predestination...

[Skillganon]

Just so everyone knows, that has looked at the site Skill gave, the guy I posted has taken 5 text of the Qur'an and combined them, to make a more acurate Qur'an, since there are so many different translations of the Qur'an, so it will not be exactly the same thing, but it is actually better than just reading one version of it.

LOL!
Thank's for admitting that:
1.Basicly christian missionary made it all up!

 

[BigChrisfilm]

LOL!
Thank's for admitting that:
1.Basicly christian missionary made it all up!

Yea, they took all of you different translations, and made a more correct version, why don't you post like, 3 of the same verse from you Qur'an, from three different sites, so everyone can see how different they are?

 

[Skillganon]

Yea, they took all of you different translations, and made a more correct version, why don't you post like, 3 of the same verse from you Qur'an, from three different sites, so everyone can see how different they are?

LOL!
Thank's for admitting that:
1.Basicly christian missionary made it all up!
2. They are Liars and have no way to back up their claim other than commiting blatant lies, and deciet! Is that what Jesus(pbuh) thought you!

I wan't HONEST GOD FEARING CHRISTIAN TO ANSWER, not this joker!

 

[BigChrisfilm]

LOL!
Thank's for admitting that:
1.Basicly christian missionary made it all up!
2. They are Liars and have no way to back up their claim other than commiting blatant lies, and deciet! Is that what Jesus(pbuh) thought you!

I wan't HONEST GOD FEARING CHRISTIAN TO ANSWER, not this joker!

Well since I knew Skill wouldn't do it, I went through the liberty of doing it for him,

(Surrah 6:39)
http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=14&sid=6

Those who reject our Sings are deaf and dumb,- in the midst of darkness profound: whom Allah willeth, He leaveth to wander: whom He willeth, He placeth on the Way that is Straight.

http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=15&sid=6

And they who reject Our communications are deaf and dumb, in utter darkness; whom Allah pleases He causes to err and whom He pleases He puts on the right way.

http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=16&sid=6

Those who reject Our Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.) are deaf and dumb in darkness. Allâh sends astray whom He wills and He guides on the Straight Path whom He wills.



(Surrah 6:48)
http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=14&sid=6

We send the messengers only to give good news and to warn: so those who believe and mend (their lives),- upon them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.

http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=15&sid=6

And We send not messengers but as announcers of good news and givers of warning, then whoever believes and acts aright, they shall have no fear, nor shall they grieve.

http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=16&sid=6

And We send not the Messengers but as givers of glad tidings and as warners. So whosoever believes and does righteous good deeds, upon such shall come no fear, nor shall they grieve.



(Surrah 6:49)
http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=14&sid=6

But those who reject Our Signs,- them shall punishment touch, for that they ceased not from transgressing.

http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=15&sid=6

And (as for) those who reject Our communications, chastisement shall afflict them because they transgressed.

http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=16&sid=6

But those who reject Our Ayât (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.), the torment will touch them for their disbelief (and for their belying the Message of Muhammad ). [Tafsir Al-Qurtubî].

Two things should be noted here, one, none of these contradict anything that I posted earlier, and two, you should see that these verses different just enuff, to be different. Also, these three different translations came from the same site, a site that some muslims on here gave to me.

 

[Skillganon]

You missed 4:88

 

[BigChrisfilm]

You missed 4:88

(Surrah 4:88)
http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=14&sid=4

Why should ye be divided into two parties about the Hypocrites? Allah hath cost them of their (evil) deeds. Would ye guide those whom Allah hath thrown out of the Way? For those whom Allah hath thrown out of the Way, never shalt thou find the Way.

http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=15&sid=4

What is the matter with you, then, that you have become two parties about the hypocrites, while Allah has made them return (to unbelief) for what they have earned? Do you wish to guide him whom Allah has caused to err? And whomsoever Allah causes to err, you shall by no means find a way for him.

http://www.theholyquran.org/?x=s_main&y=s_middle&kid=16&sid=4

Then what is the matter with you that you are divided into two parties about the hypocrites? Allâh has cast them back (to disbelief) because of what they have earned. Do you want to guide him whom Allâh has made to go astray? And he whom Allâh has made to go astray, you will never find for him any way (of guidance).

 

[Skillganon]

And the point is?

 

[BigChrisfilm]

prove that no one made up anything.

