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One Reason to Reject Amill Doctrine

jeffweedaman

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Satan in not in chains.

He is restrained through the work of his cross until just prior to his glorious second appearing.


7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only he who now restrains will do so until he is taken out of the way. 8 Then that lawless one will be revealed whom the Lord will slay with the breath of His mouth and bring to an end by the appearance of His coming; 9 that is, the one whose coming is in accord with the activity of Satan, with all power and signs and false wonders, 10 and with all the deception of wickedness for those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth so as to be saved.


The appearing of Jesus coming will destroy the revealing of satans activity in all power and deception.


11 For this reason God will send upon them a deluding influence so that they will believe what is false, 12 in order that they all may be judged who did not believe the truth, but took pleasure in wickedness.


Nothing left to do but celebrate the NHNE where only righteousness dwells.
 
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sovereigngrace

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Why do Premils not finish it?

Because it exposes their theology and shows the Church today having power over Satan, not the other way around. 1 Peter 5:8-9 says, “Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour: Whom resist stedfast in the faith.”

We have power over Satan since the cross! While Satan resists us, the Bible says we have power to resist him, and subjugate his purposes against us. By resisting Satan and staying steadfast we have enormous individual impact upon the kingdom of darkness; we curtail the expansion of his evil designs. This was powerfully manifested at the time of our conversion when the grip of Satan was immediately released. The claim he had upon our lives was instantly annulled and the control he brought to bare within us was immediately broke. The chains that brutally ensnared us fell off and the bondage Satan bound us with was lifted. Significantly, what is true of the individual is also true of the collective. When the Gospel penetrates into a community, city or a nation the same effect is wrought. We destroy Satan’s power, influence and delusion as we present “the glorious Gospel of Christ” through the nations. Satan cannot resist the victorious global spread of the Gospel. Through the work of the cross and in the power of the Holy Spirit, the Church clearly possesses the power to bind the devil’s activity and influence, or why would God in any way instruct His people to “resist stedfast” that great foe?

In fact, James 4:7 tells us what happens when you do resist, “Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.”

You resist, he must flee. When the devil plants a temptation, a doubt or a fear, you simply have to resist it, whereupon Satan must get his boots on and run. This word “flee” in the original is the Greek word pheugo. It means to flee away or vanish.

To sustain the Premil doctrine you have to ignore/reject the injury Satan sustained through the life, death and resurrection of Christ. You have to ignore/reject the victorious New Testament message that Satan is a defeated foe that has been stripped of his previous power and influence through the spiritual binding in spiritual chains. You have to ignore/reject the Gospel expanse to the Gentiles in the great commission. You have to present an unrestrained Satan being able to do whatever he wants (including thwart the Gospel). You elevate the devil and and diminish God, you portray a powerful kingdom of darkness and a weak kingdom of God. This is all wrong.
 
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Douggg

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Those verses actually indicate that Satan is not presently in chains.
 
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Douggg

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The point is Satan is not presently in chains.

In every post, you are claiming Satan is in chains, in order to justify the Amil position. Which obviously, Satan not being in chains means the Amil position is in error.

The passages you quote don't say anything about Satan being in chains.

Here is a word search on chain and chains in the new testament kjv if it will help.

CHAIN IN THE BIBLE
CHAINS IN THE BIBLE
 
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jeffweedaman

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Those verses actually indicate that Satan is not presently in chains.

What.

The verses indicate that the Man of Sin is restrained in the here and now until the time.
satan can only operate with full power of deception and power once that restraining influence is taken away. So satan has already been restrained for a long time since the cross.
Gods appointed time and Gods own sovereign agenda rules the day.
 
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sovereigngrace

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I showed you Scripture that proved he was spiritually bound in spiritual chains (Matthew 12:22-29, Mark 3:11, 23-27, Luke 10:18-19, Luke 11:20-22), but you again dismissed this inspired text because it negates Premil. 2 Peter 2:4, Jude v 6, Revelation 9 and Revelation 20 all prove the whole demonic realm is currently restrained from stopping the free-flow of the Gospel. Revelation 9 also describes an abyss that is full of wicked spirits that are restrained, but will be released prior to the second coming for a short season. This is something Premils choose to overlook. The abyss is inhabited now with Satan's minions. They had a king over them (Abaddon / Apollyon), a ruler who marshalled their hosts. This is Satan - the only king in the kingdom of darkness.
 
