Peanut Gallery - Formal Debate - New World Order

[Rick Otto]

why would they HAVE to do that in the UK or USA?
look at the history of both countries, until relatively recently the normal mechanisms of the culture kept Catholics down, extraordinary measures as seen in the Cristaros war in Mexico and the French Revolution were not needed

in places where the Catholic Church was stronger, more force was used to combat the Church, in places where the Catholic Church is weaker, Freemasonry can just kinda coast along.

In the USA there was the Know-Nothing Party and the KKK to keep the Church down, secularists had already worked in an unnatural separation of Church and State into the legal system, the vast majority of schools were State run and Catholics were a minority
you do not use TNT to kill a fly
the KKK did raise money to support the Anti-Catholic regime in Mexico btw, so there was some collaboration

He's arguing as if he knows how something he doesn't believe exists, works.

Truth is, these people (not all of them masons) infiltrate both sides of every issue camp in order to gain full spectrum control. The first reason people think it sounds crazy goes back to their thinking every one involved knows everything about the conspiracy.

 

[Armoured]

He's arguing as if he knows how something he doesn't believe exists, works.

Truth is, these people (not all of them masons) infiltrate both sides of every issue camp in order to gain full spectrum control. The first reason people think it sounds crazy goes back to their thinking every one involved knows everything about the conspiracy.

So you can claim masons are behind anything that happens, and thus more "evidence" of a conspiracy. How convenient.

 

[Simpleman25]

Catholic Priest executed by Mexican Soldiers under the regime of Freemason President Calles
Calles was HONORED by Scottish Rite Freemasons for this, so do not try and claim that "oh there are bad apples in every group"
he was going along with the aims of that group

Your picture evidence states that it was a government firing squad. Doesn't say they were masons.

 

[Armoured]

Nor does it usually lead to denying it.

Valuable observations, these are!

*blink blink* huh?

 

[Armoured]

Your picture evidence states that it was a government firing squad. Doesn't say they were masons.

The President was a mason apparently.

Although how one thinks that a president alone can instigate anti-Catholic measures in his country is a bit beyond me. Also notice that shooting priests for being priests was never apparently a capital offense, as far as I can find out. I'd be interested to know exactly what this one was shot for, officially.

Frankly, knowing the history of religion in Mexico, I find accusations of a bona fide attempt to repress Catholicism, frankly, absurd. But I stand open to more information.

 

[Rick Otto]

"open"...right.

The president was the only mason.
The soldiers had to be masons.

Right.

 

[rick357]

I think you could remove the dirt from Mexico before you could remove Catholicism. I also believe most masons are smart enough to know taking a cup of water from the ocean wont cause it to dry up

 

[Rhamiel]

Your picture evidence states that it was a government firing squad. Doesn't say they were masons.

yes, those were government soldiers
the President, who ordered the persecution, was a Freemason who was honored by the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry for his oppression of the Catholic Church

I do not know the personal beliefs of the soldiers in the pictures.... but they were working under the orders of President Calles

 

[Rhamiel]

He's arguing as if he knows how something he doesn't believe exists, works.

Truth is, these people (not all of them masons) infiltrate both sides of every issue camp in order to gain full spectrum control. The first reason people think it sounds crazy goes back to their thinking every one involved knows everything about the conspiracy.

Pope Francis agrees with you that there has been some level of Masonic infiltration

Simpleman25 tries to make this level of infiltration as a sign that Freemasonry is compatible with Christianity rather then proof that Freemasonry is trying to manipulate, dominate, and maybe even obliterate Christian denominations from within

Most of us would laugh at the idea of a masonic mafia at work in the Vatican. I’m not sure that we should | CatholicHerald.co.uk

 

[Simpleman25]

Pope Francis agrees with you that there has been some level of Masonic infiltration

Simpleman25 tries to make this level of infiltration as a sign that Freemasonry is compatible with Christianity rather then proof that Freemasonry is trying to manipulate, dominate, and maybe even obliterate Christian denominations from within

Most of us would laugh at the idea of a masonic mafia at work in the Vatican. I’m not sure that we should | CatholicHerald.co.uk

First you claim masons are trying end Catholicism, now you claim they are trying to end Christianity?

That statement borders on absurd.

Freemasonry is steeped in Christianity. The original charters and rules were based on the teachings of the bible.

 

[Simpleman25]

yes, those were government soldiers
the President, who ordered the persecution, was a Freemason who was honored by the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry for his oppression of the Catholic Church

I do not know the personal beliefs of the soldiers in the pictures.... but they were working under the orders of President Calles

Calles was a mason. That doesn't make freemasonry anti Catholic in any way at all. One man does not now, nor ever speak on behalf of freemasonry.

