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Physics and our place in the Universe

dad

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Science apparently says that our solar system is like a bubble moving in space.

"New data from NASA's Cassini spacecraft suggest that the shape of our solar system moving through the local Milky Way galaxy looks like a bubble.."



404809main_PIA12375-516.jpg


NASA - Bubble of Our Sun's Influence

This thread explores a new idea that suggests that the solar system area might indeed be a bubble, one that involves time....time controlled by the stars, which determines the laws and radioactive decay, and time dilation, etc etc!

Here is a synopis. (used with permission http://splitmerge.webs.com/stars.pdf)

http://splitmerge.webs.com/stars.pdf


Time dilation shows us that time is different in the solar system. From the experiments that show a time difference in as little as a foot, and continuing with height on building tops, mountains, airplanes and spacecraft. Indeed time is a part of the fabric of this world and solar system and all that is in them such as atoms, and light. Even down at the quantum level, time is woven in.



The following is a proposed model that explains the relationship to physics that time actually may have. It helps define our relationship with the past and future, and universe.

I will start with some things that are known both to science, and outside of science. Together, they paint an incredible picture. As mentioned we know that time is woven into the nature and physics of this present world. We know it affects decay rates, as evidenced by the many muon, and atomic clock experiments. It affects light, in that light can be shifted by time dilation, and of course it takes so much time to move.


In radioactive alpha decay we find that it is a balance of fundamental forces that is at work.

"In contrast to beta decay, the fundamental interactions responsible for alpha decay are a balance between the electromagnetic force and nuclear force."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alpha_particle


How these present forces came to exist, and be as they are id explained by science as originating in some theorized event in the 'early universe'

"During the quark epoch, the electroweak force split into the electromagnetic and weak force. The electromagnetic force plays a major role in determining the internal properties of most objects encountered in daily life."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_force

The methods used by science to calculate how the electro magnetic interactions and fields work, involve the balance and interactions of fundamentals such as time, light speed, charges, and such realities of the present.



"In the electric-magnetic field formulation there are four equations. Two of them describe how the fields vary in space due to sources, if any; electric fields emanating from electric charges in Gauss's law, and magnetic fields as closed field lines not due to magnetic monopoles in Gauss's law for magnetism. The other two describe how the fields "circulate" around their respective sources; the magnetic field "circulates" around electric currents and time varying electric fields in Ampère's law with Maxwell's addition, while the electric field "circulates" around time varying magnetic fields in Faraday's law.

"The precise formulation of Maxwell's equations depends on the precise definition of the quantities involved. Conventions differ with the unit systems; because various definitions and dimensions are changed by absorbing dimensionful factors like the speed of light c. This makes constants come out differently."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell's_equations

To summarize so far, the present state balance and interaction of fundamental forces affected by time, and involving time are what cause radioactive decay, and determine how it works. The origin of how the current forces and laws arrived at the way they now exist, and how they interact with other forces and time is the key issue.

I propose that if time itself was altered that it would affect all these forces and laws.


Science has used an explanation that requires belief and is beyond anything that is known to explain the very fundamental forces that exist now, namely this epoch that is invoked. Science, therefore has used, as a basis for calculations this invented 'epoch' that was supposedly responsible for things as we know them, in an unknown 'early universe' . In other words, at this point it ceases to be science in any real sense of the word, and becomes belief.

Not only does it become belief only at this point, but it becomes a belief that opposes the Scripture account of creation directly!

Is there a better explanation that is in keeping with the facts of this present state?

Looking at the record of the past in the bible, and the future we know that nature is different than today's nature to a large degree. The question is why was it different, and how.

The short answer proposed here is that God created the stars to control and regulate time for earth, not just in facilitating a calendar, but actually like a giant machine surrounding earth on all sides, that controls time itself for earth and our solar system!

The created exact position of earth inside this big 'time machine' if you will, was likely somewhat changed since creation. Evidence of a different alignment with the heavens comes in the foundations of ancient temples, pointing a little differently than modern ones built on top, and ancient records.

Could it be possible that our earth, and solar system were moved somewhat from their original position?! If time was controled and determined outside our solar system, could the fundamental way time is woven into our space, and matter and forces here also have changed??! A resulting change would be reflected in the way atoms work, and what time is involved, the aplha decay, light and ..all things we know now!

Using the bible as a guide to when a big nature change probably happened, we find that it is probably about the time of the great flood, or shortly after. After that time, man lived a fraction of the former lifespans, and other changes also seem apparent. (this link explores some of them Home - A Journey of Discovery )


The ancients accepted a spirit influence in the stars.

denderazod.jpg


The influence was also time related, as for example, each of the 12 star groups of the horoscope represent time in the form of months!

On the day when Genesis says the stars were made, we find four time related aspects regarding the lights in the heavens in one verse!!

4 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: 15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.


The stars were also felt to have great influence on earth. The bible speaks of them with a spiritual connection. Ancient civilizations also viewed the stars in a way that was very influential as well as related to spirits!

zodiac.jpg



If time as we know it is a function and feature of this 'solar system' (exact limits not known for our 'time system') then time here cannot be extended to the stars. That means no distances to stars is known, for example.

