Not Rocket Science

[whatfor]

I think it's an awful awful thing to say....and you should be ashamed of yourselves.

Sorry , will drop it.
But not ashamed of anything.

 

[Cassidy]

http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?t=220053

In case you can't open that link, here it is pasted for you:

A Law Enforcement Officer from Australia Speaks Out:

A LEO from Australia speaks out!

From: Ed Chenel , A police officer in Australia

Hi Yanks, I thought you all would like to see the real figures from Down Under.

It has now been 12 months since gun owners in Australia were forced

By a new law to surrender 640,381 personal firearms to be destroyed by

Our own government, a program costing Australia taxpayers more than $500 million dollars.

The first year results are now in:

Australia-wide, homicides are up 6.2 percent,

Australia-wide, assaults are up 9.6 percent;

Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!

In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent.

(Note that while the law-abiding citizens turned them in, the criminals did not and criminals still possess their guns!)

While figures over the previous 25 years showed a steady decrease in armed robbery with firearms, this has changed drastically upward in the past 12 months, since the criminals now are guaranteed that their prey is unarmed.

There has also been a dramatic increase in break-ins and assaults of the elderly, while the resident is at home.

Australian politicians are at a loss to explain how public safety has decreased, after such monumental effort and expense was expended in 'successfully ridding Australian society of guns.' You won't see this on the American evening news or hear your governor or members of the State Assembly disseminating this information.

The Australian experience speaks for itself. Guns in the hands of honest citizens save lives and property and, yes, gun-control laws affect only the law-abiding citizens.

Take note Americans, before it's too late!

FORWARD TO EVERYONE ON YOUR EMAIL LIST. [I DID]

DON'T BE A MEMBER OF THE SILENT MAJORITY.

BE ONE OF THE VOCAL MINORITY WHO WON'T

The gun control laws was only ever meant to stop mass shootings. Which it did!

What John Howard could teach the US about gun control

Tuesday, 9 September 2008

University of Sydney professor of public health Simon Chapman writes:
The US National Rifle Association has been a tad suspicious of John McCain after he voted to support a mandatory 72-hour waiting period for background checks on gun purchasers at gun fairs and when he championed campaign-finance legislation that the gun lobby saw as an attack on their rights to expression. The Columbine High School killers obtained their guns from such a fair.



With the NRA having the largest grass roots vote delivery network in the US, and promising $40m to defeat Obama, Sarah Palin has been a masterly choice to tour the midwest and southern [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] to paper over potential electoral concerns about McCain being a closet liberal among abortion hating, God fearing, gun loving Republicans.

So what would Palin’s audiences make of Australia’s record on gun control? Ever since John Howard’s 1996 post Port Arthur gun law reforms, our local gun lobby in Australia has been the laughing stock of its US brethren. Our 1996 reforms were precipitated by the Port Arthur massacre, the 13th mass shooting in 15 years in which five or more victims died in places like Hoddle and Queen Streets in Melbourne and Strathfield Plaza.

The central provisions of the reforms were the ban on semi-automatic rifles and pump action shotguns, accompanied by gun amnesties and two national buybacks, which together saw some 820,000 guns destroyed. Because of their rapid firepower, semi-automatics are the guns of choice for those intent on killing many people quickly. John Howard introduced the reforms to prevent US-style mass killings, not primarily to prevent criminal or domestic gun homicides or gun suicides.

In the 12 years since the law reforms, there have been no mass shootings. But there is also evidence of wider collateral benefits in reduced gun deaths overall. While the rate of firearm homicide was reducing in Australia by an average of 3% per year prior to the law reforms, this more than doubled to 7.5% per year after the introduction of the new laws, although to the delight of our local gun lobby, this failed to reach statistical significance simply because of the low statistical power inherent in the small numbers involved.

Gun deaths in Australia are dominated by suicides, with about 79% of all gun fatalities, followed by 15% homicides and 2% unintentional shootings. Suicide with guns has what coroners euphemistically call a very high "completion rate". When those attempting suicide use a gun, they don't need a semi-automatic. The trigger gets pulled once, so a single shot suffices, from any gun that remained unaffected by the law reforms. So by removing only semi-automatics, we really wouldn’t expect any decline in gun suicides.

Yet as with gun homicides, firearm suicides in males declined from 3.4 deaths per 100,000 person years in 1997 to 1.3 per 100,000, a decline of 59.9%. The rate of all other suicides declined from 19.9 deaths per 100,000 in 1997 to 15.0 per 100,000 in 2005, a 24.5% decline, less than half that for gun suicides.

Having more guns around seems to be associated with more gun suicides, and more suicides overall. A paper published in this week’s prestigious New England Journal of Medicine compares gun suicide rates in the 15 US states with the highest rate (47%) of household ownership with six states with the lowest rates (15%). While the rates of non-firearm suicide were equal in these two groups, the states with high gun ownership had 3.7 times more male gun suicides and 7.9 times more female gun suicides than the low gun ownership states.

The USA has 14.3 times Australia’s population, 104 times our total firearm-caused deaths (30,143 in 2005 vs 289 in 2003), and 294 times Australia’s firearm homicide rate (12,352 in 2005 vs just 42 in 2005/06). In 1979, 705 people died from gunshots in Australia. Despite population growth, in 2003, this number had fallen to 289.

Gun lobby affiliated researchers in Australia have sought to repudiate these outcomes using embarrassingly naïve methods that have been heavily criticised in the research literature. While news of the latest gun massacre in the United States remains depressingly common, Australians today enjoy one of the safest communities on earth. John Howard’s first and most popular law reform stands as the world’s most successful reform of gun laws.

 

[whatfor]

Just for the record I am not against the anti gun laws and am not saying they didn't work.

