Personal Tnoughts on Marriage

[McScribe]

I give up.

 

[FaithPrevails]

From the ERA website:

Hostile environment sexual harassment occurs when unwanted sexual touching, comments, and/or gestures are so bad or occur so often that it interferes with your schoolwork, makes you feel uncomfortable or unsafe at school, or prevents you from participating in or benefiting from a school program or activity. This type of harassment does not have to involve a threat or promise of benefit in exchange for a sexual favor. The harassment can be from your teacher, school officials, or other students.

From the National Center for Victims of Crime:

Sexual assault takes many forms including attacks such as rape or attempted rape, as well as any unwanted sexual contact or threats. Usually a sexual assault occurs when someone touches any part of another person's body in a sexual way, even through clothes, without that person's consent. Some types of sexual acts which fall under the category of sexual assault include forced sexual intercourse (rape), sodomy (oral or anal sexual acts), child molestation, incest, fondling and attempted rape. Sexual assault in any form is often a devastating crime. Assailants can be strangers, acquaintances, friends, or family members. Assailants commit sexual assault by way of violence, threats, coercion, manipulation, pressure or tricks. Whatever the circumstances, no one asks or deserves to be sexually assaulted.

This was pretty much the same definition I found everywhere.

 

[c1ners]

So, you walk down the hallway and you see girls groping boys? Every day?

My daughter used to tell me some pretty wild stories when she was in High School. Both boys and girls are awfully bold anymore.

 

[dallasapple]

In the novel Les Miserables Jean Valjean goes to the galleys as a slave for stealing a loaf of bread. I think that we can all see how enslaving a man with a starving family for stealing bread is excessive.

What is Christian at all in admiring the letter of the law so much? I mean do we really believe in Christianity when that's what we prefer to considering another way of handling something? Is this what some of you want...that the police never let you off with a warning? Speeding is way more dangerous than what the boys did. Shoplifters have sometimes been warned, and not done it again. They were sexually harrassed but they were not assaulted.
Properly speaking God should punish all of us for a million actions with unseen consequences that are sinful, that harm and ruin. God forgives us, has our forgiveness waiting for us the moment we repent.

So when the possibility that something else could be done is brought up, I think we should leap at it.

How do YOU know these boys werent warned?Werent asked to stop?What do you mean "antoher way of handeling it'..SURE I would LOVE for there to be NO CRIME beign committed agaisnt anyone ever..therefore no need fro ANYONE to have to be arrested for it ..and convicted and serve time.

But what does that have to do with this?

I dont even get what you are so distressed about..the boys were let go and the charges dismissed..because the girls involoved came forward and expressed thier wishes for them not to be convicted..That doesnt mean they were "innocent"..it means they were given considrationa and the judge had mercy..Whats your complaint?

They were committing CRIMES(this wasnt once and there wasnt one victim)SOMEONE reported their crimes to athourtiies..the authorities justly so arrested them and charged them with the crimes they were accused of..the comaplainents then asked the judge to let them go with an apology..he OBLIGED...

What exactly is your problem with that?

The only other "solution" is to make it NOT a crime against another person to touch them sexually agaisnt their will Mscribe.

Dallas

 

[JaneFW]

On my home computer, I have an article bookmarked that discusses how to help our sons fend off aggressive girls (it's Christian based, btw). If female aggressors did not exist in the tween/teen demographic, why on earth would articles like that exist, right?

Articles exist for all kinds of things. Nobody said that there was no such thing as a sexually aggressive female. Nobody! Just that these girls were not the aggressors, and that many girls, like many boys, are quite innocent and pure at that age.

 

[JaneFW]

From the ERA website:

Hostile environment sexual harassment occurs when unwanted sexual touching, comments, and/or gestures are so bad or occur so often that it interferes with your schoolwork, makes you feel uncomfortable or unsafe at school, or prevents you from participating in or benefiting from a school program or activity. This type of harassment does not have to involve a threat or promise of benefit in exchange for a sexual favor. The harassment can be from your teacher, school officials, or other students.

