Partial rapture

[Troy777]

I believe partial rapture is the only possible view for end times.

It is different than all the other views. It is about being ready to be received and matured. When man has reached a certain point of maturity in this age of mystery, consummation of this age of mystery and grace will begin.

God has foreknown when this will occur, and has set in motion a plan.

When we are ready to be received to the Throne ALIVE, just before Tribulation, then God will receive you into heaven and give you a newly clothed spiritual body necessary for entering heaven.

This is actually what precipitates the war in heaven that commences Tribulation. You can't have raptured overcomers (man-child) in heaven and Satan there at the same time.

If you are not ready to be received at this time which we may call 1st rapture, you will then go through the time of testing whether you are saved or not saved. You may still qualify for the 1st resurrection even if you go through Great Tribulation.

1st resurrection refers to the reigning during the millennial. Though all Christians are saved. Not all Christians will reign during the millennial kingdom with Christ with an iron rod as reward. 1st resurrection is considered a "best" "out-of" resurrection from the general resurrecton.

The general resurrection includes all who have evern been raptured, whether alive, or from the grave. The 1st rapture only inlcudes living overcomers, wheras the 7th trumpet resurrection includes all dead and alive Christians.

 

[Troy777]

Potential consequences of various beliefs:

1. Pre-tribulation-onlyists - will be too weak to refuse the mark because he expected he would be raptured at 1st rapture because he was too fantasy oriented and over-assuming of his rapture.
2. Post-tribulation-onlyist - will be to hardened in his spirit because he is expecting the going through the Great Tribulation, not realizing we can escape if we are ready, thus he won't be sensitive to his spirit. Pre-warth is similar.
3. Preterists deny a Great Tribulation, just as do Amillienists and that results in also unpreparing them for end times because they thought it could never happen, plus their standards of God' 1000 year reign literally, mistaking it for today.
4. Post-milleniasts sufferin the same problem in the matter of rewards of the millennial kingom because they think the 1000 years is now.

Only one end-time view is correct, and partial rapture deals with all these holes.

 

[Dad Ernie]

Greetings Troy,

Man O Man is that ever flakey. I think you should shelve that theory and start ALL OVER again.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

 

[Troy777]

Ernie,

Why is it flakey?

 

[gaetan8888]

Hi

First, "IF" there was a pre-trib rapture, being ready mean to be a truth christian, it's not mean waiting for the rapture, since even those who don't believe in rapture but would be truth christian would go with all pre-tribers if there was a rapture.

The Bible are clear, believe in Jesus, it's not asking you to believe in the rapture, so if there's a pre-trib rapture God will choose who will go and who will stay.

And don't underestimate the great apostasy, since it's much worse than now, and God would, at least, wait after the great apostasy to do any rapture (if thre's a rapture) to test who are the truth christians.

Gaetan

 

[Troy777]

To gaetana888,

Instead of think of "waiting" for rapture, think of rapture just before Tribulation starts as being that which commences because that is what God wants. God wants to receive those into heaven before the throne today, but He can't because we are not yet ready and matured to be received yet. Firstfruits are not ready yet. Even so the harvest will follow the firstfruits also. So what are we to do? Not wait. But actively spiritually get ready allowing the Holy Spirit us into maturing in Christ delivering us from sin, self and supernatural. At the appointed time He will receive those, rapture them alive as well as resurrect those in Rev. 6.11 who were martyrd.

As you can see here there are reasons for why there is a pre-tribulation rapture only and a post-tribulation rapture only, but when you see it together, you realize there is a pre-tribulation rapture and a post-tribulation rapture (or, I should say pre-wrath). There is a pre-tribulation rapture because God promises us we may escape these things to come the HOUR of the trial, not just the trial itself if we keep the Word of His patience and remain watchful and prayerful, another way of saying matured in Christ.

