pre-trib

[A Brother In Christ]

2

3


If these aren't enough to send you looking, there are plenty more.

Hismessenger

that it..... put so we can not comment .... ha ha

 

[Hismessenger]

Believers are not judged with the wicked for we are judged right now. We receive rewards for our service. They receive fire for their non service.

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Believers are not judged with the wicked for we are judged right now. We receive rewards for our service. They receive fire for their non service.

any verses...

1 cor 3:12-15 beama[GRACE] seat judgement... for christians

rev 20:11-15 Great White Throne Judgment ... put in Hell

not at the same time ....

 

[Hismessenger]

I gave Daniel 12:2 as scripture reference for the witness of the resurrection. Some to everlasting life and some to eternal contempt. Here are so more scripture to witness to this truth.

some to everlasting life
Mat 25:46 And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal.

Jhn 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,

Jhn 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

Act 24:15 And have hope toward God, which they themselves also allow, that there shall be a resurrection of the dead, both of the just and unjust.

everlasting contempt

Isa 66:24 And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcases of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Jer 20:11 But the LORD [is] with me as a mighty terrible one: therefore my persecutors shall stumble, and they shall not prevail: they shall be greatly ashamed; for they shall not prosper: [their] everlasting confusion shall never be forgotten.

Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?

Mat 13:47 ¶ Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind:

Mat 13:48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away.

Mat 13:49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,

Mat 13:50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Mat 13:51 Jesus saith unto them, Have ye understood all these things? They say unto him, Yea, Lord.

Not my words but the witness of the scripture. you can receive them or not. I have done as I was purposed. Given the word.

Hismessenger

 

[yeshuasavedme]

Believers are not judged with the wicked for we are judged right now. We receive rewards for our service. They receive fire for their non service.

Better read Daniel.

Dan 7:13¶I saw in the night visions, and, behold, [one] like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.Dan 7:14
And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion [is] an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom [that] which shall not be destroyed.Dan 7:22
Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.Dan 7:27
And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom [is] an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

the Saints of the Most High receive the kingdom and that is a reward system.
Also; those who turn many to righteousness get greater glory than those who do not.

that is a reward system and there is an appointed time for the rewards to be passed out to the Saints, in heaven, and all together.

 

[Hismessenger]

Not only did I read Daniel I posted what you just said in another manner. We receive reward, they receive eternal contemp/damnation.

1Cr 15:50 ¶ Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.

Hbr 12:8 — But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

Hbr 12:6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

Psa 73:1 [[A Psalm of Asaph.]] Truly God [is] good to Israel, [even] to such as are of a clean heart.

Psa 73:14 For all the day long have I been plagued, and chastened every morning.

Psa 73:15 If I say, I will speak thus; behold, I should offend [against] the generation of thy children.

1Pe 5:9 Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.

1Pe 5:10 But the God of all grace, who hath called us unto his eternal glory by Christ Jesus, after that ye have suffered a while, make you perfect, stablish, strengthen, settle [you

Hismessenger

 

[A Brother In Christ]

I gave Daniel 12:2 as scripture reference for the witness of the resurrection. Some to everlasting life and some to eternal contempt. Here are so more scripture to witness to this truth.



Not my words but the witness of the scripture. you can receive them or not. I have done as I was purposed. Given the word.

Hismessenger

up above
eternal contempt or eternal life

yet the church get eternal life right away 1 john 5:11-13

 

[Hismessenger]

Brother in Christ,

There is no denying that the church gets eternal life. What is misunderstood is that that eternal life begins the day you receive Christ and continues on forever, through death and into eternity. So yes we receive eternal life right away.

Hismessenger

 

[A Brother In Christ]

thus since God live inside of us... not Jew yet but at the 2nd coming

When Gods wraith comes we are with Him...

 

[timlamb]

Brother in Christ,

There is no denying that the church gets eternal life. What is misunderstood is that that eternal life begins the day you receive Christ and continues on forever, through death and into eternity. So yes we receive eternal life right away.

Hismessenger

by this understanding one could say were are born into eternal life, as God knows who will be His.

 

[Hismessenger]

Deu 32:8 When the most High divided to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the children of Israel.


I believe this scripture would agree with you.

Hismessenger

 

[Hismessenger]

Here is another verse that says the church is still here during the tribulation.

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Rev 20:4 ¶ And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and [I saw] the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received [his] mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years

They which are part of the first resurrection come out of the tribulation as given by the verses above. The tribulation is the wrath of
Satan which is the war that Rev:12:17 speaks of in the end times and even now.


Hismessenger

 

[yeshuasavedme]

Here is another verse that says the church is still here during the tribulation.





They which are part of the first resurrection come out of the tribulation as given by the verses above. The tribulation is the wrath of
Satan which is the war that Rev:12:17 speaks of in the end times and even now.


Hismessenger

Ya gotta learn the ABC's of the first principles of the Oracles of God or you can't understand the matter at all

The Woman is "Zion" Personified.
The Seed of the Woman, Zion, is Christ come in flesh; and the "Man Child" is the Church, born as One New Man, in Him; delivered [the first harvest], and caught up to the throne, who is seen in Daniel coming to Christ, Who is sitting on the Throne as the "Ancient of Days", and coming to receive the kingdom to rule from Him, in Him, under Him, with Him; as the "One Like the Son of Man" and joint heirs in Him.