Criminal Code of Canada:

SEXUAL ASSAULT (Basic Summaries)

Section 271 – Sexual Assault:
Somebody touches you in a sexual way on purpose,directly or indirectly, without your consent.

It's a CRIME.

 

[FaithPrevails]

Articles exist for all kinds of things. Nobody said that there was no such thing as a sexually aggressive female. Nobody! Just that these girls were not the aggressors, and that many girls, like many boys, are quite innocent and pure at that age.

No one has negated that the girls in the news article were not the aggressors, though. It has simply been stated that girls can be aggressors, as well.

 

[FaithPrevails]

Criminal Code of Canada:

SEXUAL ASSAULT (Basic Summaries)

Section 271 – Sexual Assault:
Somebody touches you in a sexual way on purpose,directly or indirectly, without your consent.

I'm sure we could go on ad inifintum with citations for assault vs harrassment, so I'm going to just leave it that I completely and totally disagree that what those boys did was assault. You are free to emphatically disagree with me until the cows come home and you won't hurt my feelings a bit.

 

[JaneFW]

Well you can disagree all you want to Faith, but it's defined as a crime in law, and that's all there is to it. The boys touched the girls sexually. The girls did not consent. Therefore, sexual assault.

 

[dallasapple]

They were sexually harrassed but they were not assaulted.

I beg to differ Mscribe..ANYONE who is ARRESTED is HANDCUFFED..these boys werent just HANDCUFFED ..they were ARRESTED for a crime..

If the VICTIMS choose NOT to report thats up to them ..Shoplifters?..If the SHOPOWNER chooses to NOT call the police and report the crime thne of course they arent hancuffed..but that is NOT up to the police..and if the victim reports the crime and there is evidence to back it up..the police's JOB is to take you into custody and charge you formally with the crime..part of that process is HANDCUFING you ..

But its not up to YOU or to ME to make judgments on the shopowner who has as thief on their hands..to JUDGE them for calling the police and wanting charges pressed..

If MY son goes to school and is MOLESTED sexually by another student..thats up to ME and HIM to report that person to the police..If I choose to do that..Im NOT the villain..there is NO other term for that other than demonizing the VICTIM of a crime..

Dallas

 

[Created2Write]

I am going to say it again b/c my other post got ignored. But, to me, the real issue is the parents and their lack of involvement in teaching the correct values and morals to their kids. Between modern parenting (or, more accurately stated - lack of parenting) and the disconnect between parents/kids due to technology, kids are not getting enough face time with their parents and are pretty much raising themselves.

The education system should not be accountable for teaching our kids proper manners, values, and morals. That's our job or we have no business having children.

So, the stink needs to be raised at a more basic level. More pressure needs to be put on parents to raise their children properly. Not on the education system or our government or "society in general". The focus needs to be much more narrow.

I agree.

 

[Created2Write]

From middle school all through HS, I dealt with boys being sexually inappropriate - thanks to being a large-chested girl. I got "humped" by a boy in Art class in middle school, had boys oogle and make jokes about my breasts, had a boy that sat behind me in 11th grade history class constantly grab my hand and try to get me to touch his privates.

Yes, it was unpleasant and made me uncomfortable. But, I hardly would say that it caused long term damage. Mostly, I just rolled my eyes in disgust at their immature behavior.

Was the behavior I was subjected to inappropriate? Absolutely.

Is it "normal" given the age and the drive of hormones that these boys don't know how to control? I think it is.

Does it mean it should be tolerated? Absolutely not.

Should their parents be teaching them better self-control, values, and morals? Most definitely.

It never even occurred to me, though, that they were sexually assaulting me. I still wouldn't classify it as assault, tbh. Though I wasn't a willing participant, I wasn't a victim, either, IMO. It is, unfortunately, a natural part of hormonal surges combined with a lack of proper self control.

Which is why I'm such a huge proponent of parents being more involved with their kids and drilling self control, morals, and values into their kids - boys and girls alike.

