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Pre-Tribulation Rapture Refuted with Scripture

keras

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The outright foolishness of the entire 'rapture to heaven' theory shows up plainly when people argue about when this fanciful idea will happen. Not; will it happen, as they should first ascertain.
Jesus said it was impossible for humans to go to heaven. John 3:13 He actually prayed for us to NOT be removed! John 17:15
How else would an entire church miss out on the great tribulation if they are not Raptured? Will God kill them instead?
Reading what we are told in Revelation 12 would enlighten you and avoid making silly comments. The faithful Christians are taken to a place of safety during the GT.
 
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I was thinking of creating a new thread for a Revised End Times Chronology that would explain this a little more in detail.

The Olivet discourse sounds like the 2nd Rapture taking place. This will take place sometime after the Antichrist takes control of the Jewish temple (and possibly after a bunch of saints have been martyred for the faith). I believe the remaining resistance of believers (who were not captured by the antichrist and killed yet) are told to look up for their redemption draws near. Maybe some of these remaining Christians will be captured and just before they are about to be slaughtered, the 2nd Rapture takes place (before they can be killed). Granted, many Christians will be beheaded during this time (by the antichrist), though.

The statement about the Rapture made by Paul in Thessalonians and Corinthians is the Pre-Trib Rapture (the 1st Rapture) because he is revealing a new mystery that has not been revealed before.

Christians will not go through the last half of the Tribulation or the breaking of the 6th seal (Which is a period of time known as the "Wrath of God"). Paul says we are not appointed unto Wrath.

The Wrath of God is an answer to the saints crying out for justice in the 5th seal after their having been just martyred.
 
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We already disagreed before. Not going to debate with you on it again. If you don't see it the first time, you are not going to see it a second time.
 
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Neogaia777

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I was thinking of creating a new thread for a Revised End Times Chronology that would explain this a little more in detail.

Please let me know if you do, K...?


This Idea is new to me, but I'd willing to take a look at it... And I may look into it more a bit myself as well...?

But, I think there has to be one right before Armageddon though or leading up to and right before or after that, and that the world will have peace before it really goes bad for them at that time... But that it will be hell for many believers before and leading up to that, ect...

God Bless!
 
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The strongest evidence for the two Rapture view is Matthew 25:10, and Luke 12:36:

The 1st Rapture is a call to a wedding/marriage:

Matthew 25:10

And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came; and they that were ready went in with him to the marriage: and the door was shut.​

The 2nd Rapture is a call after a return from a wedding:

Luke 12:36

And ye yourselves like unto men that wait for their lord, when he will return from the wedding; that when he cometh and knocketh, they may open unto him immediately.
We see a Rapture described by Paul that seems to be more like a surprise. Paul says it is a new mystery revealed. The Rapture we see describe in the Olivet Discourse places it in the Midpoint of the Tribulation. Also, both Raptures have to be before the period of time known as "God's Wrath." For Paul says Christians are not appointed unto wrath.

As for the thread:

I will let you know. It will take a bit of time to put together. So I am not sure on the exact timing on when I can accomplish this.
 
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Neogaia777

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Could be two different groups also, the Bride and The wedding in heaven then them returning for another group maybe...? IDK...?

God Bless!
 
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Could be two different groups also, the Bride and The wedding in heaven then them returning for another group maybe...? IDK...?

God Bless!

The first group is the bride because they are called to a wedding.
The second group is called after the wedding is finished.
The second group will definitely return with Christ and follow Him into battle. For his disciples ask where they are being taken to and Jesus replies that where the carcasses (the dead men of this world) are, is where the eagles (saints) will be gathered together. Meaning, these will be the saints who follow Christ into battle at the 2nd coming.
 
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Blade

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This "I am here to warn of the dangers and fallacy of this Eschatological view." For some this is foolishness..

We FORGET I hope to remind others that.. what we post is our personal view belief. Well if ANY of this was fact written we would post the verse. So we post what we believe POINTS to (song playing.. CHRIST IN ME..) what we personally believe. Am I wrong? Not like saying JESUS is the ONLY way to the Father. We can post the verse.

"turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God, and to wait for His Son from heaven, whom He raised from the dead, even Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come”

Are we looking for truth? Are we really willing to be wrong? Father.. if I am wrong in my personal belief.. in any and everything change me 1st..in Jesus name.. let it be written (ooh song playing I LOVE this song: Only Jesus Casting Crowns)...wow what PERFECT TIMING...

