No Literal Hell?

[phoenixdem]

The Lake of Fire is not literal, I know many Christians want it to be. Many have to have somewhere to cast those "sinners over there' into. Sorry, everything in scripture is not literal. Jesus spoke in parables so that they could not be easily understood, the book of Revelation is not all literal. The Lake of Fire can't burn up death or even hell literally can it? Death and hell go together, because hell is the grave. They both are destroyed by this Fire of God--but that fire is not a literal or a literal place.

Sorry to disappoint many Christians and even Muslims who want eternal torment to be true, it is not and you have nothing to hold over another persons head. As I hear so many say, "You have no heaven or hell to put me in", and that is quite literal.

Nope, there is not literal pit of everlasting fire that will burn forever non-stop with humans inside of it.

Christians have many verses of Holy Scripture that testify to a literal Hell. What do you have that testifies against a literal Hell?

 

[The Beautiful Heresy]

Sorry, I just found out I can't debate in these forums and I can only ask questions or just fellowship, so I have to remove my posts.

 

[Timothew]

Sorry, I just found out I can't debate in these forums and I can only ask questions or just fellowship, so I have to remove my posts.

I'm Baptist, so I will take over.

And Here is the Scriptural Support why I don't believe in the fire torture pit.

Matt 7:13​

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.

​

This says destruction, not eternal torment.

Matthew 10:28​

Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

​

Body and Soul will be destroyed in hell. Not burned alive forever in hell.

Matthew 13:30​

First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up,
​

The greek word that is used is katakausai, which comes from katakaio, and it means to consume by burning, burn down. The tares are gone after they burned. The meaning is the same as in the last 2 verses, that the wicked will be destroyed. As Jesus says in verse 40,​

So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age.
​

Just as the tares are destroyed by burning, the wicked people will be destroyed by burning, at the end of the age.

Luke 13:3​

I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.
​

Here, the greek word for perish is apoleisthe, which comes from the word apollumi, and means "to utterly destroy, kill, slay, demolish. Apoleisthe is the future tense form of apollumi which means will be utterly destroyed or will be killed.
What apoleisthe does not mean is "will be tortured alive forever."

Jesus says that the end for the unrighteous will be the same as for those in the days of Noah (Matthew 17:27), "the flood came and destroyed them all" (not tortured).
and it will be the same as for Sodom (verse 29) "destroyed them" (not tortured).

John 3:16​

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

​

So either a person receives eternal life, or they perish. They die. They are not burned alive forever, they just perish.


John 8:21​

Then He said again to them, “I go away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin; where I am going, you cannot come."
​

Jesus said they would die in their sin, not be burned alive forever.

Romans 6:23​

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
​

Note: Death, not eternal torment.

1 Corinthians 3:17​

If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.
​

Destroy, not torture alive forever.

Galations 6:8​

For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption (phthoran), but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.
​

phthoran: From phtheiro; decay, i.e. Ruin (spontaneous or inflicted, literally or figuratively) -- corruption, destroy, perish.

The one who sows to his own flesh reaps destruction, not eternal living torment.

2 Thessalonians 1:9​

These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,
​

Destruction, not eternal living torment. The greek word is olethron: destruction.
From a primary ollumi (to destroy; a prolonged form); ruin, i.e. Death, punishment -- destruction.

Hebrews 10:26-27,​

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES
​

Here it says the fire consumes the adversaries. They are burned up, not eternally alive and burning, but consumed.

Hebrews 10:39​

But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul.

​

James 1:15b​

and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
​

Death, not eternal torture.

James 4:12a​

There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the One who is able to save and to destroy;
​

Destroy, not eternally torture.

2 Peter 2:1​

But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
​

Destruction, not eternal torment.

2 Peter 3:7-9​

But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

​

Peter tells what will happent to ungodly men, they will be judged and then destroyed. All ungodly men will perish unless they repent.

1 John 5:12​

He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.
​

How can those without life be living forever in a lake of fire?

