Premillennialism ignores the tenses in the original Greek in order to sustain its teaching

[sovereigngrace]

As long as you agree no more procreation ever.

Your billions of wicked mortals are prohibited from the age to come and the new earth. Only the righteous are qualified to inherit the new earth. Mortals and the wicked do not survive the coming of Christ or are qualified to populate the new earth as you allege. They are destroyed by fire. We have repeatedly showed you that and you have rejected what the text is stating. You are promoting personal opinion here to sustain your beliefs.

Proverbs 2:21-22 states: “For the upright shall dwell in the land, and the perfect shall remain in it. But the wicked shall be cut off from the earth, and the transgressors shall be rooted out of it.”

Even in the Old Testament, when the new age or world is mentioned, it is always identified exclusively with the righteous. This is not strange when we consider it is a prepared place for a prepared people. This is an arrangement where the wicked and wickedness are prohibited from.

Psalm 37:9-11 says, “For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait `upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth. For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be. But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.”

Again, this is a truth that is repeated clearly and unambiguously throughout both Testaments.

Psalm 37:22 says, “For such as be blessed of him shall inherit the earth; and they that be cursed of him shall be cut off.”

The wicked are not worthy to inherit the new glorified earth and the perfect age to come.

Psalm 37:28-36 continues, “For the LORD loveth judgment, and forsaketh not his saints; they are preserved for ever: but the seed of the wicked shall be cut off. The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever ... Wait on the LORD, and keep his way, and he shall exalt thee to inherit the land: when the wicked are cut off, thou shalt see it.”

Here, “evildoers” and “the wicked” are synonymous titles that refer to the unrighteous whereas the designations “those that wait upon the LORD,” “the meek” and “His saints” refer to the righteous. The meek are the glorified believers. They are the antithesis of the wicked. Can you not see that? There are only ever 2 peoples. The meek alone possess the new earth - those that have been redeemed by His precious blood.

Psalm 25:12-13 says: “What man is he that feareth the LORD? him shall he teach in the way that he shall choose. His soul shall dwell at ease; and his seed shall inherit the earth.”

This is the truth that is repeated by Christ in the New Testament. We see that confirmed in Matthew 5:5 saying, “Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.”

This current earth must be perfected. It must be glorified. It must be brought back to the paradise it was before the fall. Every time Scripture speaks of the believer receiving his inheritance (the kingdom/earth) it also shows the wicked receiving their eternal punishment.

The glorified saints are said to inherit the earth. This is assuredly talking about a new glorified earth, not this current corrupt arrangement that they have just departed. Their inheritance is not another period of corruption, rebellion and despair. They have just escaped that. The promised earth in view is actually depicted as a reward for the faithful. It cannot therefore be shared with the wicked.

1 Corinthians 6:9 also confirms: “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?”

According to Scripture the ungodly are forbidden from this new glorified earth. The wicked are left outside the eternal kingdom.

When Jesus comes it is the end! The sheep “inherit the kingdom” (Matthew 25:34) and “life eternal” (Matthew 25:46) whereas the goats are cast “into everlasting fire” (Matthew 25:41) and receive “everlasting punishment” (Matthew 25:46).

1 Corinthians 15:50 declares, “flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.”

This reading makes plain, “flesh and blood” or mortal believers cannot inherit a glorified earth that has been purified by fire of every last vestige of the curse. Man in his sinful corruptible state cannot inherit an incorruptible regenerated earth. Nothing could be plainer.

The new earth and the age to come is reserved solely for God’s people. The wicked will not see Christ’s face in the new arrangement because they are not qualified to inherit it. They will be destroyed at His glorious second advent.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

Is there a literal camp of the saints? Is there a literal beloved city? Unless these are symbolic terms for some spiritual application, these are literal places that are about to be surrounded by a very large amount of literal people.

Revelation 20 declares they live some where, and you know that it does. You do not seem to want to call that somewhere, Jerusalem. I still am not sure why you think Revelation 20 has to spell everything out to satisfy those, who are dead set against the words that are found in the chapter.

It's a figurative description of unbelievers worldwide opposing the church.

Tell me, if Revelation 20:7-9 is all meant to be taken literally and if the beloved city was somehow earthly Jerusalem, then how exactly would a number of people "as the sand of the sea" all gather together around Jerusalem? Please explain the logistics of that to me. How would that many people all fit in that location? It's absurd to take that literally.

Revelation 20 does not say Jesus is the first resurrection.

Other scripture like Acts 26:23, 1 Cor 15:20, Col 1:18 and Rev 1:5 say that Jesus is the first resurrection. Should other scripture just be ignored when interpreting Revelation 20 and determining what the first resurrection refers to?

