BroRoyVa79
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- Aug 16, 2018
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You two really don't understand what "move along now" means.
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You understand what I meant by "Yes, I realize I'm oversimplyfing?" Right?
@KomatiiteBIF
You assume Uniformitarianism and not Catastrophism (Global Flood) as the mechanism for much of what you say and thus you match up with my statement generally about taking rates of TODAY and extrapolating those to YESTERYEAR. Which leads to my interpretation of data statement as well.
Since I'm ready to turn the topic back over to Zachm, I'll leave these to show that Biblical Creationists deal with relative dating, the layers, etc.
Forgot the links:
Sedimentary rocks and the geologic time scale - creation.com
The case of the missing geologic time - creation.com
Much supposed geological time missing from strata - creation.com
John K. Reed - creation.com
Andrew A Snelling - creation.com
Set your preconceived notion aside and let Gods holy inspired word speak for itself without adding to it.Or, as early Christians realized, it is not a literal history. The text itself tells us that.
Evolution is just God's creation. You're willing to admit that God creates living things, but you refuse to accept the way He does it.
Set your pride aside, and let Him be God.
Set your preconceived notion aside and let Gods holy inspired word speak for itself without adding to it.
You assume Uniformitarianism and not Catastrophism (Global Flood)
as the mechanism for much of what you say and thus you match up with my statement generally about taking rates of TODAY and extrapolating those to YESTERYEAR.
You assume Uniformitarianism and not Catastrophism (Global Flood) as the mechanism for much of what you
But of course, catastrophism cannot account for the features I've described.
For example, how could catastrophism produce the green River formation?
There is no logical way that it could. No more could catastrophism explain how complex burrow networks, nests with eggs, foot tracks and feeding traces are found throughout the entirety of the geologic column.
What kind of catastrophic event would not even destroy a nest made of brittle twigs that make up nests?
First Evidence That Dinosaurs Nested In Colonies: 15 Nests And 50 Eggs Discovered
And yet we are to believe that this very land survived unscathed while entire mountains buckled in physics defying ways?
We are to believe these eggs remain unscathed, while entire formations were metamorphosed and melted. Solid rock, melted...while eggs remain, as if nothing unusual was going on.
You claim that uniformitarianism is an assumption.
It isn't an assumption, it is a derived conclusion.
300 years ago proponents of catastrophism attempted to justify their beliefs by deriving conclusions from the same evidence.
They failed, and their position vanished from the scientific community much like beliefs in alchemy, and astrology, and other concepts that logically do not make any sense.
Your ideas are hidden behind random links of unjustified claims.
Here are my own words. I could hide behind mountains of technical research papers, published by geologists around the world. But I'd rather just speak for myself in simple terms.
Old Earth Geology Part 3 (Green River Formation)
Uniformitarianism does not mean that there are no catastrophic events. The geologic history of the Earth is one of long periods of gradual change, with occasional discontinous events. Some, like the Chixulub event, had world-wide consequences. Most do not. There is no evidence for a world wide flood.
Not necessary. For example, tidal rhythmites and lake varves preserve information about rates of change hundreds of thousands or millions of years ago. Would you like to learn how we know?
"Counting the time of activity of creatures etc. is also assumptive because it's done through the underlying lens of uniformitarianism."
What other lense is there in regards to the rates at which an animal can walk or feed or burrow?
You can deny an old earth all you want, but logically you're incapable explaining what we see. And that's the bottom line. Your ideas are contradictory to observed creation.
"You mean my ideas are contrary to what you interpret about observed creation."
Observation isn't a matter of interpretation. The physics is what it is.
Here is one for you. After a two second Google search:
RETRODEFORMATION OF CARBONIFEROUS TRACE FOSSILS FROM THE NARRAGANSETT BASIN, UNITED STATES, USING RAINDROP IMPRINTS AND BEDDING-CLEAVAGE INTERSECTION LINEATION AS STRAIN MARKERS
In the above article is description of a common practice in fossils are structurally deformed.
Meaning that the animals originally lived, acted, and then later in time, their tracks lithified and we're we'n deformed.
Logically this cannot happen in any other order. And if we have fossils deformed in orogenic processes, it's pretty straight forward to conclude a gradual deformation of features, as opposed to catastrophism.
YECism can't explain the quantity of these features that we see, nor can yecism explain the features themselves without defying all known chemistry and physics. But uniformitarianism explains them quite simply and well.
Your young earth beliefs suggest the simultaneous occurance of ice ages and rock metamorphosis and life casually walking around, burrowing, feeding and nesting, practically in simultaneous times.
"I wish I were younger. What inclines me now to think you may be right in regarding evolution as the central and radical lie in the whole web of falsehood that now governs our lives, is not so much your arguments against it, as the fanatical and twisted attitudes of its defenders." C. S. Lewis
I am not so inclined to think the science as we have it is all wrong, the question for me is, when we are talking about billions of years, how sure is it possible to be? Is our best, based on the evidence, really enough?
The link above also gives examples of multiple species of birds walking in various directions in the same location.
https://www.researchgate.net/public...ion_by_birds_on_a_tidal_flat_Dutch_Wadden_Sea
Feeding traces and bioturbation.
These animals aren't fleeing. They're just doing what typical birds do.
"You assume what you're seeing isn't something else, I dunno, FOR EXAMPLE, (caps for emphasis) like these animals trying to escape a catastrophe."
If there are feeding traces observed, then it is of no surprise that I conclude that animals were not fleeing catastrophy.
When birds flee, they also tend to fly, rather than awkwardly walking around in circles.
We can also tell if animals are walking or running based on the spacing and impressions of their tracks.
Also, we have burrow networks of all shapes and sizes throughout the geologic column.
Massive caves in southern Brazil are actually ancient ground sloth burrows
The idea of trying to escape catastrophy would imply that animals were in a hurry. But the fossils we have often suggest otherwise. And burrows suggest long, time consuming operations (such as those linked above).
Do tell me how these animals were allegedly fleeing, but for some odd reason were actually just casually walking around...
Do explain how mountains were being pushed around and rocks metamorphosed under extreme pressures and temperatures...while animals were otherwise casually burrowing or feeding or wandering around.
Entire continents buckled and crumbled...while delicate nests with eggs remain unscathed.