 

[Skillganon]

The Disbelievers will be Deaf and Mute in Darkness

Allah said,

[وَالَّذِينَ كَذَّبُواْ بِـْايَـتِنَا صُمٌّ وَبُكْمٌ فِى الظُّلُمَـتِ]

(Those who reject Our Ayat are deaf and dumb in darkness.) due to their ignorance, little knowledge and minute comprehension. Their example is that of the deaf-mute who cannot hear nor speak, as well as being blinded by darkness. Therefore, how can such a person find guidance to the path or change the condition he is in Allah said in other Ayat,

[مَثَلُهُمْ كَمَثَلِ الَّذِى اسْتَوْقَدَ نَاراً فَلَمَّآ أَضَاءَتْ مَا حَوْلَهُ ذَهَبَ اللَّهُ بِنُورِهِمْ وَتَرَكَهُمْ فِي ظُلُمَـتٍ لاَّ يُبْصِرُونَ - صُمٌّ بُكْمٌ عُمْىٌ فَهُمْ لاَ يَرْجِعُونَ ]

(Their parable is that of one who kindled a fire; then, when it illuminated all around him, Allah took away their light and left them in darkness. (So) they could not see. They are deaf, dumb, and blind, so they return not (to the right path)) [2:17-18], and,

[أَوْ كَظُلُمَـتٍ فِى بَحْرٍ لُّجِّىٍّ يَغْشَـهُ مَوْجٌ مِّن فَوْقِهِ مَوْجٌ مِّن فَوْقِهِ سَحَابٌ ظُلُمَـتٌ بَعْضُهَا فَوْقَ بَعْضٍ إِذَآ أَخْرَجَ يَدَهُ لَمْ يَكَدْ يَرَاهَا وَمَن لَّمْ يَجْعَلِ اللَّهُ لَهُ نُوراً فَمَا لَهُ مِن نُورٍ ]

(Or like the darkness in a vast deep sea, overwhelmed with a great wave topped by a great wave, topped by dark clouds, darkness, one above another, if a man stretches out his hand, he can hardly see it! And he for whom Allah has not appointed light, for him there is no light. ) [24:40] This is why Allah said here,

[مَن يَشَإِ اللَّهُ يُضْلِلْهُ وَمَن يَشَأْ يَجْعَلْهُ عَلَى صِرَطٍ مُّسْتَقِيمٍ]

(Allah sends astray whom He wills and He guides on the straight path whom He wills.) for He does what He wills with His creatures.

[قُلْ أَرَأَيْتُكُم إِنْ أَتَـكُمْ عَذَابُ اللَّهِ أَوْ أَتَتْكُمْ السَّاعَةُ أَغَيْرَ اللَّهِ تَدْعُونَ إِن كُنتُمْ صَـدِقِينَ - بَلْ إِيَّـهُ تَدْعُونَ فَيَكْشِفُ مَا تَدْعُونَ إِلَيْهِ إِنْ شَآءَ وَتَنسَوْنَ مَا تُشْرِكُونَ - وَلَقَدْ أَرْسَلنَآ إِلَى أُمَمٍ مِّن قَبْلِكَ فَأَخَذْنَـهُمْ بِالْبَأْسَآءِ وَالضَّرَّآءِ لَعَلَّهُمْ يَتَضَرَّعُونَ - فَلَوْلا إِذْ جَآءَهُمْ بَأْسُنَا تَضَرَّعُواْ وَلَـكِن قَسَتْ قُلُوبُهُمْ وَزَيَّنَ لَهُمُ الشَّيْطَـنُ مَا كَانُواّ يَعْمَلُونَ - فَلَمَّا نَسُواْ مَا ذُكِّرُواْ بِهِ فَتَحْنَا عَلَيْهِمْ أَبْوَابَ كُلِّ شَىْءٍ حَتَّى إِذَا فَرِحُواْ بِمَآ أُوتُواْ أَخَذْنَـهُمْ بَغْتَةً فَإِذَا هُمْ مُّبْلِسُونَ - فَقُطِعَ دَابِرُ الْقَوْمِ الَّذِينَ ظَلَمُواْ وَالْحَمْدُ للَّهِ رَبِّ الْعَـلَمِينَ ]
(40. Say: "Tell me if Allah's torment comes upon you, or the Hour comes upon you, would you then call upon any one other than Allah (Reply) if you are truthful!'') (41. Nay! To Him alone you call, and, if He willed, He would remove that (distress) for which you call upon Him, and you forget at that time whatever partners you joined with Him (in worship)!) (42. Verily, We sent (Messengers) to many nations before you. And We seized them with extreme poverty and loss of health so that they might believe with humility.) (43. When Our torment reached them, why then did they not believe with humility But their hearts became hardened, and Shaytan made fair-seeming to them that which they used to do.) (44. So, when they forgot (the warning) with which they had been reminded, We opened to them the gates of every (pleasant) thing, until in the midst of their enjoyment in that which they were given, all of a sudden, We took them to punishment, and lo! They were plunged into destruction with deep regrets and sorrows.) (45. So the roots of the people who did wrong were cut off. And all the praises and thanks be to Allah, the Lord of the all that exists.)