God is asking you once you are saved more than anything else to mature unto sonship. Not all Christians do this willingly, many remain quite carnal. God rewards those Christians for 1000 years who do this, reigning with Christ with an iron rod (the 1s resurrection=martyrs of 20 centuries, most high saints and the martyrs of the Great Trib.).

Obviously not all Christians are in the 1st resurrection. All those raptured at the start of the Tribulation are in the 1st resurrection. The 1st resurrection is an "out" "best" resurrection from the general resurrection.

God is asking you to understand the book of Revelation showing partial rapture.

There is already a great apostacy to day that qualifies. There is today false tongues in over a billion Pentecostal type charismatics who have the tower of babel within their hearts of mystery religions ecstasy. It doesn't get any more apostate than that in "religious Rome".

Plus we also have the brink of USA financially getting into some serious trouble with its debt/gdp at over 360%. The chain of events that tumble like dominos like the plagues of Egypt are close.

 

[duster1az]

Those who try to discern the important facts of Christian doctrine should distinguish between the things that God does for the Christian and those things Christians may do for God. What God does is of necessity since no one else can do it. Our justification falls into this area. It appears at the end of all God's work in salvation, not chronologically, but logically. It's a declaration by God in regard to the Christian that they've been made right and acceptable to Himself. Not based on our own righteousness, but on our position "in Christ" that each Christian has obtained by grace.

We're new creatures. "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come. Now all these things are from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ, and gave us the ministry of reconciliation" (2 Cor. 5:17-18). The old things that are passed away aren't habits or failures in our daily walk, but positions, which God took care of by reconciling us to Himself through Jesus.

Also, every Christian is perfected forever. "For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified" (Heb. 10:14). In this passage santification means truly to set apart or classify, such as those who are "in Christ."

Again, all Christians have the fulness of Christ. "For of His fulness we have all received, and grace upon grace" (John 1:16), "and in Him you have been made complete ..." (Col. 2:10). One can't be perfectly "in Christ" (1 Cor. 12:13) and not partake of all that Christ is.

This is the complete standing and position belonging to every Christian that God recognizes whether or not anyone else does. And it's on this position God justifies.

If and when there's a rapture of the Church all will go at once, not as they make themselves fit for heaven.

In Christ,
Tracey

 

[Troy777]

To dusteriaz,

It is common knowledge most agree with you, but scriptures show some things that do not disagree with you about our justification in Christ, but rather, about the Judgment Seat for Christians.

“And they washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the lamb” (7.14b). They do not refer to the Lord Jesus Christ as our righteousness. Indeed, the robe (singular) is righteousness (Is. 61.10), and it is the Lord himself (Jer. 23.6), for Christ is our righteousness (1 Cor. 1.30). We are clothed with Him as we come before God. But this righteousness has no need to be cleansed by the blood.

Hence we have two robes: the one we are clothed with when we are saved, by which we stand before God; the other is our own righteousness – even our victories – in which we may stand before Christ. The white garments spoken of in Revelation 3.18 require a price, whereas redemption is that which need not be bought. “Robes” is in plural number, and these robes signify righteousnesses, even the righteousnesses of the saints.
No Christian will be judged and condemned before God (John 5.24); but no Christian will be exempt from having to stand and be judged before the judgment seat of Christ according to what he has done (2 Cor. 5.10).

2 Cor. 5.10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive good or evil, according to what he has done in the body.

Believers’ robes are washed clean, yet not because of the great tribulation but because of the blood of the Lamb.

The very fact that the robes of the saints are washed in the blood of the Lamb shows how they once were defiled on earth yet they have followed the instruction of 1 John 1.9, and thus they are cleansed.

Therefore, rapture is not restricted to a one time event, since rapture is about being received because one is ready to be received into heaven (fully delivered from sin, self, and supernatural). Many a Christian are still holding onto many things of their flesh that wars against the Spirit and the Spirit wars against the flesh, so they will not be ready between the 6th seal and 1st trumpet to be raptured alive, or if they were a martyr like those spoken of in Rev. 6.11, resurrected also.

