Really struggling with the idea of Hell

[Silverback]

Very cruel and not true

Not cruel, and very true...God does not owe us anything, and we deserve nothing from him, no deals, no negotiations, no special deals. We are saved by Gods grace, for Christ sake, through faith...it's gift, of God...and that's it.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Not cruel, and very true...God does not owe us anything, and we deserve nothing from him, no deals, no negotiations, no special deals. We are saved by Gods grace, for Christ sake, through faith...it's gift, of God...and that's it.

The lucky ones get the gift in your theology. The unlucky ones got an unjust deal.

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I've been a Christian for 3 and a half years, and for the first time, I'm starting to really wrestle with the idea of a loving God sending people to Hell. Throughout my life as a Christian, I've never questioned it. I've always thought, "Of course it's fair that God sends non-Christians to Hell! Their sins aren't paid for, so they have to take the punishment of their sins upon themselves." I never really allowed myself to think about the concept of eternal suffering too hard, because I was afraid that if I started questioning the fairness of this, I would end up leaving the faith. But recently I've started asking questions I've never let myself ask before, like: "Why do the damned suffer eternal punishment for temporal sins?" "If God knew the vast majority of people would end up in unbearable agony for all eternity, why did he ever create humankind?" "Why can't God just destroy the wicked on Judgement Day? Why keep them around for the sole purpose of torturing them?"

Today I was reading an article about the physical suffering of Jesus on the Cross, and couldn't help but think to myself, "the people in Hell will suffer just as much, if not more, than this. And while Jesus' physical torture lasted less than 24 hours, their torture will never end." I immediately tried to push this blasphemous thought out of my head, but it still lingers.

Now that I'm having these questions, it's getting much harder to walk with the Lord like I used to. It's very difficult to feel affection for God when I remember that He's going to sentence the vast majority of humanity to an eternity of unimaginable torture, with no hope of relief. I mean, how does this knowledge not drive us all insane? I can't even walk around Walmart anymore without constantly thinking to myself, "Most of the people in this store will spend eternity in Hell." I don't know what to do. I feel like I'm going crazy.

I know that no matter what my feelings tell me, my God is just and merciful. I understand that any punishment God hands out is perfectly fair. I know that He is not a sadistic monster, no matter how strongly I feel otherwise. So please do not read this post as me accusing God of those things, because I'm not. I just need to figure out how to reconcile my belief that God is good with my belief that God condemns 99% of people to eternal, conscious torment.

Sorry if this post is all jumbled or makes no sense, I'm really not in the right mental state to be forming coherent thoughts right now.

It may help to know that those who reject God send themselves to hell. God is not going to force anyone to love Him. Nor will He force them to dwell with Him forever. He has revealed His plan to the world. Some will believe and some will not. Blessings

 

[Dorothy Mae]

It may help to know that those who reject God send themselves to hell. God is not going to force anyone to love Him. Nor will He force them to dwell with Him forever. He has revealed His plan to the world. Some will believe and some will not. Blessings

This is true although some also don’t want to repent. They like what they do.

 

[fhansen]

I've been a Christian for 3 and a half years, and for the first time, I'm starting to really wrestle with the idea of a loving God sending people to Hell. Throughout my life as a Christian, I've never questioned it. I've always thought, "Of course it's fair that God sends non-Christians to Hell! Their sins aren't paid for, so they have to take the punishment of their sins upon themselves." I never really allowed myself to think about the concept of eternal suffering too hard, because I was afraid that if I started questioning the fairness of this, I would end up leaving the faith. But recently I've started asking questions I've never let myself ask before, like: "Why do the damned suffer eternal punishment for temporal sins?" "If God knew the vast majority of people would end up in unbearable agony for all eternity, why did he ever create humankind?" "Why can't God just destroy the wicked on Judgement Day? Why keep them around for the sole purpose of torturing them?"

Today I was reading an article about the physical suffering of Jesus on the Cross, and couldn't help but think to myself, "the people in Hell will suffer just as much, if not more, than this. And while Jesus' physical torture lasted less than 24 hours, their torture will never end." I immediately tried to push this blasphemous thought out of my head, but it still lingers.

Now that I'm having these questions, it's getting much harder to walk with the Lord like I used to. It's very difficult to feel affection for God when I remember that He's going to sentence the vast majority of humanity to an eternity of unimaginable torture, with no hope of relief. I mean, how does this knowledge not drive us all insane? I can't even walk around Walmart anymore without constantly thinking to myself, "Most of the people in this store will spend eternity in Hell." I don't know what to do. I feel like I'm going crazy.

