Reigning over the flesh

[Jim Bob]

What do you think are the "lusts of the flesh"?
Does this mean that as a christian you basically have to torture yourself and deny yourself everything which the body wants?
For example let's say it's a totally hot day and you stand there before a fan and the body says "This feels so good" then are we supposed to be like "Oh, you like that? I'll reign over you body and dominate you" and then we go into the sun where it's totally hot and pray or do something else which is totally uncomfortable only in order to go against what the body wants?
Or let's say you come home after work and you're totally tired and you feel like getting a shower or going into the whirlpool to relax a bit then should we deny this to the body and instead do something which is straining in order to control the flesh and to reign over it like the bible says?
Is that basically what it boils down to? Then there's not a huge difference between monks in a monastery who live totally ascetic and deprive themselves of everything which is pleasurable.
With all the talk in the bible about the flesh and not fulfilling the lusts of the flesh I don't really know how to put this into the proper perspective. Those verses can be interpreted in such a way that virtually everything becomes bad and carnal and then there isn't much which remains which one might do except praying and fasting all day.
For example have you ever been depressed and then you ate something good and at least for as long as you were eating the depressing thoughts were gone or didn't matter because of the sensation of eating? Now would that be a sin? Would God expect a christian that instead of doing what the body wants like eating something or relaxing in the whirlpool that we instead pray on our knees and even make our bodies suffer more in order to show to the body that we're in control and that it doesn't matter what it wants? Are we to hate ourselves and do the opposite of what we'd like to do? For example let's say you're hungry and someone offers you a sandwich and you're totally craving to eat this delicious sandwich and then you say no thanks and instead eat some dry bread simply to dominate over your body?
Or what about eating til your full? Is that a sin? Should a good christian always eat less so that he stays slightly hungry in order to control his flesh?`

 

[Starpuppy]

you know..maybe you are being a little over serious about sinning problems

God gave us freewill to make our choices.

 

[Ttery]

What do you think are the "lusts of the flesh"?
Does this mean that as a christian you basically have to torture yourself and deny yourself everything which the body wants?
For example let's say it's a totally hot day and you stand there before a fan and the body says "This feels so good" then are we supposed to be like "Oh, you like that? I'll reign over you body and dominate you" and then we go into the sun where it's totally hot and pray or do something else which is totally uncomfortable only in order to go against what the body wants?
Or let's say you come home after work and you're totally tired and you feel like getting a shower or going into the whirlpool to relax a bit then should we deny this to the body and instead do something which is straining in order to control the flesh and to reign over it like the bible says?
Is that basically what it boils down to? Then there's not a huge difference between monks in a monastery who live totally ascetic and deprive themselves of everything which is pleasurable.
With all the talk in the bible about the flesh and not fulfilling the lusts of the flesh I don't really know how to put this into the proper perspective. Those verses can be interpreted in such a way that virtually everything becomes bad and carnal and then there isn't much which remains which one might do except praying and fasting all day.
For example have you ever been depressed and then you ate something good and at least for as long as you were eating the depressing thoughts were gone or didn't matter because of the sensation of eating? Now would that be a sin? Would God expect a christian that instead of doing what the body wants like eating something or relaxing in the whirlpool that we instead pray on our knees and even make our bodies suffer more in order to show to the body that we're in control and that it doesn't matter what it wants? Are we to hate ourselves and do the opposite of what we'd like to do? For example let's say you're hungry and someone offers you a sandwich and you're totally craving to eat this delicious sandwich and then you say no thanks and instead eat some dry bread simply to dominate over your body?
Or what about eating til your full? Is that a sin? Should a good christian always eat less so that he stays slightly hungry in order to control his flesh?`

Of course as Born Again Believers we should ask God to help us to deny ourselves from our old nature.

Lets say it is a hot day outside and nobody wants to come outside to hang out. Why don't you invite some friends over (if it's ok with your parents) and instead of playing video games, you deny yourself, and talk to your friend about God! Why not learn about God together.

The question about eating till you are full: I believe it is a sin, if you've ever heard of gluttony, which is "excessive eating and drinking."

 

[Jim Bob]

you know..maybe you are being a little over serious about sinning problems

God gave us freewill to make our choices.

I don't understand how that's supposed to help.

