Peanut Gallery - Formal Debate - New World Order

[Rick Otto]

All coincidence plus a few bad apples.

Proves nothing.

 

[Armoured]

Forgive me for pointing out confirmation bias & other biases also explain the denial of evidence.

Indeed?

Do explain that one, pray?

 

[Armoured]

Catholic Priest executed by Mexican Soldiers under the regime of Freemason President Calles
Calles was HONORED by Scottish Rite Freemasons for this, so do not try and claim that "oh there are bad apples in every group"
he was going along with the aims of that group

So, this happened to a sizeable percentage of Catholic priests in Mexico, did it?

 

[Armoured]

All coincidence plus a few bad apples.

Proves nothing.

Like I said, I bet if you went looking you'd find plenty of left handers, or people with blood group AB-, doing the same sorts of things. That hardly suggests there's an evil global conspiracy of left handers, though, does it?

 

[Rick Otto]

Indeed?

Do explain that one, pray?

Same as yours.
Amen.

 

[Rick Otto]

Like I said, I bet if you went looking you'd find plenty of left handers, or people with blood group AB-, doing the same sorts of things. That hardly suggests there's an evil global conspiracy of left handers, though, does it?

You single out one evidence in a preponderance of such as if it is an exception.


If the shoe fits...


Call OJ Simpson! lol

 

[Armoured]

You single out one evidence in a preponderance of such as if it is an exception.


If the shoe fits...


Call OJ Simpson! lol

You're the guys providing evidence in single cases and extrapolating from there, I'm only addressing what's presented.

By all means, if you have any evidence of a massive underlying conspiracy, present it, do.

 

[Rick Otto]

No thanks. If you were really interested, you would Google it.
Presentations are plentiful.

 

[Rick Otto]

 

[Armoured]

No thanks. If you were really interested, you would Google it.
Presentations are plentiful.

As it is, you prefer to set me up for a knockdown. Don't deny it.
Have you prospered in commerce from a Masonic association?

I'm not setting anything. I'm pointing out flaws in the theory. The fact you don't enjoy the cognitive dissonance kicking in is no reason to start casting aspersions.

 

[Rick Otto]

Boredom isn't dissonance.

 

[Armoured]

Boredom isn't dissonance.

Boredom doesn't usually lead to accusing others of being part of a conspiracy, either.

 

[Radagast]

"'Look at it!' said Fr. Theophanes, the monastery's tall, gaunt Guest Master, waving a hand at the dark rocky gorge beneath us. 'There it is: the Valley of Doom. The Valley of Dreadful Judgement. ... on Judgement Day that's where the River of Blood is going to flow. It's going to be full of Freemasons, harlots and heretics: Protestants, Schismatics, Jews, Catholics... At the head of the damned will be a troop composed of all the Popes of Rome, followed by their deputies, the Vice-Presidents of the Freemasons...'

'You're saying the Pope is a Freemason?'

'A Freemason? He is the President of the Freemasons. Everyone knows this.'" -- from From The Holy Mountain by William Dalrymple (at the Mar Saba Monastery, overlooking the Kidron Valley)

 

[Rhamiel]

So, this happened to a sizeable percentage of Catholic priests in Mexico, did it?

from what I have read the persecution was bloodier in the southern states of Mexico, with some places in the north having only minimal abuses
"minimal abuses" would still cover deportation of naturalized Mexican citizens where were members of Religious communities, confiscation of land and property, being arrested and held without formal charges being placed or the benefit of a lawyer, beatings by police officers, churches being boarded up sacred vessels being stolen or desecrated by police.

think of the French Reign of Terror and you get an idea

 

[Armoured]

from what I have read the persecution was bloodier in the southern states of Mexico, with some places in the north having only minimal abuses
"minimal abuses" would still cover deportation of naturalized Mexican citizens where were members of Religious communities, confiscation of land and property, being arrested and held without formal charges being placed or the benefit of a lawyer, beatings by police officers, churches being boarded up sacred vessels being stolen or desecrated by police.

think of the French Reign of Terror and you get an idea

Uh-huh.

So... if this is a global conspiracy, why don't we see this happening everywhere masons are in power, like the US, or UK, for instance?

 

[Rhamiel]

Uh-huh.

So... if this is a global conspiracy, why don't we see this happening everywhere masons are in power, like the US, or UK, for instance?

why would they HAVE to do that in the UK or USA?
look at the history of both countries, until relatively recently the normal mechanisms of the culture kept Catholics down, extraordinary measures as seen in the Cristaros war in Mexico and the French Revolution were not needed

in places where the Catholic Church was stronger, more force was used to combat the Church, in places where the Catholic Church is weaker, Freemasonry can just kinda coast along.

In the USA there was the Know-Nothing Party and the KKK to keep the Church down, secularists had already worked in an unnatural separation of Church and State into the legal system, the vast majority of schools were State run and Catholics were a minority
you do not use TNT to kill a fly
the KKK did raise money to support the Anti-Catholic regime in Mexico btw, so there was some collaboration

 

[Armoured]

why would they HAVE to do that in the UK or USA?
look at the history of both countries, until relatively recently the normal mechanisms of the culture kept Catholics down, extraordinary measures as seen in the Cristaros war in Mexico and the French Revolution were not needed

in places where the Catholic Church was stronger, more force was used to combat the Church, in places where the Catholic Church is weaker, Freemasonry can just kinda coast along.

In the USA there was the Know-Nothing Party and the KKK to keep the Church down, secularists had already worked in an unnatural separation of Church and State into the legal system, the vast majority of schools were State run and Catholics were a minority
you do not use TNT to kill a fly
the KKK did raise money to support the Anti-Catholic regime in Mexico btw, so there was some collaboration

If you are really that desperate to believe that this is all because of some diabolical conspiracy, I guess it's pointless trying to get you to question your base assumptions.

Have fun with it.

 

[Rhamiel]

If you are really that desperate to believe that this is all because of some diabolical conspiracy, I guess it's pointless trying to get you to question your base assumptions.

Have fun with it.

you never really responded to the fact that the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry awarded President Calles with honors for his work in persecuting the Catholic Church.
do I think EVERYTHING is a conspiracy?
lol no
do I think that Freemasonry is Anti-Catholic in a systemic and serious way, yes.
I have offered you evidence about that

and if you do not believe me, atleast believe the 8 or 9 Popes who have warned us that Freemasonry is dangerous and not compatible with Christianity

why do you feel the need to defend the enemies of the Church?

 

[Armoured]

you never really responded to the fact that the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry awarded President Calles with honors for his work in persecuting the Catholic Church.
do I think EVERYTHING is a conspiracy?
lol no
do I think that Freemasonry is Anti-Catholic in a systemic and serious way, yes.
I have offered you evidence about that

and if you do not believe me, atleast believe the 8 or 9 Popes who have warned us that Freemasonry is dangerous and not compatible with Christianity

why do you feel the need to defend the enemies of the Church?

I'm not defending anyone. I'm pointing out flaws in the theory of overarching conspiracy. Again, I'm not saying all Freemasons are nice people. I just don't see any reason to consider them as a whole any more dangerous to the Church than any other international group. It seems about as realistic to me as if you were saying the Rotarians were systematic enemies of the Church.

 

[Rick Otto]

Boredom doesn't usually lead to accusing others of being part of a conspiracy, either.

Nor does it usually lead to denying it.

Valuable observations, these are!