Polygamy problematic?.

[Junia]

Polygamy mentioned in scriptures was for various reasons.

A patriarchal system was instituted and because of that system everyone was now able to access at least "middle management" for issues that come up in life instead of going to the Top.

In several instances polygamy was mandated. If a brother died for some reason then his spouse was to be married to another brother and the child of that union was to be for the deceased brother. The book of Ruth is central to this theme of a kinsman Redeemer.

Then we have Moses.
Who after receiving the Law took a "barbarian" wife. (Cushite) obviously it was at the direction of God.

King's of Israel were often started out with two wives. There was no number limit placed on them.

Then we have polygamy in the New Testament.
The average wealthy Roman Businessman in various places had a wife that was of Roman upper society that was married for Business purposes or political reasons. The man also usually had a "consort"/girlfriend that was for true companionship. The Society wife would have offspring for carrying on the family name and was an heir. The consort's children...they didn't fare so well. But actually the girlfriend's status of being a consort was a recognized position in Roman society as having the ear of the man. Societal wives usually despised/disrespected their husbands for being placed first in name only but not function in their husband's hearts.

Paul, in a bit of a sarcastic jab at the situation, called both girlfriend and wife equally "wives" in the Pastoral letters.
Which of course infuriated and insulted Roman society because Romans only had one wife...but his letter was addressed to Timothy and was considered a form of an internal memo.
Kinda a backhanded fashion of telling Timothy that he could get married but only to one woman and no consort was going to be allowed and not to allow a wealthy person to take a leadership role.

But basically in all instances because of the role and opportunities for women no one suggested that support (in both directions) or in other words the symbiotic relationships with the multiple women and the only man be destroyed.


And in these modern times with everything on television I viewed a couple of programs covering a plural marriage...
The guy in the marriage was always hen pecked far more than I could ever withstand in any shape whatsoever.
Any thoughts that being in a plural marriage was about hedonism went right out the window, the door, and the chimney...
The children and the henpecking completely controlled the husband's life. He never caught a break...ever... even in his "down time".
So it became even more obvious that a person in such a position had no time to actually be of service to a church group.

I often wonder how Solomon coped.with all the nagging! All those wives and concubines!!

and I say this as a woman myself

 

[Natto]

most of country in the world just practice monogamy. Polygamy need a great financial account,and great management skill. And nowadays in most of country it's against law and would be punished. Polygamy is winner win it all, loser lose hard, that make competition more intense. Unless one converted into a few ancient tribe, immigrated to some less-developed country, or adopted uniquely special religious belief ,where and how in the world can one practice polygamy?

 

[Daniel Marsh]

read to here nice discussion all,
Daniel

 

[UnpopularOpinion]

I was having a discussion with someone who holds to Polygamy as being unproblematic. He asked me why I thought it was. I basically said it would hurt the wife by viewing her as not enough for him and would create a caste system. This was his response. How would you tackle this in a biblical way?

"Accordingto that reasoning, having more than one child is basically saying that the firstborn wasn't enough. Since scripture is ripe with sibling rivalry (Cain and Abel, Ismael and Isaac, Jacob and Esau), one can construct a religion trying to correct that tendency, by espousing a one child policy; then its adherents can come and ask questions similar to yours, about why, throughout scripture, God seems OK with having more than one offspring"

And I gave thee thy master's house, and thy master's wives into thy bosom, and gave thee the house of Israel and of Judah; and if that had been too little, I would moreover have given unto thee such and such things. 9Wherefore hast thou despised the commandment of the LORD, to do evil in his sight?

17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.


Multiple wives are gift from God therefore they can't be bad by default. You also had laws to marry widow of your brother if you were Jew

 

[HelenScot]

If our laws were to legalize polygyny, like it did same-sex marriage, the Bible holds no objection to it (apart from 1 Timothy 3:2, 12).

The bible holds every rejection to it. You don’t know your bible nor the fundamental messages of it if you can think that God promotes polygamy or same sex marriage. It is an abomination to God. Marriage is based on God’s relationship to his Church: one bridegroom, one bride.

 

[Sabertooth]

...if you can think that God promotes polygamy or same sex marriage.

I do not believe that Bible supports the latter, but there were instances in OT Israel where God required a man to marry his brother's widow, even if he already had his own wife.

The only obstruction to that, now, is the local laws of the land (which I am fine with), not the Bible.

 

[JackRT]

I do not believe that Bible supports the latter, but there were instances in OT Israel where God required a man to marry his brother's widow, even if he already had his own wife.

