Refuting OSAS in jesus name

[lori milne]

That is incorrect. The Bible tells us what pleases God (keeps us in His favor). Heb 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him. How so? Please clarify. Yes, all the verses are in the Bible. ?? What "only place"? And which verse SAYS living in sin means going to hell. Are you not familiar with John 3:36? "“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." I prefer to read the lines, not what's between them. In fact, there is nothing between the lines but empty space. The key is to discern what is meant by the various meanings of "death" in Scripture. It isn't all about eternal death, or even physical death. OK, how does this verse support your opinions? I don't see any relevancy here.

How the last verse supports OSAS is misleading people to hell
Sin even just the kind you think man can't live with out will lead you to hell
GOD didn't creat sin he created Angels and man with free will
We have a choice to chose him or not!
It's simple OSAS and hyper grace Calvinism universal salvation ??? makes it convoluted and twist the simplest direction for don't sin to sinful nature to living in sin.
The tee of knowledge had two understandings
Good and evil That's it it wasn't one understanding!
God is good the Devils is evil. Now you choose
If you choose sin brethren your ok with child murder, molestation, rap, abuse, theft, lying and everything sin comes with!
Search for righteousness and God will bless you and make that choice you lack faith to do will be easier then you think.
Why can job do it and not us
It Abraham or David Joseph Daniel Noah
They are set examples for us so some one like OSAS Or hyper grace can't fool people.
God forbid

 

[lori milne]

That is incorrect. The Bible tells us what pleases God (keeps us in His favor). Heb 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him. How so? Please clarify. Yes, all the verses are in the Bible. ?? What "only place"? And which verse SAYS living in sin means going to hell. Are you not familiar with John 3:36? "“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." I prefer to read the lines, not what's between them. In fact, there is nothing between the lines but empty space. The key is to discern what is meant by the various meanings of "death" in Scripture. It isn't all about eternal death, or even physical death. OK, how does this verse support your opinions? I don't see any relevancy here.

Your smart in the word but if you feel you can't not "choice" to sin your week in the Faith.
Humbly speaking and not to judge

 

[FreeGrace2]

1. fear of God
Yes but what keeps you true to the faith if their is no consequence to your actions.

What makes one think that there is no consequence to one's actions? OSAS doesn't mean no consequences, but it seems those who deny OSAS never got the message.

There are HUGE consequences for rebellion by God's children. 1 Cor 11:30 tells us that some of the consequences include weakness, sickness, and physical death.

1 Cor 5 illustrates divine discipline as being "turned over to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so his soul will be saved". And we all know Satan's skills in torture. Just ask Job about that!

On the positive side, there are HUGE blessings for those who are faithful and obedient in this life. They will be HUGELY rewarded. Does ruling with Christ sound good to you? Well, "if we endure, we will reign with Christ" according to 2 Tim 2:12a. "But if we deny Him, He will deny us that privilege and honor of reigning with Him". v.12b

However, 2 Tim 2:13 guarantees that we cannot lose our salvation. Because "God cannot deny Himself" and every believer has the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear
Hebrews‬ [bless and do not curse]12‬:[bless and do not curse]28‬ KJV

Once again, a verse given without any explanation. Please explain how this verse supports your view that salvation can be lost.

 

[FreeGrace2]

With OSAS theology you can sin and still go to heaven.

That seems to bother those who don't understand grace. But God put the Holy Spirit into each believer as a PLEDGE or PROMISE for the day of redemption.

So, those who deny OSAS are denying the truth of Scripture.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I said this:
"There is no evidence anywhere in Scripture that he ever believed. In fact, every person is born an unbeliever. So he was always an unbeliever."

That's assumed by you

Can my statement be refuted from Scripture? Or is this just an opinion on your part?

