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Quick Question

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by JMireles, Dec 28, 2020.

  1. JMireles

    JMireles New Member

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    Out of curiosity, who do y'all think the Antichrist will be? I've been studying the evidence for quite some time, and have come to the conclusion that the Antichrist will be a specific Muslim figure, but I would like to know what y'all think and why.
     
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  2. Sabertooth

    Sabertooth Repartee Animal: Quipping the Saints! Supporter

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    Not it!
     
  3. Spiritual Jew

    Spiritual Jew Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The antichrist is anyone who denies that Jesus is the Christ or who does not acknowledge that Jesus Christ came in the flesh.

    1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

    2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
     
  4. Michael Collum

    Michael Collum Everything began with a voice, use yours Supporter

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    I wouldn't think it's a muslim figure since they are the spiritual successors to the gnostics the ECFs wrestled with. It is clear from the judgments of the early church that these groups did not worship the same god. Thus the Jesus of the Quran cannot be an antichrist, since it does not come from a true source. The antithesis of Christ will come from those claiming to be the people of Jesus Christ - having a form of godliness, but all of the power was sucked out of the cross long ago.

    Because there is a lack of spirituality, someone understanding hidden meanings within the scripture - will begin to make miracles happen by understanding how the mechanics of creation work calling these things forces - distorting reality at will.

    It is written that this antichrist will not serve the god of his fathers but will serve the god of forces. Thus those around him would have to be worshiping the true god, for this person to meet the requirements.

    So no to the muslim angle.
     
  5. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    The antichrist of scripture was a specific heretical spirit that affected many in the 1st century.
    The antichrist of scripture is not a present day or future singular world leader/despot/tyrant.
    Such is purely a creation of man made, unbiblical tradition.
     
  6. Michael Collum

    Michael Collum Everything began with a voice, use yours Supporter

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    Just part of the futurist way of looking at prophecy.

    If the prophecies will no longer be fulfilled, might as well throw the bible out the window.
     
  7. JMireles

    JMireles New Member

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    Very true, however, I was referring to the Antichrist in Revelation, the one referred to by Jesus and the prophet Daniel. I believe the name given is Abomination of Desolation.
     
  8. JMireles

    JMireles New Member

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    Are you sure? The evidence I've seen is rather compelling. Who then do you think it will be?
     
  9. JMireles

    JMireles New Member

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    Interesting thought. Care to expand on that? Based on my reading of Daniel and Revelation alone, he is spoken of in terms of a human figure. Furthermore, the Islamic sources I've studied point to a specific figure who matches the biblical descriptions.
     
  10. JMireles

    JMireles New Member

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    Based on your response, I get the sense I've opened Pandora's Box. In either case, your answer wins for the most amusing.
     
  11. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    I’ve always found this view fascinating.
    Why would the Bible be no good anymore when the prophesies in it were fulfilled?
    Is the gospel not “everlasting” after all?

    The Bible is chalk full of fulfilled prophesy is it not? Is not our faith wholly dependent on the fulfilled prophesies we find in scripture? The virgin birth, crucifixion and resurrection of Christ are all prophesies that will no longer be fulfilled, are they not?

    How miserable would we all be if those prophesies in the Bible were not already fulfilled and we were unable to share the good news of the risen Lord??

    Should I throw the Bible out because those prophesies were fulfilled?
    Maybe I should just throw those specific parts out? If fulfilled prophesy is no good to us anymore (as you appear to contend), we might as well throw out the chapters that teach How Christ fulfilled prophesies in his day, right?

    Again, while I find this view fascinating, I just don’t buy into the notion that fulfilled prophecies = prophecies that are no good to us anymore and should be thrown out of our Bibles.
    Unlike you, I don’t believe fulfilled prophecy renders the Bible useless.
    In fact, I believe the exact opposite.
    Without fulfilled prophesies, the Bible would indeed be useless.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2020
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  12. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

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    I’d be happy to.

    The challenge you have with supporting this contention, is that antichrist is NOT mentioned anywhere in Revelation or Daniel. Not even once.

    The Bible contains very explicit teaching on the identity of antichrist and that teaching is found in only 4 passages in the first and second epistles of John.