The only obstruction to that, now, is the local laws of the land (which I am fine with), not the Bible.

There is a great many instances in both Jewish and Christian scripture that reflects human societal norms rather than the word of God. Much of this centres around patriarchy. It is my personal opinion that patriarchy might just be the greatest evil human beings have ever inflicted on each other.

 

[Sabertooth]

There is a great many instances in both Jewish and Christian scripture that reflects human societal norms rather than the word of God.

Which one would OT levirate marriage be?

 

[JackRT]

Which one would OT levirate marriage be?

Levirate marriage is definitely patriarchal but it is mitigated somewhat by the concern for the welfare of the widow.

 

[Nine of Spades]

There is a great many instances in both Jewish and Christian scripture that reflects human societal norms rather than the word of God. Much of this centres around patriarchy. It is my personal opinion that patriarchy might just be the greatest evil human beings have ever inflicted on each other.

2 Timothy 3:16 says, "All scripture is God-breathed." Which is to say, the Holy Spirit wrote every word in the Bible. All heavenly scriptures, including the scriptures you don't like, are not merely the product of "[archaic] human societal norms" or "the patriarchy," but rather living, breathing, Spirit-inspired words directly from God himself.

The scriptures say that God permits polygamy, since many if not all of the Old Testament kings, all of them righteous servants of our Lord, had multiple wives. Deuteronomy 17:17 specifically endorses polygamy, saying that "[h]e must not take many wives." The term many suggests an excessive amount; which is to say, a Christian is allowed to take a few wives if he so chooses, just not too many of them.

Don't argue against polygamy. Otherwise you're arguing against the Word of God, which is never a good thing to do. "God is not mocked" (Galatians 6:7).

 

[JackRT]

2 Timothy 3:16 says, "All scripture is God-breathed." Which is to say, the Holy Spirit wrote every word in the Bible. All heavenly scriptures, including the scriptures you don't like, are not merely the product of "[archaic] human societal norms" or "the patriarchy," but rather living, breathing, Spirit-inspired words directly from God himself.

The scriptures say that God permits polygamy, since many if not all of the Old Testament kings, all of them righteous servants of our Lord, had multiple wives. Deuteronomy 17:17 specifically endorses polygamy, saying that "[h]e must not take many wives." The term many suggests an excessive amount; which is to say, a Christian is allowed to take a few wives if he so chooses, just not too many of them.

Don't argue against polygamy. Otherwise you're arguing against the Word of God, which is never a good thing to do. "God is not mocked" (Galatians 6:7).

Yes, whoever wrote Timothy (not Paul) did say that and those other verses are certainly Biblical but are they the word of God? Since you favour polygamy do you also accept polyandry?

 

[Nine of Spades]

Yes, whoever wrote Timothy (not Paul) did say that and those other verses are certainly Biblical but are they the word of God? Since you favour polygamy do you also accept polyandry?

When God created Eve for Adam, he created her as a "suitable helper" (Genesis 2:18), suggesting women are to play a subordinate role in their relations to men. Women shouldn't take multiple husbands for the same reason mankind shouldn't lay with womankind as one lays with mankind. Role reversal is clearly not what God intended for humanity.

 

[coffee4u]

I was having a discussion with someone who holds to Polygamy as being unproblematic. He asked me why I thought it was. I basically said it would hurt the wife by viewing her as not enough for him and would create a caste system. This was his response. How would you tackle this in a biblical way?

"Accordingto that reasoning, having more than one child is basically saying that the firstborn wasn't enough. Since scripture is ripe with sibling rivalry (Cain and Abel, Ismael and Isaac, Jacob and Esau), one can construct a religion trying to correct that tendency, by espousing a one child policy; then its adherents can come and ask questions similar to yours, about why, throughout scripture, God seems OK with having more than one offspring"

Polygamy is adultery and fornication. End of. When you get married it is to one person for life.
It doesn't matter if the people involved in the Polygamy think its fine or if no one gets hurt, that is not the definition of sin. But it seems a lot of people these days think it is! God decides what is sin. This is the Bibilcal line- what does God want? What does God define as being sin? Not "well it may make someone feel this way." It's nice to think about another person's feelings and we should, but that is not what makes something wrong or right.

Hebrews 13:4
Let marriage be held in honor among all, and let the marriage bed be undefiled, for God will judge the sexually immoral and adulterous.

1 Corinthians 6:18
Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body.

1 Thessalonians 4:3-5
For this is the will of God, your sanctification: that you abstain from sexual immorality; that each one of you know how to control his own body in holiness and honor, not in the passion of lust like the Gentiles who do not know God;

Romans 13:14
But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to gratify its desires.