Jude 5​

Now I desire to remind you, though you know all things once for all, that the Lord, after saving a people out of the land of Egypt, subsequently destroyed those who did not believe.

​

Jude 10​

But these men revile the things which they do not understand; and the things which they know by instinct, like unreasoning animals, by these things they are destroyed.
​

Revelation 2:11b​

He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death.
​

The living and the dead will be judged on the last day. Those in Christ will not experience the second death. Those not in Christ will experience a second death. This second death is their destruction.

Revelation 17:8​

The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction.

​

Revelation 18:8​

For this reason in one day her plagues will come, pestilence and mourning and famine, and she will be burned up with fire; for the Lord God who judges her is strong.
​

The greek word katakauthesetai comes from katakaio and means utterly burnt up, destroyed, not eternally burned alive. (The greek is future passive indicative tense, therefore it is the word katakauthesetai).

Revelation 20:14-15​

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
​

John interprets this for us, the lake of fire is the second death. If anyones name is not in the book of life, he experiences the second death. This is exactly what it says, death. It is not eternal living torment.

Revelation 21:8​

“But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
​

They will undergo the second death, which means they are dead.

(all scriptures are NASB, definitions are Strong's or Liddell-Scott)

The Bible emphatically emphasizes that death, not eternal living torment, is the fate of unbelievers.​

 

[Basil the Great]

I strongly suspect that belief in a literal Hell will continue to dwindle as the years pass. Modernism has had an impact virtually all Christian groups. I must admit that I have an open mind on the subject, but I am certainly not convinced that a literal Hell exists.

 

[Timothew]

I strongly suspect that belief in a literal Hell will continue to dwindle as the years pass. Modernism has had an impact virtually all Christian groups. I must admit that I have an open mind on the subject, but I am certainly not convinced that a literal Hell exists.

My hope and daily prayer is that people will actually read the bible and discover what it says, and what it does NOT say.

Modernism? How about a return to pre-Catholic Christian belief.
Paul said the wages of sin is death. Then the Catholics added torment, torture, and purgatory. The reformation 'purged' some of Rome's errors, but not all of them. They still baptize unbelievers, for example.

 

[Vambram]

"There was a certain rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and fared sumptuously every day. But there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, full of sores, who was laid at his gate, desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table. Moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. So it was that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels to Abraham's bosom. The rich man also died and was buried. And being in torments in Hades, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. "Then he cried and said, 'Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus that he may dip the tip of his finger in water and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.' But Abraham said, 'Son, remember that in your lifetime you received your good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things; but now he is comforted and you are tormented. And besides all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed, so that those who want to pass from here to you cannot, nor can those from there pass to us.' "Then he said, 'I beg you therefore, father, that you would send him to my father's house, for I have five brothers, that he may testify to them, lest they also come to this place of torment.' Abraham said to him, 'They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.' And he said, 'No, father Abraham; but if one goes to them from the dead, they will repent.' But he said to him, 'If they do not hear Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded though one rise from the dead.' "
(Luk 16:19-31 NKJV)

 

[DeaconDean]

I'm Baptist, so I will take over.

And Here is the Scriptural Support why I don't believe in the fire torture pit.​

Matt 7:13

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.


​

This says destruction, not eternal torment.

Matthew 10:28​

Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


​

Body and Soul will be destroyed in hell. Not burned alive forever in hell.

Matthew 13:30​

First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up,

​

The greek word that is used is katakausai, which comes from katakaio, and it means to consume by burning, burn down. The tares are gone after they burned. The meaning is the same as in the last 2 verses, that the wicked will be destroyed. As Jesus says in verse 40,

So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age.

​

Just as the tares are destroyed by burning, the wicked people will be destroyed by burning, at the end of the age.

Luke 13:3​

I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.

​

Here, the greek word for perish is apoleisthe, which comes from the word apollumi, and means "to utterly destroy, kill, slay, demolish. Apoleisthe is the future tense form of apollumi which means will be utterly destroyed or will be killed.