 

[Elijah2]

I think it's an awful awful thing to say....and you should be ashamed of yourselves.

We didn't ask you to come and judge or condemn us on a general comment and discussion between W and myself. Be blessed!

 

[Elijah2]

Sorry , will drop it.
But not ashamed of anything.

Mate, don't be sorry, you did nothing wrong. Blessings!

 

[FrankFaith]

I think we're losing sight of the point of this post.

Here's the point:

Gun control serves to restrict/remove guns from LAW ABIDING CITIZENS. There are laws on the books right now to stop the criminals--get more cops--DON'T RESTRICT LAW ABIDING CITIZENS FROM OWNING GUNS TO PROTECT THEMSELVES! *Doing that doesn't effect the criminals--criminals don't abide by the law!

The fact that folks can't see this is proof that common sense is not all that common!

GUNS DON'T KILL PEOPLE--PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE. Control the bad people--let the good ones have guns to protect themselves from the bad ones. This is not rocket science!!!

George Washington: "It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it."

 

[Elijah2]

I think we're losing sight of the point of this post.

Here's the point:

Gun control serves to restrict/remove guns from LAW ABIDING CITIZENS. There are laws on the books right now to stop the criminals--get more cops--DON'T RESTRICT LAW ABIDING CITIZENS FROM OWNING GUNS TO PROTECT THEMSELVES! *Doing that doesn't effect the criminals--criminals don't abide by the law!

The fact that folks can't see this is proof that common sense is not all that common!

GUNS DON'T KILL PEOPLE--PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE. Control the bad people--let the good ones have guns to protect themselves from the bad ones. This is not rocket science!!!

George Washington: "It will be found an unjust and unwise jealousy to deprive a man of his natural liberty upon the supposition he may abuse it."

Frank, we all know who is behind all of this, so why worry, it won't hasten His Coming, will it.

And yes there is no COMMON in COMMONSENSE anymore!

You don't have to be a "rocket scientist" to see why THEY disarmed Australia.

Oh, by the way, when any country became a republic there has always been civil war. Can't have a civil war if you haven't any firearms, can you? Now that's "rocket science"!

 

[pinetree]

Frank, we all know who is behind all of this, so why worry, it won't hasten His Coming, will it.

And yes there is no COMMON in COMMONSENSE anymore!

You don't have to be a "rocket scientist" to see why THEY disarmed Australia.

Oh, by the way, when any country became a republic there has always been civil war. Can't have a civil war if you haven't any firearms, can you? Now that's "rocket science"!

sure you can..

it will just get really sloppy with decapitations from swords.

And ugly crushed skulls from baseball bats!

 

[Cassidy]

But they didn't disarm Australia!! Unless you think that automatics and semi automatics are the only guns known to man...then they didn't disarm australia at all!

They got rid of them because of their potential to kill many people all at once. There are still other guns available if you wish to use them as protection....you'll just have to make the perps wait a minute while you go to your gun safe and retrieve and put together your gun...before shooting...but you can still have a gun!

 

[pinetree]

what a wonderful idea in Australia..

take away guns from honest people,so that killers have an easier time..

 

[Cassidy]

Did you read my post at all?

When was the last highschool shooting in your country pinetree?

 

[pinetree]

Did you read my post at all?

When was the last highschool shooting in your country pinetree?

did you read my post?
You are harping on one idealism,and ignoring all the victims that right now are being attacked,and all they can do is yell help.:o

If someone comes into my home,we dont have to hide under the bed..

 

[Cassidy]

Pinetree - they didn't ban ALL GUNS. Did you read that part??

And I ask again...when was the last highschool shooting in your country??

 

[Elijah2]

sure you can..

it will just get really sloppy with decapitations from swords.

And ugly crushed skulls from baseball bats!

Sorry mate, we only have boomerangs and cricket bats!

 

[Elijah2]

did you read my post?
You are harping on one idealism,and ignoring all the victims that right now are being attacked,and all they can do is yell help.:o

If someone comes into my home,we dont have to hide under the bed..

Wow, strange looking boomerang!

 

[Elijah2]

Hey Cas did I ask you what "Christian Seeker" means?

 

[pinetree]

Pinetree - they didn't ban ALL GUNS. Did you read that part??

And I ask again...when was the last highschool shooting in your country??

yes,yes..all school shootings are awful!

We are a nation of 300 million,not a pipsqeak country.(no offense)

There are criminals,and freedom dictaes that we will defend ourselves.

Freedom must still reign..

Here in America,whenever states pass laws "allowing" people to carry a gun,the crime goes down!

Why?

Becasue the scum know that woman,or old guy,might just stick a 45 in their face,on a dark parking lot one night.

See that is a statistic you ignore,in your sweeping generalizations of wish..

Home invasions,rapes robberies,assaults,kidnappings..what does a soul do where you live?

That is where the rubber meets the road..

 

[pinetree]

question for Cassidy..

Ok,tomorrow a woman comes up to you and is really scared,she is being stalked,by her exboyfriend.

The police cant be everywhere.

She tells you she cant buy or carry a pistol....she knows sooner or later he will get her..

What do you say to her?

That same old school shooting statistic?

Here is a smart instinctual girl!
You remember her from the other thread..

 

[pinetree]

Another smart American!

She will not be a victim!She saw what happened,in the land that went under..

From the op,about Austrailia...

The first year results are now in:

Australia-wide, homicides are up 6.2 percent,

Australia-wide, assaults are up 9.6 percent;

Australia-wide, armed robberies are up 44 percent (yes, 44 percent)!

In the state of Victoria alone, homicides with firearms are now up 300 percent.

 

[pinetree]