Troy

 

[tulc]

So we don't go to heaven until we are ready?
tulc

 

[Dad Ernie]

Greetings Troy,

Believers’ robes are washed clean, yet not because of the great tribulation but because of the blood of the Lamb.

Believe it or not these verses pertain to the end times Christians:

Rev 6:10-11 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? 11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

Rev 7:9 After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

Rev 7:13-14 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

Rev 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

Now as you can see multitudes beyond count from every nation, tongue and people groups MUST go throught the GREAT TRIBULATION (See Mt. 24 also). And you know what? Knowing Christ as I do, when He comes to call up His people, He is not going to leave even ONE of His sheep behind.

So your error filled doctrine of the rapture makes Christ out to be a liar.

Blessings,

Dad Ernie

 

[duster1az]

The partial rapture view has problems in relation to the doctrine of salvation. Since the believer in Jesus Christ is justified by faith, not by works, then all aspects of our salvation are because of grace. The Christian's translation and resurrection is the future part of our salvation, therefore it is not a reward except in the sense that it's the fruit of faith in Christ. To accept a works principle for this aspect of our salvation undermines the whole concept of justification by faith through grace, the presence of the Holy Spirit as the seal of God "for the day of redemption" (Eph. 4:30), and the entire undertaking of God on behalf of those who trust in Him.

I agree that all believers must stand before the judgment seat of Christ, but inregard to reward, not salvation. "Each man's work will become evident; for the day will show it, because it is to be revealed with fire; and the fire itself will test the quality of each man's work. If any man's work which he has built upon remains, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work is burned up, he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved, yet as through fire" (1 Cor. 3:13-15).

In Christ,
Tracey

 

[gaetan8888]

To gaetana888,

Instead of think of "waiting" for rapture, think of rapture just before Tribulation starts as being that which commences because that is what God wants. God wants to receive those into heaven before the throne today, but He can't because we are not yet ready and matured to be received yet. Firstfruits are not ready yet. Even so the harvest will follow the firstfruits also. So what are we to do? Not wait. But actively spiritually get ready allowing the Holy Spirit us into maturing in Christ delivering us from sin, self and supernatural. At the appointed time He will receive those, rapture them alive as well as resurrect those in Rev. 6.11 who were martyrd.

As you can see here there are reasons for why there is a pre-tribulation rapture only and a post-tribulation rapture only, but when you see it together, you realize there is a pre-tribulation rapture and a post-tribulation rapture (or, I should say pre-wrath). There is a pre-tribulation rapture because God promises us we may escape these things to come the HOUR of the trial, not just the trial itself if we keep the Word of His patience and remain watchful and prayerful, another way of saying matured in Christ.

God is asking you once you are saved more than anything else to mature unto sonship. Not all Christians do this willingly, many remain quite carnal. God rewards those Christians for 1000 years who do this, reigning with Christ with an iron rod (the 1s resurrection=martyrs of 20 centuries, most high saints and the martyrs of the Great Trib.).

Obviously not all Christians are in the 1st resurrection. All those raptured at the start of the Tribulation are in the 1st resurrection. The 1st resurrection is an "out" "best" resurrection from the general resurrection.

God is asking you to understand the book of Revelation showing partial rapture.

There is already a great apostacy to day that qualifies. There is today false tongues in over a billion Pentecostal type charismatics who have the tower of babel within their hearts of mystery religions ecstasy. It doesn't get any more apostate than that in "religious Rome".
...

Hi

Yes, there's an apostasy now, but it's just a very small part of the coming apostasy. We should not underestimate the great danger coming by an apostasy 100 time worse than now. It can take years to come but it will come.

Gaetan

 

[Hitch]

I believe partial rapture is the only possible view for end times.

It is different than all the other views. It is about being ready to be received and matured. When man has reached a certain point of maturity in this age of mystery, consummation of this age of mystery and grace will begin.

