Prove to me evolution is true

[aintzaJainkoari]

If evolution and bajillions of years true, prove it to me, prove that it's true, and don't just say, "because all the scientists say it's true", because that's not proof.

Here's some logic proof and some laws of nature that prove evolution false:

Evolution goes against...

The Law of Biogenesis- that life that has a beginning can only arise from other life

The fact that mutated traits are more often harmful than beneficial

A BIG ONE: The Fossil Record, show me proof of intermediate species, has anyone ever found a fossil of an intermediate species, and that really is one, not all those ape skeletons they keep finding in Africa.

And Irreducible Complexity- organisms could not have evolved new body parts, abilities, etc. over time. They would have had to have them all perfectly in the first organism of their kind, because that organism would have died if it did not have all the necessary body parts and functions, and it's descendants, which would have the same problems if that organism could reproduce at all, would also die.

So prove to me that whatever you're talking about is true, don't use the appeal to authority or popularity fallacies.

 

[metherion]

http://talkorigins.org/indexcc/list.html

Go there. Click on the first claim and read them all through.

Go get some edjumacation.
Note: that statment was not meant to imply that you are stupid. It was meant to be humorous suggestion to increase your knowledge.

Metherion

 

[peter22]

http://talkorigins.org/indexcc/list.html

Go there. Click on the first claim and read them all through.

Go get some edjumacation.
Note: that statment was not meant to imply that you are stupid. It was meant to be humorous suggestion to increase your knowledge.

Metherion

That is a great site metherion. I wish everybody would at least have a cursory glance at it.

 

[Logic_Fault]

Edit: Reposted from here since you made a new thread.

Oh, yeah, and what scientific proof are you talking about?

The vast quantities of it that are stored in scientific journals and biology books world wide.

Show me some, tell me some, and don't just say "Well, duh, evolution!"

If evolution and bajillions of years is what you're talking about, prove it to me, prove that it's true, and don't just say, because all the scientists say it's true, because that's not proof.

To start with, see: TalkOrigins.org. Once you've digested that you can start reading the scientific research that's been performed. Make sure you have a good understanding of biology and genetics before you attempt that part though.

Give me proof by logic that evolution is true if that's what you're talking about.

"Proof," logical or otherwise, does not a scientific fact make as nothing is ever proven 100%, with the exception, perhaps, of mathematics. Evidence on the other hand...

Examples:

Evolution goes against...

The Law of Biogenesis- that life that has a beginning can only arise from other life

I see you have no understanding of the theory of evolution. Evolutionary theory says nothing about the beginning of life here or anywhere else. It assumes, with good reason, that life already exists; it then explains why we see the diversity we see.

The fact that mutated traits are more often harmful than beneficial

That's not what the research says. In fact, as I understand it, it's the opposite. The vast majority of mutations are neutral while a small percentage are helpful. Another rather small portion are harmful.

You yourself carry a good number of mutations (around 150 is the number I want to say, though I can't say where I got that figure), along with anything else that's ever been born.

A BIG ONE: The Fossil Record, show me proof of intermediate species, has anyone ever found a fossil of an intermediate species, and that really is one, not all those ape skeletons they keep finding in Africa.

Tiktaalik, Archaeopteryx, all of the ones here and, of course, you yourself are a "transitional."

And Irreducible Complexity- organisms could not have evolved new body parts, abilities, etc. over time. They would have had to have them all perfectly in the first organism of their kind, because that organism would have died if it did not have all the necessary body parts and functions, and it's descendants, which would have the same problems if that organism could reproduce at all, would also die.

Read here. And please, stop using such poor arguments.

So prove to me that whatever you're talking about is true, don't use the appeal to authority

It seems you're misapplying this fallacy. Appeal to authority is perfectly valid if said authority is, well, an authority on the subject. A professor of biology with a degree from an accredited university, and who actually teaches the subject, is a good authority. A biological scientist working on actual evolutionary experiments is, of course, a much better authority.