I know that no matter what my feelings tell me, my God is just and merciful. I understand that any punishment God hands out is perfectly fair. I know that He is not a sadistic monster, no matter how strongly I feel otherwise. So please do not read this post as me accusing God of those things, because I'm not. I just need to figure out how to reconcile my belief that God is good with my belief that God condemns 99% of people to eternal, conscious torment.

Sorry if this post is all jumbled or makes no sense, I'm really not in the right mental state to be forming coherent thoughts right now.

Think of it this way, the source of eternal suffering would be the adamant rejection of the only true source of all goodness and eternally satisfying happiness, God, Himself. All human suffering in this world, even, is a direct result of the quasi separation or exile from God that we experience here.

 

[aiki]

It is a terrible thing, the judgment and eternal punishment of God upon the rebellious and unrepentant wicked. But it is terrible in its form, not in its enactment. God does right in judging the defiant wicked as He does, awful though His punishment of them is. We wince at the nature of His punishment, but we ought not to do so because we think God has gone too far, or is somehow less than perfect in His judgment of the unrepentant wicked. This is an evil thing to think of God, even when we do so ostensibly for reasons of compassion. Do we think we are more compassionate than God? When did we last lay down our lives for our enemies, atoning for their sin by the shedding of our blood and death on a cross? No, we are not more compassionate than God by any stretch of the imagination. Are we better able to judge the right response to our sin than He? As I've already pointed out in an earlier post, we are sinners steeped in sin, comfortable with, and even loving it, and encouraging others to partake in it, blind to much of what God thinks is vile evil. How, then, do we think we can properly judge how God, in whom there is no darkness at all (and never has been), ought to judge and punish our sin? Often, I suspect, there is dangerous pride hidden in the "compassion" of Christians who cringe apologetically at God's justice as though He's a naughty child who's ruined the neighbor's flowerbed. Where do we get off acting as though God needs someone to make an apology for Him? Or, worse, deny altogether His holy justice, as many try to do today under the banner of "Love Wins." We don't have to apologize for God's justice. Though terrible, it is right and good - perfect, even, as God is.

Genesis 18:25
25 "Far be it from You to do such a thing, to slay the righteous with the wicked, so that the righteous and the wicked are treated alike. Far be it from You! Shall not the Judge of all the earth deal justly?"

Deuteronomy 32:3-4
3 "For I proclaim the name of the LORD; Ascribe greatness to our God!
4 "The Rock! His work is perfect, For all His ways are just; A God of faithfulness and without injustice, Righteous and upright is He.

 

[Randy777]

I've been a Christian for 3 and a half years, and for the first time, I'm starting to really wrestle with the idea of a loving God sending people to Hell. Throughout my life as a Christian, I've never questioned it. I've always thought, "Of course it's fair that God sends non-Christians to Hell! Their sins aren't paid for, so they have to take the punishment of their sins upon themselves." I never really allowed myself to think about the concept of eternal suffering too hard, because I was afraid that if I started questioning the fairness of this, I would end up leaving the faith. But recently I've started asking questions I've never let myself ask before, like: "Why do the damned suffer eternal punishment for temporal sins?" "If God knew the vast majority of people would end up in unbearable agony for all eternity, why did he ever create humankind?" "Why can't God just destroy the wicked on Judgement Day? Why keep them around for the sole purpose of torturing them?"

Today I was reading an article about the physical suffering of Jesus on the Cross, and couldn't help but think to myself, "the people in Hell will suffer just as much, if not more, than this. And while Jesus' physical torture lasted less than 24 hours, their torture will never end." I immediately tried to push this blasphemous thought out of my head, but it still lingers.

Now that I'm having these questions, it's getting much harder to walk with the Lord like I used to. It's very difficult to feel affection for God when I remember that He's going to sentence the vast majority of humanity to an eternity of unimaginable torture, with no hope of relief. I mean, how does this knowledge not drive us all insane? I can't even walk around Walmart anymore without constantly thinking to myself, "Most of the people in this store will spend eternity in Hell." I don't know what to do. I feel like I'm going crazy.

I know that no matter what my feelings tell me, my God is just and merciful. I understand that any punishment God hands out is perfectly fair. I know that He is not a sadistic monster, no matter how strongly I feel otherwise. So please do not read this post as me accusing God of those things, because I'm not. I just need to figure out how to reconcile my belief that God is good with my belief that God condemns 99% of people to eternal, conscious torment.

Sorry if this post is all jumbled or makes no sense, I'm really not in the right mental state to be forming coherent thoughts right now.

We believe in a resurrection of the unrighteous to judgment as in to be condemned. The lake of fire or 2nd death. No one loves more than the Father no fault can be found in Him. His judgments are righteous. People will be judged by what they do. As in the wages of sin. In Christ there is no sin. Apart from Him one's guilt remains. It is not for man to choose how to forgive sin. Therefore Christ is the only way.