God has foreknown when this will occur, and has set in motion a plan.

When we are ready to be received to the Throne ALIVE, just before Tribulation, then God will receive you into heaven and give you a newly clothed spiritual body necessary for entering heaven.

This is actually what precipitates the war in heaven that commences Tribulation. You can't have raptured overcomers (man-child) in heaven and Satan there at the same time.

If you are not ready to be received at this time which we may call 1st rapture, you will then go through the time of testing whether you are saved or not saved. You may still qualify for the 1st resurrection even if you go through Great Tribulation.

1st resurrection refers to the reigning during the millennial. Though all Christians are saved. Not all Christians will reign during the millennial kingdom with Christ with an iron rod as reward. 1st resurrection is considered a "best" "out-of" resurrection from the general resurrecton.

The general resurrection includes all who have evern been raptured, whether alive, or from the grave. The 1st rapture only inlcudes living overcomers, wheras the 7th trumpet resurrection includes all dead and alive Christians.

You're right ,this one is different. Its even more disgusting and baseless than the others.

H

 

[Troy777]

tulc,

If you are a Christian all raptures will be completed by the 7th trumpet whether you are ready or not.

 

[Troy777]

To Dad Ernie,

Dad Ernie,

You said my "error filled doctrine of the rapture makes Christ out to be a liar"? What is the error? You didn't say. I have no doubt people will be raptured before th 4 trumpets as well as at the 7th trumpet. If you know Christ, I pray you will know this one day. Maybe this will help.

7.14 The phrase “the great tribulation” is not the Great Tribulation of three years and half duration. The reasons are as follows.

(1) At the earliest, the Great Tribulation should commence at the sounding of the “woe” trumpets, the first of which is the fifth (8.13, 9.1a). Yet in 7.9 is an intimation of a rapture having taken place before the seventh seal. Some of these people must have arrived at the throne without passing through the time of the “woe” trumpets.

(2) The Great Tribulation cannot begin before Satan is cast down to earth. Satan will be cast down at the sounding of the fifth trumpet (9.1); and before the horrible situation of the 42 months prevails on earth (13.5), the man child is already raptured to the throne (12.5). Though this man child may not include all the people referred to in 7.9, nonetheless we dare say that it embraces a part of that great multitude.

(3) As soon as the seventh bowl is poured, the kingdom arrives. During the kingdom age we do not see the temple in heaven, instead we see the temple on earth as described in Ezekiel. Who will have the time and opportunity to serve God during the Great Tribulation? Yet in 7.15 clearly states that God’s servants serve Him day and night.

(4) There cannot be so many people saved at Great Tribulation. Since the great multitude mentioned in 7.9 is said to have come out of the great tribulation (7.14), this great tribulation must be different from that which comes at the fifth and sixth trumpets.

(5) According to 11.1, there are those who worship in the temple of God in heaven. Aside from the people cited in 7.9, where can there be found any who worship God in heaven? For at that time the Great Tribulation as predicted in the book of Revelation has yet to begin. In the new heaven and new earth, no temple is seen (21.22) because the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb are the temple thereof. (God and the Lamb form the center of the new city. Following the mentioning of the temple of God in 3.12 are found the words “he shall go out thence no more”, for the simple reason that God and the Lamb are the temple in the new heaven and new earth.)

(6) The Bible expressly says that there are believers who do not pass through the Great Tribulation (for example, Luke 21.36 and Rev. 3.10).

(7) Suppose these people mentioned in 7.9 did in fact pass through the Great Tribulation of three and a half years; then they must have died at the time when the temple is trodden underfoot by the nations. But according to what is given in 11.2 it is impossible to include the church therein. So how can it be held that the multitude cited in 7.9 comes out of the Great Tribulation of three and a half years?