 

[Timtofly]

Contrary to what you promote, there is no more procreation after we die.

Not what I said. I meant ever. Who never dies?

 

[Timtofly]

Your billions of wicked mortals are prohibited from the age to come and the new earth. Only the righteous are qualified to inherit the new earth. Mortals and the wicked do not survive the coming of Christ or are qualified to populate the new earth as you allege. They are destroyed by fire. We have repeatedly showed you that and you have rejected what the text is stating. You are promoting personal opinion here to sustain your beliefs.

Proverbs 2:21-22 states: “For the upright shall dwell in the land, and the perfect shall remain in it. But the wicked shall be cut off from the earth, and the transgressors shall be rooted out of it.”

Even in the Old Testament, when the new age or world is mentioned, it is always identified exclusively with the righteous. This is not strange when we consider it is a prepared place for a prepared people. This is an arrangement where the wicked and wickedness are prohibited from.

Psalm 37:9-11 says, “For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait `upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth. For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be. But the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.”

Again, this is a truth that is repeated clearly and unambiguously throughout both Testaments.

Psalm 37:22 says, “For such as be blessed of him shall inherit the earth; and they that be cursed of him shall be cut off.”

The wicked are not worthy to inherit the new glorified earth and the perfect age to come.

Psalm 37:28-36 continues, “For the LORD loveth judgment, and forsaketh not his saints; they are preserved for ever: but the seed of the wicked shall be cut off. The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever ... Wait on the LORD, and keep his way, and he shall exalt thee to inherit the land: when the wicked are cut off, thou shalt see it.”

Here, “evildoers” and “the wicked” are synonymous titles that refer to the unrighteous whereas the designations “those that wait upon the LORD,” “the meek” and “His saints” refer to the righteous. The meek are the glorified believers. They are the antithesis of the wicked. Can you not see that? There are only ever 2 peoples. The meek alone possess the new earth - those that have been redeemed by His precious blood.

Psalm 25:12-13 says: “What man is he that feareth the LORD? him shall he teach in the way that he shall choose. His soul shall dwell at ease; and his seed shall inherit the earth.”

This is the truth that is repeated by Christ in the New Testament. We see that confirmed in Matthew 5:5 saying, “Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.”

This current earth must be perfected. It must be glorified. It must be brought back to the paradise it was before the fall. Every time Scripture speaks of the believer receiving his inheritance (the kingdom/earth) it also shows the wicked receiving their eternal punishment.

The glorified saints are said to inherit the earth. This is assuredly talking about a new glorified earth, not this current corrupt arrangement that they have just departed. Their inheritance is not another period of corruption, rebellion and despair. They have just escaped that. The promised earth in view is actually depicted as a reward for the faithful. It cannot therefore be shared with the wicked.

1 Corinthians 6:9 also confirms: “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God?”

According to Scripture the ungodly are forbidden from this new glorified earth. The wicked are left outside the eternal kingdom.

When Jesus comes it is the end! The sheep “inherit the kingdom” (Matthew 25:34) and “life eternal” (Matthew 25:46) whereas the goats are cast “into everlasting fire” (Matthew 25:41) and receive “everlasting punishment” (Matthew 25:46).

1 Corinthians 15:50 declares, “flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.”

This reading makes plain, “flesh and blood” or mortal believers cannot inherit a glorified earth that has been purified by fire of every last vestige of the curse. Man in his sinful corruptible state cannot inherit an incorruptible regenerated earth. Nothing could be plainer.

The new earth and the age to come is reserved solely for God’s people. The wicked will not see Christ’s face in the new arrangement because they are not qualified to inherit it. They will be destroyed at His glorious second advent.

There are not billions of wicked in the 1000 year reign. You have literally no proof of that. You keep saying "my wicked", and I keep saying no wicked. They are your wicked in your own millennium, called the here and now. They all are about to die in your interpretation.

 

[Timtofly]

It's a figurative description of unbelievers worldwide opposing the church.

Tell me, if Revelation 20:7-9 is all meant to be taken literally and if the beloved city was somehow earthly Jerusalem, then how exactly would a number of people "as the sand of the sea" all gather together around Jerusalem? Please explain the logistics of that to me. How would that many people all fit in that location? It's absurd to take that literally.

Other scripture like Acts 26:23, 1 Cor 15:20, Col 1:18 and Rev 1:5 say that Jesus is the first resurrection. Should other scripture just be ignored when interpreting Revelation 20 and determining what the first resurrection refers to?

You take it literally by claiming billions. So perhaps you are wrong in your head count? It is still figurative of a huge army. You could scale back your objection, since you have decided how many are going to march and fit any way.