His actions clearly showed otherwise

Uh, what actions showed that he ever believed? Consider these verses:
Matt 10:4 - Simon the Zealot, and Judas Iscariot, the one who betrayed Him.
Matt 26:25 - And Judas, who was betraying Him, said, “Surely it is not I, Rabbi?” Jesus said to him, “You have said it yourself.”
Matt 27:3 - Then when Judas, who had betrayed Him, saw that He had been condemned, he felt remorse and returned the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders

These are parallel verses in the other gospel accounts about Judas being a traitor: Mark 3:19, 10:14, Luke 6:16, 22:3, 48, John 6:71, 12:4, 13:2, 18:2,5, and Acts 1:25.

Unless he was just crazy and hung him self for no apparent reason.
I'll agree it's assumed on both ends

Matt 27:3 says he felt remorse. Are there any verses that tell us that remorse results in salvation? No, there are not.

The Greek word for "repent" is metanoia. The word in Matt 27:3 is metamellomai. A different word with a different meaning.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I said this:
"This is not true. If it were, why so many passages addressed to believers to live lives worthy of the Name? It would be automatic for all who have believed if your claim were true. The truth is that even God's children can and will be rebellious. Anything that is not of faith is sin (Rom 14:23), and sin is rebellion against God. The reformed doctrine of the Perseverance of the saints is not Biblical. Believers are called TO persevere. It isn't automatic. We are commanded to "be holy" (1 Thess 4:7, 1 Pet 1:15,16, 2 Pet 3:11, etc). To be clear, many call themselves "Christian", but have no idea what the Bible says about what that means. They have NOT professed Christ as Savior. They think by being "good" they are "Christian", or some such nonsense. King David was a believer when he saw Bathsheba bathing. And that didn't turn out well. He received great discipline from the Lord. That said, OSAS is true because Paul wrote that there is nothing in the present or in the future that can separate believers from the love of Christ (Rom 8:38). Unless someone can prove that Paul didn't really mean nothing in the future, such as loss of faith, or entangling oneself into a lifestyle of sin, then there is no reason to believe that even those horrible things can separate us from the love of Christ. Paul was just as clear in 1 Thess 5:4-10 where he contrasted unbelievers as belonging to the night (asleep-v.6) and believers as belonging to the day (alert). Then he concludes in v.10 - who died for us, so that whether we are awake or asleep, we will live together with Him. The "us" is believers. Being "awake or asleep" from the context refers to lifestyle. So it is clear from v.10 that all believers, whether awake or asleep will live together with Him. This is a great promise and guarantee."

Paul mostly spoke mainly to the unsaved
James is who you need to read because he spoke to the saved which is why they are the poller opposites In their direction to the writings

Ignoring passages that support my view and plowing on with your view doesn't help anything. If my verses can be refuted, I'd be happy to read about it.

But your comments about Paul and James have no relevancy to the subject matter.

And yes the alter call says come as you are but no way will it be and stay that way

The "altar call" isn't biblical. Or relevant to the subject.

 

[FreeGrace2]

The bible is the only place ware you'll see if you sin you will go to hell yes:
4:Living in sin and going to hell
that verse from John is not balanced with the word of God so that means your reading it out of your flesh of context.
Try the first book Gods first commandment

I requested verses that support your view, and there still aren't any? Your statements are only opinions unless there are verses that SAY what is claimed.

If you eat of the apple you will die!

Guess what! Adam DID die that day. So what?

Now take that and continue on reading every ware it says if you sin you will "die" what was the meaning and goes to refer to hell as well

Not at all. Confusion reigns here. All humans are born "dead in sins", meaning that all humans are headed for hell. But, when one believes, God places the Holy Spirit into that believer as a PLEDGE or PROMISE for the day of redemption.

When a person believes, they receive the gift of eternal life. And God's gifts are irrevocable. Another way to say that is OSAS.

And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell

Would you advise someone to cut off their body parts literally?