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Douggg

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All the verses are saying is that the man of sin will not be revealed until after the rapture of Christians from the world.

verse 9 is referring to the revealed man of sin. 9 Even him [the revealed man of sin], whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, In Revelation 13:4, Satan gives him his power. As will the lying miracle of the image of the beast coming to life and speaking will be a lying wonder with Satan at the core of it.

There is no mention of chains involved. Amil's position is based on Satan being in chains. Which obviously, Satan not being in chains means the Amil position is in error.
 
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Douggg

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I showed you Scripture that proved he was spiritually bound in spiritual chains
Satan is not in chains in those verses. You saying Satan was/is bound in chains (spiritual or otherwise) doesn't make it so. Produce some text that has chain or chains in it, regarding Satan's current status.
 
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Jamdoc

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Citing from the gospels before the cross doesn't apply.
Demons have always been subject to the Authority of God.
if it happened before the Cross it does not apply to your doctrine to begin with.

It's like you don't know your own doctrine which is that the 1000 years of Satan being bound started at the cross
when now you claim it happened before the cross.
this inconsistency shows a fault in the Amillennialist position of spiritualizing scripture to the point where you can make any verse support your position by twisting its meaning to whatever you want.
That's another reason why I don't do huge walls of text quoting scripture.
Because an Amillennialist will just twist the meaning of the verses to support their view anyway, because their position relies on bending meaning to their whims and fancies.
some of you spiritualize the trumpets and vials of revelation to not mean the specific things that they say and say it "spiritually represents Jesus destroying the earth instantly in fire at his return" even when details like how long the trumpet lasts is given you handwave it away.
because you've come up with your own internalized meaning for everything, Nothing in scripture is what it says it is it's all some fantasy novelesque abstraction.
You can't argue with that. It's like playing chess with a child when they refuse to adhere to the rules of the game They'll just make up their own rules and claim they won.
 
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sovereigngrace

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Satan is not in chains in those verses. You saying Satan was/is bound in chains (spiritual or otherwise) doesn't make it so. Produce some text that has chain or chains in it, regarding Satan's current status.

Spiritual binding is speaking about putting him in spiritual chains (Matthew 12:22-29, Mark 3:11, 23-27, Luke 10:18-19, Luke 11:20-22). We are looking at spiritual restraint. Satan is currently in a spiritual prison since the first resurrection until the last trumpet (see Revelation 9 and Revelation 20). This corresponds with Satan being cast out of heaven with his minions toward earth (John 12:31-33 and Revelation 12:5-11).
 
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sovereigngrace

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Not so! Christ broke Satan’s influence through His sinless life, His atoning sacrifice, His glorious resurrection and His triumphant ascension. Please do not talk on behalf of Amils. We can do that ably and accurately ourselves.
 
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keras

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You still didnt address my question. Who will be alive at that time , as according to a previous post of yours no ungodly people will enter your millennium. Who is left to deceive.??
It will be people who have been living under Jesus' iron rule.
They do believe in Jesus, as they can physically see Him. But Satan will be able to 'seduce' them to rebel against Jesus and to give their allegiance to him. Just like the ancient Israelites, even though they had Moses and saw the cloud that was Jesus. 1 Corinthians 10:1-5
Satan is not in chains.
Quite correct, and the AMill theory is in tatters.
 
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jeffweedaman

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Why hasnt satan gone forth in all power and deception long before now???

Is he exibiting a Godly virtue of patience, or is he under Gods appointed time and agenda which restrains him?//
 
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Douggg

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Spiritual binding is spiritual chains in spiritual chains
No, the bible does not say spiritual binding is spiritual chains. Jesus was simply indicating that he could heal people because he had power over Satan, the demons, and Satan's angels.