We must pay the most careful attention, therefore, to what we have heard, so that we do not drift away. 2For since the message spoken through angels was binding, and every violation and disobedience received its just punishment, 3how shall we escape if we ignore so great a salvation? This salvation, which was first announced by the Lord, was confirmed to us by those who heard him. 4God also testified to it by signs, wonders and various miracles, and by gifts of the Holy Spirit distributed according to his will.

For the most part the nations were living in darkness and ignorance with many false Gods. With theft, murder, and sexual immorality and many other sins unrestrained . God left their many sins unpunished at that time.
With light comes accountability to all. Justices to the nations. The wrath of God was made known.

"Here is my servant, whom I uphold, my chosen one in whom I delight; I will put my Spirit on him, and he will bring justice to the nations.

You must trust that the Love of God far out weights the love of man and His judgments are righteous.
God warns and warns upfront but in the end He will show Himself Holy.

In regard to judgments made I would state it will be Jesus's words that prevail.

 

[Clare73]

Hi @cerulean
There is reason to believe that Hell is not eternal torment for the human spirit, but that they are burnt up and extinguished out of existence. Rather, the fire of Hell burns eternally - principally for the fallen angels who already have eternal life.

Immortality is not eternal life.

The fallen angels do not have eternal life. Eternal life is God's life. That's what they lost in their rebellion, just as Adam did, and is why we are all born guilty of and condemned by Adam's sin (Romans 5:12-14, Romans 5:18)

This inference can be drawn from the Scripture as easily as the alternative common view that human spirits will burn forever.

Mark 9:48 is not an "inference" and does not allow for an "alternative" view. Scripture does not contradict itself.

]As for the wicked being sent to Hell, whether to be extinguished or tormented forever, its understandable your heart breaks on the matter. But imagine Yahweh's heart on the matter? Do you think you know and love these people (who are strangers to you) more than He who saw them birth?

However, a line must be drawn in the sand, for the sake of justice. Or life in New Jerusalem would end up the same as here - corrupt with wickedness, selfishness and insubordination to the Creator. And, let's face it, in 2021 the world ain't a safe and righteous place - for children or the elderly.

There must be a closure to all things and it is a terrifying fate for the proud who wish to live in defiance to the Creator. That freedom and grace they have is drawing to a close.

But rather, think on the fate that awaits the saints and rejoice. Or think on what you might be able to do to reach those lost people. Turn your sadness into productiveness perhaps.

And once again, you can easily argue from Scripture that Hell burns eternally and angels burn eternally but the human soul is burnt up (extinguished/destroyed ). Who knows if that's right, but it makes sense to me as well.

Those who believe the God-breathed Scriptures (2 Timothy 3:16) know that's not right.
The godly solution is not to trim the sail of God's truth with the jib of unbelief,
the godly solution is to trust in God.

Please take time to pour out your heart on the matter, in brutal honesty, before Yahweh. He knows what you've posted so hopefully you've said the same words to Him directly in prayer.

Love & Shalom

 

[Clare73]

All of us are justly condemned, everyone, but God has been gracious. Some people will be passed by and they will receive justice, others will receive mercy, no one receives injustice.
Faith is a gift of Gods grace, some people receive this gift, others do not. Our salvation is a done deal before our birth, remember the names of the saved were written in the book of life before the foundation of the world.

Christ defeated death, therefore the saved will be with him forever. Those receiving Gods grace, will endure to the end and ultimately receive salvation.
God does not reveal how he chose the saved, we only know it was not something special about anyone of us, certainly not our wealth, race, or our own righteousness...which is like filthy rags. However, our election was not a military muster either, where every 3rd person

was chosen...sadly, Gods choice is a mystery, unknown to us.
Gods thoughts are not our thoughts, his ways are not our ways, but if God does something it is always just, right and fair.
God makes a choice for us, we don't choose to get saved, if we had to make that decision, while dead in our trespasses and sins, then it would be likely that know one would choose Christ, and he would have died for nothing.

Very cruel and not true

Every word of it is true, being taken straight out of Biblical text.

 

[TzephanYahu]

Immortality is not eternal life.

Semantics. It's quite clear what I meant within the context.

Mark 9:48 is not an "inference"

I didn't quote that Scripture. Check again.

The godly solution is not to trim the sail of God's truth with the jib of unbelief

Sorry I don't understand you here.

Thanks for replying.

 

[Clare73]

Glad to hear you're questioning the eternal conscious torment doctrine. It really doesn't make any sense, it is a viciously stupid half-baked concept indeed. Jesus does not save from sin and death only to condemn most ppl to an unimaginably worse fate.