 

[Skillganon]

The Idolators Call On Allah Alone During Torment and Distress

Allah states that He does what He wills with His creatures and none can resist His decision or avert what He decrees for them. He is the One Who has no partners, Who accepts the supplication from whomever He wills. Allah said,

[قُلْ أَرَأَيْتُكُم إِنْ أَتَـكُمْ عَذَابُ اللَّهِ أَوْ أَتَتْكُمْ السَّاعَةُ أَغَيْرَ اللَّهِ تَدْعُونَ إِن كُنتُمْ صَـدِقِينَ ]

(Say: "Tell me if Allah's torment comes upon you, or the Hour comes upon you, would you then call upon any one other than Allah (Reply) if you are truthful!'') This means, you -- disbelievers -- will not call other than Allah in this case, because you know that none except He is able to remove the affliction. Allah said,

[إِن كُنتُمْ صَـدِقِينَ]

(if you are truthful) by taking gods besides Him.

[بَلْ إِيَّـهُ تَدْعُونَ فَيَكْشِفُ مَا تَدْعُونَ إِلَيْهِ إِنْ شَآءَ وَتَنسَوْنَ مَا تُشْرِكُونَ ]

(Nay! To Him alone you call, and, if He willed, He would remove that (distress) for which you call upon Him, and you forget at that time whatever partners you joined with Him (in worship)!) for in times of necessity, you only call on Allah and forget your idols and false deities. In another Ayah, Allah said;

[وَإِذَا مَسَّكُمُ الْضُّرُّ فِى الْبَحْرِ ضَلَّ مَن تَدْعُونَ إِلاَ إِيَّاهُ]

(And when harm touches you upon the sea, those that you call upon besides Him vanish from you except Him (Allah)) [17:67]. Allah said;

[وَلَقَدْ أَرْسَلنَآ إِلَى أُمَمٍ مِّن قَبْلِكَ فَأَخَذْنَـهُمْ بِالْبَأْسَآءِ]

(Verily, We sent (Messengers) to many nations before you. And We seized them with extreme poverty...) That is, loss of wealth and diminished provisions,

[وَالضَّرَّآءِ]

(and loss of health) various illnesses, diseases and pain,

[لَعَلَّهُمْ يَتَضَرَّعُونَ]

(so that they might believe with humility) and call Allah and supplicate to Him with humbleness and humility. Allah said;

[فَلَوْلا إِذْ جَآءَهُمْ بَأْسُنَا تَضَرَّعُواْ]

(When Our torment reached them, why then did they not believe with humility) Meaning: Why do they not believe and humble themselves before Us when We test them with disaster'

[وَلَـكِن قَسَتْ قُلُوبُهُمْ]

(But their hearts became hardened,) for their hearts are not soft or humble,

[وَزَيَّنَ لَهُمُ الشَّيْطَـنُ مَا كَانُواّ يَعْمَلُونَ]

(and Shaytan made fair-seeming to them that which they used to do. ) That is, Shirk, defiance and rebellion.

[فَلَمَّا نَسُواْ مَا ذُكِّرُواْ بِهِ]

(So, when they forgot (the warning) with which they had been reminded,) by ignoring and turning away from it,

[فَتَحْنَا عَلَيْهِمْ أَبْوَابَ كُلِّ شَىْءٍ]

(We opened to them the gates of everything,) Meaning: `We opened the gates of provisions for them from wherever they wished, so that We deceive them.' We seek refuge with Allah from such an end. This is why Allah said,

[حَتَّى إِذَا فَرِحُواْ بِمَآ أُوتُواْ]

f(until in the midst of their enjoyment in that which they were given,) such as wealth, children and provisions,