Time then, is not just a component of our space, and laws, and matter, and motion. Time would be merely experienced here in our present nature and state as it now was part of it."


copyright March 28 2014 Enjay B Davidavitch






http://splitmerge.webs.com/stars.pdf
 
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dad

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Time is nothing but another measurement of movement.
Opinion. A man's time involves more than movement. We have a real set allotted time and so many days to live according to God's word. The 1000 year reign of Christ will involve real time, and is not dependent on movement. The first real day in creation according to Genesis was not marked by star positions, or sun movements etc.

It is truly ignorant to try to limit time itself to 'nothing but another measurement of movement'!
 
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TLK Valentine

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Don't try your hand at science Dad. It is too boring reading garbled nonsense, especially in a post as long as this one.

And yet's it's the easiest way to defeat him -- just let him blather himself into a corner and he defeats himself.
 
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dad

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And yet's it's the easiest way to defeat him -- just let him blather himself into a corner and he defeats himself.
I'll take this as evidence that you can not address either the scientific issues, or the historical facts raised in the OP.
 
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dad

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Do you have a summary of the OP please?
Fair enough, it is a lot for some to read, no matter how earth shaking.

404809main_PIA12375-516.jpg


The general idea is that the solar system could be like a bubble nested in the stars.

zodiac.jpg


We are asking if God used the stars as a big time machine to control time on earth and area. This fits with the importance the ancients placed on the stars and even God in the bible. If our place in this universe (bubble) were changed at some point in the past (after creation, say just after the flood) this would affect all laws in our time space!
 
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lesliedellow

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Why on Earth would you assume that time may be different outside our solar system.

Granted, I only skim read but could you point me to the relevant part please?

A week or two ago he hit upon a newspaper article about an experiment performed to test the General Theory of Relativity, which he managed to completely misunderstand.

Besides which, his idea of doing science is that you make it up as you go along, to try and fit it into your theological ideas - and they are scarcely any less creative.
 
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dad

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Why on Earth would you assume that time may be different outside our solar system.
Why on Earth would you assume that time may not be different outside our solar system??


Granted, I only skim read but could you point me to the relevant part please?

There are many such parts. One would be the great emphasis and importance the ancients and God placed on the stars.

Another point is that our forces that control atoms and all things are very much dependent on time, and how time is woven in.
 
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dad

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A week or two ago he hit upon a newspaper article about an experiment performed to test the General Theory of Relativity, which he managed to completely misunderstand.

Besides which, his idea of doing science is that you make it up as you go along, to try and fit it into your theological ideas - and they are scarcely any less creative.
No. The importance of the stars to man was apparent from the dawn of history. The fact that time is woven in to the fabric of our nature and laws is also clear. Time is of paramount importance in any understanding of the universe.
 
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DogmaHunter

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This fits with the importance the ancients placed on the stars


The only reason the ancients placed importance on the stars is because their position marked the beginnings and ends of hunting and gathering seasons, as well as functioning as a natural GPS system.

Only by looking at the stars could the ancients orient themselves and find their way home.

Only by looking at the stars could the ancients tell if it was winter or summer (and thus if they should break up camp and move south or north).

Observing and interpreting the stars were their ticket to survival. Gods have nothing to do with this.


If our place in this universe (bubble) were changed at some point in the past (after creation, say just after the flood) this would affect all laws in our time space!

This makes no sense.

FYI: the stars we observe today ARE different from the stars the ancients observed thousands of years ago. Because our solar system orbits the galaxy and so the relative position of the stars we see changes as we move through the cosmos around the center of the milky way.
 
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lesliedellow

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FYI: the stars we observe today ARE different from the stars the ancients observed thousands of years ago. Because our solar system orbits the galaxy and so the relative position of the stars we see changes as we move through the cosmos around the center of the milky way.

Well, not really. The last time the Sun occupied its current position in the Milky Way, the dinosaurs were just about to put in an appearance. The mere 200,000 years we have been around is a mere drop in the ocean.
 
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lesliedellow

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No. The importance of the stars to man was apparent from the dawn of history.

A Christian lauding the merits of astrology. How interesting.



The fact that time is woven in to the fabric of our nature and laws is also clear. Time is of paramount importance in any understanding of the universe.

Yep. Well we had Einstein to sort that out for us. No doubt scientists will let you know when they need your help in constructing a new theory.
 
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SkyWriting

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A Christian lauding the merits of astrology. How interesting.Yep. Well we had Einstein to sort that out for us. No doubt scientists will let you know when they need your help in constructing a new theory.

Real scientists don't discount the value of theories by lay scientists or the general public.

"We believe that scientists have a responsibility to share the meaning and implications of their work, and that an engaged public encourages sound public decision-making. In addition, the ability to communicate directly and vividly can enhance scientists’ career prospects, helping them secure funding, collaborate across disciplines, compete for positions, and serve as effective teachers."
http://www.centerforcommunicatingscience.org/our-mission-2/
 
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