 

[Rick Otto]

99% of masons are not the "they" we ascribe these motives to. The 99% are steeped in all kinds of stuff. They have good intentions. We are talking about conspirators who infiltrate, and then co-op those intentions.

It is an absurd idea of how conspiracy is played out to assume the guys on the bottom of the pyramid know what the cabal at the top are really up to.

 

[Rick Otto]

Calles was a mason. That doesn't make freemasonry anti Catholic in any way at all. One man does not now, nor ever speak on behalf of freemasonry.

Show us the freemason denunciation of his murder.

 

[Simpleman25]

99% of masons are not the "they" we ascribe these motives to. The 99% are steeped in all kinds of stuff. They have good intentions. We are talking about conspirators who infiltrate, and then co-op those intentions.

It is an absurd idea of how conspiracy is played out to assume the guys on the bottom of the pyramid know what the cabal at the top are really up to.

That's not what is being claimed here. The comment is that Freemasonry is anti Catholic. Not 1%.

 

[Simpleman25]

Show us the freemason denunciation of his murder.

Why would there be? Is there one from any other group?

 

[Armoured]

Why would there be? Is there one from any other group?

Pretty much my thought, too. Is a lack of denunciation about an assassination evidence of complicity for anyone else?

 

[Targaryen]

Pretty much my thought, too. Is a lack of denunciation about an assassination evidence of complicity for anyone else?

For some individuals, not everyone else the answer is yes...sadly.

 

[Rhamiel]

Calles was a mason. That doesn't make freemasonry anti Catholic in any way at all. One man does not now, nor ever speak on behalf of freemasonry.

Scottish Rite Freemasonry honored Calles for his work in oppressing the Catholic Church

so yeah, one man does not speak for all of Freemasonry

but I think the actions of Scottish Rite Freemasonry does help condemn the society as anti-Catholic

here is an account from St. Maximilian Kolbe, talking about an anti-Catholic parade put on by Freemasons in 1917

"The Freemasons in Rome began to demonstrate openly and belligerently against the Church. They placed the black standard of the "Giordano Brunisti" under the window of the Vatican. [Giordano Bruno was a Dominican turned Calvinist turned pantheist who was burned as a heretic on Feb. 17, 1600. This Masonic demonstration most likely occurred on Feb. 17 to commemorate his death]. On this standard the archangel St. Michael was depicted lying under the feet of the triumphant Lucifer. At the same time, countless pamphlets were distributed to the people in which the Holy Father was attacked shamefully. "Right then I conceived the idea of organizing an active society to counteract Freemasonry and other slaves of Lucifer""

 

[Simpleman25]

Scottish Rite Freemasonry honored Calles for his work in oppressing the Catholic Church

so yeah, one man does not speak for all of Freemasonry

but I think the actions of Scottish Rite Freemasonry does help condemn the society as anti-Catholic

here is an account from St. Maximilian Kolbe, talking about an anti-Catholic parade put on by Freemasons in 1917

"The Freem44asons in Rome began to demonstrate openly and belligerently against the Church. They placed the black standard of the "Giordano Brunisti" under the window of the Vatican. [Giordano Bruno was a Dominican turned Calvinist turned pantheist who was burned as a heretic on Feb. 17, 1600. This Masonic demonstration most likely occurred on Feb. 17 to commemorate his death]. On this standard the archangel St. Michael was depicted lying under the feet of the triumphant Lucifer. At the same time, countless pamphlets were distributed to the people in which the Holy Father was attacked shamefully. "Right then I conceived the idea of organizing an active society to counteract Freemasonry and other slaves of Lucifer""

Ok, you just shot yourself in the foot. 1600? Hate to burst your bubble, but freemasonry wasn't established that early!

Secondly, it was the Scottish rite of Mexico that gave him a medal. NOT Scottish rite as a group.

Do you even know how he came about his hatred of Catholicism? It's an interesting point you either overlooked, or blew off because it contradicts your freemasonry point of view.

 

[Rhamiel]

the blasphemous parade was in 1917 in Rome
the link I posted speculated that it was on February 17 to celebrate the martyrdom of an atheistic "Freethinker" who was killed in the 1600, though St.Maximilian Kolbe did not give an exact date in his writings

so the event happened in 1917 and was under the "banner" of the guy who was burned at the stake.

I do not know why Calles started to be anti-Catholic
but I do know that his hateful oppressive mindset found a home in Freemasonry that supports such views

but if you know how he came about to be anti-Catholic, feel free to share it with us
but do not accuse me of leaving it out in order to be tricky, I am not the personal biographer of Calles

Secondly, it was the Scottish rite of Mexico that gave him a medal. NOT Scottish rite as a group.

ok
but a LOT of people on this thread are trying to make it sound like it is just one or two bad apples not a systemic problem
this, and actions done by Freemasonry show that this is not JUST a few individuals but part of the groups mindset