 

[FreeGrace2]

Well it's good you know the variations of death so then How do you overlook them

Why would one think that I overlook them? That's kind of a silly question. The point is that your posts reveal that your understanding of the word "death" seems quite limited.

You can't loose wait just eating bacon

I have no idea what this means.

Of corse you'll look thinner but the end is worse for you then just staying fat cuz you'll have a heart attach at 25 oops!

More confusion!

Jesus clearly teaches VERY clear a directly to sin in ones life in fact he even says you won't want to sin !

Is there a verse that supports this claim? If not, I'll take it as an opinion.

So then why do OSAS still live in sin that's contrary to a promise from Jesus.

Every believer sins, so your question is bogus.

It seems the non-OSAS crowd just wants to use "loss of salvation" to keep people from sinning. Yet, there aren't any verses that teach such a thing.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I said this:
"That is incorrect. The Bible tells us what pleases God (keeps us in His favor). Heb 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him. How so? Please clarify. Yes, all the verses are in the Bible. ?? What "only place"? And which verse SAYS living in sin means going to hell. Are you not familiar with John 3:36? "“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." I prefer to read the lines, not what's between them. In fact, there is nothing between the lines but empty space. The key is to discern what is meant by the various meanings of "death" in Scripture. It isn't all about eternal death, or even physical death. OK, how does this verse support your opinions? I don't see any relevancy here."

How the last verse supports OSAS is misleading people to hell

What is meant by "last verse"? It has no relevancy to what I posted.

Sin even just the kind you think man can't live with out will lead you to hell

This makes no sense to me. Please clarify.

They are set examples for us so some one like OSAS Or hyper grace can't fool people.
God forbid

I have no idea what your point is here.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Your smart in the word but if you feel you can't not "choice" to sin your week in the Faith.

Please clarify what is meant by "you can't not choice to sin". I have no idea.

Everyone chooses to sin. Some might not be aware of what all is sin, but all sin is a choice. So your statement doesn't make sense.

 

[lori milne]

Please clarify what is meant by "you can't not choice to sin". I have no idea. Everyone chooses to sin. Some might not be aware of what all is sin, but all sin is a choice. So your statement doesn't make sense.

It's an oxymoron for a reason Since you always can choose to sin or not sin. But iT was in response to OSAS and well the rest of the man made theologies that No one can not" sin

 

[lori milne]

Please clarify what is meant by "you can't not choice to sin". I have no idea. Everyone chooses to sin. Some might not be aware of what all is sin, but all sin is a choice. So your statement doesn't make sense.

It is funny you can admit that . But It's correct it does t make sense because you always have a choice to sin of not

 

[lori milne]

Sorry I don't have 100 hands as you seem to and can only answer 1 question at a time but when I do you don't remember your question cuz you've asked to many at once I'm not able to respond to each question as you can.
my phone is limited or in just not so smart :/ So I'll do my best answering these

 

[lori milne]

I said this: "That is incorrect. The Bible tells us what pleases God (keeps us in His favor). Heb 11:6 - And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him. How so? Please clarify. Yes, all the verses are in the Bible. ?? What "only place"? And which verse SAYS living in sin means going to hell. Are you not familiar with John 3:36? "“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." I prefer to read the lines, not what's between them. In fact, there is nothing between the lines but empty space. The key is to discern what is meant by the various meanings of "death" in Scripture. It isn't all about eternal death, or even physical death. OK, how does this verse support your opinions? I don't see any relevancy here." What is meant by "last verse"? It has no relevancy to what I posted. This makes no sense to me. Please clarify. I have no idea what your point is here.

The "last verse " you asked me to clarify the Verse I posted and that was the answer

 

[lori milne]

I requested verses that support your view, and there still aren't any? Your statements are only opinions unless there are verses that SAY what is claimed. Guess what! Adam DID die that day. So what? Not at all. Confusion reigns here. All humans are born "dead in sins", meaning that all humans are headed for hell. But, when one believes, God places the Holy Spirit into that believer as a PLEDGE or PROMISE for the day of redemption. When a person believes, they receive the gift of eternal life. And God's gifts are irrevocable. Another way to say that is OSAS. Would you advise someone to cut off their body parts literally?