I simply can't really imagine or tell how one's supposed to live as a good christian. I can imagine that you'd live a certain way but what if this isn't the right way?
The bible says we shall be heavenly minded and not earthly minded what does this mean? That we shall hate everything on this earth and also make life as hard for us as possible and not enjoy anything because that would be carnal and not spiritual?
What does it mean to be spiritual? How does a spiritual christian live? I simply feel like I'm totally carnal but at the same time I can't really change it. I simply feel like I'm one of the types of the bad soil where the problems of this world choke the seed but this doesn't mean I can simply change it. I simply am not as determined and spiritual as other christians it's simply a fact and I can't do much about it.

 

[Jim Bob]

The question about eating till you are full: I believe it is a sin, if you've ever heard of gluttony, which is "excessive eating and drinking."

Eating till you're full is not gluttony. I am talking about eating till you notice you're not hungry anymore. You can either do that or you can stop when you're still hungry and that would be not eating till you're full.
Imagine you can eat 2 sandwiches and then your stomach signals your brain that you're full and then you could also eat 1,5 sandwiches and when you stop eating your brain tells you that your stomach isn't full and you'd still like to go on eating.

 

[Starpuppy]

I don't understand how that's supposed to help.

Sorry, i realized that i wasn't being really helpful

I simply can't really imagine or tell how one's supposed to live as a good christian. I can imagine that you'd live a certain way but what if this isn't the right way?
The bible says we shall be heavenly minded and not earthly minded what does this mean? That we shall hate everything on this earth and also make life as hard for us as possible and not enjoy anything because that would be carnal and not spiritual?

Firstly, God gave us freewill to make choices, good and bad

The teachings of Jesus are a good example (Personally I follow Book of Matthew) of spiritual living

You can enjoy the goodness life but do not be controlled by it, you can be hungry and have a simple meal but if you feel that you have done well and should have a feast, go ahead and splurge on yourself but do not splurge on yourself too much to the extent that you no longer afford the feast and do not enjoy the taste of a simple meal

What does it mean to be spiritual? How does a spiritual christian live? I simply feel like I'm totally carnal but at the same time I can't really change it. I simply feel like I'm one of the types of the bad soil where the problems of this world choke the seed but this doesn't mean I can simply change it. I simply am not as determined and spiritual as other christians it's simply a fact and I can't do much about it.

We are all carnal but we try to shake our carnal self away the best as we can over time. It takes time, Rome wasn't built in a day, if God wanted us to be perfect, He would fid someway to change us but He doesnn't because He wants to see us try

 

[Starpuppy]

Eating till you're full is not gluttony. I am talking about eating till you notice you're not hungry anymore. You can either do that or you can stop when you're still hungry and that would be not eating till you're full.
Imagine you can eat 2 sandwiches and then your stomach signals your brain that you're full and then you could also eat 1,5 sandwiches and when you stop eating your brain tells you that your stomach isn't full and you'd still like to go on eating.

so continue eating if your brain tells you that your stomach isn't full, then continue eating

 

[tturt]

What are the lusts of the flesh?
Gal 5:16 "This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. 17For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. 18But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law."

 

[hedrick]

I've just looked at another thread from you here. I don't want to discount the battle with sin, but are you thinking that your status with God depends upon being perfect? Jesus and Paul both acknowledged that this won't happen in this life. God loves you as you are.

Now Jesus also demands obedience. But he doesn't hold out any hope that by doing so you're going to become pure or good. In fact he refused to be called good himself. Take a look at Luke 17:7-10. Our goal is to be effective servants, not to build up credit.

Now clearly as we grow in God's service we will become more closely aligned with his will. But I think you're looking for some kind of magical perfection that we are not promised. That's why Christ died, and why we all depend upon God's grace. I don't think God ever promised us mastery over anything during this life, even our flesh.

After looking at your posting I expected to find the phrase "mastery of the flesh" in Scripture, After a bit of searching I don't think it is. And even if it were, it would likely not be referring specifically to sexual sins. Paul uses the term "flesh" to refer to our entire unredeemed nature. And he notes that even he still hadn't achieved mastery.

