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Personally conservative but tolerant

Zoe1188

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So I just posted a response to a thread in the liberal forum, but I thought I'd share this here, since some of you might be in the same boat. I am a Christian (Catholic/Anglo Catholic) who lives an almost fundamentalist personal life (rarely drink, don't swear, dress modestly, ect.) However I am very tolerant, or at least try to be, of other peoples lives. I believe that LGBT people have absolutely every right to legal marriage, that social welfare and caring for the poor is vital, and although I am pro-life, I understand abortion is a complex issue.
My dilemma is: conservative Chritians see me as not being serious about my faith, and frankly sometimes their intolerance can make me uncomfortable. Where as liberals are frightened of me because I can come off as conservative :o
 

Izdaari Eristikon

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So I just posted a response to a thread in the liberal forum, but I thought I'd share this here, since some of you might be in the same boat. I am a Christian (Catholic/Anglo Catholic) who lives an almost fundamentalist personal life (rarely drink, don't swear, dress modestly, ect.) However I am very tolerant, or at least try to be, of other peoples lives. I believe that LGBT people have absolutely every right to legal marriage, that social welfare and caring for the poor is vital, and although I am pro-life, I understand abortion is a complex issue.
My dilemma is: conservative Chritians see me as not being serious about my faith, and frankly sometimes their intolerance can make me uncomfortable. Where as liberals are frightened of me because I can come off as conservative :o

I can relate. I have a combination of views and behaviors that irk both sides too, in personal life, in theology and in politics. Luckily, that's mitigated by some talent for tact and diplomacy, so I manage to get along with most of them, most of the time.
 
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Albion

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So I just posted a response to a thread in the liberal forum, but I thought I'd share this here, since some of you might be in the same boat. I am a Christian (Catholic/Anglo Catholic) who lives an almost fundamentalist personal life (rarely drink, don't swear, dress modestly, ect.) However I am very tolerant, or at least try to be, of other peoples lives. I believe that LGBT people have absolutely every right to legal marriage, that social welfare and caring for the poor is vital, and although I am pro-life, I understand abortion is a complex issue.
My dilemma is: conservative Chritians see me as not being serious about my faith, and frankly sometimes their intolerance can make me uncomfortable. Where as liberals are frightened of me because I can come off as conservative :o

In order to comment, guess we'd have to know what those terms mean in this particular case.
 
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Zoe1188

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In order to comment, guess we'd have to know what those terms mean in this particular case.

Sorry for the confusion. I guess to me conservative means going along right wing "Christian" political agenda. Not to say that Democrats have a particularly Christian agenda either, of course our beliefs inform our voting decisions, but neither party is the "Christian Party" at least to me. Intolerance I guess to me means a lack of understanding that others may not hold your opinion, and demonizing them for it. I don't go to church to hear about how Obama is the Anti-Christ and the LGBT community are single handedly distorting society. In being pro-life I mean I am against abortion, but understand that the decision is a very emotional and horrible one that noone takes lightly.
The issue I have is that not being a Tea Party Republican has made it difficult for me to fit in at extremely conservative churches, but being a very traditional Christian in my personal life leaves me at times misunderstood in liberal circles.

I don't mean to offend anyone at the end of the day all of the Body of Christ are my brothers and sisters who I love dearly:hug:
 
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AlexBP

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My wife and I have a set of beliefs that sounds fairly similar to yours, and we have encountered some of the same difficulties that you've described. I think that in the end, everyone must finally accept that we won't ever be part of a community that is in total agreement with us about everything. We live in a very complicated world, where everyone is forced to confront a variety of topics. Others will disagree with us about some of these topics, always. Like so many people, when I was young, I was determined to force my 'right' viewpoints onto everybody else. With maturity came the growing realization that I'd never succeed in doing so.

I have encountered friends, both in real life and on the internet, with a wide range of viewpoints from fundamentalist Christians to liberal Christians to non-believers. I believe that love is the key to building relationships, which can bridge the chasm of differences in theology, politics, and almost anything else.
 