See .. I am ready now... I do NOT follow pre...YET WOW its as if for the past few days.. its been EVERYWHERE.. its HERE NOW... just random? Its NOT that pre is right what I get is from ALL is.. JESUS is saying.. I AM COMING... are you ready? I live each day knowing THIS IS the day.. so I am always watching how I talk.. think act. And ALWAYS wanting to SHINE..JESUS IS THE ONLY NAME...sorry love that SONG..

HAHA... what else in life is BETTER then thinking living for HIM! Seek 1st the kingdom of GOD and HIS righteousness.. Ask Him.. should I be ready NOW..should I be living as if you can come back any moment.. ask the GOD that is IN YOU! His sheep YOU hear His voice yes..and TEST the spirits.. make sure He backs it up by what is WRITTEN! He will He told you to test the spirit

I do want to say sorry,.. but not.. well I GOT SO BLESSED SO BLESSED thinking of on Him more then I was...He said.. I WILL come back for you.. sorry HIS words matter. I am ready now.. forgive me if I offended.. JESUS is your lord.. PRAISE GOD.. THATS what matters..we ARE family
 
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Alithis

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Yikes.. Your refering to israel.
Youve got your wires twisted. That seems to happen when people have been listening to men who think they know a lot waffling on about what they think they know.
 
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Revealing Times

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Everyone of these scriptures you posted point towards a Pre-tribulation Rapture, you just seemingly can't interpret them properly, that is why you are confused, going back and forth back and forth

All one has to do is read Rev. 19, see the Bride in Heaven whilst the Beast and his Armies are still on earth and that should clinch it. NOTHING BUT A PRE TRIB Rapture fits the word in reality.
 
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Alithis

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Ask yourself ..why do you desire it to be the way you hope?
 
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Revealing Times

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Ask yourself ..why do you desire it to be the way you hope?

Because I hear the Holy Spirit.............Obedience over Sacrifice.

In other words obedience is more important than anything else, I desire nothing that is not of God. This isn't even a hard question to me, when I see those that can't see this I am kinda left in wonderment to tell you the truth. This is easy and basic Christendom. It's not even a hard study.
 
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Choose Wisely

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Not quite sure why you keep posting John 3:13 and John 17:15 as they certainly don't prove your point as I have shown you several times. As far as Rev 12 is concerned it is the woman.......the nation of Israel.....that is being talked about. Those that flee when the abomination of desolation is set up are the ones that go to a place of safety. We see people in heaven all over the scriptures........and it's not even a question whether they are there or not so I wonder why you keep posting these things.
 
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Ronald

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If this event is not pre-trib, then Christ comes not as a thief.
He comes as a thief to unbelievers who are in the dark. We are not in the dark.
 
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rockytopva

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Fools...

Along with Noah for building an ark
Along with Lot for escaping the city...

All, along with me, pretrib fools... Until the event happens!

And what I say unto you I say unto all, Watch. - Mark 13:37
 
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Ronald

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They are takin out of the GT BUT doesn't that also refute the Post Triib view as well?
The Pre-Wrath view is correct, but it is still part of the whole GT period, which means we are takin out during the period and more is to come. Since its not over, its not post, its Mid-Trib.
Also thw LAST TRUMP is misinterpreted by the Pre-Tribbbers. They believe it is part of the Feast of Trumpets and so during a Jewish holiday preceding the Day of Atonement.
I view the last trumpet as #7 in Rev. 11:15. which also happens to occur right when the 7 Bowls of Wrath in the full are released.
 
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Ronald

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Besides all this refuting each others views, wasn't the GT supposed to have begun within one generation (70 years according to Psalm 90:10) after Israel became a nation in 1948? Well its 2018, I thought it should have at least begun by now. It may have. If you lived in the Middle East for the last seven years, its been a great tribulation for many millions - not the entire planet.
Think of the revolts starting with Tunisia, then Yemen, Libya, Egypt, Syria, etc.
 
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The statement about the Rapture made by Paul in Thessalonians and Corinthians is the Pre-Trib Rapture (the 1st Rapture) because he is revealing a new mystery that has not been revealed before.
The statement made by Paul in Thessalonians is the pre trib rapture. The pre trib rapture occurs at the trump of God or voice of God.
The statement made in Corinthians 15 is the second rapture. It occurs at the last trump that is blown on the Feast of Trumpets.
 
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