Question for Muslims

[TG123]

I do not know if your claim was answered by Muslims here, therefore I will:

to judge a verse in the Holy Quran you need to refer to the interpretation, In this case you need to know these facts:

With regard to numbers, there is one Hell and one Paradise, but each of them has degrees and levels. Paradise is sometimes mentioned in the plural in the Sunnah, but this does not mean that there are several types of Paradise; rather this is indicative of its greatness and the various degrees and levels in it, or it is indicative of the greatness of the reward of the one who enters it, as it says in the hadeeth of Anas ibn Maalik that Umm al-Rubayyi’ bint al-Bara’ , who was the mother of Haarithah ibn Suraaqah, came to the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and said: O Prophet of Allaah, will you not tell me about Haarithah?” – who had been killed at the battle of Badr by a stray arrow. “If he is in Paradise I will bear it with patience but if it is otherwise then I shall weep long and hard for him.” He said: “O Umm Haarithah, there are gardens in Paradise – according to another report: many gardens – and your son has attained the highest Firdaws.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 2809.
Secondly:
The levels of Hell differ according to the extent of their inhabitants’ kufr in this world. The hypocrites will be in the lowest level of Hell, as our Lord has told us (interpretation of the meaning):

“Verily, the hypocrites will be in the lowest depth (grade) of the Fire; no helper will you find for them”​

[al-Nisa’ 4:145]
The least severe (in torment) of its levels – from which we seek refuge with Allaah – was mentioned by the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) in the hadeeth reported by al-Nu’maan ibn Basheer who said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The least severely punished of the people of Hell will be a man who has two shoes and shoelaces of Fire – according to another version: two live coals will be placed on the soles of his feet – because of which his brains will boil as a pot boils. He will not think that anyone is being punished more severely than him, but he will be the one who is punished most lightly.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6562; Muslim, 212. The person is named specifically in a report narrated by Muslim, where it says that this is Abu Taalib, the paternal uncle of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him), for whom Allaah will reduce the punishment because of the role he played in protecting Islam at the beginning.
Thirdly:
We know of no limit to the number of degrees and levels in Paradise. It was said that their number is equal to the number of verses in the Qur’aan, based on the hadeeth of ‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Amr, who said that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “It will be said to the companion of the Qur’aan: ‘Recite and rise in status as you used to recite in the world, and your position will be at the last verse you recite.’” Narrated by Abu Dawood, 1646; al-Tirmidhi, 2914; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.
Al-Mundhiri said in al-Targheeb: al-Khattaabi said: It said in the report that the number of verses in the Qur’aan is the number of degrees or levels of Paradise in the Hereafter, and it will be said to the reader: ‘Rise through the levels to the extent that you used to read the verses of the Qur’aan. Whoever recites all of the Qur’aan, will reach the highest degree of Paradise in the Hereafter, and whoever recites part of it will reach a level commensurate with that, and the limit of his reward will match the limit of his reading. Al-Targheeb wa’l-Tarheeb, 2/228

But this idea is subject to further discussion, because the hadeeth speaks of the manaazil (status, position) of those who memorized Qur’aan, not of their darajaat (degrees, levels). The darajah (degree or level) varies according to their efforts in this world, just as there are other acts of faith in which people vary in status, such as sincere faith, jihad and others. So we cannot say that the one who memorized the entire Qur’aan will be in the highest degrees of Paradise in absolute terms.​