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Zoe1188

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My wife and I have a set of beliefs that sounds fairly similar to yours, and we have encountered some of the same difficulties that you've described. I think that in the end, everyone must finally accept that we won't ever be part of a community that is in total agreement with us about everything. We live in a very complicated world, where everyone is forced to confront a variety of topics. Others will disagree with us about some of these topics, always. Like so many people, when I was young, I was determined to force my 'right' viewpoints onto everybody else. With maturity came the growing realization that I'd never succeed in doing so.

I have encountered friends, both in real life and on the internet, with a wide range of viewpoints from fundamentalist Christians to liberal Christians to non-believers. I believe that love is the key to building relationships, which can bridge the chasm of differences in theology, politics, and almost anything else.
:amen:
 
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Albion

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Sorry for the confusion. I guess to me conservative means going along right wing "Christian" political agenda. Not to say that Democrats have a particularly Christian agenda either, of course our beliefs inform our voting decisions, but neither party is the "Christian Party" at least to me.
Hmm. That wouldn't be the usual definition of the term, so maybe we should say you are a practicing Christian and are criticized by others who favor their own understandings of how they think a Christian should believe and act.

Intolerance I guess to me means a lack of understanding that others may not hold your opinion, and demonizing them for it.
OK, if that's what has happened to you, I get it. However, I see no reason to identify that reaction as "Conservative." One suggestion I have is to take "conservative" out of the conversation, whether it's applied to you or to them. I say this because I have the sneaking suspicion that part of their inhospitality towards you is resentment against you saying you're conserative--which they consider themselves to be--when you actually are a moderate.

I don't go to church to hear about how Obama is the Anti-Christ and the LGBT community are single handedly distorting society. In being pro-life I mean I am against abortion, but understand that the decision is a very emotional and horrible one that noone takes lightly.
The issue I have is that not being a Tea Party Republican has made it difficult for me to fit in at extremely conservative churches, but being a very traditional Christian in my personal life leaves me at times misunderstood in liberal circles
.

Well, there are plenty of churches in which you wouldn't fit in unless you were Far Left in your politics and despised as unchristian anyone who is pro-life, pro-free enterprise, or Republican.

I tend to think many of us have the same problem you've faced, just depending on which churches we are dealing with. It seems a hard one to get away from unless you choose your church with care. Our society is divided pretty much 50-50 at the moment with each side quite unforgiving of the other. To the extent that you can keep from letting this bitterness get you down, the better. However, it won't go away and we just have to negotiate our associations without giving up our principles.
 
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Tigger45

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So I just posted a response to a thread in the liberal forum, but I thought I'd share this here, since some of you might be in the same boat. I am a Christian (Catholic/Anglo Catholic) who lives an almost fundamentalist personal life (rarely drink, don't swear, dress modestly, ect.) However I am very tolerant, or at least try to be, of other peoples lives. I believe that LGBT people have absolutely every right to legal marriage, that social welfare and caring for the poor is vital, and although I am pro-life, I understand abortion is a complex issue.
My dilemma is: conservative Chritians see me as not being serious about my faith, and frankly sometimes their intolerance can make me uncomfortable. Where as liberals are frightened of me because I can come off as conservative :o
:amen:Tolerant is a synonym of moderate as defined for the purposes of this forum.:thumbsup:
 
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WannaWitness

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This is the dilemma I face, being quite conservative in my personal walk/lifestyle but not-so-much politically. While I naturally have reasonable standards as a Christian based on my understanding of the Bible, I feel myself to be moderate politically, socially conservative but maybe a little liberal on economy and health care issues. I am one of those awkward people that extremists on both sides tend not to understand; I mean, some would see me as a legalistic prude (just for having and expressing certain convictions I may have) where others on the other end would look upon me as "lukewarm" and not truly caring about pleasing the Lord just because I may not have the same convictions as they do (for instance, reading and studying only the King James translation, not wearing pants as a female, listening to only "traditional" music, and so on). So, I completely understand where my "moderate" brothers and sisters come from, facing the same dilemma myself, sometimes. Some understand "moderate" to mean being "wishy-washy" or "namby-pamby", and in some cases, this might be true. But I have posted in Bridge Builders for quite some time, and therefore, I can understand the positive side of the word. It simply means that we believe in respecting each other as fellow believers despite our differing convictions. This is what Romans 14 talks about.