[أَخَذْنَـهُمْ بَغْتَةً فَإِذَا هُمْ مُّبْلِسُونَ]

(all of a sudden, We took them to punishment and lo! They were plunged into destruction with deep regrets and sorrows.) They have no hope for any type of good thing. Al-Hasan Al-Basri said, "Whomever Allah gives provision and he thinks that Allah is not testing him, has no wisdom. Whomever has little provision and thinks that Allah will not look at (provide for) him, has no wisdom.'' He then recited the Ayah,

[فَلَمَّا نَسُواْ مَا ذُكِّرُواْ بِهِ فَتَحْنَا عَلَيْهِمْ أَبْوَابَ كُلِّ شَىْءٍ حَتَّى إِذَا فَرِحُواْ بِمَآ أُوتُواْ أَخَذْنَـهُمْ بَغْتَةً فَإِذَا هُمْ مُّبْلِسُونَ ]

(So, when they forgot (the warning) with which they had been reminded, We opened to them the gates of every (pleasant) thing, until in the midst of their enjoyment in that which they were given, all of a sudden, We took them to punishment, and lo! They were plunged into destruction with deep regrets and sorrows.) He added, "By the Lord of the Ka`bah! Allah deceived these people, when He gave them what they wished, and then they were punished.'' Ibn Abi Hatim recorded this statement.

[قُلْ أَرَأَيْتُمْ إِنْ أَخَذَ اللَّهُ سَمْعَكُمْ وَأَبْصَـرَكُمْ وَخَتَمَ عَلَى قُلُوبِكُمْ مَّنْ إِلَـهٌ غَيْرُ اللَّهِ يَأْتِيكُمْ بِهِ انْظُرْ كَيْفَ نُصَرِّفُ الاٌّيَـتِ ثُمَّ هُمْ يَصْدِفُونَ - قُلْ أَرَأَيْتَكُمْ إِنْ أَتَـكُمْ عَذَابُ اللَّهِ بَغْتَةً أَوْ جَهْرَةً هَلْ يُهْلَكُ إِلاَّ الْقَوْمُ الظَّـلِمُونَ - وَمَا نُرْسِلُ الْمُرْسَلِينَ إِلاَّ مُبَشِّرِينَ وَمُنذِرِينَ فَمَنْ ءَامَنَ وَأَصْلَحَ فَلاَ خَوْفٌ عَلَيْهِمْ وَلاَ هُمْ يَحْزَنُونَ - وَالَّذِينَ كَذَّبُواْ بِـَايَـتِنَا يَمَسُّهُمُ الْعَذَابُ بِمَا كَانُواْ يَفْسُقُونَ ]

(46. Say: "Tell me, if Allah took away your hearing and your sight, and sealed up your hearts, is there a god other than Allah who could restore them to you'' See how variously We explain the Ayat, yet they turn aside.) (47. Say: "Tell me, if the punishment of Allah comes to you suddenly, or openly, will any be destroyed except the wrongdoing people'') (48. And We send not the Messengers but as givers of glad tidings and as warners. So whosoever believes and does righteous good deeds, upon such shall come no fear, nor shall they grieve.) (49. But those who reject Our Ayat, the torment will strike them for their rebelling.) Allah said to His Messenger, say, O Muhammad , to those rebellious liars,

[أَرَأَيْتُمْ إِنْ أَخَذَ اللَّهُ سَمْعَكُمْ وَأَبْصَـرَكُمْ]

(Tell me, if Allah took away your hearing and your sight.) just as He gave these senses to you. In another Ayah, Allah said;

[هُوَ الَّذِى أَنشَأَكُمْ وَجَعَلَ لَكُمُ السَّمْعَ وَالاٌّبْصَـرَ]

(It is He Who has created you, and endowed you with hearing, seeing.) [67:23]. The Ayah above might also mean that Allah will not allow the disbelievers to benefit from these senses in religious terms. This is why He said next,

[وَخَتَمَ عَلَى قُلُوبِكُمْ]

(and sealed up your hearts,.) He also said in other Ayat,

[أَمَّن يَمْلِكُ السَّمْعَ والاٌّبْصَـرَ]

(Or who owns hearing and sight) [10:31], and,

[وَاعْلَمُواْ أَنَّ اللَّهَ يَحُولُ بَيْنَ الْمَرْءِ وَقَلْبِهِ]

(And know that Allah comes in between a person and his heart.) Allah said;

[مَّنْ إِلَـهٌ غَيْرُ اللَّهِ يَأْتِيكُمْ بِهِ]

(Is there a god other than Allah who could restore them to you) Meaning, is there anyone except Allah who is able to give you back these senses if Allah took them from you Only Allah is able to do so, and this is why He said here,

[انْظُرْ كَيْفَ نُصَرِّفُ الاٌّيَـتِ]

(See how variously We explain the Ayat,) and make them plain and clear, testifying to Allah's Oneness in lordship and that those worshipped besides Him are all false and unworthy.