What apoleisthe does not mean is "will be tortured alive forever."​

Jesus says that the end for the unrighteous will be the same as for those in the days of Noah (Matthew 17:27), "the flood came and destroyed them all" (not tortured).

and it will be the same as for Sodom (verse 29) "destroyed them" (not tortured).​

John 3:16​

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.


​

So either a person receives eternal life, or they perish. They die. They are not burned alive forever, they just perish.

John 8:21​

Then He said again to them, “I go away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin; where I am going, you cannot come."

​

Jesus said they would die in their sin, not be burned alive forever.

Romans 6:23​

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

​

Note: Death, not eternal torment.

1 Corinthians 3:17​

If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.

​

Destroy, not torture alive forever.

Galations 6:8​

For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption (phthoran), but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.

​

phthoran: From phtheiro; decay, i.e. Ruin (spontaneous or inflicted, literally or figuratively) -- corruption, destroy, perish.

The one who sows to his own flesh reaps destruction, not eternal living torment.​

2 Thessalonians 1:9​

These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,

​

Destruction, not eternal living torment. The greek word is olethron: destruction.

From a primary ollumi (to destroy; a prolonged form); ruin, i.e. Death, punishment -- destruction.​

Hebrews 10:26-27,​

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES

​

Here it says the fire consumes the adversaries. They are burned up, not eternally alive and burning, but consumed.

Hebrews 10:39​

But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul.


​

James 1:15b

and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.

​

Death, not eternal torture.

James 4:12a​

There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the One who is able to save and to destroy;

​

Destroy, not eternally torture.

2 Peter 2:1​

But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.

​

Destruction, not eternal torment.

2 Peter 3:7-9​

But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.


​

Peter tells what will happent to ungodly men, they will be judged and then destroyed. All ungodly men will perish unless they repent.

1 John 5:12​

He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.

​

How can those without life be living forever in a lake of fire?

Jude 5​

Now I desire to remind you, though you know all things once for all, that the Lord, after saving a people out of the land of Egypt, subsequently destroyed those who did not believe.


​

Jude 10

But these men revile the things which they do not understand; and the things which they know by instinct, like unreasoning animals, by these things they are destroyed.

​

Revelation 2:11b

He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death.

​

The living and the dead will be judged on the last day. Those in Christ will not experience the second death. Those not in Christ will experience a second death. This second death is their destruction.

Revelation 17:8​

The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction.


​

Revelation 18:8

For this reason in one day her plagues will come, pestilence and mourning and famine, and she will be burned up with fire; for the Lord God who judges her is strong.

​

The greek word katakauthesetai comes from katakaio and means utterly burnt up, destroyed, not eternally burned alive. (The greek is future passive indicative tense, therefore it is the word katakauthesetai).

Revelation 20:14-15​

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

​

John interprets this for us, the lake of fire is the second death. If anyones name is not in the book of life, he experiences the second death. This is exactly what it says, death. It is not eternal living torment.

Revelation 21:8​

“But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”

​

They will undergo the second death, which means they are dead.

(all scriptures are NASB, definitions are Strong's or Liddell-Scott)​

The Bible emphatically emphasizes that death, not eternal living torment, is the fate of unbelievers.​

One question, since when is death the end of the story?​

Scripture indeed does say the wages of sin is death, death in this mortal life on earth. And that being the case, then the second death from God's eternal judgment seat means that the sins we committed here on earth will have the effect of producing a second death whereby we will simply cease to exist?

Which is clearly seen in your treatment of the word "qanatoV".​

You do know that what you advocate is a form of annihilationism.​

God Bless​

Till all are one.​

 

[spiritwarrior37]

I'm Baptist, so I will take over.

And Here is the Scriptural Support why I don't believe in the fire torture pit.​

Matt 7:13

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.


​

This says destruction, not eternal torment.

Matthew 10:28​

Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.


​

Body and Soul will be destroyed in hell. Not burned alive forever in hell.

