold the maidservant of the Lord! Let it be to me according to your word.” And the angel departed from her.

 

[Athanasias]

explain.

Good question! Veneration of Mary and making her your personal mother is not absolutely necessary for eternal salvation although it is biblical and I feel it should be done just as naturally as Jesus is accepted as our Personal savior. The bible itself also is not absolutely necessary for salvation. Jesus is. So in that sense then no. However, Mary like the bible, points us toward her son and a relationship with him. If there was no Mary there would be no Incarnation of Jesus for us and if there is no incarnation then there would be no crucifixion and no redemption. Biblically speaking Mary's role in salvation history is important and that is why she is the second most studied person int he bible throughout church history over the ages. She is the Mother of Jesus and our Mother biblically. She is the New Davidic Queen. So we should not hesitate to venerate her run to her for her intercession. Like a good Mother she knows whats best for us(Her Son) and she will point us towards him always and pray for us.

At least that is the way Catholic see it. I hope that helps.

God bless you always.

In Jesus through Mary,
Athanasias

 

[Uphill Battle]

You conveniently skipped her reply.

no, I didn't. I know what her very noble response was.

that does very little to change the fact that she wasn't asked, she was told.

 

[sunlover1]

luke 1:31 You will be with child and give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus.

luke 1:35The angel answered, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[c] the Son of God.

near as I can figure it out, the angel never said "If that's alright with you... if not, back to the drawing board.

Nope, it doesnt sound like there was any
room for discussion whatsoever.
More like, 'Thus saith the Lord'.

 

[GregoryTurner]

Well everyone, I have enjoyed this thread and the learning about the ways of EO and RCC but I would rathar keep my fellowship with Jesus Himself, not through anyone else. I just wonder when the day comes how many of us will be plucked and thrown away for not producing fruit.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Nope, it doesnt sound like there was any
room for discussion whatsoever.
More like, 'Thus saith the Lord'.

Heck, one could just switch the names of elizabeth and mary around, then elizabeth would be the one exalted.

Luke 1:7 And they had no child, because that Elisabeth was barren, and they both were now well stricken in years.
Luke 1:13 But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John.

 

[sunlover1]

Heck, one could just switch the names of elizabeth and mary around, then elizabeth would be the one exalted.

Luke 1:7 And they had no child, because that Elisabeth was barren, and they both were now well stricken in years.
Luke 1:13 But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John.

My daughter was wondering where Liz was when
the (Mary's) birthing time came.

 

[Hentenza]

Hey Hentenza

He also knew that without her, there could be no Incarnation.

Love,
Christina

But your post sounds like if she said no then Jesus would never would have been born. Mmmm....... God is the one with the plan.

 

[Hentenza]

In one sense no but in another sense yes.

Thanks for the definite answer,

 

[jckstraw72]

that does very little to change the fact that she wasn't asked, she was told.

so God basically raped her then?