BTW, this behavior didn't stop when I reached adulthood. I had a co-worker who did cross the line into sexual harrassment. My father knew him well and put an end to it quickly. I also had another man stalk me for a short time - again, Daddy to the rescue. So, I did address behaviors that were truly harmful or dangerous swiftly and without fear b/c I wasn't going to tolerate being violated by someone who was doing what they were doing intentionally and at an age where they should have known better.

Again, I totally agree.

 

[dallasapple]

Criminal Code of Canada:

SEXUAL ASSAULT (Basic Summaries)

Section 271 – Sexual Assault:
Somebody touches you in a sexual way on purpose,directly or indirectly, without your consent.

It's a CRIME.

Its unbelievable..If I as an adult..go to the store today..and a strange man grabs my breast and walks off..according to some here thats not an assault..It must be so often I suppose (by the same person too it sounds) that it litterally interferes with my abiltiy to get mys shopping done for it to be a crime..Unbelievable...

And by the way..look up the defination of MOLEST..

Dallas

 

[JaneFW]

United States Department of Justice

What is sexual assault?

Sexual assault is any type of sexual contact or behavior that occurs without the explicit consent of the recipient. Falling under the definition of sexual assault are sexual activities as forced sexual intercourse, forcible sodomy, child molestation, incest, fondling, and attempted rape.

 

[JaneFW]

Its unbelievable..If I as an adult..go to the store today..and a strange man grabs my breast and walks off..according to some here thats not an assault..It must be so often I suppose (by the same person too it sounds) that it litterally interferes with my abiltiy to get mys shopping done for it to be a crime..Unbelievable...

And by the way..look up the defination of MOLEST..

Dallas

Oh but you'll just giggle Dallas - that's what girls do - they giggle. Or, it's more likely that you will grab his bits.

 

[FaithPrevails]

Oh but you'll just giggle Dallas - that's what girls do - they giggle. Or, it's more likely that you will grab his bits.

Have I mocked your POV? Do I not deserve the same respect in return?

 

[dallasapple]

Also..just becasue Faith wasnt bothered by perverts molesting her and making sexually innapropriate comments to her doesnt mean it should then be legal for all people to have to endure such things and to not have any legal rights for it to be stopped..

Saying that it didnt bother you "that much' is a moot point..society as a whole has determined its offensive enough to call it a crime.That we have the RIGHT to NOT be touched ...that someone else doesnt have to RIGHT to touch me whenever they feel the urge and I have to just accept it..

I do NOT want my sons to go to school ..and be told..well its "normal " for girls to grab your rear end and your crotch..if you find it offensive or it irrtitates you just blow it off..Sometimes people just feel like grabbing and groping each other that way.They cant really control it..Oh and by the way..its O.K for you too..if you get the urge..ya know you are a 15 year old boy...to grab a breast here and there..or hump the air and make sexual comments..Just dont make it a "habit"..try and keep it to a minimum..Its really not that bad unless you do it to the point someone might have problems with there grades or something..Im sorry thats sheer ignorance and a barbaric attitude.

Dallas

 

[c1ners]

Oh but you'll just giggle Dallas - that's what girls do - they giggle. Or, it's more likely that you will grab his bits.

Honestly? If some strange man came up and grabbed my boobs, I probably would grab his bits. I'd grab them and twist them and probably knock him upside his head while screaming at him.

 

[McScribe]

Who cares anyway. It doesn't matter. All that matters is the law. Why we even bother with Christianity is beyond me. I mean you can't even talk about it without being accused of approving of sexual assault. It makes me sick.

 

[JaneFW]

Who cares anyway. It doesn't matter. All that matters is the law. Why we even bother with Christianity is beyond me. I mean you can't even talk about it without being accused of approving of sexual assault. It makes me sick.

But McScribe -- you can't be outside the law of the land! You can't. The boys couldn't, and you can't. Do you think that if I went right now and started getting all over my boss (ugh) and then said "but I'm a Christian, so you must forgive me" that would work? Of course not. He would call HR, and get me hauled out of here, and off to the funny farm (where I would need to go for sure.) There just is the law, and the law doesn't care which church you attend if you break it. You just broke it.

Edited to add - and that's how it should be. No favor shown to people according to wealth, race, gender, religion etc.