Matthew 13:30​

First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up,

​

The greek word that is used is katakausai, which comes from katakaio, and it means to consume by burning, burn down. The tares are gone after they burned. The meaning is the same as in the last 2 verses, that the wicked will be destroyed. As Jesus says in verse 40,

So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age.

​

Just as the tares are destroyed by burning, the wicked people will be destroyed by burning, at the end of the age.

Luke 13:3​

I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.

​

Here, the greek word for perish is apoleisthe, which comes from the word apollumi, and means "to utterly destroy, kill, slay, demolish. Apoleisthe is the future tense form of apollumi which means will be utterly destroyed or will be killed.

What apoleisthe does not mean is "will be tortured alive forever."​

Jesus says that the end for the unrighteous will be the same as for those in the days of Noah (Matthew 17:27), "the flood came and destroyed them all" (not tortured).

and it will be the same as for Sodom (verse 29) "destroyed them" (not tortured).​

John 3:16​

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.


​

So either a person receives eternal life, or they perish. They die. They are not burned alive forever, they just perish.

John 8:21​

Then He said again to them, “I go away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin; where I am going, you cannot come."

​

Jesus said they would die in their sin, not be burned alive forever.

Romans 6:23​

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

​

Note: Death, not eternal torment.

1 Corinthians 3:17​

If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.

​

Destroy, not torture alive forever.

Galations 6:8​

For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption (phthoran), but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.

​

phthoran: From phtheiro; decay, i.e. Ruin (spontaneous or inflicted, literally or figuratively) -- corruption, destroy, perish.

The one who sows to his own flesh reaps destruction, not eternal living torment.​

2 Thessalonians 1:9​

These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,

​

Destruction, not eternal living torment. The greek word is olethron: destruction.

From a primary ollumi (to destroy; a prolonged form); ruin, i.e. Death, punishment -- destruction.​

Hebrews 10:26-27,​

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES

​

Here it says the fire consumes the adversaries. They are burned up, not eternally alive and burning, but consumed.

Hebrews 10:39​

But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul.


​

James 1:15b

and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.

​

Death, not eternal torture.

James 4:12a​

There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the One who is able to save and to destroy;

​

Destroy, not eternally torture.

2 Peter 2:1​

But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.

​

Destruction, not eternal torment.

2 Peter 3:7-9​

But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.


​

Peter tells what will happent to ungodly men, they will be judged and then destroyed. All ungodly men will perish unless they repent.

1 John 5:12​

He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.

​

How can those without life be living forever in a lake of fire?

Jude 5​

Now I desire to remind you, though you know all things once for all, that the Lord, after saving a people out of the land of Egypt, subsequently destroyed those who did not believe.


​

Jude 10

But these men revile the things which they do not understand; and the things which they know by instinct, like unreasoning animals, by these things they are destroyed.

​

Revelation 2:11b

He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death.

​

The living and the dead will be judged on the last day. Those in Christ will not experience the second death. Those not in Christ will experience a second death. This second death is their destruction.

Revelation 17:8​

The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction.


​

Revelation 18:8

For this reason in one day her plagues will come, pestilence and mourning and famine, and she will be burned up with fire; for the Lord God who judges her is strong.

​

The greek word katakauthesetai comes from katakaio and means utterly burnt up, destroyed, not eternally burned alive. (The greek is future passive indicative tense, therefore it is the word katakauthesetai).

Revelation 20:14-15​

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

​

John interprets this for us, the lake of fire is the second death. If anyones name is not in the book of life, he experiences the second death. This is exactly what it says, death. It is not eternal living torment.

Revelation 21:8​

“But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”

​

They will undergo the second death, which means they are dead.

(all scriptures are NASB, definitions are Strong's or Liddell-Scott)​

The Bible emphatically emphasizes that death, not eternal living torment, is the fate of unbelievers.​

Revelation 14: 9-11 "9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, 10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: 11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.​

Sounds like eternal torment to me.​

 

[phoenixdem]

I'm Baptist, so I will take over.