An ID supporter who has a "degree" in Theology, engineering, statistics or another field unrelated to biology is a poor authority and the fallacy would apply if you attempted to use such a person to support your statements.

or popularity fallacies,

I can't recall the last time I've seen anyone seriously say, "evolution is true because 'X' number of people believe it." I do recall a list of "scientists" passed around by the ID crowd stating that 'X' number of "scientists" doubted evolution, thereby implying that there's something wrong with the theory.

 

[Punchy]

If evolution and bajillions of years true, prove it to me, prove that it's true, and don't just say, "because all the scientists say it's true", because that's not proof.

29+ Evidences for Macroevolution

The Scientific Case for Common Descent

Version 2.87

Copyright © 1999-2006 by Douglas Theobald, Ph.D. [Last Update: December 7, 2006]
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/comdesc/

 

[ranmaonehalf]

If evolution and bajillions of years true, prove it to me, prove that it's true, and don't just say, "because all the scientists say it's true", because that's not proof.

Here's some logic proof and some laws of nature that prove evolution false:

Evolution goes against...

The Law of Biogenesis- that life that has a beginning can only arise from other life

The fact that mutated traits are more often harmful than beneficial

A BIG ONE: The Fossil Record, show me proof of intermediate species, has anyone ever found a fossil of an intermediate species, and that really is one, not all those ape skeletons they keep finding in Africa.

And Irreducible Complexity- organisms could not have evolved new body parts, abilities, etc. over time. They would have had to have them all perfectly in the first organism of their kind, because that organism would have died if it did not have all the necessary body parts and functions, and it's descendants, which would have the same problems if that organism could reproduce at all, would also die.

So prove to me that whatever you're talking about is true, don't use the appeal to authority or popularity fallacies.

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and that pretty much sums it up.

 

[WhiteMageGirl]

Why even respond to such a ignorant OP.

So prove to me that whatever you're talking about is true, don't use the appeal to authority or popularity fallacies.

And why doesn't this apply to you and your post? PRATTs don't help you post either.

If you can really present a case for creationism based on evidence, take my challenge. However, you have already effectively demonstrated that you do not meet the requirements so it would be pointless if you did.

 

[Pseudonym]

A BIG ONE: The Fossil Record, show me proof of intermediate species, has anyone ever found a fossil of an intermediate species, and that really is one, not all those ape skeletons they keep finding in Africa.

Hate to break it to you: Homo sapiens sapiens is an intermediate species.

 

[Lucretius]

Well, he is 15 years old; we shouldn't be too hard on him.

 

[lemmings]

Well, he is 15 years old; we shouldn't be too hard on him.

He is still a Frosh until August…. HAZE HIM!!!




Evidence for evolution… The HIV virus has yet to be cured because it is constantly developing a resistance to our medications.

 

[WhiteMageGirl]

Well, he is 15 years old; we shouldn't be too hard on him.

He should atleast be finished with high school like me at 15. I would've finished sooner but my parents enrolled me at a christian private school for a semester(worst time of my life) and because people thought I was 'slow' until the 5th grade.

 

[Pseudonym]

Finished with high school at 15? Where are you from? Most people in the U.S. finish at 17.

 

[DrunkenWrestler]

Assume that we do "prove" evolution is true. Are you willing to accept it? The answer seems to be no, so why should we bother entertaining you?

Evolution goes against...

The Law of Biogenesis- that life that has a beginning can only arise from other life

The fact that mutated traits are more often harmful than beneficial

A BIG ONE: The Fossil Record, show me proof of intermediate species, has anyone ever found a fossil of an intermediate species, and that really is one, not all those ape skeletons they keep finding in Africa.

And Irreducible Complexity- organisms could not have evolved new body parts, abilities, etc. over time. They would have had to have them all perfectly in the first organism of their kind, because that organism would have died if it did not have all the necessary body parts and functions, and it's descendants, which would have the same problems if that organism could reproduce at all, would also die.

So prove to me that whatever you're talking about is true, don't use the appeal to authority or popularity fallacies.

You wanna talk logic? Don't use strawmen.