The highest of the degrees of Paradise is al-Firdaws, as it was narrated that Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “… When you ask of Allaah, ask Him for al-Firdaws, for it is in the middle of Paradise and is the highest part of Paradise, and above it is the Throne of the Most Merciful, and from it spring forth the rivers of Paradise.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 2637; Muslim, 2831
What is meant by the “middle of Paradise” is the best of it, as when Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“Thus We have made you a just (and the best) nation (lit. a middle nation)”
[al-Baqarah 2:143]
The Sunnah also describes the position of those who do certain actions. For example:
1 – Faith in Allaah and belief in the Messengers:
It was narrated from Abu Sa’eed al-Khudri (may Allaah be pleased with him) that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The people of Paradise will be able to see the people in the apartments above them as you see the shining stars on the horizon in the east and the west, because of the differences in their status.” They said: “O Messenger of Allaah, is that the status of the Prophets which no one else will reach besides them?” He said: “No, by the One in Whose hand is my soul, they are men who had faith in Allaah and believed in the Messengers.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 2082; Muslim, 2831.
2 – Jihad for the sake of Allaah:
It was narrated that Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: The Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “In Paradise there are one hundred degrees which Allaah has prepared for those who strive in jihad for the sake of Allaah. The distance between each two degrees is like the distance between the heavens and the earth.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 2637.
3 – The one who sincerely desires martyrdom may also attain that.
It was narrated from Sahl ibn Haneef that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever asks Allaah sincerely for martyrdom, Allaah will cause him to reach the status of the martyrs even if he dies in his bed.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 1909.
4 – Spending for the sake of Allaah.
It was narrated that Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: The poor came to the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and said: “The rich people have taken all the highest positions. They pray as we pray, and they fast as we fast, but they have surplus wealth with which they perform Hajj and strive in jihad and give in charity…” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 807; Muslim, 595.
5 – Doing wudoo’ properly even when it is difficult, taking many steps towards the mosque and waiting for prayer after prayer.
It was narrated from Abu Hurayrah that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Shall I not tell you of something by means of which Allaah erases sins and raises you in status?” They said: “Yes, O Messenger of Allaah.” He said: “Doing wudoo’ well even when it is difficult, taking many steps to the mosques and waiting for prayer after prayer. That is (equivalent) to guarding the frontier.” Narrated by Muslim, 251.
6 – Memorizing Qur’aan
‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Amr narrated that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “It will be said to the companion of the Qur’aan: ‘Recite and rise in status as you used to recite in the world, and your position will be at the last verse you recite.’” Narrated by Abu Dawood, 1646; al-Tirmidhi, 2914; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.
The one who is keen should set his sights on the highest position in Paradise and strive to earn the pleasure of Allaah and enter the Paradise of al-Firdaws, which is the highest that Allaah has promised.


This long article is to tell you that the food, punishment, leasure is according to where a person goes, therefore dare' is food for some Hell-dwellers, ghisleen is for another, and so forth.

Assalamu Alaikum, Sunrise.

Thank you for sharing this, I read through it. It is a good article, however it does not explain away the contradiction. The chapter about ghisleen (the only food in fire for disbelievers and those who chose not to feed the poor) says that the only people who will eat it are the sinners... which would mean everyone in hell. Yet other parts of the Quran state that people in hell will eat only dari and yet others that some will only eat fire... despite the statement earlier that the only people who eat pus will be the sinners... which would include both the people who steal from orphans as well as those who are described in 88:2 who on that day will be humbled... would that not be the case for every person entering Hell?

 

[sunrise0]

where is the contradiction although I said :

the food, punishment, leasure is according to where a person goes, therefore dare' is food for some Hell-dwellers, ghisleen is for another, and so forth

in other words: both Paradise and Hell are like a building with different design for each story

 

[TG123]

where is the contradiction although I said :

the food, punishment, leasure is according to where a person goes, therefore dare' is food for some Hell-dwellers, ghisleen is for another, and so forth

in other words: both Paradise and Hell are like a building with different design for each story

Salaam Alaikum,

The contradiction is that the Quran says that the only ones eating ghisleen will be the sinners... and unless you can prove me wrong, I will assume that Islam teaches that everyone in hell is a sinner... not unlike what Christianity teaches.

If no one eats ghisleen but the sinners, it means no one but the people in hell eat it.

Yet the Quran states that some people in hell eat only dari and now ILoveBeingAMuslimah pointed out a verse that states that some will eat nothing but fire.

There is obviously a contradiction.

If you eat only dari you cannot also eat ghisleen. If you eat only fire you cannot also eat ghisleen.

Yet the Quran states that ghisleen will only be eaten by the sinners... who happen to be 100% of hell's population.

Allah Akhbar.

 

[LoAmmi]

TG, I'm not sure if what you said is a contradiction. Let's put it into other terms and perhaps you can point out where I am misunderstanding you:

Only people on the cruise will eat fish. Some people on the cruise will eat only steak. Others on the cruise will eat only chicken.

The problem you are having is the first sentence. But the phrasing is wrong. You are saying it as "People on the cruise will only eat fish" as opposed to "Only people on the cruise will eat fish". Do you see the difference?

 

[sunrise0]

TG, I'm not sure if what you said is a contradiction. Let's put it into other terms and perhaps you can point out where I am misunderstanding you:

Only people on the cruise will eat fish. Some people on the cruise will eat only steak. Others on the cruise will eat only chicken.

The problem you are having is the first sentence. But the phrasing is wrong. You are saying it as "People on the cruise will only eat fish" as opposed to "Only people on the cruise will eat fish". Do you see the difference?

well put

have you heard of the reason why Robert Gillham the Jewish embryologist embraced islam?
please search for it since posting such links is not allowed

 

[LoAmmi]

well put

have you heard of the reason why Robert Gilhom the Jewish embryologist embraced islam?
please search for it since posting such links is not allowed

I've read it, I'm unconvinced. The verses he talks about are vague at best.