(8) The Great Tribulation of three years and a half spoken of in Revelation is especially related to the Jews. Both Daniel 12.1 – “And there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and that time thy people shall be delivered . . . “ – and Matthew 24.16-18 depict particularly the situation of the Jewish people. God’s primary purpose is to make use of the Great Tribulation to deal with the Jews. “The time of Jacob’s trouble” spoken of in Jeremiah 30.7 manifestly points to the Jews. But in the book of Revelation reference is made to the subject of tribulation several times in connection with the church, such as in 1.9 and 2.9-10,13. According to John 16.33 tribulation seems to be the earthly portion of the church for she must pass through a prolonged duration of sufferings. Accordingly, this tribulation may also be described in the same way as Revelation 7.14 itself literally does in the Greek original, namely: “the tribulation the great”. Nevertheless, the great tribulation cited in Revelation 2.22 is very different from that of 7.14, nor is it the same as that of the three and a half years mentioned elsewhere in Revelation.

(The words “through many tribulations we must enter into the kingdom of God” in Acts 14.22 has reference to the common experience those who enter the kingdom of God will share on earth.)

 

[Troy777]

To Tracey,

Others object that rapture is part of redemption, that since redemption is according to grace, rapture cannot be based on the concept of worthiness.

In reply, it needs to be pointed out that while the act of changing (see 1 Cor. 15.51-52) is indeed according to grace, the act of being taken (rapture) is according to works.

God will not "receive" (rapture) you to the throne before the final resurrection if you have not kept the Word of His patience and not are ready to be received.

Work in the worldy sense is not how the Bible uses it in this case as you put it. Works means do that will of God abiding in Him, that is works according to grace. It is by the grace of God I am given the strength to do His will, for example.

If all you do is focus on the matter of substitutory death and forget co-death, then you will have problems maturing in Christ and be ready for 1st rapture.

One problem that arises is not realizing that 1st rapture is not about "reward" at the time so much as it is about God being able to "receive" due to you being ready. The reward actually comes later. The reward is involved with those who were matured (1st Resurrection, Rev. 20.4) in Christ to reign with Christ for 1000 years with an iron rod over the nations after Great Tribulation.

Obviously not all Christians are included in the 1st resurrection, an "out-of" "best" resurrection from the general resurrection spanning all centuries.





Troy

 

[Troy777]

Gaetan8888,

Trust me, that slow working has been underway since the mystery religions at corinth. And now all of a sudden about a hundred years ago it began to accelerate exponentionally in the first wave movement. By 1950 came about the charismatic 2nd wave movement. And today we are in the midst of the 3rd wave movement which the Roman Catholic Church "charismatics" don't want to get left behind on, so they are endorsing with full force the principles of Pentecostal false tongues which will instill waves of forthcoming delusions in the masses, certainly not the narrow path leading up to the narrow gate. There is no point in even praying for them. Most are too fargone and according to Mark 3.28-30 and 1 John 5.16,17 we are admonished by scripture not pray for them.

 

[Troy777]

H,

What is your issue?

It is hard to accept something that brings your conscience in deeper agreement with Christ intuitively. But that is what overcoming is all about, so much so that God is trying to get you to be in the 1st resurrection as oppossed to the general resurrection of all past centuries. The flesh wars against the spirit, who is going to win this battle?

The reason what I have said is different than the common wide path beliefs is because they are all focused on timing whereas partial rapture focuses on maturing. Wow eh?

 

[duster1az]

To Tracey,

Others object that rapture is part of redemption, that since redemption is according to grace, rapture cannot be based on the concept of worthiness.

In reply, it needs to be pointed out that while the act of changing (see 1 Cor. 15.51-52) is indeed according to grace, the act of being taken (rapture) is according to works.

God will not "receive" (rapture) you to the throne before the final resurrection if you have not kept the Word of His patience and not are ready to be received.

Work in the worldy sense is not how the Bible uses it in this case as you put it. Works means do that will of God abiding in Him, that is works according to grace. It is by the grace of God I am given the strength to do His will, for example.

