Praying is now illegal

[apollosdtr]

Yes intimidate and offend. But its the assumption that the person wants to intimidate when they don't know that. But that is where modern society is at. We have divided society up into identity groups and and are making all these laws and regulations about how we should behave, speak and now think towards each other. Its very divisive.

Unless you're a legislator, you didn't have anything to do with the "We" that's doing all that stuff.
The question is: Why are the real "We" people trying to divide their slaves?

 

[stevevw]

Unless you're a legislator, you didn't have anything to do with the "We" that's doing all that stuff.
The question is: Why are the real "We" people trying to divide their slaves?

I don't think its just the legislators who have created this situation. It comes mainly from activist groups who get in the ears of legislators under the the banner of an 'Inclusive society'.

How I understand this is that the right to abortion is 'Pro Choice' and pro choice is part of a wider idea of equality and individual rights. That came about with the revolutions of the 60s such as race, but especially women's liberation. So its a people based movement. Since then different groups have been vying for their rights and now everything is about individual and group rights over everything else.

At the same time maybe because of the rise of Rights based politics religion has been recast as one of many identity groups and pushed to the fringes because it often clashes with these identity groups. This has divided society into identity groups not just religion verses other identity groups but as one identity group against another because your level of rights and therefore being accommodated by society depends on which identity group you belong to. A bit like a competition of Rights.

So rather than it being about what is right and good for all its about how to accommodate the rights each identity group. But often individual rights clash with other individual or group rights and it becomes a minefield as to which rights trump each other. So society is reduced to monitoring and policing individuals and groups based on which groups right should be upheld.

So belief in Gods truth as a basis for an ordered and stable society is now being replaced by other ideologies based on individual rights which often clash with religious belief. In fact religion (Christianity) is not just seen as another identity group but it is becoming more apparent as time goes by that it is being seen as hostile to the the rights of other groups so I suspect Christianity is being treated more harshly where secular society sees it as a threat and we may see religion pushed more to the fringes if not underground.

 

[Darren Court]

...gotta admit I didn't watch the video... the cliff notes were enough for me.

What I always want to ask is... Why does a christian care if non-christians don't raise-up a batch of non-christian children?
Isn't that whole thing sorta like a christian persecution of non-christians?

Huh? This isn't about raising children! It isn't even about the killing of children in the womb!
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It's about a woman standing on a street silently with no indication of why, and more importantly is that illegal!

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Sadly, in the UK the police believe that praying silently in your head constitutes a breach to PSPO laws to protest or indicate approval or disapproval.

It's either the biggest mistake West Midlands Police have made in years else a sign of prosecution to come.

The question is whether the Christian community is going to do anything about it? Will you?

WATCH: NEW footage of police arresting woman for silently praying

Birmingham charity volunteer arrested and searched – including through her hair – after silently praying in a censorship zone

adf.uk

That’s weird, because it looks like she was arrested for violating an exclusion zone on an abortion clinic, violating a public space protection order (seems like the UK equal to standing trespassing orders), and two counts of disobeying a public service official in the commission of their duties. And this was after the buffer zone was reduced by the clinic.

So what was it people said during George Floyd and the BLM protests? If you want to avoid being arrested, stop breaking the law…? Hello pot, it’s me, kettle… Deliver a message from goose to gander, please.

 

[apollosdtr]

Huh? This isn't about raising children! It isn't even about the killing of children in the womb!
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It's about a woman standing on a street silently with no indication of why, and more importantly is that illegal!

"Misinformation about why Isabel Vaughan Spruce, 45, was arrested spread around social media after Mary Margaret Olohan, a senior reporter for the US publication The Daily Signal, shared the video of the arrest and falsely claimed it was for “silent praying”."

Row as claim over woman arrested for ‘silent praying’ is fact checked

Twitter was forced to correct a false claim made by a right-wing US commentator that an anti-abortionist was arrested for "silent praying" in Birmingham.

www.express.co.uk

She was arrested for voluntarily failing to go to the police station for questioning, as she was asked. The policeman says, in that video, words to the effect that... it wasn't her first rodeo.

_______________________________
Couldn't she "pray in her closet" at home, instead of making her "prayers on the street"?
I'm sure you can find the scriptures for these quotes I'm giving you easily enough.
And in those scriptures, the reason for praying on the streets are given...

 

[Darren Court]

That’s weird, because it looks like she was arrested for violating an exclusion zone on an abortion clinic, violating a public space protection order (seems like the UK equal to standing trespassing orders), and two counts of disobeying a public service official in the commission of their duties. And this was after the buffer zone was reduced by the clinic.

So what was it people said during George Floyd and the BLM protests? If you want to avoid being arrested, stop breaking the law…? Hello pot, it’s me, kettle… Deliver a message from goose to gander, please.

What is weird?
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Someone commenting without knowing the facts?
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If you bothered to watch the video provided, you'd see that she didn't disobey "a public official in commission of their duties" and that we have a wonderful principle in law, it's called "innocent until proven guilty".
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So kettle I suggest you stop trying to be a pot, or gander being goose!

 

[Whyayeman]

We should know more tomorrow, when she appears before the beak.

Watch this space.

 

[Tinker Grey]

We should know more tomorrow, when she appears before the beak.

Watch this space.

Beak? Help a Usofan out!

 

[Tropical Wilds]

What is weird?
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Someone commenting without knowing the facts?
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If you bothered to watch the video provided, you'd see that she didn't disobey "a public official in commission of their duties" and that we have a wonderful principle in law, it's called "innocent until proven guilty".
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So kettle I suggest you stop trying to be a pot, or gander being goose!