Again, I'm not suggesting that you be unconcerned about sin, but you shouldn't focus too narrowly on sexual purity, but rather should ask yourself how to be the most effective servant. Christ didn't talk about Christians being pure (except the somewhat metaphorical "pure in heart" in the beatitudes), but he talked a lot about his expectation that they would bear fruit. Indeed I think you can make a good case that the whole purity ideal was more characteristic of the Pharisees than of Jesus. Jesus' ideal was obedience and fruitfulness, not perfection and purity. There's some overlap, of course. But I think a focus on obedience and bearing fruit has different psychological and personal effects than focusing on being pure and perfect.

(Yes, he did say "be perfect" in Mat 5:48. But this was unusual. And if you look at the context, he seemed to be saying that God called us to go beyond just the kinds of good things that come naturally to everyone. The context was about loving your enemies, not just your friends. I don't think in context this holds out any promise of perfection in this life. And furthermore, in Mat 19:21 Jesus talks about perfection as selling all your possessions and following him. Note the parallel passage in Luke is 6:36. The punch line there is "be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.")

 

[Johnnz]

The NT uses a Greek word "sarx' for our word 'flesh'.The word flesh has several meanings in Scripture.

a) Humanity in general "All flesh..."
b) Our existence with our present bodies "The life I now live in the flesh...."
c) The corrupt desires of a lifestyle outside of Christ, which have been replaced by the life of the Spirit for all Christians. This is its intended meaning in Romans fro example.

But when referring to the human body a different word is used "soma".

It is really important not to get the two terms confused. Otherwise you end up with a kind of civil war within, a denial o four God created humanity, and that is not biblical at all. We were created to be fully human.

John
NZ

 

[Emmy]

Dear Jim Bob. Jesus told us the first and great Commandment is: " Love God with all thy heart, with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. The second is like it: love thy neighbour as thyself." Everything we say, or do, should be from love, selfless and beneficial. If it is without love, God will disapprove, and it is sin. God wants us to love all others, friend or not friends, as we love ourselves. We are allowed to love ourselves as long as we love others as well. If we are selfish and look after us without any concern for others, that is wrong, it is a sin, and God will certainly disapprove. To have a cold bath in hot weather, ( or any weather ) is not a sin, but it becomes a sin if we would forbid all others to have cold baths. God wants our love, for God because He made us in His image, and He is our Heavenly Father, and love for all others, because it is a sin to be selfish, and to deprive our fellow human-being of the living we want for ourselves. Jesus died for all of us, and Love and Charity is for all God`s children/sons and daughters. We are the only representatives God has on Earth, and we are told to love God and love each other. I say this with love, Jim. Greetings from Emmy, sister in Christ

 

[Jim Bob]

Hello,
the reason I made this thread is because I find it hard to tell wether God would approve something or what God thinks about things. For example if you're in the supermarket then do you only buy basic stuff which is needed for survival or do you also buy things which are not really necessary like sweets or something like that which is for pure enjoyment? Now what if doing this is actually carnal and worldly minded because there are people on this planet who do not have such things? Or should a christian not care about any such things and instead only be about spiritual things?
I simply often feel like I'm carnal and not spiritual at all but at the same time I can't just flip a switch and then turn into a totally spiritual person who only thinks about heaven all day or about bible verses but I bet there are christians who are on such a level but to be honest when I think about this it's scary somehow when I imagine living such a way.

18But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,

What is uncleanness? This could mean a lot of things. Sounds like it's about sexual things.

Again, I'm not suggesting that you be unconcerned about sin, but you shouldn't focus too narrowly on sexual purity, but rather should ask yourself how to be the most effective servant. Christ didn't talk about Christians being pure (except the somewhat metaphorical "pure in heart" in the beatitudes), but he talked a lot about his expectation that they would bear fruit.

But the thing is that I've heard sermons which made me think what if my spiritual state is the way it is because of not being pure? What if you simply cannot make progress when you've stuff in your life which isn't okay like masturbation? I always thought maybe that is the reason for everything and if I could get this out then everything would be different.
Many sermons are this way that you've got to clean of your life and get the sins out and unless this happens you can forget it and can't be close to God and many also say that every single sin separates us from God.

@ johnnz

Corrupt desires can also mean so many things. When one hears corrupt desires then it could mean a lot and how do you know what it really means?