The One Church "perfected" is the "Man Child"; "like the Son of Man", and is "the Saints of the Most High" as the angel told Daniel.
The Remnant is also the saints of the Most High -but the remnant is below, the Church is above for the seven years -celebrating seven days of the party of consecraton as the bride of Christ; priests unto Him.

Dan 7:13 ¶I saw in the night visions, and, behold, [one] like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him.

Dan 7:14 And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion [is] an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom [that] which shall not be destroyed.
Dan 7:16 I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things.
Dan 7:18 But the saints of the most High shall take the kingdom, and possess the kingdom for ever, even for ever and ever.

Dan 7:22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.

Dan 7:27 And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom [is] an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him.

The Rapture is at the beginning, and the fleeing is mid way through, after the two eyewitnesses are slain and resurrected/ raptured -so there are 3-1/2 years for the remnant [those redeemed of Israel] to come to Christ through the preaching of the two -and their converts.

 

[A Brother In Christ]

The Church is not a seed of many but of one Gal 3:16

As the Jews are Abraham seed of many ... but you will argue or not understand

Jews promised the earth
Church promised to be in the heavens with Christ..heb 11:40

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Deu 32:8 When the most High divided to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the children of Israel.


I believe this scripture would agree with you.

Hismessenger

In the OT son of God are only angels since the holy spirit does not indwell yet

Once acts 2 happens we are considered sons in the heavenlies since we are put into Christ 1 cor 12:12-13


the law showed that one was a sinner romans 3:20 thus the sons of Adam [ones that believed] could mature in their walk... like the church? maybe

 

[Hismessenger]

Thats right Brother,

the ones who believed are covered by the same blood and are apart of the church. One body with many members from all the times of creation. Old testament and new. If you look at the rest of the chapter from Duet 32 you will see a greater picture.

Deu 32:8When the most High divided to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the children of Israel.

Deu 32:9For the LORD'S portion [is] his people; Jacob [is] the lot of his inheritance.

Deu 32:10He found him in a desert land, and in the waste howling wilderness; he led him about, he instructed him, he kept him as the apple of his eye.

Deu 32:11As an eagle stirreth up her nest, fluttereth over her young, spreadeth abroad her wings, taketh them, beareth them on her wings:

Deu 32:12[So] the LORD alone did lead him, and [there was] no strange god with him.

Deu 32:13He made him ride on the high places of the earth, that he might eat the increase of the fields; and he made him to suck honey out of the rock, and oil out of the flinty rock;

Deu 32:14Butter of kine, and milk of sheep, with fat of lambs, and rams of the breed of Bashan, and goats, with the fat of kidneys of wheat; and thou didst drink the pure blood of the grape.

The next verse, verse 9 tells us that the Lord's portion is His people and Jacob/Israel is the lot of His inheritance.


Hismessenger

 

[A Brother In Christ]

Here is another verse that says the church is still here during the tribulation.

romans 5:9 saved from wrath through him

1 cor 11:32 But when we are judged, we are chastened of the Lord, that we should not be judged with the world.
The body Judged now.. rapture ... world judged

They which are part of the first resurrection come out of the tribulation as given by the verses above. The tribulation is the wrath of
Satan which is the war that Rev:12:17 speaks of in the end times and even now.


Hismessenger

day of wrath....... rev 6:17, isa 13:9, nah 1:2, ro 2:5, 1 thes 1:10, 1thes 5:9, eph 5:6, col 3:6

day of slaughter... james 5:5

day of vengence... luke 21:22

day of the Lord ...... 2 cor 1:14, isa 12:9, zech 14:1, 1cor 5:5,1:8 , rev 1:10, 1 thes 5:2, 2 peter 3:10

day of judgement ... mk 6:11, mt 10:5, 11:22,24 , 2 peter 2:9, 1 john 4:17, jude 6, 1 peter 3:7


all these words are looking at the same time frame...
and we are not going to be there... count on it..

 

[Hismessenger]

The tribulation is not the wrath, judgement,day of the Lord, vengeance, slaughter of God, As A matter of fact, the word says that unless those days be shortened, should no flesh be saved from the wrath of Satan. Our Job is to stand for God. Jesus said I pray you take them not out of the world. The word of God is truth whether you accept it or not. That is totally your decision. Is God's power such that He can't keep you in the fire. He did it with Shadrach, Meshach and Abednigo. He will do it for the church.


Hismessenger

 

[A Brother In Christ]

they are both... at the same time

 

[Hismessenger]

You say they are both, Please explain.

Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, [ye] heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

Why is the devils time short, because he only has our life time to deceive us.

Why would God take those who are beheaded in the tribulation to reign with Him for a thousand years, Isn't the "RAPTURED CHURCH" worthy of this blessing since they are as you say taken before the tribulation.

What then gives the raptured church the favor to be taken and not to reign with Christ for the thousand years. They can't because the DEAD in Christ must rise first by the word of God. So are all the church going to die to be raptured in order to reign with Him for the thousand years?


Hismessenger