And Here is the Scriptural Support why I don't believe in the fire torture pit.​

Matt 7:13

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.

​

This says destruction, not eternal torment.

Matthew 10:28​

Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

​

Body and Soul will be destroyed in hell. Not burned alive forever in hell.

Matthew 13:30​

First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up,
​

The greek word that is used is katakausai, which comes from katakaio, and it means to consume by burning, burn down. The tares are gone after they burned. The meaning is the same as in the last 2 verses, that the wicked will be destroyed. As Jesus says in verse 40,​

So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age.
​

Just as the tares are destroyed by burning, the wicked people will be destroyed by burning, at the end of the age.

Luke 13:3​

I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.
​

Here, the greek word for perish is apoleisthe, which comes from the word apollumi, and means "to utterly destroy, kill, slay, demolish. Apoleisthe is the future tense form of apollumi which means will be utterly destroyed or will be killed.

What apoleisthe does not mean is "will be tortured alive forever."​

Jesus says that the end for the unrighteous will be the same as for those in the days of Noah (Matthew 17:27), "the flood came and destroyed them all" (not tortured).
and it will be the same as for Sodom (verse 29) "destroyed them" (not tortured).​

John 3:16​

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

​

So either a person receives eternal life, or they perish. They die. They are not burned alive forever, they just perish.

John 8:21​

Then He said again to them, “I go away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin; where I am going, you cannot come."
​

Jesus said they would die in their sin, not be burned alive forever.

Romans 6:23​

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
​

Note: Death, not eternal torment.

1 Corinthians 3:17​

If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.
​

Destroy, not torture alive forever.

Galations 6:8​

For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption (phthoran), but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.
​

phthoran: From phtheiro; decay, i.e. Ruin (spontaneous or inflicted, literally or figuratively) -- corruption, destroy, perish.

The one who sows to his own flesh reaps destruction, not eternal living torment.​

2 Thessalonians 1:9​

These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,
​

Destruction, not eternal living torment. The greek word is olethron: destruction.

From a primary ollumi (to destroy; a prolonged form); ruin, i.e. Death, punishment -- destruction.​

Hebrews 10:26-27,​

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES
​

Here it says the fire consumes the adversaries. They are burned up, not eternally alive and burning, but consumed.

Hebrews 10:39​

But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul.

​

James 1:15b​

and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
​

Death, not eternal torture.

James 4:12a​

There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the One who is able to save and to destroy;
​

Destroy, not eternally torture.

2 Peter 2:1​

But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
​

Destruction, not eternal torment.

2 Peter 3:7-9​

But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

​

Peter tells what will happent to ungodly men, they will be judged and then destroyed. All ungodly men will perish unless they repent.

1 John 5:12​

He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.
​

How can those without life be living forever in a lake of fire?

Jude 5​

Now I desire to remind you, though you know all things once for all, that the Lord, after saving a people out of the land of Egypt, subsequently destroyed those who did not believe.

​

Jude 10​

But these men revile the things which they do not understand; and the things which they know by instinct, like unreasoning animals, by these things they are destroyed.
​

Revelation 2:11b​

He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death.
​

The living and the dead will be judged on the last day. Those in Christ will not experience the second death. Those not in Christ will experience a second death. This second death is their destruction.

Revelation 17:8​

The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction.

​

Revelation 18:8​

For this reason in one day her plagues will come, pestilence and mourning and famine, and she will be burned up with fire; for the Lord God who judges her is strong.
​

The greek word katakauthesetai comes from katakaio and means utterly burnt up, destroyed, not eternally burned alive. (The greek is future passive indicative tense, therefore it is the word katakauthesetai).

Revelation 20:14-15​

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
​

John interprets this for us, the lake of fire is the second death. If anyones name is not in the book of life, he experiences the second death. This is exactly what it says, death. It is not eternal living torment.

Revelation 21:8​

“But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
​

They will undergo the second death, which means they are dead.