If it is without love, God will disapprove, and it is sin. God wants us to love all others, friend or not friends, as we love ourselves.

But is love really the only thing which matters? What if you love everybody and at the same time you're carnally minded and you spend your entire day doing earthly things and no spiritual things like praying or reading the bible? Then God also won't be pleased will he?

 

[LWB]

Jim Bob, there is nothing wrong about enjoying pleasure. The problem comes when we use pleasure and other distractions to replace our need for God.

In order to love others and love God, we have to put them first and ourselves last, for it is impossible to serve two masters. But man from the very beginning has loved himself first, and others including God, last. This would be fine if God designed us to be selfish, but we were designed to be selfless. We were designed to not have a self focus, but an otherness focus. We can never be happy without God. We can never fulfill ourselves with the desires of the self.

To use your examples:

If there was room for only one person in front of the fan, and you pushed them away so you could enjoy it - this would be selfish and wrong. But if you're the only one present, by all means it is fine to enjoy it!

If a person arrived home from work tired and grumpy and just wanted to shower and relax, but children or chores for others needed attention, it would be selfish and wrong to just ignore them to satisfy yourself. But if everyone else was fine and there was nothing that needed your attention, by all means it is fine to enjoy a relaxing shower.

True spirituality has nothing to do with conquering one's body or will. For that in itself can become a selfish act and source of pride. It is all about how one relates to others and God.

 

[Johnnz]

Hello,
the reason I made this thread is because I find it hard to tell wether God would approve something or what God thinks about things. For example if you're in the supermarket then do you only buy basic stuff which is needed for survival or do you also buy things which are not really necessary like sweets or something like that which is for pure enjoyment? Now what if doing this is actually carnal and worldly minded because there are people on this planet who do not have such things? Or should a christian not care about any such things and instead only be about spiritual things?
I simply often feel like I'm carnal and not spiritual at all but at the same time I can't just flip a switch and then turn into a totally spiritual person who only thinks about heaven all day or about bible verses but I bet there are christians who are on such a level but to be honest when I think about this it's scary somehow when I imagine living such a way.

What is uncleanness? This could mean a lot of things. Sounds like it's about sexual things.

But the thing is that I've heard sermons which made me think what if my spiritual state is the way it is because of not being pure? What if you simply cannot make progress when you've stuff in your life which isn't okay like masturbation? I always thought maybe that is the reason for everything and if I could get this out then everything would be different.
Many sermons are this way that you've got to clean of your life and get the sins out and unless this happens you can forget it and can't be close to God and many also say that every single sin separates us from God.

@ johnnz

Corrupt desires can also mean so many things. When one hears corrupt desires then it could mean a lot and how do you know what it really means?

But is love really the only thing which matters? What if you love everybody and at the same time you're carnally minded and you spend your entire day doing earthly things and no spiritual things like praying or reading the bible? Then God also won't be pleased will he?

Wow.Lots of real questions and issues. A quick response:

a) Minimum of not? God's creation is extravagant in its variety. Doesn't that say something about what God intends for us?

b) Spiritual things only? All of life is spiritual. It is thinking from an unbiblical dualism that asks such a question. God created us to be humans, not angels, to live in this world, not some abstract 'spiritual' existence.

c) Uncleanness? Not necessarily sexual. We wrongly talk about sexual issues as 'dirty'. Touching a dead person, contact with blood, a defective animal as a sacrifice also defiled a person in the OT.

d) Not pure enough? This is a reversion to a works/contract basis for salvation. Our purity is a gift - there is no other way we can attain divine standards of purity.

You wrote Many sermons are this way that you've got to clean of your life and get the sins out and unless this happens you can forget it and can't be close to God and many also say that every single sin separates us from God

Virtually every concept there is wrong. That denies all that Jesus has accomplished for us.

The negative take on human sexuality that seems very common in some sectors imposes a huge burden on many young,single people. I'm all for sexual purity, but some sexual purity teaching is quite polluted in its essence. There is a huge difference between genuine, deliberate sexual sin and normal human sexuality that was created as part of our being human.

Although some don't quite see it, the bible, most especially the NT, does not give us an identikit tick-the-box list of sins. Very frustrating for many of us! The NT does give examples of different values and lifestyles. That was deliberate. That's just what the Pharisees had done, take various verses and construct a huge volume defining what was and was not permitted. Jesus often challenged those definitions "It was said .. but I say..."