 

[Timtofly]

Other scripture like Acts 26:23, 1 Cor 15:20, Col 1:18 and Rev 1:5 say that Jesus is the first resurrection. Should other scripture just be ignored when interpreting Revelation 20 and determining what the first resurrection refers to?

No, I do not ignore John 3 which describes a physical and spiritual aspect to life.

 

[sovereigngrace]

There are not billions of wicked in the 1000 year reign. You have literally no proof of that. You keep saying "my wicked", and I keep saying no wicked. They are your wicked in your own millennium, called the here and now. They all are about to die in your interpretation.

How many wicked are there in your future millennium then?

 

[sovereigngrace]

Not what I said. I meant ever. Who never dies?

Stop avoiding the issue. Where in The Bible does it teach that resurrected beings can procreate?

 

[sovereigngrace]

No, I do not ignore John 3 which describes a physical and spiritual aspect to life.

That is nothing to do with what he was saying. You're always diverting away from the issues.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

You take it literally by claiming billions.

I didn't give a number. You need to pay attention to who you're talking to. But, surely, a number "as the sand of the sea" would have to be a huge number. Too many to realistically all travel to Israel to surround Jerusalem. If not billions, then how many? Let's say it's 500 million. Is that more reasonable to you? I would still ask how that would happen logistically. Explain the scenario to me as you understand it and how it would work exactly.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

No, I do not ignore John 3 which describes a physical and spiritual aspect to life.

Where did I say anything about John 3? I didn't. Do you just skim over what people say to you and not read anything carefully?

I was talking about verses like the following which teach that Jesus Himself is the first resurrection because He was the first to rise from the dead unto bodily immortality.

Acts 26:23 That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.

 

[Spiritual Jew]

Not what I said. I meant ever. Who never dies?

You believe that the ones who will initially populate an earthly millennial kingdom in the future are mortal people who have been resurrected, right? And you believe those people will have children during the thousand years, right? If so, then why are you trying to avoid talking about that?

 

[sovereigngrace]

You believe that the ones who will initially populate an earthly millennial kingdom in the future are mortal people who have been resurrected, right? And you believe those people will have children during the thousand years, right? If so, then why are you trying to avoid talking about that?

I know! Because it is totally extra-biblical. He has zero Scripture. Nada!

 

[Spiritual Jew]

I know! Because it is totally extra-biblical. He has zero Scripture. Nada!

And I think he knows that he can't provide any scriptural support for his opinion. I wouldn't want to talk about it, either, if I believed something like he does that I couldn't support with any scripture.

 

[Timtofly]

How many wicked are there in your future millennium then?

None.

 

[Timtofly]

Stop avoiding the issue. Where in The Bible does it teach that resurrected beings can procreate?

Where in the Scriptures can beings with incorruptible bodies not have the ability to procreate? The reason for humanity on earth has not changed since Genesis 1.

 

[sovereigngrace]

None.

Really? You obviously have not read Revelation 20 thorough and you clearly have no understanding of what a wicked person is then. Jesus outlines that there are countless millions of wicked in the millennium. In fact, they grow to such a degree that they are as the sand of the sea.

1. Do people who reject Jesus and turn against Him sin?
2. Do people who listen to Satan and submit to his deception sin?

 

[sovereigngrace]

Where in the Scriptures can beings with incorruptible bodies not have the ability to procreate? The reason for humanity on earth has not changed since Genesis 1.

That is ridiculous. You are the one making the allegations. The burden of proof is with you. You thought up this absurdity. You invented this extra-biblical theory. Obviously you are arguing from silence. You have nothing! So, where does it teach this in the Bible that resurrected redeemed believers procreate and produce billions of wicked satanists?

 

[sovereigngrace]

Where in the Scriptures can beings with incorruptible bodies not have the ability to procreate? The reason for humanity on earth has not changed since Genesis 1.

There is no room for mortals, wicked, death, marriage or procreation in the age to come. You force it into that age where it is not allowed. You ducked around multiple Scriptures above that I presented that exposes your argument.

 

[Timtofly]

I didn't give a number. You need to pay attention to who you're talking to. But, surely, a number "as the sand of the sea" would have to be a huge number. Too many to realistically all travel to Israel to surround Jerusalem. If not billions, then how many? Let's say it's 500 million. Is that more reasonable to you? I would still ask how that would happen logistically. Explain the scenario to me as you understand it and how it would work exactly.

Is this argument about the city or the number? You know as much about it as I do. The point is that this deception happens after the 1,000 years. It is not even a part of the millennium issue amil have. Not sure why Amil even bring it up?