Glad to have you here, Zoe1188.
 
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Albion

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This is the dilemma I face, being quite conservative in my personal walk/lifestyle but not-so-much politically. While I naturally have reasonable standards as a Christian based on my understanding of the Bible, I feel myself to be moderate politically, socially conservative but maybe a little liberal on economy and health care issues. I am one of those awkward people that extremists on both sides tend not to understand; I mean, some would see me as a legalistic prude (just for having and expressing certain convictions I may have) where others on the other end would look upon me as "lukewarm" and not truly caring about pleasing the Lord just because I may not have the same convictions as they do (for instance, reading and studying only the King James translation, not wearing pants as a female, listening to only "traditional" music, and so on). So, I completely understand where my "moderate" brothers and sisters come from, facing the same dilemma myself, sometimes. Some understand "moderate" to mean being "wishy-washy" or "namby-pamby", and in some cases, this might be true. But I have posted in Bridge Builders for quite some time, and therefore, I can understand the positive side of the word. It simply means that we believe in respecting each other as fellow believers despite our differing convictions. This is what Romans 14 talks about.
Glad to have you here, Zoe1188.

:thumbsup:
 
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Zoe1188

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This is the dilemma I face, being quite conservative in my personal walk/lifestyle but not-so-much politically. While I naturally have reasonable standards as a Christian based on my understanding of the Bible, I feel myself to be moderate politically, socially conservative but maybe a little liberal on economy and health care issues. I am one of those awkward people that extremists on both sides tend not to understand; I mean, some would see me as a legalistic prude (just for having and expressing certain convictions I may have) where others on the other end would look upon me as "lukewarm" and not truly caring about pleasing the Lord just because I may not have the same convictions as they do (for instance, reading and studying only the King James translation, not wearing pants as a female, listening to only "traditional" music, and so on). So, I completely understand where my "moderate" brothers and sisters come from, facing the same dilemma myself, sometimes. Some understand "moderate" to mean being "wishy-washy" or "namby-pamby", and in some cases, this might be true. But I have posted in Bridge Builders for quite some time, and therefore, I can understand the positive side of the word. It simply means that we believe in respecting each other as fellow believers despite our differing convictions. This is what Romans 14 talks about.

Glad to have you here, Zoe1188.

:hug:
 
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stevenfrancis

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Somehow...somewhere along the line....Christianity became both a target and a weapon for man made "politics". Savvy politicians are quick on the uptake in exploiting this as well. Until I heeded my actual call from Christ, I had been all over the map both politically and religiously in my life, which in retrospect makes a good deal of sense to me, because I didn't have the anchoring truth of Jesus Christ as the focal point of my life. I have actually been a far left political affiliate, at the peak of my Buddhist years where I didn't wish to ruffle the feathers of anybody or anything. I wouldn't even step on a spider. All war was wrong. I believed that the solutions to world problems were in the hands of human beings, so I was naturally drawn to the utopian thinking of Socialism. I would march with anybody or anything that was against the oppressive state. I had become a political leftist, and it was because I was without truth. Well, in my late 40's as I was undergoing a profound conversion, and answering the call of Jesus Christ to the truth, i sincerely died to my old self. When I see a video of myself in our home movies, I don't recognize me as being me. Not just the way I look, but mostly the things coming from my mouth. Who was that guy? What happened to my mind?

I am an orthodox, Roman-Catholic Christian man. Having died to the world in baptism, I have become a new creation. By making Christ the center of my life, I have lost my traditional American sense of politics. The left/right/conservative/liberal sense or lens through which to view things. When this happened, one of the things I began noticing as elections started coming around was that both of the major political parties in the United States were playing me for a fool. They both know that the largest voting block in the country is religious people. It's a religious country. So they each target certain values and ethics, and emphasize those to the voting public, and then either exaggerate OR de-emphasize the importance of issues that they know we filter through a Christian lens, in order to stir up animosity between persons, and make the modernist culture everything that satan could ever hope for it to be.