Chains are indicative of prison like conditions. Chains are one way to bind a person, physically. But a person could also be bound up with ropes, or simply by arms wrapped around him.

The issue is Satan is not bound by chains, and is not in the bottomless pit.
___________________________________________________________________

In Revelation 9:1, the angel falling from heaven having the key to the bottomless pit - is not a good angel. It is Satan, who had just been cast down to earth, losing the war in heaven in Revelation 12:7-9, to Michael and his angels. To happen just past the middle point of the 7 year 70th week.
 
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Jamdoc

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Not so! Christ broke Satan’s influence through His sinless life, His atoning sacrifice, His glorious resurrection and His triumphant ascension. Please do not talk on behalf of Amils. We can do that ably and accurately ourselves.

Yet you claim it began at the cross
and the scriptures you cite take place before the cross.
that doesn't support your position at all in fact it disputes it because it dismisses the main claim, that it began at the cross and that the crucifixion was a massive change. Which it was, but it seems like less of one when you're citing the effects of that change as existing prior to the crucifixion.

It's like you say you fixed a car, claiming it was totally broken down prior to you fixing it, but you claim at the moment you fixed it, it began running fine, and then you use examples to prove it where the car was running fine before you popped open the hood. What exactly did you fix then if it's behaving the same?

What the crucifixion did was atone for sin, and establish a way for all people to be able to have a direct relationship with God through His Son, where prior you needed a priest to be an intermediary for you. It tore the veil. It also made it to where Satan's accusations no longer had power to condemn you, because now Christ is your advocate (Romans 8:34). It was not however, directly judging devils or Satan. That judgement is a future event, though there are some angels who actually are imprisoned right now as I cited before from Jude 1.
We're not currently influenced by them, they actually can't afflict anyone right now. They get released at Revelation 9 at the 5th trumpet. Satan will suffer the same imprisonment.
 
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sovereigngrace

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I refer you back to my last post that rebuts this.
 
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sovereigngrace

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You cannot divorce the earthly ministry of Christ as being integral to the defeat of Satan, just like you cannot divorce the first resurrection of Christ from the same. It was all apart of our Lord's defeat of Satan.
 
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Douggg

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Why hasnt satan gone forth in all power and deception long before now???

Is he exibiting a Godly virtue of patience, or is he under Gods appointed time and agenda which restrains him?//
verse 9 is referring to the revealed man of sin. 9 Even him [the revealed man of sin], whose coming is after the working of Satan with all [Satan's] power and signs and lying wonders,

You are misunderstanding the verse. It just means that the revealed man of sin when he is revealed will do the work of Satan, with all of Satan's power to do signs and lying wonders.

Daniel 8:24 And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.
 
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Timtofly

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We clearly see that Christ was physically on earth at that time. Why the rejection of when Christ will be Prince physically on earth the next time? When He is going to stay even longer. I get that you accept Christ was on earth the first time, but then you turn around and deny He will spend time on earth the Second Time.

When one calls Satan a spirit, is that not making him out to be like the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit is the only spirit outside of our spirit. God is a spirit, and there is no other created spirits other than God. In Scripture angels are likened unto wind or air, but still physical. Wind and air are part of the physical created existence. I am not sure why so many get this aspect of creation wrong. People view the stars all the time. They are not viewing spirits, but angels.

All the term "spiritual" does is remove that which is spiritual from our ability to experience this part of creation with our 5 senses. If our eyes were opened, and our ears could hear the other part of creation, it would be just as physical as that which we do experience. God is a spirit. Satan is not. Satan is a physically created being just like humans are physically created beings.
 
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jeffweedaman

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It will be people who have been living under Jesus' iron rule.
They do believe in Jesus, as they can physically see Him. But Satan will be able to 'seduce' them to rebel against Jesus and to give their allegiance to him.

Paul assures all who do see Jesus at his coming that they will dwell with him forever more.
Yet your claiming some will rebel.
 
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