[ثُمَّ هُمْ يَصْدِفُونَ]

(yet they turn aside.) After this explanation, they still turn away from the truth and hinder people from following it. Allah's statement,

[قُلْ أَرَأَيْتَكُمْ إِنْ أَتَـكُمْ عَذَابُ اللَّهِ بَغْتَةً]

(Say: "Tell me, if the punishment of Allah comes to you suddenly...'') means, while you are unaware -- or during the night -- striking you all of a sudden,

[أَوْ جَهْرَةً]

(or openly) during the day, or publicly,

[هَلْ يُهْلَكُ إِلاَّ الْقَوْمُ الظَّـلِمُونَ]

(will any be destroyed except the wrongdoing people) This torment only strikes those who commit injustice against themselves by associating others with Allah, while those who worship Allah alone without partners will be saved from it, and they will have no fear or sorrow. In another Ayah, Allah said;

[الَّذِينَ ءَامَنُواْ وَلَمْ يَلْبِسُواْ إِيمَـنَهُمْ بِظُلْمٍ]

(It is those who believe and confuse not their belief with Zulm, (wrong or Shirk).) [6:82] Allah's statement,

[وَمَا نُرْسِلُ الْمُرْسَلِينَ إِلاَّ مُبَشِّرِينَ وَمُنذِرِينَ]

(And We send not the Messengers but as bearers of glad tidings and as warners.) means, the Messengers bring good news to Allah's servants, as well as, command all that is good and righteous. They also warn those who disbelieve in Allah of His anger and of all types of torment. Allah said,

[فَمَنْ ءَامَنَ وَأَصْلَحَ]

(So whosoever believes and does righteous good deeds.) meaning, whoever believes in his heart with what the Messengers were sent with and makes his works righteous by imitating them;

[فَلاَ خَوْفٌ عَلَيْهِمْ]

(upon such shall come no fear,) concerning the future,

[وَلاَ هُمْ يَحْزَنُونَ]

(nor shall they grieve.) about what they missed in the past and left behind them in this world. Certainly, Allah will be the Wali and Protector over what they left behind. Allah said next,

[وَالَّذِينَ كَذَّبُواْ بِـَايَـتِنَا يَمَسُّهُمُ الْعَذَابُ بِمَا كَانُواْ يَفْسُقُونَ ]

(But those who reject Our Ayat, the torment will strike them for their rebelling.) The torment will strike them because of disbelieving in the Message of the Messengers, defying Allah's commands, committing what He prohibited and transgressing His set limits.