Neither party has left room for the actual Christian who loves the Lord God, with all his heart, all his mind, and all his strength, and loves his neighbor as himself. Neither want the Church to do what the Church does well, (faith, morals, charity, medicine, and education), and let government do what government does well, (national defense, common currency, and an international post office).

So where does that leave me when voting comes around? Good question. I have become a pariah to everyone I know politically. I can't get my Republican or Democrat friends to see that it's not really appropriate to identify with their parties, but that I love them all as people, just fine.

Just as a personal choice, (but there are probably many other ways to do it....this is just mine) is that I've let all the rhetoric of both parties become so much background noise. I've picked one issue, which isn't even a specifically Christian one. It is a sentence from our American Creed (The Declaration of Independence). The RIGHT of all persons to LIFE, LIBERTY, and the pursuit of HAPPINESS. Of those, the most fundamental is the right to life. Because if a person isn't born. If they're prevented or slaughtered before they get a chance to have a chair at the table, then we are a failed nation. An experiment which sadly died on the vine in the 1960's when powerful political lobbies snatched the most fundamental right of mankind from our grasp. Our American grasp. The only government to have ever founded itself on a creed.

So when I look at the field of candidates for any political office, the first thing I try to find out is their stance on contraception, abortion, and defense of marriage. (They all go hand in hand). The one who is closest to believing, and being the most willing to work towards the right of human beings to exist is who I vote for. I try to stay away from voting for anyone who would have happily prevented cooperating with God even to the point on my coming to being on this earth.

So yes, I'm a one issue voter. It's hopefully not permanent. If life once again becomes a the fundamental right of all Americans, then I can move on and see what they want to do about illegal immigration, a stronger dollar, a failing medical system, and big government. It's not that I don't care about any other issues. I truly do. We just have to have a benchmark. The same person who will strongly stand up for a persons right to BE in the first place, is also going to be more respectful of the wants and needs of that person as they grow into members of the society. If they get life right, there's a strong likelihood that they'll get other things right, because their fundamental motivations are sound.

As to your other observation.......I agree, it's very difficult to be Christan (and mean it), and be popular with a good number of people. That's not on us. That's on them. We have love for all. They have love only for those with whom they agree. who sanction their proclivities, perhaps, or are luke warm about their eugenics or overt acts aimed at the destruction of tradition of any kind. They love only the "tolerant" which to them means to sit and twittle ones thumbs. Keep our mouth shut, and let modernist and post-modernist culture just wash over us like some soothing balm. Just read the Gospels. Jesus made waves. He decried the culture. He loved everyone all the same, but he most definitely took a stand on sin. Sinners He loved. Sins He hated. And He didn't sit around all mealy mouthed and lukewarm about it either. He spoke truth. He IS truth. It is all He can be. He can't deceive. Only satan can deceive, and lull us to sleep in our sins.
---------------------------------------------
Revelation 3:14
And to the angel of the church at Laodicea write thus: A message to thee from the Truth, the faithful and unerring witness, the source from which God’s creation began: 15 I know of thy doings, and find thee neither cold nor hot; cold or hot, I would thou wert one or the other. 16 Being what thou art, lukewarm, neither cold nor hot, thou wilt make me vomit thee out of my mouth. 17 I am rich, thou sayest, I have come into my own; nothing, now, is wanting to me. And all the while, if thou didst but know it, it is thou who art wretched, thou who art to be pitied. Thou art a beggar, blind and naked; 18 and my counsel to thee is, to come and buy from me what thou needest; gold, proved in the fire, to make thee rich, and white garments, to clothe thee, and cover up the nakedness which dishonours thee; rub salve, too, upon thy eyes, to restore them sight. 19 It is those I love that I correct and chasten; kindle thy generosity, and repent. 20 See where I stand at the door, knocking; if anyone listens to my voice and opens the door, I will come in to visit him, and take my supper with him, and he shall sup with me. 21 Who wins the victory? I will let him share my throne with me; I too have won the victory, and now I sit sharing my Father’s throne. 22 Listen, you that have ears, to the message the Spirit has for the churches.
 