    There is no scriptural instruction that teaches us to apply the term antichrist to any other biblical figures besides the ones John specifically identifies as antichrist in his 1st and 2nd epistles.

    As I mentioned, such is purely a later, unbiblical invention/tradition of men.

    You most certainly have every right to base your theological views on the later added Unbiblical traditions of fallible men, but I prefer to stick to what scripture actually, specifically teaches.

    Here is a foolproof, biblical test to check to see if anyone you think might be antichrist, fits John’s biblical descriptions of antichrist.

    Instructions: Take any person you want and run them through St. John's biblical test below. A "yes" for all four questions gives a positive identification -- a single "no" disqualifies. Remember, it's the BIBLICAL test to discover antichrists.

    BIBLICAL LITMUS TEST TO DISCOVER "ANTICHRISTS"
    -- Four Questions--


    #1) Has the person departed from the apostles' flocks, defecting from the true Christian faith to join "many deceivers" after first appearing to be a member?

    "even now many antichrists have appeared ... THEY WENT OUT FROM US, but they were not really of us; for if they had been of us they would have remained with us; but they went out" (1 Jn 2:18-19)

    "For many deceivers have GONE OUT INTO THE WORLD ... this is the deceiver and the antichrist" (2 Jn 1:7)

    "but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world ... this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world" ( 1 Jn 4:1, 3)

    #2) Does this ex-church member now embrace and promote the specific heresy that makes a confession that Christ did not come in the flesh?

    "For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who don't confess that Jesus Christ came in the flesh. This is the deceiver and the Antichrist" (2 John 1:7)

    "By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit who confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit who doesn't confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God, and this is the spirit of the antichrist, of whom you have heard that it comes. Now it is in the world already. " (1 Jn 4:2-3)

    #3) Does this ex-church member, among many others who now embrace and promote the heresy about Christ not having ever come in the flesh, also try to claim the Father without having the Son (thereby denying both, according to John's teaching: Jn 15:23; Jn 5:23; Jn 8:42)?


    "This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the son Whoever denies the Son DOES NOT HAVE THE FATHER; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also." (1 Jn 2:22-23)

    #4) Does this person have a vital connection to St. John, who cites his presence in his own day as a sign that the the last hour of the endtimes is come upon the world?

    "just as you heard that antichrist is coming, EVEN NOW MANY ANTICHRSTS HAVE APPEARED; FROM THIS WE KNOW IT IS THE LAST HOUR. They went out from us," (1 Jn 2:18-19)

    HOW'D YOU SCORE?

    Remember: A "yes" for all four questions gives a positive identification -- a single "no" disqualifies.

    Do any of your modern day Muslim suspects fit this biblical description of antichrist?
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2020
  13. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    The image will be Satan's Messiah. Revelation 13:14-15

    14 It deceives the people living on earth by the miracles it is allowed to perform in the presence of the beast, and it tells them to make an image honoring the beast that was struck by the sword but came alive again.
    15 It was allowed to put breath into the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast could even speak; and it was allowed to cause anyone who would not worship the image of the beast to be put to death.
     
  14. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    The image in Revelation 13.
     
  15. Michael Collum

    Michael Collum Everything began with a voice, use yours Supporter

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    That was a good post so I'll say you win. Deep Truth must prevail, afterall.

    God bless.
     
  16. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    Most have and moved on to theology.
     
  17. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    Why did you bias it to the 1st century?

    No antichrist in the last 1900 years at all?

    What if John is actually alive today? Are you insinuating the possibility, or just denying any antichrist in the last 1900 years?
     
  18. Michael Collum

    Michael Collum Everything began with a voice, use yours Supporter

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    It will be someone born into a christian family, cultured to believe he is saved, and totally irritated that none of the spiritual stuff happens anymore. This person will by force of will make these things happen, through a process similar to the old style of witchcraft.
     
  19. Kenny'sID

    Kenny'sID Well-Known Member Supporter

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    There is always at least one in the crowd. :)

    As to ths question, I would not even try to guess at this time.
     
  20. Timtofly

    Timtofly Well-Known Member

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    This is your interpretation of Daniel? That could be any teen today playing video games hours on end.
     
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