If all you do is focus on the matter of substitutory death and forget co-death, then you will have problems maturing in Christ and be ready for 1st rapture.

One problem that arises is not realizing that 1st rapture is not about "reward" at the time so much as it is about God being able to "receive" due to you being ready. The reward actually comes later. The reward is involved with those who were matured (1st Resurrection, Rev. 20.4) in Christ to reign with Christ for 1000 years with an iron rod over the nations after Great Tribulation.

Obviously not all Christians are included in the 1st resurrection, an "out-of" "best" resurrection from the general resurrection spanning all centuries.





Troy

Confusion abounds in those who insist on mixing the rule of law into a grace economy in order to merit the approbation of God. One is a covenant of pure works; the other a covenant of pure grace. I hope you'll eventually see the difference between the two.

I've enjoyed the conversation.

In Christ,
Tracey

 

[Troy777]

Tracey,

I enjoy the challenge of being tested, and I have enjoyed our conversation too.

However don't degrade your commentary by saying stuff like "confusion abounds in those who insist on mixing the rule of law into a grace economy in order to merit the pprobation of God" which show your unwillingness to listen deeply to what is being said.

Have you not yourself done this very thing by by living by some law you have for yourself legalizing the rapture without meaning or purpose by blocking out of your conscience the act God has put before us to motivate us to overcome whereby he does not forsake His promises to us such as Luke 21.36 and Rev. 3.10.

Let me help you with where I think you may be stuck on the works and grace matter.
We no longer live by the law, for we now live by the Spirit. In walking after the spirit, God will lead you, and as He leads you, if you do not listen to that still small voice in your inner woman, your spirit, that is an act of not living in the Spirit and thus what God had wanted you to do, you do not do.

In this example you have created for yourself a situation whereby you were not watchful and you were not prayerful. If to the degree that this disatisfies God to the requirement He needs to receive you in heaven, then He simply will not receive you and allow you to go through the time of testing, to be tested, even unto martyrdom. He knows whether you are saved or not. The problem is you do not know your full condition or not, because you are you, you are not God, but the Word of God affords you all that you need to work towards sonship, and receive the grace of God to reach a life of overcoming. If as a Christian you just remain in substitutory death (Forgiveness for sins) you miss half the salvation, being (co-death experience with Christ). While the first deals with your sins, the latter deals with the power of sin.

Romans 7 talks about the the law of sin and also the law of death. The law of sin is "energy do things against God" and the law of death comes from the law of sin which makes you "unable to do anything for God". In the same way you can prevent God's grace to work through you so that you do not do what He wants of you and thus you will not be energized to do things for God because you are yet not delivered from sin, self or supernatural. You would be surprised what works He has in store for you, but many Christians stop half way in their salvation.

Some call it lazy-believism. I simply call it "not abiding in the Word of God". Therefore if you are in the last generation how can God receive you to heaven if you have not done what He asked you to do, that is, keep the Word of His patience. It is a strange thing because they know the law is past and they know that we do like by works, yet they go the extreme in the Spirit and don't recognize when legitimate work is called for by God as He leads His children. This problem is throughout scripture. For example take a look at the 7 churches in Rev. 2 and 3. Each church mentions the few overcomers within and what they must do to but because the Philadelphia church is the most spiritual God asks them not what they need to do, but to keep what they got.

When we are saved by grace, we don't shrivel up, but we are spiritually active, and that activity is called "works". This should not offend you. Whereas the sabbath was for rest, not we embrace the Lord's day instead and we are spiritually active as well as rest. The works of spiritual activity it is not the same thing as the law. The law was attempting ot please the Lord by "works", whereas living in Christ by the Spirit, God will move you this way or that to do this work or that work. The key here is that you know it is a work for you, whatever it may be for you can sense God moving you to do it. The work doesn't go away, but our guiding principle is the Spirit of the Law, not legalization of it, that which we could never fulfill anyway for we are not God. But in the Spirit you can move mountains.