She was asked to leave and has been told on past occasions she can’t be there, she didn’t leave and she returned when she was told not to. She was asked to appear at a precinct for questioning. She said no. She was detained. Kind of like if you get pulled over on suspicion of DUI and ask for you to do a sobriety test. You can say no, but it means you’re going to be detained until a warrant is sworn out compelling you to submit blood for testing. She was asked to go in, she said no, she was detained until she was charged and compelled to answer questions. Charges that could have been avoided if she had obeyed the first order to not return there, or the second order to go to a station for questioning.

And the whole innocent until proven guilty refers to punishments and repercussions for crimes committed. It means the police can’t implement the punishments of somebody who is guilty upon her. It doesn’t mean they can’t arrest her. It has nothing to do with levying charges, which is what these are, or analyzing the merit of the charges, which is what we are doing. So the statement “innocent until proven guilty” is wholly irrelevant in this scenario.

 

[Darren Court]

She was asked to leave and has been told on past occasions she can’t be there, she didn’t leave and she returned when she was told not to. She was asked to appear at a precinct for questioning. She said no. She was detained. Kind of like if you get pulled over on suspicion of DUI and ask for you to do a sobriety test. You can say no, but it means you’re going to be detained until a warrant is sworn out compelling you to submit blood for testing. She was asked to go in, she said no, she was detained until she was charged and compelled to answer questions. Charges that could have been avoided if she had obeyed the first order to not return there, or the second order to go to a station for questioning.

And the whole innocent until proven guilty refers to punishments and repercussions for crimes committed. It means the police can’t implement the punishments of somebody who is guilty upon her. It doesn’t mean they can’t arrest her. It has nothing to do with levying charges, which is what these are, or analyzing the merit of the charges, which is what we are doing. So the statement “innocent until proven guilty” is wholly irrelevant in this scenario

Sorry you seem to be confused. You wrote..."disobeying a public service official in the commission of their duties.". Are you back tracking on that because this response says something different?
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She was asked to accompany them to the police station to answer questions and she asked if she had a choice, and if so, she would say no! She simply exercised what the choice the police officer gave her!
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" has been told on past occasions she can’t be there.." I've seen no evidence of this and followed the case closely. Can you provide a link?
Irrespective, the police have no power or authority to tell someone not to be anywhere. Only a court order can do that! The PSPO does not prohibit anyone from "being there" just not to carry out certain and prescribed activities when they are within the PSPO defined boundaries.
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"innocent until proven guilty refers to punishments and repercussions for crimes committed"... huh? I was referring to your judgement!" If you want to avoid being arrested, stop breaking the law…? " Since there is no law to stand and pray silently even within a PSPO, and the fact that she is innocent until proven guilty, your assumption that she was breaking the law is premature! Stop hanging the girl (metaphorically in your statements) until proven guility!

 

[Robban]

Huh? This isn't about raising children! It isn't even about the killing of children in the womb!
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It's about a woman standing on a street silently with no indication of why, and more importantly is that illegal!

I checked out,
"Loitering wirh intent"

If it is still valid I know not.

 

[Whyayeman]

Beak? Help a Usofan out!

Two great nations divided by a common language, again. The beak is the magistrate in criminal parlance.

 

[Robban]

Two great nations divided by a common language, again. The beak is the magistrate in criminal parlance.

Like "Apples and pears" =Stairs?

 

[Darren Court]

I checked out,
"Loitering wirh intent"

If it is still valid I know not.

Huh? "Loitering with intent" is a criminal act based on the intent to commit a criminal act. Since breach of PSPO isn't part of the criminal law, you can't be "loitering with intent" to breach PSPO!!!

 

[Aussie Pete]

As long as it does not break the law Christians can do whatever they want.

The law is the problem in many places. A UK bookshop owner was arrested for displaying 1 Corinthians 6:9 on his computer screen that faced the street. The case was dismissed, but he spent a night in jail anyway. Funny how no Muslim gets arrested for quoting the Koran. Another pastor was arrested for explaining what the Bible says about homosexuality. The question was from a Muslim. The pastor also spent the night in jail. The case was again dismissed. At least he was not in America. He had less chance of being shot.

I'm English. I am watching the place of my birth headed to an international backwater. I'm delighted that my parents got me out of there while I was a teenager.

The stupidity is that the passage in question is directed at Christians, not those who reject Christ. It's unfortunate that Christians misuse this passage. It creates unnecessary strife for believers. The UK has rejected God and God has returned the favour.

 

[Robban]

Huh? "Loitering with intent" is a criminal act based on the intent to commit a criminal act. Since breach of PSPO isn't part of the criminal law, you can't be "loitering with intent" to breach PSPO!!!

Is there such a thing as a dictionary for abbreviations?

Today with all the countless time saving appliances we do not have the time spell out what we are talking about.

 

[Larniavc]

The law is the problem in many places. A UK bookshop owner was arrested for displaying 1 Corinthians 6:9 on his computer screen that faced the street.

Good. That passage is needlessly offensive. Hopefully he was forced to take it down.

 

[2PhiloVoid]

Good. That passage is needlessly offensive. Hopefully he was forced to take it down.

So, some of you are here to protest. Merely to protest. ... I hope you see that I see that you see.

And God sees both of us.

 

[Darren Court]

Is there such a thing as a dictionary for abbreviations?

Today with all the countless time saving appliances we do not have the time spell out what we are talking about.

There is such a thing... it's called google!

 

[Robban]

There is such a thing... it's called google!

Then google "loitering with intent"

and you will maybe understand ir is not so simple as you say.