(all scriptures are NASB, definitions are Strong's or Liddell-Scott)​

The Bible emphatically emphasizes that death, not eternal living torment, is the fate of unbelievers.​

So, your position is that Hell does exist, but people won't be required to be in Hell for all Eternity, they will simply cease to exist? Do you believe that Satan and his fallen, unmerry band of angels will be punished for all Eternity in Hell?​

 

[Timothew]

So, your position is that Hell does exist, but people won't be required to be in Hell for all Eternity, they will simply cease to exist? Do you believe that Satan and his fallen, unmerry band of angels will be punished for all Eternity in Hell?[/left]

Whatever the bible says is my belief.

What do you mean by Hell? Sheol, Hades, Tartarus, Gehenna, Lake of Fire, or something else?

 

[phoenixdem]

Whatever the bible says is my belief.

What do you mean by Hell? Sheol, Hades, Tartarus, Gehenna, Lake of Fire, or something else?

So, you really haven't thought out what you believe from the Holy Bible? In other words, you don't really know what the Holy Bible states about Hell? What does the Holy Bible mean about Hell and Lake of Fire? Do you know?

 

[Hentenza]

Whatever the bible says is my belief.

What do you mean by Hell? Sheol, Hades, Tartarus, Gehenna, Lake of Fire, or something else?

The final destination of the unbeliever is the lake of fire.

 

[Hentenza]

I'm Baptist, so I will take over.

And Here is the Scriptural Support why I don't believe in the fire torture pit.

Matt 7:13​

Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.

​

This says destruction, not eternal torment.

Matthew 10:28​

Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

​

Body and Soul will be destroyed in hell. Not burned alive forever in hell.

Matthew 13:30​

First gather up the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them up,
​

The greek word that is used is katakausai, which comes from katakaio, and it means to consume by burning, burn down. The tares are gone after they burned. The meaning is the same as in the last 2 verses, that the wicked will be destroyed. As Jesus says in verse 40,​

So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age.
​

Just as the tares are destroyed by burning, the wicked people will be destroyed by burning, at the end of the age.

Luke 13:3​

I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.
​

Here, the greek word for perish is apoleisthe, which comes from the word apollumi, and means "to utterly destroy, kill, slay, demolish. Apoleisthe is the future tense form of apollumi which means will be utterly destroyed or will be killed.
What apoleisthe does not mean is "will be tortured alive forever."

Jesus says that the end for the unrighteous will be the same as for those in the days of Noah (Matthew 17:27), "the flood came and destroyed them all" (not tortured).
and it will be the same as for Sodom (verse 29) "destroyed them" (not tortured).

John 3:16​

For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

​

So either a person receives eternal life, or they perish. They die. They are not burned alive forever, they just perish.


John 8:21​

Then He said again to them, “I go away, and you will seek Me, and will die in your sin; where I am going, you cannot come."
​

Jesus said they would die in their sin, not be burned alive forever.

Romans 6:23​

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
​

Note: Death, not eternal torment.

1 Corinthians 3:17​

If any man destroys the temple of God, God will destroy him, for the temple of God is holy, and that is what you are.
​

Destroy, not torture alive forever.

Galations 6:8​

For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption (phthoran), but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.
​

phthoran: From phtheiro; decay, i.e. Ruin (spontaneous or inflicted, literally or figuratively) -- corruption, destroy, perish.

The one who sows to his own flesh reaps destruction, not eternal living torment.

2 Thessalonians 1:9​

These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power,
​

Destruction, not eternal living torment. The greek word is olethron: destruction.
From a primary ollumi (to destroy; a prolonged form); ruin, i.e. Death, punishment -- destruction.

Hebrews 10:26-27,​

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES
​

Here it says the fire consumes the adversaries. They are burned up, not eternally alive and burning, but consumed.

Hebrews 10:39​

But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul.

​

James 1:15b​

and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death.
​

Death, not eternal torture.

James 4:12a​

There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the One who is able to save and to destroy;
​

Destroy, not eternally torture.

2 Peter 2:1​

But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves.
​

Destruction, not eternal torment.