There's what Shrewd Manager says, and then there's what Jesus says in Mark 9:48.

Who you gonna' believe?

Believe Jesus, and trust God.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Every word of it is true, being taken straight out of Biblical text.

There is no verse that says God selects some and rejects others, but we ought not discuss this on this thread.

 

[Clare73]

Semantics. It's quite clear what I meant within the context.
I didn't quote that Scripture. Check again.

Agreed. . .you conveniently overlooked Mark 9:48.

 

[Clare73]

There is no verse that says God selects some and rejects others, but we ought not discuss this on this thread.

There is more than one; e.g., John 6:65, John 6:37, John 6:39, taken at their word.

 

[zoidar]

Guys, we are all eager to discuss views, but this section is for advice only. Please try to keep it that way.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

There is more than one; e.g., John 6:65, John 6:37, John 6:39, taken at their word.

John 3:16 says that whosoever believes in Him shall not perish. We can see therefore that God offers salvation to all who will. He is just to all and has no arbitrary favorites. So no one can accuse Him of injustice to any.

 

[GraceBro]

I've been a Christian for 3 and a half years, and for the first time, I'm starting to really wrestle with the idea of a loving God sending people to Hell. Throughout my life as a Christian, I've never questioned it. I've always thought, "Of course it's fair that God sends non-Christians to Hell! Their sins aren't paid for, so they have to take the punishment of their sins upon themselves." I never really allowed myself to think about the concept of eternal suffering too hard, because I was afraid that if I started questioning the fairness of this, I would end up leaving the faith. But recently I've started asking questions I've never let myself ask before, like: "Why do the damned suffer eternal punishment for temporal sins?" "If God knew the vast majority of people would end up in unbearable agony for all eternity, why did he ever create humankind?" "Why can't God just destroy the wicked on Judgement Day? Why keep them around for the sole purpose of torturing them?"

Today I was reading an article about the physical suffering of Jesus on the Cross, and couldn't help but think to myself, "the people in Hell will suffer just as much, if not more, than this. And while Jesus' physical torture lasted less than 24 hours, their torture will never end." I immediately tried to push this blasphemous thought out of my head, but it still lingers.

Now that I'm having these questions, it's getting much harder to walk with the Lord like I used to. It's very difficult to feel affection for God when I remember that He's going to sentence the vast majority of humanity to an eternity of unimaginable torture, with no hope of relief. I mean, how does this knowledge not drive us all insane? I can't even walk around Walmart anymore without constantly thinking to myself, "Most of the people in this store will spend eternity in Hell." I don't know what to do. I feel like I'm going crazy.

I know that no matter what my feelings tell me, my God is just and merciful. I understand that any punishment God hands out is perfectly fair. I know that He is not a sadistic monster, no matter how strongly I feel otherwise. So please do not read this post as me accusing God of those things, because I'm not. I just need to figure out how to reconcile my belief that God is good with my belief that God condemns 99% of people to eternal, conscious torment.

Sorry if this post is all jumbled or makes no sense, I'm really not in the right mental state to be forming coherent thoughts right now.

Perhaps the following two messages on eternal punishment will help. God bless.

1. https://www.livinggodministries.net...ive/audio_files/eternal_punishment_1_of_2.mp3

2. https://www.livinggodministries.net...ive/audio_files/eternal_punishment_2_of_2.mp3

 

[GirdYourLoins]

Ive always believed that the people who go to hell are the people who have knowingly rejected God and that the worst thing about being in hell would be the regret of being completely and totally separated from the presence of God while knowing what it is like for those who are in His presence.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

There are plenty of genuine Christians who do not believe in the eternal torment doctrine, including some well known theologians, and they have plenty of scripture to back them up. It wasn't something taught much until around 500 AD and the Eastern Orthodox church still doesn't.

There's a current thread about one of those theologians David Bentley Hart on Hell

You might find this lecture helpful. I know the speaker and he's like the last person I would have expected to not support the traditional view.

What do you think Jesus was talking about when he vividly described the sufferings of hell in 40 AD if you think the church more or less invented it in 500 AD?

 

[Dorothy Mae]

What if hell was not fire, what if hell was simply not being in the company of God forever? Those who reject God are not likely to miss not being with Him because they do not believe in Him anyway. Those who believe in God know that being with God forever is going to be fantastic beyond words. God does not send anyone to hell, everyone makes their own decision on where they go. BUT THE BIBLE says hell is fire and it is horrible, when the Bible was written how would you explain what it is going to be like being without God forever, you have to use words and concepts that people are going to understand. Burning forever is certainly one of the worst things a person can think of and I would suggest the being without God forever is equivalent.

Jesus didn’t describe it as merely being separated from God, someone some people don’t want to be with in the first place.