Our Father wants us to grow up and learn about life, God and living. Rather than rules we are told to seek wisdom. This means thinking from biblical principles and working them through into our lives in ways that involve learning ("get understanding",) exercising choice and thereby acquiring wisdom as we allow the Holy Spirit to infuse our thinking in that constant process. Look at this verse

2 Tim 2:15-16 Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. NIV

A workman learns his trade. We must become skilled in acquiring wisdom and thereby honouring God's principles in our lives.

There is no recipe, no formula, just a new heart and the Holy Spirit teaching us in various ways.

John
NZ

 

[Jim Bob]

In order to love others and love God, we have to put them first and ourselves last, for it is impossible to serve two masters.

But how do you know if God's jealous of something or not? For me it has always been like when I had something which I really liked then I feared that this could be an idol and I thought that the only way to really find out wether it is an idol is giving it up because otherwise I can't know if it's an idol or not.
Even if I had something I liked I couldn't really enjoy it but felt guilty and thought about wether it's an idol and tried to find out if God might be displeased with it. It's really stupid somehow when you fear that something could be an idol because how shall you find out about it? For example if a christian tells you that if you were willing to give it up for God then it's not an idol then this doesn't solve the issue because then you basically have to give it up. Let's say you like playing guitar and you practice it and then you fear what if it's an idol and then somebody tells you if you were willing to give it up then it's not an idol then going on with it would not make sense because why go on if one day you might have to give it up? Then I'd rather want to know it right away if I have to stop or not.

God created us to be humans, not angels, to live in this world, not some abstract 'spiritual' existence.

But you can still be very much involved in the affairs of this world or not involved. For example a monk isn't very much involved in it all he does is spiritual stuff. And Jesus also talks about the seeds which are choked by the sorrows of this world. For example if you worry a lot about worldy stuff like money or clothes or who you look then certainly isn't good and also not spiritual and I often feel like I'm not spiritual enough but at the same time it's hard to change this. I can be aware of things not being right but at the same time it's not like being aware of it means that you can simply change it.

There is a huge difference between genuine, deliberate sexual sin and normal human sexuality that was created as part of our being human.

Would you mind elaborating on that and give some examples of what's sin and what's normal?
From the sermons which I listened to about sex it basically sounded like if you're not married then you best be a nonsexual being because sex is only for marriage and if you're not married then you have to exercise self-control and struggle for all time which I find totally depressing.

 

[Johnnz]

But how do you know if God's jealous of something or not? For me it has always been like when I had something which I really liked then I feared that this could be an idol and I thought that the only way to really find out wether it is an idol is giving it up because otherwise I can't know if it's an idol or not.
Even if I had something I liked I couldn't really enjoy it but felt guilty and thought about wether it's an idol and tried to find out if God might be displeased with it. It's really stupid somehow when you fear that something could be an idol because how shall you find out about it? For example if a christian tells you that if you were willing to give it up for God then it's not an idol then this doesn't solve the issue because then you basically have to give it up. Let's say you like playing guitar and you practice it and then you fear what if it's an idol and then somebody tells you if you were willing to give it up then it's not an idol then going on with it would not make sense because why go on if one day you might have to give it up? Then I'd rather want to know it right away if I have to stop or not.

But you can still be very much involved in the affairs of this world or not involved. For example a monk isn't very much involved in it all he does is spiritual stuff. And Jesus also talks about the seeds which are choked by the sorrows of this world. For example if you worry a lot about worldy stuff like money or clothes or who you look then certainly isn't good and also not spiritual and I often feel like I'm not spiritual enough but at the same time it's hard to change this. I can be aware of things not being right but at the same time it's not like being aware of it means that you can simply change it.

Would you mind elaborating on that and give some examples of what's sin and what's normal?
From the sermons which I listened to about sex it basically sounded like if you're not married then you best be a nonsexual being because sex is only for marriage and if you're not married then you have to exercise self-control and struggle for all time which I find totally depressing.