[قُل لاَّ أَقُولُ لَكُمْ عِندِى خَزَآئِنُ اللَّهِ وَلا أَعْلَمُ الْغَيْبَ وَلا أَقُولُ لَكُمْ إِنِّى مَلَكٌ إِنْ أَتَّبِعُ إِلاَّ مَا يُوحَى إِلَىَّ قُلْ هَلْ يَسْتَوِى الاٌّعْمَى وَالْبَصِيرُ أَفَلاَ تَتَفَكَّرُونَ - وَأَنذِرْ بِهِ الَّذِينَ يَخَافُونَ أَن يُحْشَرُواْ إِلَى رَبِّهِمْ لَيْسَ لَهُمْ مِّن دُونِهِ وَلِىٌّ وَلاَ شَفِيعٌ لَّعَلَّهُمْ يَتَّقُونَ - وَلاَ تَطْرُدِ الَّذِينَ يَدْعُونَ رَبَّهُمْ بِالْغَدَاةِ وَالْعَشِىِّ يُرِيدُونَ وَجْهَهُ مَا عَلَيْكَ مِنْ حِسَابِهِم مِّن شَىْءٍ وَمَا مِنْ حِسَابِكَ عَلَيْهِمْ مِّن شَىْءٍ فَتَطْرُدَهُمْ فَتَكُونَ مِنَ الظَّـلِمِينَ - وَكَذلِكَ فَتَنَّا بَعْضَهُمْ بِبَعْضٍ لِّيَقُولواْ أَهَـؤُلاءِ مَنَّ اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِم مِّن بَيْنِنَآ أَلَيْسَ اللَّهُ بِأَعْلَمَ بِالشَّـكِرِينَ - وَإِذَا جَآءَكَ الَّذِينَ يُؤْمِنُونَ بِـَايَـتِنَا فَقُلْ سَلَـمٌ عَلَيْكُمْ كَتَبَ رَبُّكُمْ عَلَى نَفْسِهِ الرَّحْمَةَ أَنَّهُ مَن عَمِلَ مِنكُمْ سُوءًا بِجَهَالَةٍ ثُمَّ تَابَ مِن بَعْدِهِ وَأَصْلَحَ فَأَنَّهُ غَفُورٌ رَّحِيمٌ ]
(50. Say: "I don't tell you that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor (that) I know the Unseen; nor do I tell you that I am an angel. I but follow what is revealed to me.'' Say: "Are the blind and the one who sees equal Will you not then consider'') (51. And warn therewith those who fear that they will be gathered before their Lord, when there will be neither a protector nor an intercessor for them besides Him, so that they may have Taqwa.) (52. And turn not away those who invoke their Lord, morning and evening seeking His Face. You are accountable for them in nothing, and they are accountable for you in nothing, that you may turn them away, and thus become of the wrongdoers.) (53. Thus We have tried some of them with others, that they might say: "Is it these (poor believers) that Allah has favored from amongst us'' Does not Allah know best those who are grateful) (54. When those who believe in Our Ayat come to you, say: "Salamun `Alaykum'' (peace be on you); your Lord has written mercy for Himself, so that, if any of you does evil in ignorance, and thereafter repents and does righteous good deeds, then surely, He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful.)

 

[Skillganon]

(ref to 4:88)
when they referred to other than the Prophet for judgment, not that they believe in such alternative judgment, as they claim. Allah describes these people to us further in His statement,


[فَتَرَى الَّذِينَ فِى قُلُوبِهِم مَّرَضٌ يُسَـرِعُونَ فِيهِمْ يَقُولُونَ نَخْشَى]

(And you see those in whose hearts there is a disease (of hypocrisy), they hurry to their friendship, saying: "We fear''), until,

[فَيُصْبِحُواْ عَلَى مَآ أَسَرُّواْ فِى أَنفُسِهِمْ نَـدِمِينَ]

(Then they will become regretful for what they have been keeping as a secret in themselves). At-Tabarani recorded that Ibn `Abbas said, "Abu Barzah Al-Aslami used to be a soothsayer who judged between the Jews in their disputes. When some Muslims came to him to judge between them, Allah sent down,

[أَلَمْ تَرَ إِلَى الَّذِينَ يَزْعُمُونَ أَنَّهُمْ ءَامَنُواْ بِمَآ أُنزِلَ إِلَيْكَ وَمَآ أُنزِلَ مِن قَبْلِكَ]

(Have you not seen those (hyprocrites) who claim that they believe in that which has been sent down to you, and that which was sent down before you), until,

[إِنْ أَرَدْنَآ إِلاَّ إِحْسَاناً وَتَوْفِيقاً]

("We meant no more than goodwill and conciliation!'') Allah then said,

[أُولَـئِكَ الَّذِينَ يَعْلَمُ اللَّهُ مَا فِى قُلُوبِهِمْ]

(They (hypocrites) are those of whom Allah knows what is in their hearts These people are hypocrites, and Allah knows what is in their hearts and will punish them accordingly, for nothing escapes Allah's watch. Consequently, O Muhammad! Let Allah be sufficient for you in this regard, because He has perfect knowledge of their apparent and hidden affairs. This is why Allah said,

[فَأَعْرِضْ عَنْهُمْ]

(so turn aside from them (do not punish them)) meaning, do not punish them because of what is in their hearts.

[وَعِظْهُمْ]

(but admonish them) means, advise them against the hypocrisy and evil that reside in their hearts,

[وَقُل لَّهُمْ فِى أَنفُسِهِمْ قَوْلاً بَلِيغاً]

(and speak to them an effective word to reach their inner selves) advise them, between you and them, using effective words that might benefit them.