 

[sunrise0]

I've read it, I'm unconvinced. The verses he talks about are vague at best.

he is the specialist and you are unconvinced ?

what makes you unconvinced ?

Please search for (scientists for Islam) or science in the Holy Quran
and you will be amazed

 

[LoAmmi]

he is the specialist and you are unconvinced ?

what makes you unconvinced ?

Please search for (scientists for Islam) or science in the Holy Quran
and you will be amazed

I won't be amazed. For many of them I have been unable to even verify the person existed. You all do your religion a disservice by trying to claim science is within it. Maybe, if you take what the text says and bend it. I read things at their base meaning, not what people can read into it.

I was once handed a pamphlet with all this stuff in it. It took me less than ten minutes to dismiss it because it was stretching the truth. If you can't convince me by the plain reading of your text, parlor tricks aren't going to do it. Makes your faith seem desperate to prove itself.

Let's look at this example. This guy claims to have found "imprints" in women who were recently with a man. And these go away after three months. And the Quran says to wait three months after divorce so it means the Quran knows these things. Is this the right guy?

Funny. A three month waiting period has been part of Judaism after marriage since before the Quran existed. So, following that, aren't you amazed at Judaism?

Of course, I can't find anything that actually proves this guy existed or said any of these things, so it becomes even more amusing.

 

[sunrise0]

niether the Holy Quran nor Prophet Muhammad or any Muslim claims that Islam is a new religion. all Prophets from Adam to Muhammad had the same message; worship the One and Only Allah and disobey satan. the differences are in the law.

Apparently you do not have the basic knowledge of the Holy Quran. please read these verses:


2: 41. And believe in what I have sent down (this Qur'an), confirming that which is with you, [the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)], and be not the first to disbelieve therein, and buy not with My Verses [the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel)] a small price (i.e. getting a small gain by selling My Verses), and fear Me and Me Alone.
this verse is adressed to the People of the Book (Jews and Christians)

2:91. And when it is said to them (the Jews), "Believe in what Allah has sent down," they say, "We believe in what was sent down to us." And they disbelieve in that which came after it, while it is the truth confirming what is with them. Say (O Muhammad Peace be upon him to them): "Why then have you killed the Prophets of Allah aforetime, if you indeed have been believers?"



3:3. It is He Who has sent down the Book (the Qur'an) to you (Muhammad with truth, confirming what came before it. And he sent down the Taurat (Torah) and the Injeel (Gospel).



3:50. And I have come confirming that which was before me of the Taurat (Torah), and to make lawful to you part of what was forbidden to you, and I have come to you with a proof from your Lord. So fear Allah and obey me.
this is in the Bible Mat 5:17



61:6. And (remember) when 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), said: "O Children of Israel! I am the Messenger of Allah unto you confirming the Taurat [(Torah) which came] before me, and giving glad tidings of a Messenger to come after me, whose name shall be Ahmed . But when he came to them with clear proofs, they said: "This is plain magic."

 

[LoAmmi]

You can claim whatever you want. Christians don't claim that theirs is a new religion either. In fact, many will go so far as to say that I am part of the new religion.

Do you believe our Torah is corrupted? That we changed things in it? Do you believe that I, and other Jews, must follow the Torah? If the Quran changed the dietary laws for Jews, it is wrong. Quite simply. The Torah was for us to keep throughout every generation.

What's funny is that these science things backfire even more when you really look into it. You trumpet the one guy that claims it, but don't talk about the 100 other scientists that write about how the guy is wrong and using faulty logic and reasoning. Desperate and dishonest.

 

[sunrise0]

You can claim whatever you want. Christians don't claim that theirs is a new religion either. In fact, many will go so far as to say that I am part of the new religion.

Do you believe our Torah is corrupted? That we changed things in it? Do you believe that I, and other Jews, must follow the Torah? If the Quran changed the dietary laws for Jews, it is wrong. Quite simply. The Torah was for us to keep throughout every generation.

What's funny is that these science things backfire even more when you really look into it. You trumpet the one guy that claims it, but don't talk about the 100 other scientists that write about how the guy is wrong and using faulty logic and reasoning. Desperate and dishonest.