Hi,

I'll reply to each item in the order you set them out.

a) Idol or not? Firstly, what sort of God is it who creates much for humanity to enjoy and then finds displeasure when we do? That god would be a monster. Sure there is a judgement to be made. But we can freely enjoy many things with gratitude and thankfulness without that becoming and idol. The Holy Spirit, or maybe some wise, close friend might give us a nudge to remind us to keep something in the right perspective. And of course we are to utilise and enjoy our God given abilities. Any good parent delights in their children's growth and enjoyment of life.

b) Spiritual or worldly? This is a Greek not a biblical division. The scared/secular dichotomy is not correct, an import into the biblical account. As a person indwelt by the Spirit of God, I bring Christ's presence into every situation that I am in. Being 'worldly' is forgetting divine principles in our usage and participation of creation, but not in avoiding proper interaction within our society.

c) Sex? One very big issue. Yes, a lot of teaching would be just fine if we were asexual! For those of us who aren't, that teaching makes life far too fraught.

As a sexual, hormonally activated being I can expect to experience any or all of the following:
a general interest in sex and sexual material
awareness of physical, mental and emotional expressions of my sexuality
a interest in the opposite sex, and what they look like, both outwardly and beneath their covering - hence available images become very enticing
a sexual response to a sexual stimulus
thoughts about friendship with the opposite sex, interest in dating, romantic.

Sexual sin involves any of the following

involvement with wrong material - eg inappropriate content
imagining the opposite sex purely in physical terms, not as primarily as a person
over indulgence time wise
planned or actual immoral sex - outside of marriage, adultery

Does that help with your questions?

John
NZ

 

[heron]

I don't want to discount the battle with sin, but are you thinking that your status with God depends upon being perfect?

Good discussion above.

I will give you an example. I am sensitive to sugar, so much that if I have too many carbs at once, it creates such a strong pull within me that lack of control is formed.

I do not naturally lust for food. Usually I am not even interested in it. But I know what it takes to put myself into a situation where the strong pull is generated.

I put myself into modes of defiance once in a while, where I want to be normal and do what other people do. Having orange juice at breakfast, for me, is outright defiance. It will throw off my whole day. In itself, OJ is a beneficial thing. But I know that it will put me into a mode that I cannot control, which will take my focus off the right things later.

Know thyself, and to thine own self be true.

 

[PintoBean]

Try asking "would this be an abomination to the Lord" with each activity. Would getting in the hot tub to relax be an abomination to the Lord? No. Would eating this sandwich be an abomination? No. God wants us to enjoy life; it is a gift. Would watching inappropriate content and self pleasure be an abomination? yes. Why? Because lust is in scripture. To understand God we must read and pray and read and pray.

 

[heron]

A balance of verses...

1Ti 5:6
She who gives herself to wanton pleasure is dead even while she lives.

Eccl 5:18
Here is what I have seen to be good and fitting: to eat, to drink and enjoy oneself in all one's labor in which he toils under the sun during the few years of his life which God has given him; for this is his reward.

Jas 5:5
You have lived luxuriously on the earth and led a life of wanton pleasure; you have fattened your hearts in a day of slaughter.

Jer 31:5
Again you will plant vineyards on the hills of Samaria; the planters will plant and will enjoy them.

Pr 21:17
He who loves pleasure will become a poor man; He who loves wine and oil will not become rich.

1Ti 6:17
Instruct those who are rich in this present world not to be conceited or to fix their hope on the uncertainty of riches, but on God, who richly supplies us with all things to enjoy.

Heb 11:25
choosing rather to endure ill-treatment with the people of God than to enjoy the passing pleasures of sin

Ec 2:1, 2
I said to myself, "Come now, I will test you with pleasure. So enjoy yourself." And behold, it too was futility. I said of laughter, "It is madness," and of pleasure, "What does it accomplish?"

1Ki 3:11
God said to him, "Because you have asked this thing (wisdom) and have not asked for yourself long life, nor have asked riches for yourself, nor have you asked for the life of your enemies, but have asked for yourself discernment to understand justice... there will not be any among the kings like you all your days.

1Ki 10:23
King Solomon became greater than all the kings of the earth in riches and in wisdom.

1Ch 29:12
Both riches and honor come from You, and You rule over all, and in Your hand is power and might; and it lies in Your hand to make great and to strengthen everyone.

 

[Jim Bob]

hi, just a short note. I'll reply to the posts tomorrow.