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Zoe1188

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Peace be with you Steven,

Thank you for your response. As far as politics goes, to me it's all lies and delusion to some degree. As you said, you would think that being "pro-life" as in anti-abortion would make a politician more respectful of life from begining to end, but that is rarely the case. I don't no of one "pro-life" politician that cares half as much about the quality of life of a child once it is born. I fell life the abortion issue is another way that politicians manipulate Christian's into voting a certain way. I'm almost done with voting altogether unfortunately :sigh:
 
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stevenfrancis

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Peace be with you Steven,

Thank you for your response. As far as politics goes, to me it's all lies and delusion to some degree. As you said, you would think that being "pro-life" as in anti-abortion would make a politician more respectful of life from begining to end, but that is rarely the case. I don't no of one "pro-life" politician that cares half as much about the quality of life of a child once it is born. I fell life the abortion issue is another way that politicians manipulate Christian's into voting a certain way. I'm almost done with voting altogether unfortunately :sigh:

Thank you Zoe. I wonder that this isn't a desired result of the same politicians. That we give up our right and responsibility to fight back through the vote rather than throw up our hands. Just stick by our guns. Demand better. If we don't get it.....oh well. Perhaps the next generation will. But if we relinquish the one power that we have as citizens because we don't trust or believe anything, then they have won with their overriding our Christian faith with worldly cynicism. At least it feels that way to me. I have voted outside the box before. Third party stuff. But then the Church tells us that unless there is a reasonable hope, that a protest vote is a throw away vote also. In the final analysis, if we always do what we always did, we'll always get what we always got. We need to vote differently WITHIN one of the major parties, until the parties MUST respond to us. Our life times? Who knows. Certainly not if they succeed in keeping conscientious people from voting altogether. Keep the hope of Christ, and put on His armor. Please pray for me in the struggle, and I will pray for you.
 
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Albion

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Peace be with you Steven,

Thank you for your response. As far as politics goes, to me it's all lies and delusion to some degree. As you said, you would think that being "pro-life" as in anti-abortion would make a politician more respectful of life from begining to end, but that is rarely the case. I don't no of one "pro-life" politician that cares half as much about the quality of life of a child once it is born.

Hmmm. I know quite a few who do. Of course, what you think will improve the quality of life for a child may not be the best way to do it. That's a more difficult issue to deal with than "Shall we kill the child in the womb? Yes or No."
 
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Zoe1188

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Hmmm. I know quite a few who do. Of course, what you think will improve the quality of life for a child may not be the best way to do it. That's a more difficult issue to deal with than "Shall we kill the child in the womb? Yes or No."

I wasn't trying to be antagonistic to anyone on this forum and truth be told I'm not interested in political debate as I'm not a political person. I just get frustrated with politics altogether. I'm sorry if my post seemed disrespectful to you or your personal political standing, it was not my intention. Again this thread was not posted to start political debate, so I will refrain from debating
 
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Albion

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I wasn't trying to be antagonistic to anyone on this forum and truth be told I'm not interested in political debate as I'm not a political person. I just get frustrated with politics altogether. I'm sorry if my post seemed disrespectful to you or your personal political standing, it was not my intention. Again this thread was not posted to start political debate, so I will refrain from debating

Whoa. It was just a thought that arose after reading your thought. I didn't think either of us wanted to start a debate.
 
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FireDragon76

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"Anglican" is a good fit for you. I can relate to what you are talking about, in many ways I look and act conservative, even espouse some conservative sentiments sometimes. But politically I am liberal.

I think anyone that is truly Christian is going to be seen as a bit conservative, especially to the irreligious. I currently attend a liberal Old Catholic parish that welcomes gays and has a non-political stance on abortion, but... the tone of the service in the preaching isn't that different from conservative mainline churches I've gone to.
 
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