I do not claim anything. I state facts our Creator told us

where is the original Book which Allah revealed to His prophet Moses (peace be upon him) and to His Prophet Jesus (peace be upon him) ?

anyone can claim what they want. it is the proof that counts. No Book from the Almighty Allah exists except the Holy Quran.
many of Books were revealed to the Prophets. they were for that period of time and special people.

in Deu{34:5} So Moses the servant of the LORD died there in
the land of Moab, according to the word of the LORD.

Moses wrote that he died !

look at what you wrote

If the Quran changed the dietary laws for Jews

you are admitting that the Torah is for Jews only.

It makes no sense that there is One Creator and different holy books.
the Holy Quran is for all humans
whether you admit it or not , Jews are minorities in the world which means the Torah is not for the entire world.
number of Christians is decreasing dramaticaly. in Europe Islam and athiesm is taking over, other parts of the world are mostly secular or Budhists or Hindus....etc

Allah told us in His Book that Islam will prevail :
9: 33. It is He Who has sent His Messenger (Muhammad

) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam), to make it superior over all religions even though the Mushrikun (polytheists, pagans, idolaters, disbelievers in the Oneness of Allah) hate (it).

to see the proofs search for:
(Jews for Islam)
Jews convert to Islam
(scientists embracing Islam)
(Major Religions of the World Ranked by Number of Adherents)

 

[LoAmmi]

I do not claim anything. I state facts our Creator told us

where is the original Book which Allah revealed to His prophet Moses (peace be upon him) and to His Prophet Jesus (peace be upon him) ?

Oh, you have the ORIGINAL book? Is it in a museum? Somehow I doubt you can claim you have the original book.

anyone can claim what they want. it is the proof that counts. No Book from the Almighty Allah exists except the Holy Quran.
many of Books were revealed to the Prophets. they were for that period of time and special people.

Yes. Anybody can claim what they want. Just like you have claimed these things.

in Deu{34:5} So Moses the servant of the LORD died there in
the land of Moab, according to the word of the LORD.

Moses wrote that he died !

Ah. So now you limit what G-d can reveal? Interesting.

look at what you wrote

you are admitting that the Torah is for Jews only.

That's right, it is.

It makes no sense that there is One Creator and different holy books.
the Holy Quran is for all humans

Makes sense to me. I'm sorry you can't see past your own bias.

whether you admit it or not , Jews are minorities in the world which means the Torah is not for the entire world.

When did I ever make the claim the Torah was for the whole world? Can I start throwing wild accusations at you for what you have claimed?

number of Christians is decreasing dramaticaly. in Europe Islam and athiesm is taking over, other parts of the world are mostly secular or Budhists or Hindus....etc

I don't care.

Allah told us in His Book that Islam will prevail :
9: 33. It is He Who has sent His Messenger (Muhammad

) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam), to make it superior over all religions even though the Mushrikun (polytheists, pagans, idolaters, disbelievers in the Oneness of Allah) hate (it).

We're told we're going to prevail in the Tanakh. Woooo! Go team.

to see the proofs search for:
(Jews for Islam)
Jews convert to Islam
(scientists embracing Islam)
(Major Religions of the World Ranked by Number of Adherents)

Why would the amount of people following a religion make it true? Why would a few people converting to a religion making it true? Why would a few crackpot scientists, who are laughed at in the scientific community, make a religion true?

Truth is truth. If one guy in a shack in Kansas has the truth, it is still the truth if he is the only one who knows it. You can have everybody in the world become Muslim, but if Islam is false it would still be false.

 

[sunrise0]

Oh, you have the ORIGINAL book? Is it in a museum? Somehow I doubt you can claim you have the original book.
Yes. Anybody can claim what they want. Just like you have claimed these things.
Ah. So now you limit what G-d can reveal? Interesting.

I am not claiming anything. it is against true belief in God to think that He sends different Books for humankind. I said and say ahgain and you proved it : Holy Books were for different nations at different times.
the Almighty Allah guranteed the reservation of His Book; the Holy Quran:
15: 9. Verily We: It is We Who have sent down the Dhikr (i.e. the Qur'an) and surely, We will guard it (from corruption).

No one on earth can come up with 2 different copies.
some enemies of Islam tried but failed

When did I ever make the claim the Torah was for the whole world? Can I start throwing wild accusations at you for what you have claimed?

I don't care.

