Refuting Calvin's TULIP

[PrettyboyAndy]

The point of the verse I posted is that Jesus wanted them to come to him, but they were unwilling. How can you be so blind to this? You are very deeply entrenched in your dogma.

The point of the verse I posted is that Jesus wanted them to come to him, but they were unwilling. How can you be so blind to this? You are very deeply entrenched in your dogma.

This was to fulfill the word of Isaiah the prophet: “Lord, who has believed our message? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?” 39For this reason they were unable to believe. For again,Isaiah says: 40“He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, so that they cannot see with their eyes, and understand with their hearts, and turn, and I would heal them

If they are blind, they can not see!

 

[Thursday]

He was talking to Israel, Israel rejected the

It doesn't matter who he is talking to. The point is that he wanted them to do one thing but he allowed them to reject his will and follow their own path.

 

[Thursday]

This was to fulfill the word of Isaiah the prophet: “Lord, who has believed our message? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?” 39For this reason they were unable to believe. For again,Isaiah says: 40“He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, so that they cannot see with their eyes, and understand with their hearts, and turn, and I would heal them

If they are blind, they can not see!

No, it is not about this. Jesus specifically stated that he longed to gather them up.

If that's what he wanted, then the only possible reason it didn't happen is that he allowed them to choose another path.

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

It doesn't matter who he is talking to. The point is that he wanted them to do one thing but he allowed them to reject his will and follow their own path.

Or is it possible that they were blind and deaf and were unable to come to Him? Scripture appears to say that.

This was to fulfill the word of Isaiah the prophet: “Lord, who has believed our message? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?” 39For this reason they were unable to believe. For again,Isaiah says: 40“He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, so that they cannot see with their eyes, and understand with their hearts, and turn, and I would heal them

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

No, it is not about this. Jesus specifically stated that he longed to gather them up.

If that's what he wanted, then the only possible reason it didn't happen is that he allowed them to choose another path.

And He was saying, “For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted him from the Father.” John 6:65


“All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him - Matthew 11:27

Salvation is from the Lord. Jonah 2:9

Paul, a bond-servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the faith of those chosen of God and the knowledge of the truth which is according to godliness, Titus 1:1

also we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will, Ephesians 1:11

just as He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. 5 He predestined us to adoption as sons through Jesus Christ to Himself, according to the kind intention of His will, Ephesians 1:4-5

 

[Thursday]

Or is it possible that they were blind and deaf and were unable to come to Him? Scripture appears to say that.

This was to fulfill the word of Isaiah the prophet: “Lord, who has believed our message? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?” 39For this reason they were unable to believe. For again,Isaiah says: 40“He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, so that they cannot see with their eyes, and understand with their hearts, and turn, and I would heal them

Scripture says no such thing in that passage.

In fact, it tells of Jesus longing to gather them up.

 

[Thursday]

And He was saying, “For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted him from the Father.” John 6:65


“All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him - Matthew 11:27

Exactly!! And who do the Father and son want to reveal themselves to?

Titus 2:11
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men

John 12:32
And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.

1 John 2:2
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

1 Tim 2:4
3This is good and pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

Exactly!! And who do the Father and son want to reveal themselves to?

Titus 2:11
For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men

John 12:32
And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself.

1 John 2:2
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

1 Tim 2:4
3This is good and pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, 4who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.

2 Peter 3:9
The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. Instead he is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.

They want ALL men Jew and Gentile alike to be saved, Agreed.

Those who are in the realm of the flesh cannot please God. Romans 8:8-9

They are blind, deaf and have a heart of stone unable to come to God.

 

[Thursday]

They want ALL men Jew and Gentile alike to be saved, Agreed.

Then why are some men not saved?

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

Then why are some men not saved?

Why are all men not saved if Jesus died for all?

 

[Thursday]

Why are all men not saved if Jesus died for all?

Because some men reject his call to pick up their cross daily and follow him.

It is not God's will that these men are lost.

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

Then why are some men not saved?

Because some men reject his call to pick up their cross daily and follow him.

It is not God's will that these men are lost.

The ones who reject his call to be belong to Him, if they did belong to Him, they would follow Him

 

[Thursday]

The ones who reject his call to be belong to Him, if they did belong to Him, they would follow Him

No, we become his sheep by following him.

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

No, we become his sheep by following him.

How can a blind, deaf, person with a heart of stone, hear, see or accept the call of Our Shepard?

They can't nor will they because they are blind, deaf, slave to sin, dead in their sins

 

[Thursday]

How can a blind, deaf, person with a heart of stone, hear, see or accept the call of Our Shepard?

They can't nor will they because they are blind, deaf, slave to sin, dead in their sins

You keep repeating this falsehood. All have been made alive in Christ. He draws all men to himself. He stands at the door and knocks. His incarnation, death, and resurrection have enabled us, all men, to respond to God's grace.

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

You keep repeating this falsehood. All have been made alive in Christ. He draws all men to himself. He stands at the door and knocks. His incarnation, death, and resurrection have enabled us, all men, to respond to God's grace.

Show me a verse or verses showing that please, I have never seen that before.

And by that I mean that every person is alive in Christ

 

[Thursday]

Show me a verse or verses showing that please, I have never seen that before.

And by that I mean that every person is alive in Christ

1 Cor 15:22
For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive.

Romans 5
18Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

1 Cor 15:22
For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive.

Romans 5
18Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.

I will look into 1 Cor 15:22

Romans 5, I have no problem with:

One man died, One Man brought justification and life for all people.

All people are not saved, if all people were saved then your view points would be correct.

 

[Thursday]

I will look into 1 Cor 15:22

Romans 5, I have no problem with:

One man died, One Man brought justification and life for all people.

All people are not saved, if all people were saved then your view points would be correct.

Salvation comes to those who cooperate with God's grace. The point of Romans 5 is that this gift is offered to all. This directly contradicts Reformed dogma.

 

[PrettyboyAndy]

1 Cor 15:22
For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive.

Romans 5
18Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people.

Matthew Henry - 1 Cor 5:22

All that are by faith united to Christ, are by his resurrection assured of their own. As through the sin of the first Adam, all men became mortal, because all had from him the same sinful nature, so, through the resurrection of Christ, shall all who are made to partake of the Spirit, and the spiritual nature, revive, and live for ever.

All who are to be believers, not every person, then everyone would have the Holy Spirit of God