The bible is the only place ware you'll see if you sin you will go to hell yes: 4:Living in sin and going to hell that verse from John is not balanced with the word of God so that means your reading it out of your flesh of context. Try the first book Gods first commandment

<Your question.
I requested verses that support your view, and there still aren't any? Your statements are only opinions unless there are verses that SAY what is claimed.

<My Answer
Btw surely die means go to hell When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand Ezekiel&#8236; [bless and do not curse]3&#8236;:[bless and do not curse]18&#8236; KJV

If you eat of the apple you will die! Guess what! <Adam DID die that day. So what?

<Do you think it didn't at all mean go to hell? Surely die is used a lot in the bible. does it just mean if I sin I will die?
You can misread that if you don't balance it out with what the rest of the bible means by surly die .so the it should make sense after you've balanced it all out.
Just 1 example Of what the BIBLE mean by die When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand Ezekiel&#8236; [bless and do not curse]3&#8236;:[bless and do not curse]18&#8236; KJV


<Now take that and continue on reading every ware it says if you sin you will "die" what was the meaning and goes to refer to hell as well Not at all. Confusion reigns here. All humans are born "dead in sins", meaning that all humans are headed for hell. But, when one believes, God places the Holy Spirit into that believer as a PLEDGE or PROMISE for the day of redemption. When a person believes, they receive the gift of eternal life. And God's gifts are irrevocable. Another way to say that is OSAS.

<Jesus didn't die for you to go on sinning in fact he said stop sinning and if you drink his water you will thirst no more! "The girl at the well story " Be perfect he said! As your father in heaven is" Did he not mean this?!
Grace isn't a word jesus used at all !! Ever !!
even! The word means favor in Gods eyes" the only way you can attain this is with righteousness through Faith!
Living in sin is unrighteous

<And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell Would you advise someone to cut off their body parts literally?

<Yes and no depends on if your eyes are truly able to stumble you but I feel with TRUE FAITH you won't have to

 

[lori milne]

Why would one think that I overlook them? That's kind of a silly question. The point is that your posts reveal that your understanding of the word "death" seems quite limited. I have no idea what this means. More confusion! Is there a verse that supports this claim? If not, I'll take it as an opinion. Every believer sins, so your question is bogus. It seems the non-OSAS crowd just wants to use "loss of salvation" to keep people from sinning. Yet, there aren't any verses that teach such a thing.

Originally Posted by lori milne
Well it's good you know the variations of death so then How do you overlook them
<Why would one think that I overlook them? That's kind of a silly question. The point is that your posts reveal that your understanding of the word "death" seems quite limited.

<I think you forgot what i was responding to /:
It was about reading between the lines on death meaning hell.
Which hd been clearly understood to mean just that! You don't literally die when you sin that's silly.
The bible means you won't have eternal life
You can't loose wait just eating bacon
I have no idea what this means.

Of corse you'll look thinner but the end is worse for you then just staying fat cuz you'll have a heart attach at 25 oops!
More confusion!
The easy road of Christianity is wrong OSAS is the easy road
It was a clear analogy

Jesus clearly teaches VERY clear a directly to sin in ones life in fact he even says you won't want to sin !
<Is there a verse that supports this claim? If not, I'll take it as an opinion.

<Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again: But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life
John&#8236; [bless and do not curse]4&#8236;:[bless and do not curse]13-14&#8236;

What do you think he meant when he taught about faith to move mountains or walk on water!
If jesus said it will give us that strength then why can't it stop us from sinning?
Peter walked on water
Matt 14:29
Muster seed sized faith moves mountains
Matt 17:10



So then why do OSAS still live in sin that's contrary to a promise from Jesus.
<Every believer sins, so your question is bogus.