One God and many Books

We're told we're going to prevail in the Tanakh. Woooo! Go team.

this is your golden time. enjoy it while it lasts. look at what the OT says about the Jews in Palestine:

Ezekial says:22:19 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because ye are all become dross, behold, therefore I will gather you into the midst of Jerusalem. 22:20 As they gather silver, and brass, and iron, and lead, and tin, into the midst of the furnace, to blow the fire upon it, to melt it; so will I gather you in mine anger and in my fury, and I will leave you there, and melt you. 22:21 Yea, I will gather you, and blow upon you in the fire of my wrath, and ye shall be melted in the midst therof22:22 As silver is melted in the midst of the furnace, so shall ye be melted in the midst thereof; and ye shall know that I the LORD have poured out my fury upon you.[/font]

This is what will happen on the Day of Wrath. At this point there is a question: What will happen to the remnant of the children of Israel who will remain in the land after the Day of Wrath? What will be the fate of the Zionists after that day?
The prophecies describe the fate of the people of Israel when the Day of Wrath arrives, in the following manner:
Isaiah says that most of them will be exterminated and punished, except for a small number of them: 24:1 Behold, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof 24:5 The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have transgressed the laws, changed the ordinance, broken the everlasting covenant. 24:6 Therefore hath the curse devoured the earth, and they that dwell therein are desolate: therefore the inhabitants of the earth are burned, and few men left.

Zechariah is more specific, he divides them into thirds:3:8 And it shall come to pass, that in all the land, saith the LORD, two parts therein shall be cut off and die; but the third shall be left therein.13:9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.

According to Ezekial5:2 Thou shalt burn with fire a third part in the midst of the city, when the days of the siege are fulfilled: and thou shalt take a third part, and smite about it with a knife: and a third part thou shalt scatter in the wind; and I will draw out a sword after them. 5:3 Thou shalt also take thereof a few in number, and bind them in thy skirts. 5:4 Then take of them again, and cast them into the midst of the fire, and burn them in the fire; for thereof shall a fire come forth into all the house of Israel.

Zephaniah says concerning the surviving remnant in Jerusalem 3:12 I will also leave in the midst of thee an afflicted and poor people, and they shall trust in the name of the LORD.3:13 The remnant of Israel shall not do iniquity, nor speak lies; neither shall a deceitful tongue be found in their mouth: for they shall feed and lie down, and none shall make them afraid.

This faithful remnant is also described by Isaiah 6:11 Then said I, Lord, how long? And he answered , Until the cities be wasted without inhabitant, and the houses without man, and the land be utterly desolate, 6:12 And the LORD have removed men far away, and there be a great forsaking in the midst of the land.6:13 But yet in it shall be a tenth, and it shall return, and shall be eaten: as a teil tree, and as an oak, whose substance is in them, when they cast their leaves: so the holy seed shall be the substance thereof.

Deu:[FONT='Times New Roman','serif']28:68 And the LORD shall bring thee into Egypt again with ships, by the way whereof I spake unto thee, Thou shalt see it no more again: and there ye shall be sold unto your enemies for bondmen and bondwomen, and no man shall buy you.


this is enough for now

 

[LoAmmi]

Tell you what. The minute you let a Jewish source be your guide for the Quran, I'll let a Muslim source be my guide for the Tanakh.

What you posted at the end there is taking part of it and leaving EVERYTHING else. Do you even care how many chapters there are in Ezekiel? No, just the ones that show the dispersion of the Jewish people, that's the one you want and you're applying it forward because... well, because you don't care what it really says, you just want it to say what Islam wants. But it doesn't. I've read the Prophets, I've read the whole book not just whatever agrees with me.

You are leaving out the parts where it says we will have ten men from all nations grab hold of our sleeves and ask to come with us, because they know G-d is with us. You are leaving out the part where everybody recognizes that we have been right all along. You're leaving out the part where G-d restores us to Israel, the Temple is rebuilt, and peace reigns. Why leave that out? Because you probably haven't even really read it, and that guy you're quoting either hasn't or is leaving it out intentionally. What rubbish.

I again say your tactics are doing your religion a disservice.

 

[TG123]

TG, I'm not sure if what you said is a contradiction. Let's put it into other terms and perhaps you can point out where I am misunderstanding you:

Only people on the cruise will eat fish. Some people on the cruise will eat only steak. Others on the cruise will eat only chicken.

The problem you are having is the first sentence. But the phrasing is wrong. You are saying it as "People on the cruise will only eat fish" as opposed to "Only people on the cruise will eat fish". Do you see the difference?

Shalom, LoAmmi.

I think you have a point.

I am going to retract my allegation that on the issue of food for people in hell, the Quran contradicts itself. On this issue, it is consistent and non-contradictory.

Thank you LoAmmi as well as ILoveBeingAMuslimah and Sunrise for a great discussion, and for educating me and pointing out where I was wrong.