Genesis 2:24
Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.''

1 Corinthians 7:39
A wife is bound to her husband as long as he lives. But if her husband dies, she is free to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord.

Mark 10:8-12
And the two shall become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.” And in the house the disciples asked him again about this matter. And he said to them, “Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her, and if she divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery.”

Mark 10:6-9
But from the beginning of creation, ‘God made them male and female.’ ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.”

 

[Nine of Spades]

Polygamy is adultery and fornication. End of. When you get married it is to one person for life.
It doesn't matter if the people involved in the Polygamy think its fine or if no one gets hurt, that is not the definition of sin. But it seems a lot of people these days think it is! God decides what is sin. This is the Bibilcal line- what does God want? What does God define as being sin? Not "well it may make someone feel this way." It's nice to think about another person's feelings and we should, but that is not what makes something wrong or right.

Hebrews 13:4
Let marriage be held in honor among all, and let the marriage bed be undefiled, for God will judge the sexually immoral and adulterous.

1 Corinthians 6:18
Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body.

1 Thessalonians 4:3-5
For this is the will of God, your sanctification: that you abstain from sexual immorality; that each one of you know how to control his own body in holiness and honor, not in the passion of lust like the Gentiles who do not know God;

Romans 13:14
But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to gratify its desires.

Genesis 2:24
Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh.''

1 Corinthians 7:39
A wife is bound to her husband as long as he lives. But if her husband dies, she is free to be married to whom she wishes, only in the Lord.

Mark 10:8-12
And the two shall become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.” And in the house the disciples asked him again about this matter. And he said to them, “Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her, and if she divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery.”

Mark 10:6-9
But from the beginning of creation, ‘God made them male and female.’ ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.’ So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.”

None of those Bible scriptures say, "Thou shalt not marry multiple wives." In fact, none of them address polygamy in the first place or even hint at the subject.

 

[coffee4u]

None of those Bible scriptures say, "Thou shalt not marry multiple wives." In fact, none of them address polygamy in the first place or even hint at the subject.

One woman to one man for life addresses Polygamy. The two shall become one.

It doesn't need a verse saying "Thou shalt not marry multiple wives." the same way we don't need a verse saying "Thou shalt not lie in the middle of the road and wait for a semi trailer" We know from other verses that we are to not commit suicide and that our body is the temple of the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 19:4-6
He answered, “Have you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.”

Only two can become one flesh. Adding in anyone else is adultery.

 

[Nine of Spades]

One woman to one man for life addresses Polygamy. The two shall become one.

It doesn't need a verse saying "Thou shalt not marry multiple wives." the same way we don't need a verse saying "Thou shalt not lie in the middle of the road and wait for a semi trailer" We know from other verses that we are to not commit suicide and that our body is the temple of the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 19:4-6
He answered, “Have you not read that he who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.”

Only two can become one flesh. Adding in anyone else is adultery.

For the record, I would never take multiple wives for myself. I am content to marry one woman for life. However, I cannot in good conscience argue against what scripture teaches on the subject of polygamy. And from what I've read and understood, scripture teaches that polygamy is perfectly acceptable.

As I said in my earlier post, Deuteronomy 17:17 addresses this subject; it says that a believer cannot take many wives. Which is to say, he cannot take an excess amount of wives, but he is permitted to take a few of them if he so chooses.

Again, polygamy is not something I wish to practice, but I feel like it's wrong and immoral to argue against the Word of God. Therefore, I believe polygamy should be legal for Christians wishing to enter into a plural marriage. It isn't adultery.

 

[Sabertooth]

...do you also accept polyandry?

(I am willing to speak to that in a PM, but I am not willing to derail this thread to do so.)

 

[Kylie]

most of country in the world just practice monogamy. Polygamy need a great financial account,and great management skill. And nowadays in most of country it's against law and would be punished. Polygamy is winner win it all, loser lose hard, that make competition more intense. Unless one converted into a few ancient tribe, immigrated to some less-developed country, or adopted uniquely special religious belief ,where and how in the world can one practice polygamy?

How do you figure polygamy requires a lot of money?

 

[Sabertooth]

How do you figure polygamy requires a lot of money?

More mouths to feed. Each wife and her children would be like a separate household.

 

[Tinker Grey]

More mouths to feed. Each wife and her children would be like a separate household.

Also, I believe that most though not all societies that have/had polygamy also have a bride price. So, not only does one need enough income to support the next household, one needs enough to pay a price outright.