It seems the non-OSAS crowd just wants to use "loss of salvation" to keep people from sinning. Yet, there aren't any verses that teach such a thing.

<Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again: But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life
John&#8236; [bless and do not curse]4&#8236;:[bless and do not curse]13-14&#8236;

 

[lori milne]

Sorry I don't have 100 hands as you seem to and can only answer 1 question at a time but when I do you don't remember your question cuz you've asked to many at once I'm not able to respond to each question as you can. my phone is limited or in just not so smart :/ So I'll do my best answering these

Ok I think I got this now lol
Few your fast at this btw

 

[lori milne]

The bible is the only place ware you'll see if you sin you will go to hell yes: 4:Living in sin and going to hell that verse from John is not balanced with the word of God so that means your reading it out of your flesh of context. Try the first book Gods first commandment <Your question. I requested verses that support your view, and there still aren't any? Your statements are only opinions unless there are verses that SAY what is claimed. <My Answer Btw surely die means go to hell When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand Ezekiel&#8236; [bless and do not curse]3&#8236;:[bless and do not curse]18&#8236; KJV If you eat of the apple you will die! Guess what! <Adam DID die that day. So what? <Do you think it didn't at all mean go to hell? Surely die is used a lot in the bible. does it just mean if I sin I will die? You can misread that if you don't balance it out with what the rest of the bible means by surly die .so the it should make sense after you've balanced it all out. Just 1 example Of what the BIBLE mean by die When I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand Ezekiel&#8236; [bless and do not curse]3&#8236;:[bless and do not curse]18&#8236; KJV <Now take that and continue on reading every ware it says if you sin you will "die" what was the meaning and goes to refer to hell as well Not at all. Confusion reigns here. All humans are born "dead in sins", meaning that all humans are headed for hell. But, when one believes, God places the Holy Spirit into that believer as a PLEDGE or PROMISE for the day of redemption. When a person believes, they receive the gift of eternal life. And God's gifts are irrevocable. Another way to say that is OSAS. <Jesus didn't die for you to go on sinning in fact he said stop sinning and if you drink his water you will thirst no more! "The girl at the well story " Be perfect he said! As your father in heaven is" Did he not mean this?! Grace isn't a word jesus used at all !! Ever !! even! The word means favor in Gods eyes" the only way you can attain this is with righteousness through Faith! Living in sin is unrighteous <And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell Would you advise someone to cut off their body parts literally? <Yes and no depends on if your eyes are truly able to stumble you but I feel with TRUE FAITH you won't have to

Just as a reminder the first " question was you wanted versus to support the many many sin leads to hell versus you feel are not in the bible!
So the one I used is just a verse staying sin leads to hell

 

[FreeGrace2]

It's an oxymoron for a reason Since you always can choose to sin or not sin. But iT was in response to OSAS and well the rest of the man made theologies that No one can not" sin

I'm still not sure what you're trying to say. No one has proven that OSAS is a man made theology. In fact, Scripture teaches it. Which has been proven.

Rom 6:23 says eternal life is a gift of God. Rom 11:29 says that God's gifts are irrevocable.

Rom 8:38 says that there is nothing in the present or in the future that can separate us from the love of Christ. {this would include anything that might occur}

Eph 1:13,14, 4:30, 2 Cor 1:22 and 5:5 says that the Holy Spirit is a pledge/promise for the day of redemption.

With these clear statements of Scripture, there can be no loss of salvation.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I said this:
"Please clarify what is meant by "you can't not choice to sin". I have no idea. Everyone chooses to sin. Some might not be aware of what all is sin, but all sin is a choice. So your statement doesn't make sense."

It is funny you can admit that .

Admitting what? That everyone chooses to sin? Of course it's a choice. What's funny about saying that?

But It's correct it does t make sense because you always have a choice to sin of not

Why doesn't it make sense?