Refuting Sola Scriptura - Why the Bible Alone is Not Sufficient

[Standing Up]

The Bible is regarded as the most important part of holy tradition;

If you've read their clarifying comments, you'll find you're wrong. As to your religion, do you have a source that states what you have said for you personally?

 

[Albion]

If you've read their clarifying comments, you'll find you're wrong. As to your religion, do you have a source that states what you have said for you personally?

Not to interrupt your point, but for him to say that the "Bible is the most important part of Tradition" automatically admits that something else is as good as the word of God.

How, one may ask, can anything be equal to that which is revealed to us by God himself?

 

[tulipbee]

The Catholic idea of "Tradition" does not require there to be any Biblical support, let along proof. The presumed authority of the church itself to define doctrine, along with an absence of Biblical opposition to whatever the doctrine might be is considered to be sufficient.

They become a denomination on thier first man made tradition. They left the orthodox and went thier own way.

 

[Albion]

They become a denomination on thier first man made tradition. They left the orthodox and went thier own way.

Hi, tulipbee.

"Catholic" there referred to all the denominations that fall into that category of Christian churches--Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Roman Catholic, Old Catholic, etc.

 

[tulipbee]

Hi, tulipbee.

"Catholic" there referred to all the denominations that fall into that category of Christian churches--Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Roman Catholic, Old Catholic, etc.

And Protestants and etc

 

[Albion]

And Protestants and etc

What about them?

 

[tulipbee]

What about them?

The Protestants are universal Catholic church as well. RCC will fight agianst that cause they want to protect their denomination while orthodox wants to the same thing. The RCC and orthodox fight among each other. Why?

 

[Albion]

The Protestants are universal Catholic church as well.

That's to use the word in a totally different sense, though.

RCC will fight agianst that cause they want to protect their denomination while orthodox wants to the same thing. The RCC and orthodox fight among each other. Why?

It's the oldest continuing rivalry of importance in Christendom, and the reasons are ethnic pride and competing claims to be the older church.

 

[tulipbee]

That's to use the word in a totally different sense, though.



It's the oldest continuing rivalry of importance in Christendom, and the reasons are ethnic pride and competing claims to be the older church.

Old cars break, new cars runs. The holy spirit is still alive today running the Church

 

[Rick Otto]

Old cars break, new cars runs. The holy spirit is still alive today running the Church

Bees on the other hand, are having a tough time of it. Watch out for that Fortran, Lasso, and Roundup.

 

[tulipbee]

Bees on the other hand, are having a tough time of it. Watch out for that Fortran, Lasso, and Roundup.

Ok

 

[Root of Jesse]

Neither do Catholics. But the Protestants agree on what the Bible is and they agree that Christ was using the "sola scriptura" test of tradition and doctrine - in Mark 7:6-13 to hammer the church traditions of Jewish Magesterium.

Actually, it doesn't matter that "neither do Catholics". What matters is that the faith is consistent, and we find that faith documented in the Catechism, which is the same for all Catholics, regardless of how much or how little they agree with it. And I wonder how you know that all Protestants agree with your interpretation of Mark 7:6-13, especially in light of the first 5 verses of that chapter...

 

[Root of Jesse]

Interesting. Apparently you and RootofJesse are at odds with each other on this issue. However, I think each of you is viewing this issue from differing aspects. On one hand, RoJ asserts that, of course, there is no disagreement with ST because it only really exists in your Church and in your Church alone.

Of course, my Church (which is the Church and not a denomination)encompasses the vast majority of Christians, so saying 'only really exists in your Church and your Church alone" pretty much encompasses most Christians...)

You, on the other hand, at least recognize the existence of churches outside of your own, although you readily dismiss them as lacking consistent ST. In both cases, you agree that ST is contained in your denomination and your denomination alone.

I don't think thecolorsblend recognizes any but one Church, but with many denominations. I recognize that there's many denominations, too.

Modern science, being a relatively closed system, is not unlike your ST. It is internally consistent and, therefore, its proponents can sincerely make the claim that it reflects the Truth faithfully. Your ST, by contrast, contains a number of internal flaws and discrepancies, such as the myriad Papal Bulls which have been retired to the dustbins of the Vatican. Even on such an essential doctrine as Purgatory, your magisterium has not proven to be definitive.

Modern science is a poor example. Modern science has widely disparate views of many things. Secondly, Papal Bulls are not necessarily ST. Thirdly, the doctrine of Purgatory-that it exists, what it is, what it is not, is set in stone. How people describe it, which is not ST, is different.

 

[Root of Jesse]

Westminster confessions are great sources and contains quote proofs. Did we tie?

Nope, ST is more ancient, closer to the source (Jesus), and therefore superior.

 

[Root of Jesse]

The Catholic idea of "Tradition" does not require there to be any Biblical support, let along proof. The presumed authority of the church itself to define doctrine, along with an absence of Biblical opposition to whatever the doctrine might be is considered to be sufficient.

Simply wrong.

 

[Root of Jesse]

No, that's actually not true. Some national churches include books that others do not have.

Not in worship, which is where it really matters.

Don't keep us in suspense. Which churches "barely regard sacred scripture at all?" And BTW, "barely regard" it as what?

 

[Root of Jesse]

Not to interrupt your point, but for him to say that the "Bible is the most important part of Tradition" automatically admits that something else is as good as the word of God.

How, one may ask, can anything be equal to that which is revealed to us by God himself?

No, it admits that something else IS the Word of God...And God's Word is equal to God's Word.

 

[Root of Jesse]

The Protestants are universal Catholic church as well. RCC will fight agianst that cause they want to protect their denomination while orthodox wants to the same thing. The RCC and orthodox fight among each other. Why?

Actually, we agree about that. Protestants are part of the universal Church.

 

[Standing Up]

No, it admits that something else IS the Word of God...And God's Word is equal to God's Word.

True enough (CCC 85).
Your group RC believes Tradition and Scripture source to the same object God. (CCC 80) The point was RC does not think scripture is sufficient for all things salvific. RC does not think scripture is "supreme".

 

[AionPhanes]

I think the Holy Spirit is also required to internalize the wisdom found in the Bible and to carry out the Spiritual discipline it reccomends. Having access to church tradition can be very helpful so can a good spiritual advisor but ultimately the Spirit blows wherever it pleases regardless of outward ecclesial boundaries.