[وَمَآ أَرْسَلْنَا مِن رَّسُولٍ إلاَّ لِيُطَاعَ بِإِذْنِ اللَّهِ وَلَوْ أَنَّهُمْ إِذ ظَّلَمُواْ أَنفُسَهُمْ جَآءُوكَ فَاسْتَغْفَرُواْ اللَّهَ وَاسْتَغْفَرَ لَهُمُ الرَّسُولُ لَوَجَدُواْ اللَّهَ تَوَّاباً رَّحِيماً - فَلاَ وَرَبِّكَ لاَ يُؤْمِنُونَ حَتَّى يُحَكِّمُوكَ فِيمَا شَجَرَ بَيْنَهُمْ ثُمَّ لاَ يَجِدُواْ فِى أَنفُسِهِمْ حَرَجاً مِّمَّا قَضَيْتَ وَيُسَلِّمُواْ تَسْلِيماً ]
(64. We sent no Messenger, but to be obeyed by Allah's leave. If they, when they were unjust to themselves, had come to you and begged Allah's forgiveness, and the Messenger had begged forgiveness for them, indeed, they would have found Allah All-Forgiving, Most Merciful.) (65. But no, by your Lord, they can have no faith, until they make you judge in all disputes between them, and find in themselves no resistance against your decisions, and accept (them) with full submission.)

 

[BigChrisfilm]

And your point is? I am still not going to read that whole thing.

 

[Skillganon]

Do we have free will?

YEs! There you go!

 

[BigChrisfilm]

lol, you can say whatever you want, but it doesn't make it true, expecially after reading what the Qur'an says about it.

 

[Skillganon]

lol, you can say whatever you want, but it doesn't make it true, expecially after reading what the Qur'an says about it.

I refuted you, and you admitted that those christian missionary Just made their own using several translation to fit what they wanted to say's, you have not proved anything!

 

[BigChrisfilm]

Except that there is no differeance between what they said and what the Quran says?

 

[Skillganon]

Look, you understand it wrong, the verse is not pertaining to free will, but guidance!
Allah leading, those astray is pertaining to those who after the sign and Gudaince has come they reject, and persist in rejection and desbelieve in God, thus allah(swt) lead's them to their demise (astray) in their evil plot's!

Allah Guide's those who believe in him, and those who are steadfast in him. Not those who just say "I believe but actually don't believe in God's i.e. Hyprocrites, thinking that staying with the believers they can lead them astray(away from allah), but allah(swt) will lead the astray in their plot's!

Nothing about free will.

It will be stupid for allah(swt) to lead astray those who really believe in him, and Guides those who don't believe in him in their plot's against those who believe in him.

 

[BigChrisfilm]

Look, you understand it wrong, the verse is not pertaining to free will, but guidance!
Allah leading, those astray is pertaining to those who after the sign and Gudaince has come they reject, and persist in rejection and desbelieve in God, thus allah(swt) lead's them to their demise (astray) in their evil plot's!

Allah Guide's those who believe in him, and those who are steadfast in him. Not those who just say "I believe but actually don't believe in God's i.e. Hyprocrites, thinking that staying with the believers they can lead them astray(away from allah), but allah(swt) will lead the astray in their plot's!

Nothing about free will.

It will be stupid for allah(swt) to lead astray those who really believe in him, and Guides those who don't believe in him in their plot's against those who believe in him.

Lol, it sure would be stupid of him.

 

[Osiris]

Predistination means the advanced knowledge of Allah; God of everything a person will do in his life before he does it and even before he is born.

in no way does it mean that Allah;God forces people to do anything bad.

i'd suggest you look up the definition again:

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=predestination

predestination and freewill do not go together....

He sent thousands of prophets
and many Books to teach people the aim of their being here on earth and what they should and should not do so they can go to Paradise and not to Hell

it doesn't matter if god sent down thousands of prophets and books.... at the end, some men were made to not follow them.

so a person himself decides his destiny be it Paradise or Hell

you are just begging the question...

the first words you read in the Holy Quran is some traits of the Almighty Allah "the Most Beneficent, Most Merciful" so how can He be not loving and Merciful at the same time?

perhaps because man is not perfect?
you are assuming too much, you are assuming that text in the quran must be true...

 

[BigChrisfilm]

I never thought I would have a Athiest on my side, lol. But I suposse your beliefs will come in handy when combating a religion like Islam.

Thanks for showing up buddy!