2 Peter 3:7-9​

But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

​

Peter tells what will happent to ungodly men, they will be judged and then destroyed. All ungodly men will perish unless they repent.

1 John 5:12​

He who has the Son has the life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have the life.
​

How can those without life be living forever in a lake of fire?

Jude 5​

Now I desire to remind you, though you know all things once for all, that the Lord, after saving a people out of the land of Egypt, subsequently destroyed those who did not believe.

​

Jude 10​

But these men revile the things which they do not understand; and the things which they know by instinct, like unreasoning animals, by these things they are destroyed.
​

Revelation 2:11b​

He who overcomes will not be hurt by the second death.
​

The living and the dead will be judged on the last day. Those in Christ will not experience the second death. Those not in Christ will experience a second death. This second death is their destruction.

Revelation 17:8​

The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction.

​

Revelation 18:8​

For this reason in one day her plagues will come, pestilence and mourning and famine, and she will be burned up with fire; for the Lord God who judges her is strong.
​

The greek word katakauthesetai comes from katakaio and means utterly burnt up, destroyed, not eternally burned alive. (The greek is future passive indicative tense, therefore it is the word katakauthesetai).

Revelation 20:14-15​

Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. 15And if anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
​

John interprets this for us, the lake of fire is the second death. If anyones name is not in the book of life, he experiences the second death. This is exactly what it says, death. It is not eternal living torment.

Revelation 21:8​

“But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
​

They will undergo the second death, which means they are dead.

(all scriptures are NASB, definitions are Strong's or Liddell-Scott)

The Bible emphatically emphasizes that death, not eternal living torment, is the fate of unbelievers.​

Each one of those verses has been addressed in the many threads where you have posted them. Annihilation is not biblical. Man is appointed to die once (and only once) and then the judgment (Heb. 9).

 

[Timothew]

So, you really haven't thought out what you believe from the Holy Bible? In other words, you don't really know what the Holy Bible states about Hell? What does the Holy Bible mean about Hell and Lake of Fire? Do you know?

I know, but I aint lowed to say, cepting in UT.

I want to know what you are referring to when you say Hell. 'cause the word aint in the original greek nor hebrew.

 

[Timothew]

Each one of those verses has been addressed in the many threads where you have posted them. Annihilation is not biblical. Man is appointed to die once (and only once) and then the judgment (Heb. 9).

And after the judgment, the result of the judgment, eternal life or destruction. According to the scriptures.

 

[Hentenza]

And after the judgment, the result of the judgment, eternal life or destruction. According to the scriptures.

Ignoring the verse is not going to make it go away. The scriptures do not teach annihilation.

 

[phoenixdem]

I know, but I aint lowed to say, cepting in UT.

I want to know what you are referring to when you say Hell. 'cause the word aint in the original greek nor hebrew.

This conversation is going nowhere. Let me give you some advice. When you post something in a forum, especially in a religious forum, you really need to be able to defend it and know the subject matter.

 

[Timothew]

This conversation is going nowhere. Let me give you some advice. When you post something in a forum, especially in a religious forum, you really need to be able to defend it and know the subject matter.

Refer to post 143.

Ignoring the verse is not going to make it go away. The scriptures do not teach annihilation.

Refer to post 143.

Ignoring all of the verses will not make them go away.

 

[Timothew]

Originally Posted by Timothew

And after the judgment, the result of the judgment, eternal life or destruction. According to the scriptures.
​

Ignoring the verse is not going to make it go away. The scriptures do not teach annihilation.

Do you believe the result of the judgment comes before the judgment? The wages of sin is death. (Then the judgment?)

 

[Hentenza]

Do you believe the result of the judgment comes before the judgment? The wages of sin is death. (Then the judgment?)

The result of the judgment does not come prior to the judgment even though those that do not believe (die in unbelief) are judged already (John 3:18). The wages of sin is indeed death but not the secular definition of death. The bible defines spiritual death as that of condemnation. We've been through this a number of times before.