 

[Wiccan_Child]

Oh wow *rolls up sleeves*

If evolution and bajillions of years true, prove it to me, prove that it's true, and don't just say, "because all the scientists say it's true", because that's not proof.

1) The scientific community defines Evolution to be: a change in the frequency of alleles of a population*
2) We have empirically observed at least one instance of Evolution as defined in (1).
3) Therefore, Evolution is a fact (i.e., is 'true').
QED

*other people undoubtedly word it differently, but the concept is the same

Here's some logic proof and some laws of nature that prove evolution false:

Evolution goes against...

The Law of Biogenesis- that life that has a beginning can only arise from other life

Elaborate. Evolution only deals with the actions of imperfect replicators; their origin is quite irrelevant.

The fact that mutated traits are more often harmful than beneficial

Your source? To my knowledge, the reality is neither: mutations are very, very often have no effect whatsoever (mainly due to the prevalence of junk &/or 'switched off' DNA).

A BIG ONE: The Fossil Record, show me proof of intermediate species, has anyone ever found a fossil of an intermediate species, and that really is one, not all those ape skeletons they keep finding in Africa.

Define 'intermediate species'. Are these what you want?:

In fact, here's a rather amazing (I just this minute found it) Wikipedia article that has a list of transitional fossils: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_transitional_fossils

And Irreducible Complexity- organisms could not have evolved new body parts, abilities, etc. over time. They would have had to have them all perfectly in the first organism of their kind, because that organism would have died if it did not have all the necessary body parts and functions, and it's descendants, which would have the same problems if that organism could reproduce at all, would also die.

I have emboldened the fallicious part: the organism would not necessarily die. Bacteria survive very well without gills, brains, eyes, lungs, muscles, a gut, an anus, etc. And yet, if you remove them from us, we will almost certainly die.

So prove to me that whatever you're talking about is true, don't use the appeal to authority or popularity fallacies.

Trust me, it is not us who does this.

 

[RedBalfour]

I can't say anything more than my fellow Evolutionists have said...

But! Disprove evolution to me. dont say the bible, because i can disprove that, and then we'll all go off topic and get modded

 

[Atheuz]

Why is it that the burden of proof always gets transfered to Evolutionists when we have nearly all scientific evidence to back it up - But the Religious counterpart has nearly none!

 

[RedAndy]

Evolution goes against...

The Law of Biogenesis- that life that has a beginning can only arise from other life.

Previous posters are technically correct that the question of the origin of life is irrelevant to the theory of evolution, but I'll take up this point anyway.

Pasteur's law of biogenesis only deals with what was called "spontaneous generation." For example, if you had a piece of rotting meat, some people before Pasteur believed that the maggots that would infest the meat had somehow formed themselves out of the meat, and not (as we now know) hatched from eggs laid by flies.

Spontaneous generation deals with the arisal of complex life forms from non-living matter; the present theories of abiogenesis deal with the formation of living organisms through gradual chemical processes. These are two different ideas, and to conflate them is at best misunderstanding, at worst dishonesty.

Here is an article about spontaneous generation and abiogenesis for you to read at leisure.

 

[chunkylee]

Why is it that the burden of proof always gets transfered to Evolutionists when we have nearly all scientific evidence to back it up - But the Religious counterpart has nearly none!

<speculation>I would say that it's due to the indoctrination of these messages: evolution has no evidence, evolution directly opposes the bible, and evolution lowers a person's moral standing to that of an animal's. These are what I've seen to be the most prevalent (and false) ideas backing people who are adamant against the theory of evolution. </speculation>

 

[Dannager]

My hit-n-run-creationist alarm is going off!

 

[bindaniel]

Evolution must be true: because T-tex soft tissue defies the laws of forensic science in decomposition.

1) Evo`s=It must have been trapped in somekind of chemical stew as yet undefined.
2) Soft tissue was not subject to embalming or lead coffin burial.
3) it only takes 36/48 hrs to get a DNA result and maybe weeks longer for deeper analysis if one might get smaller amounts. A quick google search does not seem to indicate such a test being done either way to confirm or deny.
If DNA was found would that confirm thousands of years instead of millions?